Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: CAP1 on May 18, 2012, 04:34:14 PM
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that is the new gt500 bone stock right down to the tires. a good .3 faster than the zl1, and still .1 faster than the zl1 on drag radials.
next up, hammer em on the 'ring, then the tracks here. :devil
almost forgot.....those 11.8's were in 2,000ft density altitude. imagine if it were good air. good air, and drag radials probably put this thing down in the 11.5 or quicker area.
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Pretty fast Cap! but how many gas stations can it pass....... :devil
The new stangs are nice and likely much faster and handle better than the old ones but I lost interest in them after the 71 mach 1.
Now Acura's new 276 hp RDX is more my speed these days! maybe abit to fast for me.. :rofl :rofl :rofl
:salute
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Pretty fast Cap! but how many gas stations can it pass....... :devil
The new stangs are nice and likely much faster and handle better than the old ones but I lost interest in them after the 71 mach 1.
Now Acura's new 276 hp RDX is more my speed these days! maybe abit to fast for me.. :rofl :rofl :rofl
:salute
i forget the exact numbers, but it is still good enough to avoid the gas guzzler tax that a certain other hotrod can't avoid.
that all said, i thought i was gonna be ordering myself an 013 boss302 tonight.
there was a guy out in the lot drooling over my gt. i yelled out the door, as i was aligning timing marks, "37,000 and it's yours!". he looked at me, then drooled a bit more.......almost lingering like he thought real hard about it.
if i got that much for my gt, that'd pay her off, and give me enough of a down payment that i should be able to get a well equipped boss for the same monthly payment. :devil
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almost forgot.....those 11.8's were in 2,000ft density altitude. imagine if it were good air. good air, and drag radials probably put this thing down in the 11.5 or quicker area.
Curious. Will the gain in HP from the denser air offset the increase in drag from the denser air?
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Curious. Will the gain in HP from the denser air offset the increase in drag from the denser air?
nope. 2k density altitude should make in the ballpark of .2 difference in the 1/4. at least that's about how much it used to effect my camaro.
the thing that got me, is the 2.0 60ft times. that is S L O W for that et. it should be more in the 1.6 to 1.7 range for 11.8's. there's no video of the runs yet, so i don't know if he was spinning off the line, or babying it......i think there's more good stuff to come from this though.
god i wish i could afford one...........
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Had 3 stangs thru the years. I'd chop off 3 fingers for a new GT.
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Id like to see the zl1 and the gt500 go at it at a road course. :D
Kinda off topic, but the boss 302 stang is awsome!
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Blah blah blah you still haven't done a single pass in your car, slacker.
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Where are the road course times?
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The GT 500 ain't going to touch the ZL1 on the turny tracks :)
The mustang built for turny tracks can't touch it.
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The GT 500 ain't going to touch the ZL1 on the turny tracks :)
The mustang built for turny tracks can't touch it.
there's rumors that the two gt500's that were at the ring last year(a red one and a black one) both did in fact match, and beat the zl at the ring. one was rumored to be in the mid 7:40's, the other was rumored to be in the mid 7:30's.
regardless of what anyone says, the shelbys will always outperform the boss mustangs. in every way.
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Where are the road course times?
they've got one at the 'ring now.....we should see them soon. i think it's gonna draw tears from the chevy crowd. :cry
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Blah blah blah you still haven't done a single pass in your car, slacker.
yea i know......it's gonna be awhile with only 1700 on the clock.........
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the only vid i can find so far......prostock style burnouts.......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQUuZ2X65Gc&feature=player_embedded#!
oh...and this one......a little bad weather driving at the ring......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=kqx0YzQEATI&NR=1
looks like she holds the road pretty good. i predict faster than the zl............ :noid
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The Zl1 has already ran the ring..
Ford has not shown much enthusiasm with their new gt500 with an attempt to compete.. :lol
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The Zl1 has already ran the ring..
Ford has not shown much enthusiasm with their new gt500 with an attempt to compete.. :lol
they tested the suspension, and aero last year there. they've got a gt5oo there right now.
the thing i note about the two..........chevy's guy is like your neighbors annoying chiwawa......making a LOT of noise all the time. fords guy is more of the "speak softly and carry a big stick" kind of guy.
both methods are good for keeping people hyped.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoKRbBfXo1M&feature=relmfu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoKRbBfXo1M&feature=relmfu)
nuff said :rofl
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nope. 2k density altitude should make in the ballpark of .2 difference in the 1/4. at least that's about how much it used to effect my camaro.
the thing that got me, is the 2.0 60ft times. that is S L O W for that et. it should be more in the 1.6 to 1.7 range for 11.8's. there's no video of the runs yet, so i don't know if he was spinning off the line, or babying it......i think there's more good stuff to come from this though.
god i wish i could afford one...........
Why would the car care about the 2000ft elevation, the GT500 is supercharged isn't it?
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Why would the car care about the 2000ft elevation, the GT500 is supercharged isn't it?
sure, but a lower air density still equals less boost..
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sure, but a lower air density still equals less boost..
ytou beat me to it.......
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoKRbBfXo1M&feature=relmfu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoKRbBfXo1M&feature=relmfu)
nuff said :rofl
just an fyi....that wasn't a supersnake. at least it didn't look/sound like one.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoKRbBfXo1M&feature=relmfu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoKRbBfXo1M&feature=relmfu)
nuff said :rofl
:rofl :rofl
looks like the dodge has the torque in the bottom end because it left the line the best,but midrange is all cammero...Wow!
And I'm an old ford guy,had to be family was upper management and I'd be disowned.... :furious
:salute
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:rofl :rofl
looks like the dodge has the torque in the bottom end because it left the line the best,but midrange is all cammero...Wow!
