Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Helm on February 25, 2012, 09:57:36 AM
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I have often wondered why there is such a lack of interest from this comunity in Japanese aircraft. I remember a poll from awhile back and the Japanese plane had 13% support.
I can't speak for the rest of the folks who play this game, but I love ALL airplanes and I am excited by the opportunity to fly anything that fought in WW II. Yet most people who play here are only interested USA/British/German planes. It seems odd to me that if you have in interest aviation that you would not enjoy the chance to fly everything.
When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
At this point, with all the planes we have available, there are not many planes left the would "set the MA on it's ear" so asking for a revolution seems a bit much.
Hanger queens? the only thing that makes a plane a hanger queen is the pilots fear to fly it. I can assure you the "hanger queen"is eager to fly....ready to fly ...and she would love to get in the action. It's the pilots who are afraid, not the airframe, she has more then enough courage.
I guess it just seems odd to me that there is no interest in Japanese planes. Even more puzzling is how strongly players oppose HTC making more Japanese planes. All I can hope for is: when we have 20 versions of the spit ...20 versions of the p51 and 20 versions of the 109 ...maybe ...just maybe ...we could get a ki-43? ...or a ki-44? .....or a Nell ? I'll take anything. I'll continue to hold out hope!
Helm ...out
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Unfortunately, it's not just Japanese aviation. There's a huge sub-group of people in here who put down any idea if it's not 'their' idea, and are against any plane if it's not 'their plane'. Just browse the wishlist forum for a group of people who are entirely too full of themselves trying to sound smart in putting down someone else's ideas. They are the same group of people who shut down the hangars in a furball in game because people are having fun and not joining their missions and playing 'their way'.
It's part of the reason I loved David Wales. The people in that forum couldn't possibly respond to his posts intelligently and still put him down, so they resorted to personal attacks and got muted. I miss the lad...
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When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
Ah, one of those dinosaur historians you are! Fewer and fewer of us left, I fear.
Watching the polls over the past few years, it seems to have come to this: Unless the plane can compete with the 1945 plane set (P-51H, Do-335, Meteor, that sort of thing) or be successfully used in a manner it wasn't designed for (P-61, Me-410, A-26), the majority of AH players do not want it because, almost by definition, it will be overwhelmed by the 1945 planes. We already have the best of the 1945 Japanese plane set....so why ask for more?
- oldman
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One problem with the votes, which I think HTC implicitly acknowledged with the last vote, is that anything American on it will win over anything that is not American unless it is very obscure or very obsolete. I don't think a Ventura or Devastator would win over a Tu-2 or He177, but put the A-26, P-61 or P-63 on the list and they may as well not have any British, German, Italian, Japanese or Russian aircraft on the list. I don't think this is only due to jingoism, I think most of the players are only casual WWII aviation buffs and while they might not know what a P-61 is off hand, they will know it is a fighter with a higher number than the P-51 and therefor probably better whereas who the heck knows what a J2M3 or Ki-44 might be....
For my part I would love to see the Japanese and Russian planesets at least be close to the British planeset in sizes.
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For my part I would love to see the Japanese and Russian planesets at least be close to the British planeset in sizes. :cheers:
[/quote]
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Odd, every time I'm up in LW is see quite a few A6Ms, KI's, and Nikis. I think we need more, too, not less, Russian, French and Italian also.... But I guess I've never noticed any negativity towards their addition.
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It's because people think if its not late war monster its stupid and becuase everyone seems to hate someone and when that person makes a wish its like antichrist on here :rolleyes:
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My "Japanese wishlist":
B6N2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B5N2
B7A2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B6N2, all carriers lost before it entered service
D4Y1 - carrier dive bomber, replacement for the D3A, fastest dive bomber of WWII
H8K2 - well protected high performance flying boat, patrol aircraft/bomber/torpedo bomber
J2M3 and J2M5 - interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-43-I, Ki-43-II and Ki-43-III - most common IJA fighter, lightly armed and built but extremely maneuverable
Ki-44-II - Moderately armed interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-45 - twin engined fighter of modest capability
Ki-61-I-Ko - early version of the Ki-61 with four 12.7mm guns and better turning ability
Ki-61-II - late version of the Ki-61, faster, more ammo, cut down rear fuselage
Ki-84-I-Otsu - Ki-84 with four 20mm cannons and perhaps a slightly more powerful engine, might be a light perk plane
Ki-100 - Ki-61-II airframe with a radial engine, slower, better climb
Ki-102 - twin engined attack aircraft with decent performance and some larger guns
N1K1 - float plane fighter
N1K1-J - land based interceptor based on the float plane fighter, a bit lower performance and much less ammo than the N1K2-J
P1Y1 - bomber/torpedo bomber with good performance and the ability to carry two 500kg bombs which would make it very useful for a Japanese bomber
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Personally .. I would like to see a new countries plane/s added before anything from countries all ready in the game.
Add these Countries:
IAR80/81..........Romania
Boomerang........Australia
D-520..............France
Of countries all ready in the game the Italian set is the weakest.
New Countries,
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Personally .. I would like to see a new countries plane/s added before anything from countries all ready in the game.
Add these Countries:
IAR80/81..........Romania
Boomerang........Australia
D-520..............France
Of countries all ready in the game the Italian set is the weakest.
New Countries,
All minor participants compared to the big five, and two of the big five have tiny planesets that do not do a good job of representing them. Australia in particular can wait as its actual participation was in US and UK designs.
For Italy, give them the SM.79-II, C.200, CR.42, G.50 and G.55 and that would mostly take care of Italy.
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change the title to
"Lack of Interest in Italian aviation"
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change the title to
"Lack of Interest in Italian aviation"
Italy was a minor player in comparison to the big five. If their planeset were as large as Russia's they would be very well covered.
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All minor participants compared to the big five, and two of the big five have tiny planesets that do not do a good job of representing them. Australia in particular can wait as its actual participation was in US and UK designs.
For Italy, give them the SM.79-II, C.200, CR.42, G.50 and G.55 and that would mostly take care of Italy.
Minor or not you have what 6-7 napanese planes in the game all ready? Japan is well represented , and you just got a new zeke. So no Jap planes for a while.
No Australia can't wait they have a large player base and likewise would like and deserve there plane to be represented in the game. <---period
Add New Countries,
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My "Japanese Spamlist":
B6N2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B5N2
B7A2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level ............................. ..........bla bla bla bla bla bla
Fixed :aok
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Every country has its wishlist, its not just one country its all of them...
Boomerang from Australia
Meteor from England
IAR.80 from Romania
D.520 from France
G.55 from Italy
Yak3 from Russia
Ki-43 from Japan
Beaufighter from Australia
Lets stop whining about what (insert countries) aircraft isn't being added, eventually they will be - if you look at the recent poll - the Me410 beat out the Meteor, Yak and Beaufighter. This is four aircraft from 4 different countries that were voted on.
I can understand its frustrating because you back a certain country, I know far to many that only vote for certain countries and nothing else, and others simply don't care and vote for whatever seems more versatile.
Everyone has their vote, I've been requesting an update for C.202/205 and adding the G.55 for at least 3-4 years now and nothing comes up, have I whined? Nah, eventually they will get updated.
The amount of work put into making one plane to be added in game takes months to do, not exactly a 20 minute slap together.
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"Italy was a minor player in comparison to the big five. If their planeset were as large as Russia's they would be very well covered."
A couple of balls !!!
We don't speak about quantity but about sim experience.
:salute
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Every country has its wishlist, its not just one country its New Countries all of them...
Boomerang from Australia
IAR.80 from Romania
D.520 from France
Beaufighter from Australia
Plz26 from Poland
:aok
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When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
I guess it just seems odd to me that there is no interest in Japanese planes. Even more puzzling is how strongly players oppose HTC making more Japanese planes.
Helm ...out
Funny but I searched for these legions you spoke of and found several people with interest in Japenese Aircraft. :headscratch:
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,329073.0.html http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,316276.0.html
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"Italy was a minor player in comparison to the big five. If their planeset were as large as Russia's they would be very well covered."
A couple of balls !!!
We don't speak about quantity but about sim experience.