And I'm an old ford guy,had to be family was upper management and I'd be disowned.... :furious
:salute
i thought the dodge dude jumped......... :noid
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CAP, really are you going to compare a GT500 to a ZL-1 on a road course? See if you can find a picture of those two GT500's on the track with factory tires, I bet I can find one with the ZL-1 on factory tires. This is the info they don't let out. It's simple physics, the GT500 is how much heavier then a ZL-1, to get close to the same times it has to increase grip dramatically over what the ZL-1 has, to make up for it's increased weight. 200 extra lbs in a corner pulling 1g or more is a lot more extra tire loading then one might think. One day you'd think CAP would get over his corvette envy and just buy one and be done with it :lol
:salute
BigRat
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sure, but a lower air density still equals less boost..
I don't think so because the supercharger is able to pump well over the regulated 8 or whatnot psi. So it will work a bit harder but still provide the sea level boost no?
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I don't think so because the supercharger is able to pump well over the regulated 8 or whatnot psi. So it will work a bit harder but still provide the sea level boost no?
Frenchy, good question I know it effects a turbo car but a charger.......Hmmm???
:salute
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NICE CAP!! :aok
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CAP, really are you going to compare a GT500 to a ZL-1 on a road course? See if you can find a picture of those two GT500's on the track with factory tires, I bet I can find one with the ZL-1 on factory tires. This is the info they don't let out. It's simple physics, the GT500 is how much heavier then a ZL-1, to get close to the same times it has to increase grip dramatically over what the ZL-1 has, to make up for it's increased weight. 200 extra lbs in a corner pulling 1g or more is a lot more extra tire loading then one might think. One day you'd think CAP would get over his corvette envy and just buy one and be done with it :lol
:salute
BigRat
the gt500 is about 250# lighter than the zl1. :aok
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I don't think so because the supercharger is able to pump well over the regulated 8 or whatnot psi. So it will work a bit harder but still provide the sea level boost no?
if they run 8psi boost at sea level, and 8psi boost at 2k alt.......you're gonna get less o2 to burn.
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Frenchy, good question I know it effects a turbo car but a charger.......Hmmm???
:salute
it does indeed affect a supercharged car, just as it would a normally aspirated car.
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Well take that 402 I fly, the turbos will maintain the boost all the way till 18,000ft.
So I'm thinking that supercharger is set at let's say 8 psi. So it gets it's 8 spi and dumps the rest. At 2,000ft the thing will still get it's 8 psi it will just have to gather more 'air', thus o2. The system can't be that much different than a plane turbo and have a "critical altitude' of 0ft. That GT500 supercharger is not maxed out at sea level is it? And whatever PSI it's geared for is not the max available boost it can put out either.
Do I make sense? :devil
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it is a lot different i think.
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sure, but a lower air density still equals less boost..
Well, not until you get to an altitude where the supercharger is no longer able to make up the difference. (Assuming the system is capable of over-boosting the engine at sea level)
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the pullies will spin the supercharger at the same speed, regardless of alt.....or density alt....thus, less air will be force fed to the engine at 2k
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But there's a waste gate isn't it? The pulley will provide boost and the waste gate will make sure it stays there. (Not taht I know much, just trying to understand). I drove a turbocharged diesel truck over the rockies, and man at 8,000ft that thing felt just like at sea level.
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the gt500 is about 250# lighter than the zl1. :aok
Never mind, got ZL-1 confused with ZR-1 :lol :O, I see ZL-1 I still think 69 prototype vette before I think COPO camaro.
:salute
BigRat
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But there's a waste gate isn't it? The pulley will provide boost and the waste gate will make sure it stays there. (Not taht I know much, just trying to understand). I drove a turbocharged diesel truck over the rockies, and man at 8,000ft that thing felt just like at sea level.
no waste gate on a blower
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CAP, really are you going to compare a GT500 to a ZL-1 on a road course? See if you can find a picture of those two GT500's on the track with factory tires, I bet I can find one with the ZL-1 on factory tires. This is the info they don't let out. It's simple physics, the GT500 is how much heavier then a ZL-1, to get close to the same times it has to increase grip dramatically over what the ZL-1 has, to make up for it's increased weight. 200 extra lbs in a corner pulling 1g or more is a lot more extra tire loading then one might think. One day you'd think CAP would get over his corvette envy and just buy one and be done with it :lol
:salute
BigRat
It's simple fact.
2012 ZL1 - 580 horsepower, 556 pound-feet of torque and 4120 pound curb weight.
2013 GT500 - 662 horsepower, 631 pound-feet of torque and 3850 pound curb weight.
Are you laughing because you blinked and realized you are wrong?
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Never mind, got ZL-1 confused with ZR-1 :lol :O, I see ZL-1 I still think 69 prototype vette before I think COPO camaro.
:salute
BigRat
the copo isn't street legal. it's an attempt to compete with the cobrajets. :aok
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Positive diplacement superchargers like on the ZL-1, GT500, ZR-1, my car, etc. don't use a wastegate. This is becouse boost is built after the throttlebody, not before it, like in a centrifigual(sp?) or turbo, Centrifigual(sp?) superchargers do need a waste gate. Boost in these engines is limited by how fast you can spin the blower (pulley sizes) and the engines restriction to flow. Boost and air density go hand and hand. At a given pulley speed and ambient temp the supercharger will displace so much volume of air. Now take that air and cool it and use the same example. Now that the air is denser you have more of it being pushed in for the same pulley revolutions, thereby the pressure built is more (packed in tighter). The opposite is true for heating the air. Now we have come to the reasons of intercoolers and alky injection. We want a consistent air charge tempreture so that we can control things like detonation under boost. My car previous to the alcohol injection would very boost between 7 and 9lbs depending on outside temp and engine heat soak, this is with an intercooler of similiar design to the OE cars above. Now with both the intercooler improvements and Alky injection it stays a pretty stable 9psi, I've seen 9.5 in the winter (makes real good power there :D). So yes altitude does effect these cars, becouse it effects air density. But it's not near the effect that altitude has on normally aspirated cars.
:salute
BigRat
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It's simple fact.
2012 ZL1 - 580 horsepower, 556 pound-feet of torque and 4120 pound curb weight.
2013 GT500 - 662 horsepower, 631 pound-feet of torque and 3850 pound curb weight.
Are you laughing because you blinked and realized you are wrong?