:salute
lulu why not just say what you want to say instead of letting other people try to figure out what you mean? notice in your threads you always throw a vague statement.
semp
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lulu why not just say what you want to say instead of letting other people try to figure out what you mean? notice in your threads you always throw a vague statement.
semp
Prolly because he is from a different country and English is not a 1st language?
My Guess,
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My "Japanese wishlist":
B6N2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B5N2
B7A2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B6N2, all carriers lost before it entered service
D4Y1 - carrier dive bomber, replacement for the D3A, fastest dive bomber of WWII
H8K2 - well protected high performance flying boat, patrol aircraft/bomber/torpedo bomber
J2M3 and J2M5 - interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-43-I, Ki-43-II and Ki-43-III - most common IJA fighter, lightly armed and built but extremely maneuverable
Ki-44-II - Moderately armed interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-45 - twin engined fighter of modest capability
Ki-61-I-Ko - early version of the Ki-61 with four 12.7mm guns and better turning ability
Ki-61-II - late version of the Ki-61, faster, more ammo, cut down rear fuselage
Ki-84-I-Otsu - Ki-84 with four 20mm cannons and perhaps a slightly more powerful engine, might be a light perk plane
Ki-100 - Ki-61-II airframe with a radial engine, slower, better climb
Ki-102 - twin engined attack aircraft with decent performance and some larger guns
N1K1 - float plane fighter
N1K1-J - land based interceptor based on the float plane fighter, a bit lower performance and much less ammo than the N1K2-J
P1Y1 - bomber/torpedo bomber with good performance and the ability to carry two 500kg bombs which would make it very useful for a Japanese bomber
I fly the K-84 quite a lot, and wouldn't mind trying a 4 cannon variant myself. The Ki-100 I am always a +1 on, and the J2M would be nice as well.
I have always wanted an a better Japanese attack plane - The D4Y1 would be a nice addition as well +1.
After that, they can bring me the B6N - but I'd hope they do something about the balancing the torpedo system first (otherwise it would be a waste).
Early war Ki-27, 43, 44 would be wonderful for scenarios, but I don't think they would get much MA time.
P1Y1 would seem to fit the same role as the Ki-67, and I would only be in favor of floatplanes if they were enabled at ports.
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P1Y1 would seem to fit the same role as the Ki-67,
A formation of P1Y1s could take out two hangars in one pass. Try to do that with Ki-67s. There were also more P1Y1s built than Ki-67s. The only other Japanese bomber that could do that would be the H8K2 which could carry eight 250kg bombs or two 1500kg bombs.
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I would say that the problem goes just as much, if not doubly so, for Soviet aviation, minus the popularity of the La7 and Il2 for obvious reasons.
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I think there are some big historical holes in the planeset, the fixation on late war monster planes confuses and to a certain extent frustrates me. A sizable portion of the AH community seems locked in it's own little arms race "they got the king-tiger so now we need the pershing!". I wonder what will happen when we run out of 1945 planes and tanks? There are huge gaps from models that historically played a major role in the war, the argument that they won't see massive usage in the late war arena just doesn't hold a lot of water for me. If there is going to be a another late war addition I think a Japanese attack plane would be a great choice, something like the D4Y1.
My top 3 in no particular order would have to be
Ki-43
He-111
Beaufighter
I'd also love to see something like a Pe-2, or another early/mid war VVS aircraft, and/or British tank.
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There are a couple of groups in AH in the airplane voting: those who want what will be the highest-performance plane in the list and those who want it because of its historical significance. The later group actually is not small. If you look at past voting, we got a B-25 and a P-39 instead of various higher performance planes, and in the recent voting where the Me 410 won, the Ki-43 did quite well; and HTC adds some planes independent of voting (Brewster, I-16, Betty).
Also, planes of historical significance (independent of how great they compare to the best 1945 aircraft) are used a great deal in special events.
So, things are actually in good shape -- do not fret! :)
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Brooke,
Were the P-39 and B-25 up against anything that was both high performance and American? If not, I don't think you can assign their shared victory to being voted for by the guys who favor history over power, but rather to the guys who vote American/recognizable over not American/don't know what it is.
Still, was good to see the final of the last vote was between the Me410 and Yak-3 and not the Meteor Mk III.
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There's not much left that is high peformance and American and not already in the game. There were high-performance planes in the mix (certainly higher performance than the B-25 and P-39), but I don't remember the list. It might still exist here on the BB, but my couple of attempts at a search didn't find anything. I do remember that the Pe-2 did reasonably well in the voting, which couldn't happen unless there were a substantial base of folks out there who want planes that were historically significant regardless of ueberness.
Brooke,
Were the P-39 and B-25 up against anything that was both high performance and American? If not, I don't think you can assign their shared victory to being voted for by the guys who favor history over power, but rather to the guys who vote American/recognizable over not American/don't know what it is.
Still, was good to see the final of the last vote was between the Me410 and Yak-3 and not the Meteor Mk III.
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I wouldn't be caught dead in a Japanese ride.
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I don't know much about Japanese aviation, but the Ki series seems to be great, More of those would be nice. Love the Ki84!
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I wouldn't be caught dead in a Japanese ride.
I wouldn't be caught dead in a german ride.
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I would say that the problem goes just as much, if not doubly so, for Soviet aviation, minus the popularity of the La7 and Il2 for obvious reasons.
Soviet aviation is the most "dissed" big player in the game. I know, I know "skin the Lend Lease". :huh Boy is that getting old.
I think a major factor is deciding to model an airframe, not that anyone cares what I think, is that players should actually want to fly it. But also Modeling based on player votes alone is a mistake. Didnt WW1 teach them anything?
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I wouldn't be caught dead in a Japanese ride.
I wouldn't be caught dead in a german ride.
I don't understand attitudes like these.
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I don't understand attitudes like these.
Nor I, and I am almost always Yank, Brit, Soviet. But going a raiding in KI-67s is Soooooo fun. I love seeing 262s run away in fear. :lol
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I don't understand attitudes like these.
Me neither. I am caught dead in a lot of rides. :D
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I don't understand attitudes like these.
:rofl
sarcasim? Slash flew the ki84 regularly and I flew the 109 series often.
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The zeros are one of my favorite rides. On a side note you would be amazed (or maybe not) at how many pilots think its a good idea to flat turn with one.
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The zeros are one of my favorite rides. On a side note you would be amazed (or maybe not) at how many pilots think its a good idea to flat turn with one.
Back when the F6F was first announced there was a bit of clamor on the forums about how it was going to be the Zero killer and such, posts about its historical K/D ratio against the A6M. I said at that time that people shouldn't expect that here and that it might well not even have a one to one K/D ratio against the Zero. In the actual event, it took the F6F many, many tours before the F6F was able to break even with the A6M5b. Why? Because people knew it was "the Zero killer" and would turn with the Zero, and die.
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Back when the F6F was first announced there was a bit of clamor on the forums about how it was going to be the Zero killer and such, posts about its historical K/D ratio against the A6M. I said at that time that people shouldn't expect that here and that it might well not even have a one to one K/D ratio against the Zero. In the actual event, it took the F6F many, many tours before the F6F was able to break even with the A6M5b. Why? Because people knew it was "the Zero killer" and would turn with the Zero, and die.
Meet Greebo the Zero killer :)
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Soviet aviation is the most "dissed" big player in the game. I know, I know "skin the Lend Lease". :huh Boy is that getting old.
While I agree with this sentiment, it would be nice to see lend lease skins for the P40s.
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Meet Greebo the Zero killer :)
Don't get me wrong, certain F6F drivers, such as Mathman, absolutely dominated the A6M5b from the get go, but overall the F6F did poorly against the A6M5b despite their efforts because too many people just tried to turn fight it.
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I'm sorry but I don't carry much for the Japapanese airpranes either. For one they bombed Pearl Harbor, so I don't care. Sounds wierd but I hate them.
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I wonder what will happen when we run out of 1945 planes and tanks?
Dude. You are not paying attention.
We go to 1946. Maybe 1947.
Maybe 1950.
- oldman
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I don't understand attitudes like these.
Heh. Take the hook out of your mouth if you can reach it.
Slash is a Frank weiner because he needs the help.