See Above post on getting Z%-1 confused, and I was laughing becouse CAP is a closet vette guy and won't admit it openly
:salute
BigRat
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Positive diplacement superchargers like on the ZL-1, GT500, ZR-1, my car, etc. don't use a wastegate. This is becouse boost is built after the throttlebody, not before it, like in a centrifigual(sp?) or turbo, Centrifigual(sp?) superchargers do need a waste gate. Boost in these engines is limited by how fast you can spin the blower (pulley sizes) and the engines restriction to flow. Boost and air density go hand and hand. At a given pulley speed and ambient temp the supercharger will displace so much volume of air. Now take that air and cool it and use the same example. Now that the air is denser you have more of it being pushed in for the same pulley revolutions, thereby the pressure built is more (packed in tighter). The opposite is true for heating the air. Now we have come to the reasons of intercoolers and alky injection. We want a consistent air charge tempreture so that we can control things like detonation under boost. My car previous to the alcohol injection would very boost between 7 and 9lbs depending on outside temp and engine heat soak, this is with an intercooler of similiar design to the OE cars above. Now with both the intercooler improvements and Alky injection it stays a pretty stable 9psi, I've seen 9.5 in the winter (makes real good power there :D). So yes altitude does effect these cars, becouse it effects air density. But it's not near the effect that altitude has on normally aspirated cars.
:salute
BigRat
very excellent explanation. :aok
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See Above post on getting Z%-1 confused, and I was laughing becouse CAP is a closet vette guy and won't admit it openly
:salute
BigRat
oohh...i've admitted it before......when grey eagle i think it was? was selling his z06, i was interested....i hesitated, and lost on that one.
now, at this point, i prolly won't have one, 'cause if i ditch my gt, i'm gettin a boss302.
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there's rumors that the two gt500's that were at the ring last year(a red one and a black one) both did in fact match, and beat the zl at the ring. one was rumored to be in the mid 7:40's, the other was rumored to be in the mid 7:30's.
regardless of what anyone says, the shelbys will always outperform the boss mustangs. in every way.
Rumors are just that.... rumors.
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very excellent explanation. :aok
The turbo on my diesel has computer adjusted fins. I always thought that was pretty cool.
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Best mustang built. 302 boss, runs with the ZL1 all day and it's 100hp less horse power than the zl1.
(I forgot to mention its naturally aspirated too!)
(http://0.tqn.com/d/mustangs/1/0/5/t/-/-/ag_12boss_ls_ltfrt2.JPG)
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boss don't run with the zl
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On a root blower like the GT500 ... Our on a blower period? Because my friend zo6 has a centrifugal Vortec blower and he has a waste gate. He also has a knob that allows to change the amount of boost.
If you have a blower, and you loose boost/perf with altitude, then it's a piss poor design that doesn't take into account the advantages of force induction over NA. :headscratch: Install your pulley that can actually give you 10 psi at max rpm and regulate the blow off valve to give you your 8 psi max. So when you drag race in Denver you still have your 8 psi. Now that would make sense to me. :)
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On a root blower like the GT500 ... Our on a blower period? Because my friend zo6 has a centrifugal Vortec blower and he has a waste gate. He also has a knob that allows to change the amount of boost.
If you have a blower, and you loose boost/perf with altitude, then it's a piss poor design that doesn't take into account the advantages of force induction over NA. :headscratch: Install your pulley that can actually give you 10 psi at max rpm and regulate the blow off valve to give you your 8 psi max. So when you drag race in Denver you still have your 8 psi. Now that would make sense to me. :)
centrifugal....like a paxton? those boost before the throttle body.
the tvs style like the zl's and the shelbys use boost after the throttle body. the air they get comes through the throttle body first....whatever they compress is goin in the engine.
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boss don't run with the zl
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE4AH4DZtEI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE4AH4DZtEI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
i like the mustang better....but the camaro beats the boss here......
On the road course, the Camaro was 2.4 seconds a lap quicker and almost 10 mph faster at the end of the back straight. Roughly 4 of those mph were courtesy of higher cornering speed carried out of the previous turn.
Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/1203_2012_chevrolet_camaro_zl1_vs_2012_ford_mustang_boss_302_laguna_seca/viewall.html#ixzz1vJntcx6X
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On a root blower like the GT500 ... Our on a blower period? Because my friend zo6 has a centrifugal Vortec blower and he has a waste gate. He also has a knob that allows to change the amount of boost.
If you have a blower, and you loose boost/perf with altitude, then it's a piss poor design that doesn't take into account the advantages of force induction over NA. :headscratch: Install your pulley that can actually give you 10 psi at max rpm and regulate the blow off valve to give you your 8 psi max. So when you drag race in Denver you still have your 8 psi. Now that would make sense to me. :)
There's + and -'s with blower designs. Centrifigal has the advanatage of greater boost potential and control due to a wastegate, so you can actually spin it up for more boost then you actually need and the excess can be vented. It's drawback is that it's not as instantaneous boost as a positive displacement, and requires a lot more piping and engine compartment space. For all practical purposes it's a belt driven turbocharger. Positive displacement blowers are boost controlled over their pulley size, and all of them have an efficiency range (eg. spinning them beyond a certain point doesn't get you much except heat). So you can't set it to give you 10psi boost in Denver and then drive to Louisiana and it still only have 10psi of boost, will be quite a bit more. The opposite true in the other direction. You would have to pulley up or down to keep the boost consistent in a positive displacement, keeping in mind the blowers operating RPM range. One other reason you tend to see positive's at lower boost levels is becouse of the difficulty of intercooling them effectively. Since Boost is built right on top of the engine you only have so much room to cool off the boosted air in. While a centrifigal can run huge intercoolers and lots of piping to help cool the air in, since boost is built well before the engine. Given this, you may thing why would anyone want a positive over a centrifigal? two main reasons and why the OE tends to stick with them. They tend to be a smaller package with less piping and engine space taken, and secondly boost is pretty much instant. They make brutal torque down low, which makes them fun around town. If you want to make big power, centrifigal is the way to go. Almost every boosted car I see over 600 RWHP (that's over 700 engine) is either running a centrifigal or turbo, in large part due to intercooling issues on the positives. Can't run big boost numbers with high intake air temps or your engine isn't long for this world. At 533RWHP my PD blower engine ran into the intake air heat issue and timing had to be kept very timid. So I'm leaving a lot on the table due to heat that I wouldn't have to with a centrifigal with a large intercooler. The alcohol injection helped quite a bit later on when I added it last year, but even then I have to add the alky before the blower so I can't inject too much. I just wanted to get over that 550 mark anyway with my stock bottom end :uhoh
:salute
BigRat
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Cap and mostly Rat, thx makes perfect sense now :cheers:
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just an fyi....that wasn't a supersnake. at least it didn't look/sound like one.
Uploaded in 09 .... no relevance.
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i like the mustang better....but the camaro beats the boss here......
On the road course, the Camaro was 2.4 seconds a lap quicker and almost 10 mph faster at the end of the back straight. Roughly 4 of those mph were courtesy of higher cornering speed carried out of the previous turn.
Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/1203_2012_chevrolet_camaro_zl1_vs_2012_ford_mustang_boss_302_laguna_seca/viewall.html#ixzz1vJntcx6X
True, but the camaro is supercharged and puts alot more power to the wheels over the mustang. For the boss to still be just behind it is incredible. IMO.
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True, but the camaro is supercharged and puts alot more power to the wheels over the mustang. For the boss to still be just behind it is incredible. IMO.
2 seconds on that course is pretty far. the shelby on the other hand, i feel will grip a lot better than anyone expects it to, and will pummel the zl..........
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Uploaded in 09 .... no relevance.
ya know? i didn't even look at the date........ :bhead
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ya know? i didn't even look at the date........ :bhead
That is just what they were hoping for.
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anyone remember this?
Not so fast, says Camaro Chief Engineer Al Oppenheiser (above). Speaking with Autoblog at an Arizona drive event for the Camaro ZL1, Oppenheiser told us, "We've done simulations. We predict that the ZL1 will be quicker to 60 than the [2013] GT500..
guess ford's 1 for 1 right now.......next will be the 'ring....then the road courses.....
kind of crappy videos......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqyGoP2eYC0&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKBUksFviRs&feature=relmfu
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anyone remember this?
Not so fast, says Camaro Chief Engineer Al Oppenheiser (above). Speaking with Autoblog at an Arizona drive event for the Camaro ZL1, Oppenheiser told us, "We've done simulations. We predict that the ZL1 will be quicker to 60 than the [2013] GT500..
guess ford's 1 for 1 right now.......next will be the 'ring....then the road courses.....
kind of crappy videos......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqyGoP2eYC0&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKBUksFviRs&feature=relmfu
"Predictions"? :rofl :rofl :rofl
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"Predictions"? :rofl :rofl :rofl
and simulations mind you. :airplane: :airplane:
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Simulations, predictions... things you do to compare performance with a car that, at that time, didn't exist yet....
And no one (who has all their teeth and had finished the 6th grade) cares about drag racing. Whoopdy. Fricking. Doo.
Road course victory over the Bowtie of FAIL.
Simple as that.
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Simulations, predictions... things you do to compare performance with a car that, at that time, didn't exist yet....
And no one (who has all their teeth and had finished the 6th grade) cares about drag racing. Whoopdy. Fricking. Doo.
Road course victory over the Bowtie of FAIL.
Simple as that.
welllll..technically speaking it did exist. ford's been working on this since 2007 i believe. it's not a response to the zl1..........
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welllll..technically speaking it did exist. ford's been working on this since 2007 i believe. it's not a response to the zl1..........
I'm working on a spaceship that will take me to Mars and help me to conquer the world, have been since 2007. Wanna see it?
in other words, not available to be tested, in this sense, equals "doesn't exist" as far as the rest of the world is concerned.
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11's in a stock car is impressive ..
... alla 'muscle cars' of the '60's-'70's would have had their doors blown off.
Stock.
But .. headers were $25, a decent cam and alla gaskets to put it in, about a hundred bucks.
Tunnel ram and carbs ..a coupla hundred.
Even the big dog blower from BDS back in the day was right around 1k.
Biggest problem was hookin it up
..tires sucked unless you ran wrinkle-walls or Mcreary dirt track tires (G2 compound was like bubble gum :)
And .. they didn't stop, corner, and most needed constant attention on one thing or another.
Not that there was anything wrong with runnin the valves before Saturday's cruise :)
They did sound sweet when everything was 'right.'
-GE aka Frank
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11's in a stock car is impressive ..
... alla 'muscle cars' of the '60's-'70's would have had their doors blown off.
Stock.
But .. headers were $25, a decent cam and alla gaskets to put it in, about a hundred bucks.
Tunnel ram and carbs ..a coupla hundred.
Even the big dog blower from BDS back in the day was right around 1k.
Biggest problem was hookin it up
..tires sucked unless you ran wrinkle-walls or Mcreary dirt track tires (G2 compound was like bubble gum :)
And .. they didn't stop, corner, and most needed constant attention on one thing or another.
Not that there was anything wrong with runnin the valves before Saturday's cruise :)
They did sound sweet when everything was 'right.'
-GE aka Frank
yea they did. but just being in the low 13's will beat over 95% of those hot rods.
here's a fairly interesting article too.....
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/1968-tunnel-port-ford-mustang-vs-chevrolet-camaro-z-28-archived-comparison
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2 seconds on that course is pretty far. the shelby on the other hand, i feel will grip a lot better than anyone expects it to, and will pummel the zl..........
maybe but folks say a IRS will beat a solid axle rear end on a road course most days.. which is a good point to make when racing a 1/4.. The gt will hook better off the line.. the gt has a pretty strong 60ft..