- oldman
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Ah, one of those dinosaur historians you are! Fewer and fewer of us left, I fear.
Watching the polls over the past few years, it seems to have come to this: Unless the plane can compete with the 1945 plane set (P-51H, Do-335, Meteor, that sort of thing) or be successfully used in a manner it wasn't designed for (P-61, Me-410, A-26), the majority of AH players do not want it because, almost by definition, it will be overwhelmed by the 1945 planes. We already have the best of the 1945 Japanese plane set....so why ask for more?
- oldman
I see the Mosca made it. Mwahahahaha .... my evil plan is slow to fruition but it is making progress. Next the SM-79:
http://italianaircraftofwwii.devhub.com/blog/594598-italian-torpedo-bomber-squadrons/
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Germans are better.
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Japanese AA tries to kill a vulcher.
(http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l8z2bz99S31qzun0bo1_500.jpg)
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It's part of the reason I loved David Wales.
Why use past tense? I we still love David Wales and wish and pray for his return. :pray
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Ah, one of those dinosaur historians you are! Fewer and fewer of us left, I fear.
Watching the polls over the past few years, it seems to have come to this: Unless the plane can compete with the 1945 plane set (P-51H, Do-335, Meteor, that sort of thing) or be successfully used in a manner it wasn't designed for (P-61, Me-410, A-26), the majority of AH players do not want it because, almost by definition, it will be overwhelmed by the 1945 planes. We already have the best of the 1945 Japanese plane set....so why ask for more?
- oldman
That says it as clear as it can be said.
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Dude. You are not paying attention.
We go to 1946. Maybe 1947.
Maybe 1950.
- oldman
Sad part is 90% that request anything beyond 1944 are using wikipedia for the source for this information, not even bothering to crack open a book and do some research on their own, instead they use the first google search entry that's posted.
How the Me-410 won over the Meteor is interesting, I highly doubt after all these years it won fair and square. Given how quick the B-29 was added, it wasn't an hour later a "nuke" thread was already posted.
Yet so many good planes are left out simply because "Late War Arena" pays where history doesn't.
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Ki is short for Kitai and roughly translates to 'airframe'. So lots of different manufacturers like Nakajima, Mitsubishi and Kawasaki made models prefixed with 'Ki'
I have once caught Slash27 in a Ki-84, he was very much alive though :rock :salute
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Sad part is 90% that request anything beyond 1944 are using wikipedia for the source for this information, not even bothering to crack open a book and do some research on their own, instead they use the first google search entry that's posted.
Perhaps, but recall that AH went live with a 1945 airplane already in the planeset, the N1K2-J.
How the Me-410 won over the Meteor is interesting, I highly doubt after all these years it won fair and square.
It is easy to see how the Me410 won. Many people in the game 1) don't know what the Meteor is and 2) many of us don't like jets because they mess up fights between piston engined fighters. Remember, the Yak-3 also beat the Meteor.
Given how quick the B-29 was added, it wasn't an hour later a "nuke" thread was already posted.
So? B-29+Nuke wish threads had been in existence for more than a decade on this forum, why would the nuke wish disappear as soon as the B-29 was announced? It would be absurd not to expect that wish to appear immediately.
Yet so many good planes are left out simply because "Late War Arena" pays where history doesn't.
Just because people request it doesn't mean HTC will add it.Will we see the A-26 at some point? Of course. Will we see the P-80? Very unlikely.
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We should Get some Migs in the sim and not the jet migs the prop migs like the mig 3
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I love the Japanese planes in this game and am one who wishes for more of them quite often.
But as others have stated it seems like a majority of players have a 2000HP and Multi cannon requirement, because in the LW arena everyone thinks...."if you can't run, it aint fun"
Slow down some, turn into a fight for a change. Don't protect your score like it was your first born child.
Do that, and some of the other planes that don't only excel in a straight line become more appealing.
+1 for the Japanese plane set (I do very much feel the Russian and Italian sets could use some additions as well)
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A formation of P1Y1s could take out two hangars in one pass. Try to do that with Ki-67s. There were also more P1Y1s built than Ki-67s. The only other Japanese bomber that could do that would be the H8K2 which could carry eight 250kg bombs or two 1500kg bombs.
My refs had them both (ki-67 and P1Y) with 1000 Kg bomb load unless they were off on a "kamikaze strike", which had a much higher load. If you have a ref showing it with a higher load, let me know.
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My refs had them both (ki-67 and P1Y) with 1000 Kg bomb load unless they were off on a "kamikaze strike", which had a much higher load. If you have a ref showing it with a higher load, let me know.
What I had it at was 1000kg by way of two 500kg bombs. The Ki-67 is, in comparison, at 800kgs via eight 100kg bombs.
A formation of P1Y1s could take out two hangars by dropping one 500kg bomb from each bomber on each hangar.
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"if you can't run, it aint fun"
Slow down some, turn into a fight for a change. Don't protect your score like it was your first born child.
You know, I agree 100%... But as much as I would prefer to stall fight, I've been flying the P51D a lot this tour simply because I am tired of 95% of my engagements being the other guy running away from me after I beat them in the first turn. If I fly the P51, I actually get more fights because fewer people can escape by simply putting their nose down and running away.
I would much rather be flying a 109F turn fighting, but in LW that isn't how you find a lot of fights.... It's really only how you find a lot of LW monsters trying to pick you during the rare turnfight that you find.
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I have often wondered why there is such a lack of interest from this comunity in Japanese aircraft. I remember a poll from awhile back and the Japanese plane had 13% support.
I can't speak for the rest of the folks who play this game, but I love ALL airplanes and I am excited by the opportunity to fly anything that fought in WW II. Yet most people who play here are only interested USA/British/German planes. It seems odd to me that if you have in interest aviation that you would not enjoy the chance to fly everything.
When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
At this point, with all the planes we have available, there are not many planes left the would "set the MA on it's ear" so asking for a revolution seems a bit much.
Hanger queens? the only thing that makes a plane a hanger queen is the pilots fear to fly it. I can assure you the "hanger queen"is eager to fly....ready to fly ...and she would love to get in the action. It's the pilots who are afraid, not the airframe, she has more then enough courage.
I guess it just seems odd to me that there is no interest in Japanese planes. Even more puzzling is how strongly players oppose HTC making more Japanese planes. All I can hope for is: when we have 20 versions of the spit ...20 versions of the p51 and 20 versions of the 109 ...maybe ...just maybe ...we could get a ki-43? ...or a ki-44? .....or a Nell ? I'll take anything. I'll continue to hold out hope!
Helm ...out
Most of the kids want the fastest in the game.
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J2M5 Jack. I may be mistaken but this could be a superior BnZ plane. Designed for high alt interceptions.
I'd like this in game. My Japanese vote.
Boo
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Ki is short for Kitai and roughly translates to 'airframe'. So lots of different manufacturers like Nakajima, Mitsubishi and Kawasaki made models prefixed with 'Ki'
I have once caught Slash27 in a Ki-84, he was very much alive though :rock :salute
:D :salute
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I know my in game experience doesn't reflect this, because I've been killed by a lot of ki's. But I'm of the biased opinion that the Japanese planes are all too flammable, and under-armed. I feel this way because it is also my opinion that the Japanese airforce was absolutely decimated by hellcats, P-51s and corsairs.
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I know my in game experience doesn't reflect this, because I've been killed by a lot of ki's. But I'm of the biased opinion that the Japanese planes are all too flammable, and under-armed. I feel this way because it is also my opinion that the Japanese airforce was absolutely decimated by hellcats, P-51s and corsairs.
I have a lot of time in the 84 and she can take a beating. The Ho-5 cannon is not as potent as the Hispano, but it does hit hard and has an awesome rate of fire. It's really one damn fine aircraft.
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I know my in game experience doesn't reflect this, because I've been killed by a lot of ki's. But I'm of the biased opinion that the Japanese planes are all too flammable, and underarmed. I feel this way because it is also my opinion that the Japanese airforce was absolutely decimated by hellcats, P-51s and corsairs.