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maybe but folks say a IRS will beat a solid axle rear end on a road course most days.. which is a good point to make when racing a 1/4.. The gt will hook better off the line.. the gt has a pretty strong 60ft..
they do indeed say that. but then i would steer you to look at the continental tire challenge, in which these cars compete directly against each other. the camaro in race trim weighs less than the mustang, has the irs, and a bigger engine. the mustang in race trim weighs a bit more, runs a smaller engine, has a live rear solid axle, and isn't as well balanced as the camaro.....yet it is more than a match for the camaro on those road courses.
last year, the camaros won 2 races, both of which had the top running ford and bmw teams knocked out of the race.......this year, porshce has come back, now that they've got an engine that can compete, and has been wiping the track with both ford and chevy.....but fords are still topping chevys in the series.
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I don't watch much racing but yesterday during Indy 500 trials and testing...... it was all chevy and honda except for 2 lotus engined cars. Both of the lotus cars were running 90 hp below the chevys and hondas.
Ford evidently does not support that type racing.
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I don't watch much racing but yesterday during Indy 500 trials and testing...... it was all chevy and honda except for 2 lotus engined cars. Both of the lotus cars were running 90 hp below the chevys and hondas.
Ford evidently does not support that type racing.
i don't know if they still run in indy or f1 or now.....but the cosworths i think are ford designs.
the racing series i'm talking about is road racing. they're generally factory race cars, that actually still look like the street versions you can buy. and in fords case, for about 105k, you can buy one ready to run in this series.
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i don't know if they still run in indy or f1 or now.....but the cosworths i think are ford designs.
the racing series i'm talking about is road racing. they're generally factory race cars, that actually still look like the street versions you can buy. and in fords case, for about 105k, you can buy one ready to run in this series.
If I unsderstand correctly the ones ford run are not built by ford.... right/ wrong/ what?
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If I unsderstand correctly the ones ford run are not built by ford.... right/ wrong/ what?
which series?
also, there's been talk now that the stock gt500......right down to the tires......has gone 11.53@128mph. probably got outta that 2k density altitude, and lost the 10mph headwind.
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which series?
also, there's been talk now that the stock gt500......right down to the tires......has gone 11.53@128mph. probably got outta that 2k density altitude, and lost the 10mph headwind.
Oh is it just some series and not others?
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maybe but folks say a IRS will beat a solid axle rear end on a road course most days.. which is a good point to make when racing a 1/4.. The gt will hook better off the line.. the gt has a pretty strong 60ft..
Depends on course conditions... pool table smooth... not so much. If on the other hand a lot of washboarding then yes IRS holds an advantage. IMO
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If I unsderstand correctly the ones ford run are not built by ford.... right/ wrong/ what?
if you're talking about the road racing series i've mentioned, those mustangs roll down the very same assembly line that my gt came down. they get pulled off, shipped out for the rollcage, then returned to the ford plant, where they are completed by hand.
it is the same for the cobrajet mustangs, which have been recorded as fast as in the 8 second 1/4 mile range, although they're not street legal. they also are factory built.
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Anyone notice that the "Stock Viper" that set the "production car" record at Nurburgring won't be "produced" with the R compound Michelins they used to set the time......but instead will only be available with significantly harder Pirelli tires instead?
My point is that most numbers touted by manufacturers are not valid.
That said, Edmunds got the 2012 GT-R to achieve 0-60 mph in 2.9 seconds and did the 1/4 mile in 11.2 seconds.
Goes back to rebuilding the transfer case on a 3000GT VR-4.
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that said, the gt500 went 11.5's @129 so far. still bone stock. by the time they learn the car, it'll probably be down in the 11.3 range.
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Well ..
numbers posted by manufacturers can be interesting.. f'rinstance:
GT-R weighs more than a Vette
GT-R uses smaller tires than a Vette
GT-R produces less horsepower than Z06 or ZR-1 Vette and even the base Vette is 430 hp
..which is pretty close to hp/weight figure of said GT-R.
And yet people still insist the GT-R is faster.
I dunno what planet they're on, but here on Earth, basic physics says no, it is not.
Even had one person who I thought knew better tell me that figures posted by fanboi sights weren't accurate ..
..when in fact I linked the manufacturer's websites for reference to the above figures.
Of course that all goes out the window when you start modding :)
-just sayin
(tm Pasha)
-GE aka Frank
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Well ..
numbers posted by manufacturers can be interesting.. f'rinstance:
GT-R weighs more than a Vette
GT-R uses smaller tires than a Vette
GT-R produces less horsepower than Z06 or ZR-1 Vette and even the base Vette is 430 hp
..which is pretty close to hp/weight figure of said GT-R.
And yet people still insist the GT-R is faster.
I dunno what planet they're on, but here on Earth, basic physics says no, it is not.
Even had one person who I thought knew better tell me that figures posted by fanboi sights weren't accurate ..
..when in fact I linked the manufacturer's websites for reference to the above figures.
Of course that all goes out the window when you start modding :)
-just sayin
(tm Pasha)
-GE aka Frank
i think the AWD helps the gtr...but to be honest, given the choice between a top of the ling gtr, or a base vette.....i'm rolling the vette.
another forum i'm on, they posted a video of livernious motorsports doing a dyno run on the gt500......and DAYUM does she sound sweet.
funny thing is that people keep trying to compare the shelby to the vette.....when if they've got any clue, they should know better, as the vette will always be king of the hill.....unless ford gets serious about the gt40 that is..... :devil
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Man .. Cap .. if Ford did a retro beast GT-40 ..
..I'd like to see em do an OHC high winding 427 for it ..make it 'real' .. not some wannabe :)
Somethin you could run hard with right outta the box with just a tire change.
Bring back the white-knuckle salesman rides in spades :)
Go after the ZR-1 .. go big or go home :)
-GE aka Frank
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Man .. Cap .. if Ford did a retro beast GT-40 ..
..I'd like to see em do an OHC high winding 427 for it ..make it 'real' .. not some wannabe :)
Somethin you could run hard with right outta the box with just a tire change.
Bring back the white-knuckle salesman rides in spades :)
Go after the ZR-1 .. go big or go home :)
-GE aka Frank
yea...that's what they should do....but i doubt they will.
wouldn't it be a sight to see though? those two monsters going at it full bore? dam..the hair on my arms is standing up just thinking about seeing those two roaring through the turns............. :joystick:
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that said, the gt500 went 11.5's @129 so far. still bone stock. by the time they learn the car, it'll probably be down in the 11.3 range.