I would disagree that all the Japanese planed are flammable. The A6M, B5N, G4M and the D3A are very much prone to catching fire. The Ki84, Ki61, Ki67, and N1K2 however have pilot armor and self sealing fuel tanks and for me rarely catch fire.
And other than the Ki43 that we don't have (yet) I don't see that they are underarmed.
Missconceptions that all Japanese planes are as flammable as the Zeke is part of the problem.
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I would disagree that all the Japanese planed are flammable. The A6M, B5N, G4M and the D3A are very much prone to catching fire. The Ki84, Ki61, Ki67, and N1K2 however have pilot armor and self sealing fuel tanks and for me rarely catch fire.
And other than the Ki43 that we don't have (yet) I don't see that they are underarmed.
Missconceptions that all Japanese planes are as flammable as the Zeke is part of the problem.
you hit the nail right on the head!
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I have a lot of time in the 84 and she can take a beating. The Ho-5 cannon is not as potent as the Hispano, but it does hit hard and has an awesome rate of fire. It's really one damn fine aircraft.
It can't catch much, but against anything that's interested in staying and fighting, it's a very competent aircraft. Same with the 61, and the 61 can fly for an hour in the MA on internal fuel at full throttle.
Wiley.
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It can't catch much, but against anything that's interested in staying and fighting, it's a very competent aircraft. Same with the 61, and the 61 can fly for an hour in the MA on internal fuel at full throttle.
Wiley.
Ki-84 is faster than most of the fighters in AH, though obviously not the currently fashionable speed demons.
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J2M5 Jack. I may be mistaken but this could be a superior BnZ plane. Designed for high alt interceptions.
I'd like this in game. My Japanese vote.
Boo
This or the KI-100 and only because of the B-29..... and after the Boomerang, D520 and the IAR 80/81. :aok
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Ki-84 is faster than most of the fighters in AH, though obviously not the currently fashionable speed demons.
...yeah, I was thinking about that after I typed it. I guess the speed demons are all I'm thinking of when I consider 'is a plane fast' for chasing down runners.
Wiley.
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Bah ... don't worry about the runners .. they aren't worth the fight anyway...just fodder .... the ones that stick around is all that matters .... BnZer's are painful ... but they eventually leave cause they can't deal with the frustration of missing or slow down too much and die hahaha .....
on subject...I really know to little about all of these planes to have any kind of insight as to what is lacking ...
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Bah ... don't worry about the runners .. they aren't worth the fight anyway...just fodder .... the ones that stick around is all that matters .... BnZer's are painful ... but they eventually leave cause they can't deal with the frustration of missing or slow down too much and die hahaha .....
on subject...I really know to little about all of these planes to have any kind of insight as to what is lacking ...
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+1 more more Japanese planes preferably the D4 but until then will still fly the D3 often, I find it fun and challenging even though mist of the time its just a magnet for the score monkeys.
The overemphasis on American planes is getting silly slightly, understandandable with our playerbase but skewed nevertheless.
If I dug my garden up I might even find dornier or 111 bits very common sight over the south coast in the time Aces high is set but not IG why?
Why so many variants of US planes but no Wellington, Lysander, Beaufighter, or many other significant planes.
Japanese planes may be seen as hanger queens for many but look at the the voting for the B29 and how many do you see fly? I have bomber perks coming out my ears but just don't bother.
Would like to see the perk system heavily re-visited so it would'nt be so easy to constantly up late model racehorse's and get more variety back in the game.
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My "Japanese wishlist":
B6N2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B5N2
B7A2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B6N2, all carriers lost before it entered service
D4Y1 - carrier dive bomber, replacement for the D3A, fastest dive bomber of WWII
H8K2 - well protected high performance flying boat, patrol aircraft/bomber/torpedo bomber
J2M3 and J2M5 - interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-43-I, Ki-43-II and Ki-43-III - most common IJA fighter, lightly armed and built but extremely maneuverable
Ki-44-II - Moderately armed interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-45 - twin engined fighter of modest capability
Ki-61-I-Ko - early version of the Ki-61 with four 12.7mm guns and better turning ability
Ki-61-II - late version of the Ki-61, faster, more ammo, cut down rear fuselage
Ki-84-I-Otsu - Ki-84 with four 20mm cannons and perhaps a slightly more powerful engine, might be a light perk plane
Ki-100 - Ki-61-II airframe with a radial engine, slower, better climb
Ki-102 - twin engined attack aircraft with decent performance and some larger guns
N1K1 - float plane fighter
N1K1-J - land based interceptor based on the float plane fighter, a bit lower performance and much less ammo than the N1K2-J
P1Y1 - bomber/torpedo bomber with good performance and the ability to carry two 500kg bombs which would make it very useful for a Japanese bomber
+1 Great List
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I wouldn't be caught dead in a german ride.
Almost this, unless its a scenario or squad thing.
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I have often wondered why there is such a lack of interest from this comunity in Japanese aircraft. I remember a poll from awhile back and the Japanese plane had 13% support.
I can't speak for the rest of the folks who play this game, but I love ALL airplanes and I am excited by the opportunity to fly anything that fought in WW II. Yet most people who play here are only interested USA/British/German planes. It seems odd to me that if you have in interest aviation that you would not enjoy the chance to fly everything.
When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
At this point, with all the planes we have available, there are not many planes left the would "set the MA on it's ear" so asking for a revolution seems a bit much.
Hanger queens? the only thing that makes a plane a hanger queen is the pilots fear to fly it. I can assure you the "hanger queen"is eager to fly....ready to fly ...and she would love to get in the action. It's the pilots who are afraid, not the airframe, she has more then enough courage.
I guess it just seems odd to me that there is no interest in Japanese planes. Even more puzzling is how strongly players oppose HTC making more Japanese planes. All I can hope for is: when we have 20 versions of the spit ...20 versions of the p51 and 20 versions of the 109 ...maybe ...just maybe ...we could get a ki-43? ...or a ki-44? .....or a Nell ? I'll take anything. I'll continue to hold out hope!
Helm ...out
As both a history buff, and a LW MA junky, I wm exactly the the person who doesn't vote for some of the historical planes. The reason is simple, I am most interested in planes that affect game play; that change it in by adding depth via a new dimension.
The way you do that is adding planes that excede at something, and kind of stink at something else. This forces players to leard to play to it's strengths and have to avoid it's weaknesses.
Ask this Question "Does this new plane change the fight compared to something we already have. Does it change it enough that it's worth the time and resources to add it?"
To add the Ki-43, it would need to be different enough from say it's nearest similar plane...the Zeke.
To add the P-63, it would need to be different enough from say it's nearest similar plane...the P-39.
Then you figure how much work the new plane or varient takes to bring to the game, and you divide the difference by the effort. Low numbers mean you don't do it.
In the case of the Ki-43, a low number results. Model a whole new plane from the ground up, so effort is max. If a Corsair comes across a Zeke, and a fight ensues, would the resulting fight be different if the Zeke was an Oscar? The oscar is like a Zeke the turns better, but is slower and has less guns. The extra turn doesn't change the fight. The slower speed and the less guns, just makes the oscar even more vulnerable in that fight. When a plane runs away, the Zeke can't catch it but neither can the Oscar. So no one would take an Oscar, they'd take the Zeke.
In the case of the P-63, a medium number results. Model a whole new plane from the ground up, so effort is max. If a Corsair comes across an airacobra, and a fight ensues, would the fight be different if the airacobra was a Kingcobra? The cobras have the same quirky gun package but with 500 more HP and 50-60 mph more speed the KingKobra changes the E-game significantly compared to the Airacobra, but it's turn capability may be less. If someone runs the P-39 can't catch them, but the P-63 could run down most LW birds. It become a very different fight.
Since it gives a new and different fight, I'd vote for the P-63. Not because it's a super plane that gives me an advantage, but it creates a different set of competive trade offs that I have to master to be successful.
That's the fun.....for me. :salute
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We do seem to have a bit of relative over-representation of American planes. Then again, America also seemed to produce the most planes since the Axis had a difficult time bombing American industry.
I'm all for more planes, I don't care where the new ones come from.
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Then again, America also seemed to produce the most planes since the Axis had a difficult time bombing American industry.