The gtr is faster right now.
How much time does the mustang need to be learned.
I would probably start learning how to rebuild that chinese transmission.
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The gtr is faster right now.
How much time does the mustang need to be learned.
I would probably start learning how to rebuild that chinese transmission.
do you wanna go read up on the shelby, or should i just embarrass you again?
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and although it's not street legal, i think this may be the quickest production car?
http://www.competitionplus.com/drag-racing/news/20775-adrl-supercar-racer-goes-zero-to-60-mph-in-152-seconds-in-a-production-car
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do you wanna go read up on the shelby, or should i just embarrass you again?
So your car doesn't have a chinese made transmission?
You need to review post history here because it shows you losing every argument you have thrown at me.......because you argue outside of your depth way too often.
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I think the point he's making is the Shelby doesn't have an MT-82. They're Tremecs still.
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So your car doesn't have a chinese made transmission?
You need to review post history here because it shows you losing every argument you have thrown at me.......because you argue outside of your depth way too often.
:rofl you just lost. we ain't talkin' about my car in this thread, are we?
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I think the point he's making is the Shelby doesn't have an MT-82. They're Tremecs still.
dammit man!! you spoiled the fun!! :noid :neener:
and even the gt's don't have chinese transmissions in 'em. they're chinese built german transmissions. :aok
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sadly chinese in the middle of anything is not good.
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They're still made in China man.
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I did not know that. Kind of funny the ford folks chirping about the camaro made in canada.
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I did not know that. Kind of funny the ford folks chirping about the camaro made in canada.
Just the manuals. V6, GT, BOSS 302.
GT500s retained the 6060 on account of the power they make. The MT-82 isn't made for that much oomph. That or the old man still had a say on his namesake.
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The gtr is faster right now.
How much time does the mustang need to be learned.
I would probably start learning how to rebuild that chinese transmission.
"I would probably start learning how to rebuild that chinese transmission." was aimed at your chinese transmission and what you should start learning.
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sadly chinese in the middle of anything is not good.
yea i know. there were a couple problems with them, one of which wasn't even the tranny, but rather what i think was a batch of bad quality bolts mounting the pressure plate to the flywheel. ford handled all of the tranny related problems back in the middle of last year.
considering that golfer's running his car hard, i think if the 012's were blessed with this problem, his would be showing it by now.
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I did not know that. Kind of funny the ford folks chirping about the camaro made in canada.
yea, but that entire car is built there. and it's from austrailia. :neener:
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"I would probably start learning how to rebuild that chinese transmission." was aimed at your chinese transmission and what you should start learning.
ooohhhh......so you just threw that out there, completely, and totally off topic. gotcha.
read up on them. the problem was handled in 011.
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it should also be noted, that this shelby's trapped at 129mph. that's a pretty dam good speed for a mid 11 second run. get that thing into good air, and we're probably looking in the low 11's.......REALLY good air, possibly even a 10.99.
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No need to read up on them. I've already had one apart after it kept popping out of 1st gear.
The trans. is nearly identical to the supra transmissions I used to work on except that for the differences in shift hardware.
We ordered new shift fork for 1st gear but realized it would only be a temporary fix so we found someone making brass tips for the forks much like we used to replace plastic shims with brass in all of our jatco and aisin transmissions for nissan and toyota.
Tranny is a good design but it was compromised by ford by trying to "smooth it up" and get rid of the balky shifting behavior.
It handles 1000hp in it's toyota form.
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WELL, HERE'S my take on the transmission thing. first off, look up the info on it. actually, here.....
The Office of Defects Investigations (ODI) analyzed complaint data provided by Ford as well as complaints submitted to ODI from consumers. In total, there were 364 unique reports indicating various shift quality issues while driving. Ford identified several factors that may contribute to shift quality concerns in the subject vehicles, including cold transmission, clutch stay-out at high engine speeds, gear clash or grinding, and gradual loosening of clutch plate bolts in some early production vehicles. The largest percentage of complaints indicated higher than expected shift efforts in cold ambient temperatures. These complaints were related to transmission fluid viscosity and the higher shift efforts resolved themselves with the drivetrain warming. Ford published technical service bulletin TSB 11-3-18 to inform technicians that a lower viscosity fluid was available for use to address the cold shift issues.
from here.....http://www.mustangevolution.com/mustang-news/nhtsa-kills-ford-mustang-mt82-transmission-investigation/
now, that all up there, when i bought my 83 5 liter new, i was warned not to go with the bwt5. was told it'd break at the slightest hint of power. yet, that tranny survived repeated 6k rpm launches every single weekend. i broke the 7.5 rear, and replaced it with a 9". still never had problems with the tranny. in fact that transmission is still in my basement, as when i took the car off the road, i put a 289 with an old top loader 4 speed in it for drag usage.
i was given the same warnings when i bought my 89gt back in 92. that one has withstood repeated 6k rpm launches every weekend that iwas driving that car, plus the street racing it used to see.
so from personal experience.......i think i'll take my chances, as chances of me experiencing these problems are slim and none....and slim's on his way outta town.
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I tried to keep out of this topic due to being a fairly new board member but, I have to agree with CAP. Also I find it interesting the GT-R was mentioned while bashing the MT-82 in the mustangs. It looks like the GT-R had some issues too with its transmission. :neener:
http://www.caranddriver.com/features/2010-nissan-gt-r-gets-its-launch-control-reprogrammed
(I also don't get how a transmission costs $20,000, you can almost buy half of a GT500 for that much money. :headscratch:)
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I tried to keep out of this topic due to being a fairly new board member but, I have to agree with CAP. Also I find it interesting the GT-R was mentioned while bashing the MT-82 in the mustangs. It looks like the GT-R had some issues too with its transmission. :neener:
http://www.caranddriver.com/features/2010-nissan-gt-r-gets-its-launch-control-reprogrammed
(I also don't get how a transmission costs $20,000, you can almost buy half of a GT500 for that much money. :headscratch:)
new or not new, ya gotta start somewhere.
welcome aboard.