In numeric quantity as a whole, yes, as a number of types, not so much of a dominance. The US flew so many types because the USAAF and USN had almost completely separate type inventories. The RAF and RN had more overlap and also relied on American designed and built types. The VVS, Luftwaffe and Regia Aeronautica did not have naval counterparts. The Japanese, on the other hand, flew almost as many types as we did, though in much smaller numbers, because they also had a army and navy that had almost completely separate type inventories.
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In the case of the Ki-43, a low number results. Model a whole new plane from the ground up, so effort is max. If a Corsair comes across a Zeke, and a fight ensues, would the resulting fight be different if the Zeke was an Oscar? The oscar is like a Zeke the turns better, but is slower and has less guns. The extra turn doesn't change the fight. The slower speed and the less guns, just makes the oscar even more vulnerable in that fight. When a plane runs away, the Zeke can't catch it but neither can the Oscar. So no one would take an Oscar, they'd take the Zeke.
In the case of the P-63, a medium number results. Model a whole new plane from the ground up, so effort is max. If a Corsair comes across an airacobra, and a fight ensues, would the fight be different if the airacobra was a Kingcobra? The cobras have the same quirky gun package but with 500 more HP and 50-60 mph more speed the KingKobra changes the E-game significantly compared to the Airacobra, but it's turn capability may be less. If someone runs the P-39 can't catch them, but the P-63 could run down most LW birds. It become a very different fight.
Since it gives a new and different fight, I'd vote for the P-63. Not because it's a super plane that gives me an advantage, but it creates a different set of competive trade offs that I have to master to be successful.
That's the fun.....for me. :salute
I'm sorry but I can not agree with that reasoning. If its gotta be bigger, better, faster to be included then that leaves out way to many planes for me.
Funny how speed is the one paper stat that so many people focus on, yet for me "fights" never really happen at full speed :headscratch:
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has anybody thought that the reason theres not much more for the japanese planeset is because the plane models may not exist enough in records or in replicas/WWII aircraft to actually duplicate in game? As is i know of very few A6Ms still in existance. id be astonished if you can find an Oscar anywhere on the globe
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Vinkman has a decent point. I don't mind adding neat early or mid-war birds though they end up with very little use. They are so overmatched by late war it's not a real competition...unless they slow to turnfight. In the end we see them rarely.
If we add great early/mid birds for scenarios three thumbs up!
Boo
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has anybody thought that the reason theres not much more for the japanese planeset is because the plane models may not exist enough in records or in replicas/WWII aircraft to actually duplicate in game? As is i know of very few A6Ms still in existance. id be astonished if you can find an Oscar anywhere on the globe
Actually a company not that far from HTC made some replica Ki-43s from some salvaged wrecks. I don't recall where they ended up but I did see one doing acrobatics over the lake near my house one day. Very cool to say the least.
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has anybody thought that the reason theres not much more for the japanese planeset is because the plane models may not exist enough in records or in replicas/WWII aircraft to actually duplicate in game? As is i know of very few A6Ms still in existance. id be astonished if you can find an Oscar anywhere on the globe
There is one flying Ki-43 and several awaiting restoration. There is one Ki-84 existent non-flying although it was flying in the 1980s. There is one Ki-100 I-Otsu remaining (no other variants exist) also not flying, engine restored to running order in the 1980s. The spinner, propellor and oil cooler on this aircraft were replaced by non production parts during the war following a belly landing.
Edited for shocking grammar.
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vinkman,
Disregarding the false claim that the Ki-43 was slower than the A6M, you should consider things beyond what happens when you something in your F4U. Compare what happens when an A6M meets a Ki-43, or a B239 or a Hurricane meets the Ki-43. All of those are different fights than when they meet an A6M. The Ki-43 is such a core aircraft from WWII that what is needed is not one Ki-43, but three of them, the 315mph Ki-43-I, 330mph Ki-43-II and 365mph Ki-43-III.
The P-63 is a footnote and should be a very long time in coming to AH.
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I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
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Actually a company not that far from HTC made some replica Ki-43s from some salvaged wrecks. I don't recall where they ended up but I did see one doing acrobatics over the lake near my house one day. Very cool to say the least.
There is one flying Ki-43 and several awaiting restoration. There is one Ki-84 existent non-flying although it was flying in the 1980s. There is one Ki-100 I-Otsu remaining (no other variants exist) also not flying, engine restored to running order in the 1980s. The spinner, propellor and oil cooler on this aircraft were replaced by non production parts during the war following a belly landing.
Edited for shocking grammar.
then i can understand the introduction of the KI43 into AH as the KI84 has enough information to be given the rights it has in here. what im sayin though is if there isnt enough information to model the aircraft correctly to what it was in real life then why have it here in the first place? granted id absolutely LOVE to see more japanese aviation in here but it doesnt seem possible to model them correctly...
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Conjecturing that Aces High uses some version of Blade Element Theory at the core of its flight modelling and there are still types in existence, or even original blueprints or even faithful scale models (all of which would give you a fairly accurate physical shape), coupled with the manufacturer's specification and data and various flight reports I should say you have most of what you need to make a very faithful representation. Or am I missing something essential?
I hope not or bang goes my eternal dream that I'll one day see the Westland Whirlwind here too.
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I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
You may need to see a psychiatrist.
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I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
There is not a big enough roll-eyes smiley icon to express my utter disdain for this line of "thought". Yes, the Japanese empire did a sneak attack on us, then we kicked their tulips back to Japan and dropped two nukes on them. Now they are one of our strongest allies. I think we can let Pearl Harbor go now and count it even.
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There is not a big enough roll-eyes smiley icon to express my utter disdain for this line of "thought". Yes, the Japanese empire did a sneak attack on us, then we kicked their tulips back to Japan and dropped two nukes on them. Now they are one of our strongest allies. I think we can let Pearl Harbor go now and count it even.
No, every now and then I have screaming, cursing outbursts at my English squaddies over vox, since I'm still sore about them burning Washington during the War of 1812. :furious :furious :furious
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has anybody thought that the reason theres not much more for the japanese planeset is because the plane models may not exist enough in records or in replicas/WWII aircraft to actually duplicate in game? As is i know of very few A6Ms still in existance. id be astonished if you can find an Oscar anywhere on the globe
Actually you don't even need to leave the US :D
http://www.flyingheritage.com/TemplatePlane.aspx?contentId=14 (http://www.flyingheritage.com/TemplatePlane.aspx?contentId=14)
(http://www.flyingheritage.com/images/Slideshows/plane/Hayabusa-1.jpg)
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I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
Honestly, even if your the "payback type", I think we got our "payback" over that one and can now let it go. We did , after all, almost anihilate them as a people.
More Japanese planeset missions would energize the set. We used to have lots of IJN/IJA plane set missions and dont anymore. Kinda silly most of all since we now have the Betty bomber.
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Ya cant really cause any damage by running them into ships so whats the point??
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:)
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(http://i1114.photobucket.com/albums/k526/rwrk2/pointandlaugh.gif)
I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
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I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
So I'm guessing you don't eat hot dogs or hamburgers as they are derivatives from the German bratwurst and Hamburg rindfleisch?
I guess you could attempt embrace a strict diet of 'American cheese', icecream & Twinkies...
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No, every now and then I have screaming, cursing outbursts at my English squaddies over vox, since I'm still sore about them burning Washington during the War of 1812. :furious :furious :furious
why stop there?
I refuse to speak english because the bloody English colonized us.... (oh wait I'm of European decent :uhoh)
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why stop there?
I refuse to speak english because the bloody English colonized us.... (oh wait I'm of European decent :uhoh)
Well, I'm part English, part Irish, and part Scottish. Every now and then I just slap the $h!t outta myself for what a percentage of me did in the past.
Don't even get me started on what I do to the German part of me. :uhoh
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Actually you don't even need to leave the US :D
http://www.flyingheritage.com/TemplatePlane.aspx?contentId=14 (http://www.flyingheritage.com/TemplatePlane.aspx?contentId=14)
(http://www.flyingheritage.com/images/Slideshows/plane/Hayabusa-1.jpg)
we already established that theres one :lol
read my second post as to why i wrote that first one :aokWell, I'm part English, part Irish, and part Scottish. Every now and then I just slap the $h!t outta myself for what a percentage of me did in the past.
Don't even get me started on what I do to the German part of me. :uhoh
English, French Canadian (therefore part french too), Irish and more Irish. you think you have it bad? :rofl
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Well, I'm part English, part Irish, and part Scottish. Every now and then I just slap the $h!t outta myself for what a percentage of me did in the past.
Don't even get me started on what I do to the German part of me. :uhoh
:lol :aok
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My wife is half Italian, half Croation. When I come home I never know if I'm going to get laid, or killed, but either way, dinner is gunna be yummie !
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I have often wondered why there is such a lack of interest from this comunity in Japanese aircraft. I remember a poll from awhile back and the Japanese plane had 13% support.
I can't speak for the rest of the folks who play this game, but I love ALL airplanes and I am excited by the opportunity to fly anything that fought in WW II. Yet most people who play here are only interested USA/British/German planes. It seems odd to me that if you have in interest aviation that you would not enjoy the chance to fly everything.
When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
At this point, with all the planes we have available, there are not many planes left the would "set the MA on it's ear" so asking for a revolution seems a bit much.
Hanger queens? the only thing that makes a plane a hanger queen is the pilots fear to fly it. I can assure you the "hanger queen"is eager to fly....ready to fly ...and she would love to get in the action. It's the pilots who are afraid, not the airframe, she has more then enough courage.
I guess it just seems odd to me that there is no interest in Japanese planes. Even more puzzling is how strongly players oppose HTC making more Japanese planes. All I can hope for is: when we have 20 versions of the spit ...20 versions of the p51 and 20 versions of the 109 ...maybe ...just maybe ...we could get a ki-43? ...or a ki-44? .....or a Nell ? I'll take anything. I'll continue to hold out hope!
Helm ...out
I love them, they are different kinds of planes and most are excellently designed... they're just not my type of plane; very fast, durable, and a precision shooting instrument.
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I think the problem guys are having with the Japanese planes can be summed up in two words... Pearl Harbor! That GD sneak attack which took place over 70 years ago still doesn't sit well with a lot of people. And I happen to be one of them. Case in point, last night my wife dragged me to a Sushi restaurant to celebrate her sister's 40th birthday. To avoid an argument I agreed to go, but not once during the evening did I stop looking over my shoulder to see if the chef was sneaking up behind me with a sushi knife nor did I stop eyeing the waiter as he came at us full bore with a dessert tray. Some people just can't let things go.
I appreciate your feelings I lost a 3 family members in the Pacific War. You must realise one thing though, countries don't go to War for little reason. The United States was more powerful in everyway to Japan. The USA military, and USA's ability to produce WAR materials dwarfed the Japanese's mostly agrarian economy. The Japanese attacking the USA was like a NFL quaterback starting a fight with a defensive lineman, a hopeless battle from the start.
So why did they attack the USA?
In every argument and dispute in life there are two sides to the story. The Japanese were not this bunch fiendish characters with coke bottle glass that Hollywood movies portrays. They did not attack USA, and Britian just to kill or make misery. They were NOT attempting to take over the world either. The Japanese wished to the be the dominant power in Asia. They viewed the presence of USA and Britian as western interference in a area of the world where the Japanese felt they should be in charge. Their ambitions were no worse the our's. The USA wanted to be in charge as well, so you can see this would be a major friction point.
USA politicians made things far worse and pushed the Japanese to War by imposing crushing economic sanctions, tariffs, embargo's on the Japanese. Japan felt that she had little choice but to fight. The Congress, The Senate and the President of the USA are very much to blame for the War starting. The policies they enacted convinced the Japanese Government that they were being driven towards extinction. Even a good dog if backed in a corrnor, and poked with a stick long enough will bite. Think of the scene in the Movie "The Christmas Story" where the kid Ralphie is being teased by the big bully. At one point Ralphie goes nuts and attacks the bully. This is kind of what happened to the Japanese ...they had just had enough
The Japanese never even dreamed of invading the USA. Yamamoto's plan was push the US and Britian out of Asia ...then sue for piece. The Japanese were well aware that they lacked the resources to conquer the world. The attack on Pearl was never intended to be a surprise attack, much like the USA politicians failed the American people by pushing the Japanese into War, the Japanese politicians failed their people by not giving timely notice to the USA prior to hostilities commencing.
Please do not misunderstand me, DURING the war the Japanese did many many horrible things to captured people. Their conduct during the War was awful. Nothing excuses this, but the reasons that the war started in the first place has little to do with their conduct during the war, or their surprise attacks. The fact that their attacks were a surprise was a blunder not a plan.
Remember it takes 2 people to argue and have a fight. Each side has their reasons. I hope you find this information helpful.
Helm ...out
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Me I am Scottish,English,Irish,French,Portuguese,Brazilian,etc (some many that i cant even remember) :banana: :noid
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Half Irish, half English... Half of me can't stand the other half...
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Half Irish, half English... Half of me can't stand the other half...
Ahh kitu kama vita ndani. Naam nadhani kwa sababu sisi wote ni awali kutoka Afrika, mimi ili pamoja na kuzungumza Kiswahili.
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I'm a mix of Finnish, German, English, French, Dutch, a bit of Native American and some other stuff. My mom says the Native American is there, but I am skeptical of that. Finnish is the biggest chunk at 25% and my last name.
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100% Vietnamese. :) Was even born there too.
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Irish, English, American Indian
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Irish, English, American Indian
your diddlyed!
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your uplifted!
Snicker :aok
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vinkman,
Disregarding the false claim that the Ki-43 was slower than the A6M, you should consider things beyond what happens when you something in your F4U. Compare what happens when an A6M meets a Ki-43, or a B239 or a Hurricane meets the Ki-43. All of those are different fights than when they meet an A6M. The Ki-43 is such a core aircraft from WWII that what is needed is not one Ki-43, but three of them, the 315mph Ki-43-I, 330mph Ki-43-II and 365mph Ki-43-III.
The P-63 is a footnote and should be a very long time in coming to AH.
All true but those planes are in rare use in the LW MA. Adding another slow turny bird with low firpower, will not change the mix of planes or fights. It will just mean one less A6m because the A6M guy decided to take an Oscar. I think what you said is true for EW, but that's my point....there's no one in that arena.
My point was a P-63 would probably mean a bunch of P-63, at the expense of something else like K4s, or fewer Yak9s. That adds diversity to the mix and adds competitiveness.
Again remember that my comments are reserved to the effect on LW MA game ply and plane use. :salute
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All true but those planes are in rare use in the LW MA. Adding another slow turny bird with low firpower, will not change the mix of planes or fights. It will just mean one less A6m because the A6M guy decided to take an Oscar. I think what you said is true for EW, but that's my point....there's no one in that arena.
My point was a P-63 would probably mean a bunch of P-63, at the expense of something else like K4s, or fewer Yak9s. That adds diversity to the mix and adds competitiveness.
Again remember that my comments are reserved to the effect on LW MA game ply and plane use. :salute
I disagree.... there was a guy in EW 4 nights back at around 7:35 to 8:15 pm central time. Please do not make assumptions.
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I'm sorry but I can not agree with that reasoning. If its gotta be bigger, better, faster to be included then that leaves out way to many planes for me.
Funny how speed is the one paper stat that so many people focus on, yet for me "fights" never really happen at full speed :headscratch:
The reason that in LW MA if you are in a slow plane and get an tactical advantage, everyone just hits the throttle and walks away from you. The speed is required to FORCE a turn fight. When I fly the K4 every fights ends up a stall fight. Players know they're only option is to try to out turn it, because they can't out run it. When I fly a P-39, which is a better turning plane, no one turn fights, because they can all just walk a way and wave bye bye. So it's turn ability and quirky huge cannon are wasted.
I see the P-63 as the P-39Q you can't run away from. When I catch 'em in a 63, I'll still miss with that bazooka anyway. Trying is the fun. It's not a Bigger, Better, Faster Superplane :salute
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I disagree.... there was a guy in EW 4 nights back at around 7:35 to 8:15 pm central time. Please do not make assumptions.
lol :rofl
He was lost and ended up there by accident. I think he thought is was the Sandra Flook support group chat room.