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Regarding the MT-82. Mine is fine :)
Just swapped the trans and diff oil and frankly didn't notice the change that some mustang forum members declare as a kind of revelation. Mine was an 8/11 build with the latest revision of parts and seems to be behaving. Got a couple hundred passes on it now :)
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Regarding the MT-82. Mine is fine :)
Just swapped the trans and diff oil and frankly didn't notice the change that some mustang forum members declare as a kind of revelation. Mine was an 8/11 build with the latest revision of parts and seems to be behaving. Got a couple hundred passes on it now :)
wanna hear something funny? i literally just came up to the office to post here, asking if yours seemed fine.
also....where'd you get your driveshaft? is it frpp? if my helper shows up next week, the shelby mufflers, and boss302 airdam/splitter go on....next will be the driveshaft.
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American Muscle. The first one I bought was Shaftmasters. 3.5" one piece aluminum and it seemed great. During the winter, Shaftmasters bought them back because 2 broke on a dyno after being unloaded at somewhere around north of 140mph IIRC. I figured they'll give a full refund and none of the Axle Exchange 4" shafts had broken (These are sold by American Muscle as their house brand but are manufactured by Axle Exchange)
It cost a little more than Shaftmasters, I already had a loop and I knew I wanted the shaft installed so I just took the money I got back and put it right back into another shaft. I think it's worth noting Shaftmasters provided great service and has since revised their shaft to prevent that failure from occurring. The timeline wasn't right for me and I needed the new one (when I bolted on drag radials earlier this year) to run as safely as possible. I wouldn't hesitate to buy from them again, FWIW.
I bought my wheels and drag radials from them too. With a forum member discount you can't buy them off the truck for what they charge, shipped to your door and since you're not in PA, no sales tax. MT ET Street Radials for $203/each. Nitto NT05R (Pays contingency for drive wheels only, MT requires all 4. Bastages.) were 185 each.
The wheels were ~100 during a sale event. I bought based on looks/weight and just happened to get a good deal. You know, if you ever got out to the track you could see them in person.
(http://i538.photobucket.com/albums/ff345/martinguitarist/e2d622c9.jpg)
(http://i538.photobucket.com/albums/ff345/martinguitarist/launch.jpg)
(http://i538.photobucket.com/albums/ff345/martinguitarist/d2491338.jpg)
(http://i538.photobucket.com/albums/ff345/martinguitarist/f3696eb0.jpg)
(http://i538.photobucket.com/albums/ff345/martinguitarist/66d49374.jpg)
And a video. Maybe this will finally stir up some interest in getting your car on a track where it belongs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQsxsCj1wYY
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Don't mind the tongue depressors. I was test fitting for how much shim I'd need to provide clearance for the loop. It didn't need shimmed with the 3.5" shaft, the 4" shaft needed it. I picked up some longer bolts, washers and used the same lock nuts.
I also put the bolts in from the top just because. That wasn't how the instructions had it (this picture was IAW the instructions) but it not only made it easier, I can lose a nut ( :huh ) and my bolt won't fall out.
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Starting next summer I'm turning my 93 Trans Am into the "what if" T/A. In other words what if Pontiac was allowed to keep building it's V8's and not forced to put chevy engines in them. I personally don't like SB Chevy engines, I don't want to rev my engine to 8k plus to get horsepower. I'm putting a 540 cid Butler performance Pontiac engine in it (I'll store the LT1 only because it numbers matching engine) but I'll keep the 6-speed tranny, the car is only 1 of 88 that had T-Tops and a 6-speed so it's ultra rare. The point is the Pontiac engine by design is like a Ford or Mopar engine, it's a torque monster and you builds all it's power and torque under 6500 rpm's!!!! Butler performance built a 4th gen T/A similar to what I'm doing and it ran 10.20's in the 1/4 consistantly!!! So for less than half the price of a new camero or gt500 I'l have a car thats a crapload quicker!!! Not trying to take away from either cause they are both awsome cars but I like to go a bit faster lol!!!! :devil :salute
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Cool project! Good luck with it. I'm actually going to be looking for a salvage 00-02 Bird, Trans Am or Camaro with an LS1 and 4L60 to use as a donor car for my C3 Corvette race car. The idea is build it to run 10s but only use it for the 11.50 index and bracket racing. My coworker just did that with a C5 Z06 and it's scary consistent. He had two time shot slips Friday that were dead on to the thousandth in both the 1/8 and 1000. .002 off in the 1/4.
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I wish my father would have kept his 69 Camaro. :( He said he could consistently pull about a 11.40 out of it with his fastest time being a 11.37 (While the engine lasted at least.)
I can't help but wonder what could be squeezed out of one nowadays. :)
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Starting next summer I'm turning my 93 Trans Am into the "what if" T/A. In other words what if Pontiac was allowed to keep building it's V8's and not forced to put chevy engines in them. I personally don't like SB Chevy engines, I don't want to rev my engine to 8k plus to get horsepower. I'm putting a 540 cid Butler performance Pontiac engine in it (I'll store the LT1 only because it numbers matching engine) but I'll keep the 6-speed tranny, the car is only 1 of 88 that had T-Tops and a 6-speed so it's ultra rare. The point is the Pontiac engine by design is like a Ford or Mopar engine, it's a torque monster and you builds all it's power and torque under 6500 rpm's!!!! Butler performance built a 4th gen T/A similar to what I'm doing and it ran 10.20's in the 1/4 consistantly!!! So for less than half the price of a new camero or gt500 I'l have a car thats a crapload quicker!!! Not trying to take away from either cause they are both awsome cars but I like to go a bit faster lol!!!! :devil :salute
that sounds fun as hell.....but i don't think i'd touch a "1 of 88" car. i'd leave that one alone, and go find another one not as rare to do this to.