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Speed is everything. If you can't catch them, they won't fight.
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If the P-63 lives up to its claimed performance on the forums, i.e. speed of an La-7 and turn of an A6M5, it will be rare because it will be perked.
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Speed is everything. If you can't catch them, they won't fight.
That is more a reflection of the timid player base than it is of anything else. Unless flying a perk plane there are no penalties to death, one only has to gain from it...
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take up flying Emils, tame that cowardess. :banana:
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japanese b-24 of flying boat version.
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F1M PETE or the A6M2-N RUFE Id fly the heck outta both these aircraft and they would add a legit scout aircraft for the IJN.
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Personally I have a great deal of interest, especially for Ki-61-I and Ki-44-II. Any new Japanese fighter would certainly get air time from me.
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If the P-63 lives up to its claimed performance on the forums, i.e. speed of an La-7 and turn of an A6M5, it will be rare because it will be perked.
I don't think anyone ever said it turns like a Zeke, or attributed super plane like numbers to it that I can recall. It will be a competitive LW plane for speed and turn, and have a lousy gun package.
I see it as:
Flat turning better than a pony, but not as good as a spit...Perhaps like a 109F.
Rolling like a 190-A5
Accelerate and climb like a Pony
Top speed of F4U-1A, or D. (410mph)
Gun package of a P-39
Fuel range of an La7
Rear visibility of a 109 Emil.
ENY will be in the 25 to 30 Range.
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Vinkman,
Per Widewing, IIRC, it would be able to run down La-7s on the deck.
fyi, the Bf109F-4 out turns every Spitfire in AH other than the Mk I, Mk V and maybe the Seafire.
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Speed is everything. If you can't catch them, they won't fight.
This is why I love the La-7.
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Vinkman,
Per Widewing, IIRC, it would be able to run down La-7s on the deck.
fyi, the Bf109F-4 out turns every Spitfire in AH other than the Mk I, Mk V and maybe the Seafire.
Are you sure about that? That has not been my experience. Compitive, but not better. Back up anyone?
As for running down La7s. Hmmm, all of the P-63 data I've seen is "A" model with WEP, which I believe was 1300hp base, and 1500 WEP. I have seen A models listed as "wet" WEP, but I have not seen HP ratings for that engine. Everything I've seen shows top HP rating for "A" variants as 1500HP. It is my understanding that the C model made 1800hp with wet WEP, but I have not seen any test data for this variant.
I've never seen a speed chart that shows a P-63 faster than an La7 on the deck. Does anyone have sucha chart?
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fyi, the Bf109F-4 out turns every Spitfire in AH other than the Mk I, Mk V and maybe the Seafire.
Either you are trolling or you are drunk. The statement is wildly inaccurate. Go get badboys bootstrap calc, see for your self... spits, ki84, etc.. all out turn the k4.
Or check this page...
http://gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php (http://gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php)
or if your lazy here..
(http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/v2p4i.png)
EDIT: I'm sorry, I just noticed you said F4 not k4.... yeah the F4 is close but its not as good as you state it...
(http://www.freeimagehosting.net/newuploads/dviqe.png)
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What was that again. Sorry hear the phone.
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My "Japanese wishlist":
B6N2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B5N2
B7A2 - carrier torpedo bomber/level bomber, replacement for the B6N2, all carriers lost before it entered service
D4Y1 - carrier dive bomber, replacement for the D3A, fastest dive bomber of WWII
H8K2 - well protected high performance flying boat, patrol aircraft/bomber/torpedo bomber
J2M3 and J2M5 - interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-43-I, Ki-43-II and Ki-43-III - most common IJA fighter, lightly armed and built but extremely maneuverable
Ki-44-II - Moderately armed interceptor with good climb and decent speed
Ki-45 - twin engined fighter of modest capability
Ki-61-I-Ko - early version of the Ki-61 with four 12.7mm guns and better turning ability
Ki-61-II - late version of the Ki-61, faster, more ammo, cut down rear fuselage
Ki-84-I-Otsu - Ki-84 with four 20mm cannons and perhaps a slightly more powerful engine, might be a light perk plane
Ki-100 - Ki-61-II airframe with a radial engine, slower, better climb
Ki-102 - twin engined attack aircraft with decent performance and some larger guns
N1K1 - float plane fighter
N1K1-J - land based interceptor based on the float plane fighter, a bit lower performance and much less ammo than the N1K2-J
P1Y1 - bomber/torpedo bomber with good performance and the ability to carry two 500kg bombs which would make it very useful for a Japanese bomber
Great list
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Personally .. I would like to see a new countries plane/s added before anything from countries all ready in the game.
Add these Countries:
IAR80/81..........Romania
Boomerang........Australia
D-520..............France
Of countries all ready in the game the Italian set is the weakest.
New Countries,
+1
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I'm sorry but I don't carry much for the Japapanese airpranes either. For one they bombed Pearl Harbor, so I don't care. Sounds wierd but I hate them.
:headscratch:
as far as I knew the Japanese pilots flying the said planes bombed the Harbor....are you telling me the planes flew themselves and bombed it????
that's like saying you hate hammers because you smashed your thumb with one.
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Actually enjoy flying the kites of the empire, myself.
Flying Axis 99% of the year in FSO, we log allot of sorties in them all, in...an environment that adds much realism to the fight, not only that FSO is a one life effort, but other factors as well, and when flown smartly...they perform well and are enjoyable to engage with. Most are simply overwhelmed in the MA late war environment, lacking a dedicated force to pursue their use.
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there is no counter for the runner in a Japanese plane - but - if you take a few chances and draw them in close, you can get a fight. . .but most pilots are far too timid and will just dive away at the first sign of trouble.
The only real axis counter is in the 190d and the 109k4.
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:headscratch:
as far as I knew the Japanese pilots flying the said planes bombed the Harbor....are you telling me the planes flew themselves and bombed it????
that's like saying you hate hammers because you smashed your thumb with one.
:lol
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I have often wondered why there is such a lack of interest from this comunity in Japanese aircraft. I remember a poll from awhile back and the Japanese plane had 13% support.
I can't speak for the rest of the folks who play this game, but I love ALL airplanes and I am excited by the opportunity to fly anything that fought in WW II. Yet most people who play here are only interested USA/British/German planes. It seems odd to me that if you have in interest aviation that you would not enjoy the chance to fly everything.
When a new Japanese plane is suggested legions of people line up to say: "what a waste of time it would be" ...or "it would be a hanger queen" or the one that irks me most ..."it would not revolutionize the MA"
At this point, with all the planes we have available, there are not many planes left the would "set the MA on it's ear" so asking for a revolution seems a bit much.
Hanger queens? the only thing that makes a plane a hanger queen is the pilots fear to fly it. I can assure you the "hanger queen"is eager to fly....ready to fly ...and she would love to get in the action. It's the pilots who are afraid, not the airframe, she has more then enough courage.
I guess it just seems odd to me that there is no interest in Japanese planes. Even more puzzling is how strongly players oppose HTC making more Japanese planes. All I can hope for is: when we have 20 versions of the spit ...20 versions of the p51 and 20 versions of the 109 ...maybe ...just maybe ...we could get a ki-43? ...or a ki-44? .....or a Nell ? I'll take anything. I'll continue to hold out hope!
Helm ...out
Goth & Yourself instilled the love of the Ki-61 back in 2002. I miss flying your wing my Former C.O. :salute
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In the right hands, a N1K2 fears nothing but a patient energy pilot (with a bit more E).
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.
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The Zero is a excellent plane, I used to fly the A6M2 a lot as a beginner plane. I was never a big fan of Axis planes but some did have there advantages. I grew into the Ki-84 and Ki-61 both excellent planes. I probably will have to start back in them again to get the rust off my joystick, before I can fly the P-47D-40 again. :P
Warthog
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Ive grown very fond of the KI-84. Besides the KI-67 bomber its the only rising sun plane Ive really gotten into.
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Couldn't agree more with the original post on this thread. However my biggest complaint again planesets and new planes. Is that HT should of completed the conversion of all AH1 aircraft to AH2 spec as it's highest priority over introducing any new planes or GV's, let alone the development time spent (wasted) on the WW1 theatre.
<S>...-Gixer
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I find their special effects a bit challenged. I just watched Godzilla vs Megalon. :bhead
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Ive grown very fond of the KI-84. Besides the KI-67 bomber its the only rising sun plane Ive really gotten into.
Thanks to INK's skin the Ki-84 is the only plane i've really been flying, and been avoiding Ground vehicles all together.
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Thanks to INK's skin the Ki-84 is the only plane i've really been flying, and been avoiding Ground vehicles all together.
Does it have tats :)
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Couldn't agree more with the original post on this thread. However my biggest complaint again planesets and new planes. Is that HT should of completed the conversion of all AH1 aircraft to AH2 spec as it's highest priority over introducing any new planes or GV's, let alone the development time spent (wasted) on the WW1 theatre.
<S>...-Gixer
To be fair, most of this has been done by now. All we have left that needs to be revised:
wildcats
hurricanes
110s
ju88
b26
lanc
d3a
b5n
A20s
SBD
TBM
Ki61
Ar234
Me163
Yaks
C2s
So out of 100 or so the majority have been updated. About 23 left to do.
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Ki-67 as well.
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Does it have tats :)
Right on the tail :aok
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late war japanese planes will be available in the AVA this week. come and play. bring a friend!
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To be fair, most of this has been done by now. All we have left that needs to be revised:
wildcats
hurricanes
110s
ju88
b26
lanc
d3a
b5n
A20s
SBD
TBM
Ki61
Ar234
Me163
Yaks
C2s
So out of 100 or so the majority have been updated. About 23 left to do.
Tempest missing.
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Thanks to INK's skin the Ki-84 is the only plane i've really been flying, and been avoiding Ground vehicles all together.
Thanx man :salute
2 more ingame as of today....51B and P40E :rock
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Their ambitions were no worse the our's.
Please do not misunderstand me, DURING the war the Japanese did many many horrible things to captured people. Their conduct during the War was awful. Nothing excuses this, but the reasons that the war started in the first place has little to do with their conduct during the war, or their surprise attacks.
Maybe I'm misremembering here, but I'm pretty sure the Nanjing Massacre was a good bit before poor lil' set upon Japan was "forced" into attacking every other power in the region.
And it wasn't just captured enemies. Thailand was a Japanese ally and yet tens of thousands of Thais were worked to death along with Allied POWs and civilians from subjugated countries. The Japanese had been treating Koreans the same way for decades. Their empire was savage and brutal even compared to the worst excesses of European colonialists.
The Japanese government of the day was no better than the Nazis, and in many ways worse. They were hyperviolent, routinely assassinating anyone who dissented from their lust for conquest. One reason Yamamoto was given command of the Combined Fleet was to give him a seagoing command and get him out of Tokyo because the Navy leadership understood that if he stayed in the capital he was certain to be assassinated for opposing the Army's warmongering (on pragmatic, not ethical, grounds). Think about it, this was the guy who was chiefly responsible for the attack on Pearl Harbor, and his own government was going to murder him for being too pacifist! And this cult of aggressive war and rule by assassination went well back into the preceding decades, long before the US or anyone else imposed sanctions on Japan. The government was hanging Buddhist priests in 1911 for opposing the government's militarism (among other things) - Google Uchiyama Gudō sometime.
The Roosevelt administration was generally anti-colonial and the US had already committed to freeing the Philippines, its only significant colony in the Pacific. The reasons it rightly resisted Japanese aggression were, in no particular order, (1) Desire to prevent a Pacific distraction from the all-important task of defeating Hitlerism in Europe, (2) The many, many routine and well-documented atrocities carried out by the Japanese in China without the slightest shred of justification, and (3) Desire not to see a European hegemony in Asia that was plainly (to anyone but the colonial powers) on its eventual way out replaced by Japanese hegemony that was orders of magnitude more brutal and potentially much longer-lasting. I don't see how anyone could take issue with any of these motives.
The Allies in Asia and the PTO were not always in the right, but that doesn't mean that Japan was not always in the wrong. The Russian government was pretty nasty too, but that didn't excuse Hitler for unilaterally launching a war of pure aggression and extermination against the people unfortunate enough to live in the USSR. Japanese people weren't inherently bad any more than German people were, but their government in 1941 was absolutely atrocious and didn't need arm-twisting from anyone to launch aggressive wars against anyone who had stood in the way of anything they wanted.
Of course, this doesn't have much to do with the lack of interest in Japanese warplanes. For most aviation buffs planes aren't political. But I wouldn't confuse lack of interest in early war deathtraps with lack of interest in Japanese planes generally. I love flying (in-game) and reading about WW2 Japanese planes, and planes like the Ki-67, Ki-84, and N1K2 are valuable additions to the plane set, but the Ki-43 would be nothing but a target in the MA, it has absolutely no virtues to recommend it. It's a bamboo and rice paper tinderbox whose pathetic armament alone would make it nothing but cannon fodder against anything other than Zekes or other Oscars. Just look at the G4M - how often do you see those anywhere except perk farming in deserted arenas? Why on earth would anyone fly one in the MA except as a joke?
There's also the romance factor. Most other nations made a cult of their own aces and as a result people tend to know a lot more about them. For their own political/psychological reasons, the Japanese government didn't do this; it much preferred making a cult of servicemen who died. People want to fly the planes flown by the great aces they've read so much about, less so the planes mostly famous (at least after the first year of the war) mostly for being shot down in record numbers.
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Oh, and I'd definitely have voted for a Ki-44 over the 410. However, if you're looking at history, I don't think the Ki-44 could be said to have had a major impact on the outcome of the war. That's another problem with the Japanese plane set, by the time their better designs started appearing, they weren't able to manufacture many of them, their quality control was horrendous, and most of their pilots were nearly untrained novices, so the planes didn't have much impact.
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The Russian government was pretty nasty too, but that didn't excuse Hitler for unilaterally launching a war of pure aggression and extermination against the people unfortunate enough to live in the USSR
You probably already know this, but some readers here might not. I would say that the Soviets were extremely nasty. They killed more than 10 million of their own people, killed more in their concentration camps than the Nazis did, signed an agreement with the Nazis prior to the start of WWII to conquer Europe and to divide it between them, and started WWII in Europe along with Germany by co-invading Poland and quickly thereafter invading Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and Romania. When the Soviets conquered a region, they typically engaged in large-scale slaughter among the civilian population and, after that, relocated segments of the population to concentration/death camps.
An marvelous book on WWII covering the USSR's full contribution (which is not typically done in western books on WWII) is "No Simple Victory," by Davies.
War between Germany and the USSR was likely inevitable, but if Germany hadn't invaded the USSR and if the USSR had thus stayed a partner of the Nazis, the allies would have found themselves fighting against Germany, Japan, Italy, *and* the USSR, and the course of history would have been a great deal different.
In fact, given that 80% or more of WWII in Europe was between Germany and the USSR (as measured by land area, size of battles, number of troops involved, number of casualties, number of tanks, or number of guns or any mixture of those), if Germany and the USSR had instead remained on the same side, the allies probably would not have been able to stop Germany and the USSR from taking and holding all of Europe (and perhaps more after that).
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Bah ... don't worry about the runners .. they aren't worth the fight anyway...just fodder .... the ones that stick around is all that matters .... BnZer's are painful ... but they eventually leave cause they can't deal with the frustration of missing or slow down too much and die hahaha .....
So... you're suggesting a BNZ plane should stick around... and turn fight?? :rolleyes:
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My wife is half Italian, half Croation. When I come home I never know if I'm going to get laid, or killed, but either way, dinner is gunna be yummie !
That was flippin' funny.
I see zekes, nikis and kis everywhere. As (mostly) a 109F driver, I'd like to fly the Ki-43. I'm used to having to work with feeble guns. That plane, not the zeke, was the #1 japanese fighter of the war... Having said that, I don't think you can go much longer without adding the He-111 for gawd's sake. The Russian Pe-2, the Italian SM-79... There are very significant aircraft that should be added because many of us play this thing for FSO and because we love WWII aircraft - not because of scores (although I wish I could improve mine - damnit!).