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Cool project! Good luck with it. I'm actually going to be looking for a salvage 00-02 Bird, Trans Am or Camaro with an LS1 and 4L60 to use as a donor car for my C3 Corvette race car. The idea is build it to run 10s but only use it for the 11.50 index and bracket racing. My coworker just did that with a C5 Z06 and it's scary consistent. He had two time shot slips Friday that were dead on to the thousandth in both the 1/8 and 1000. .002 off in the 1/4.
that's part of why we kept my camaro in the 10's. she'd easily drop into the 9's, but that was balls out. de-tuning, and going easy on her, she'd run the number i chose all night long.
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watching an excellent bbc Cobra Ferrari Wars doc at the moment, some great interviews in there with the whole cobra team, well worth looking for online.
(also some brilliant footage of the AC factory with cobras being built next to the rows of wheelchairs they manufactured to keep the company afloat :lol )
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i don't think they became cobras till they had the ford drivetrain installed. they were still ac aces till that point.
that said...cool vid here......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzMr9WQc_LM&feature=related
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that sounds fun as hell.....but i don't think i'd touch a "1 of 88" car. i'd leave that one alone, and go find another one not as rare to do this to.
I know hwat you mean, thats why everything I'm gonna do is done without cutting it up. Everything will be bolton. The engine mount is a front mounted 1 piece 6061 aluminum plate ( I was a certified welder/ fabricator specializing in aluminum, GTAW and GMAW), I'm not cutting any part of that car!!!!! :rock :salute
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that's part of why we kept my camaro in the 10's. she'd easily drop into the 9's, but that was balls out. de-tuning, and going easy on her, she'd run the number i chose all night long.
What year was your Camaro, and what engine did you use?
I am curious cause my father did manage to get his to do 11.40's using a smallblock 307 back in the 70's
:)
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What year was your Camaro, and what engine did you use?
I am curious cause my father did manage to get his to do 11.40's using a smallblock 307 back in the 70's
:)
That's impressive for a 307,what did he do to it to make it so quick? IIRC the 307 was a Mom's motors.
:salute
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I actually just talked to him about that, Sadly only being 20 myself I am still learning all this stuff, so I may not perfectly quote what he told me. :o
His Camaro actually came with the 307 (and he agreed that it was definitely a Mom's motor with no compression and small lifters and such)
He actually joked with me that it may be a shorter list to tell what he didn't do to that engine. but he rebuilt the engine using parts from an 1970 LT-1 engine while also doing things like port and polish. He said the motor ran its butt off but sadly didn't last too long before it blew. (After that he put a 327 into his Camaro, but for some reason couldn't the quarter mile times he could get with the 307)
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Nice!
Ya the 307 wasnt much but it had potenial,all you had to do was strip it down to the block and then put it together with out using anything you took off! :rofl :rofl
I knew a couple guys who put 327 cranks into them but by the time they were all said and done,they would have been better off just using a 327 to begin with. Tell Pops I'm impressed! that LT1 was a stout unit itself!
:salute
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I know hwat you mean, thats why everything I'm gonna do is done without cutting it up. Everything will be bolton. The engine mount is a front mounted 1 piece 6061 aluminum plate ( I was a certified welder/ fabricator specializing in aluminum, GTAW and GMAW), I'm not cutting any part of that car!!!!! :rock :salute
awesomen. if you've been taking pics of the progress, post a thread up here. stuff like that is fun as hell to see.....like vonmessa with his jeep.
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What year was your Camaro, and what engine did you use?
I am curious cause my father did manage to get his to do 11.40's using a smallblock 307 back in the 70's
:)
sh'e s a 69, but she's a drag car only. mostly fiberglass, weighing 2600 and change with me and a full fuel cell. the quickest run i have on a timeslip, was a 9.96@131mph on a hot muggy night. in good air, we figured she'd drop into the 9.8's or 9.7's.........
it wasn't anything fancy. 454 bored to 461, with truck heads, ported and polished by yours truly, and an 800cfm holley. if i can find my notebook, i cuold tell ya what jets squirters, and power valve we were running in the carb.
was running a msd 6al with a 2 step. msd dist, full mechanical advance, fully in by 2500rpm. we had total set to only 35 degrees.
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Nice!
Ya the 307 wasnt much but it had potenial,all you had to do was strip it down to the block and then put it together with out using anything you took off! :rofl :rofl
I knew a couple guys who put 327 cranks into them but by the time they were all said and done,they would have been better off just using a 327 to begin with. Tell Pops I'm impressed! that LT1 was a stout unit itself!
:salute
307's could be made to run, but usually at the expense of severely shortening their lifespans.
i was on frpp website the other day....you can buy a coyote crate engine, all forged internals(technically that makes it a road runner), and rated at 412+(which tells me it's more than the boss302) for less than $8k. annnd it's a direct swap into any s197 mustang.
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awesomen. if you've been taking pics of the progress, post a thread up here. stuff like that is fun as hell to see.....like vonmessa with his jeep.
Lol, you can go on the FREEBIRD website I think they still got my pics on there of the artwork I've done. I'm a airbrush artist too, been doing that for 35 yrs now lol
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Lol, you can go on the FREEBIRD website I think they still got my pics on there of the artwork I've done. I'm a airbrush artist too, been doing that for 35 yrs now lol
airbrushing? where in florida are you again? :devil
and where's the freebirds website?
i wasn't meaning to be pushy about the build thread......it's just fun to see someone doing something different. and being as your car is rare, you're also doing it in such a way as to respect the car enough to return to original.
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i don't remember if i posted this video or not....but they talk to the legend himself.......http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzMr9WQc_LM&feature=related
i'm still waiting for a 'ring time to be posted. there were rumors of the ones there last year going in the 7:30 range. this i think is feasible, as with this power, and straight line performance, the shelby only needs to be meadoricre in the turns.......it'll downright rape the blacktop coming out, and into the straights. the brakes are reported to have been improved enough that the driver should be able to brake pretty late going into the turns. this should let them go much much faster than anyone expects.
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airbrushing? where in florida are you again? :devil
and where's the freebirds website?
i wasn't meaning to be pushy about the build thread......it's just fun to see someone doing something different. and being as your car is rare, you're also doing it in such a way as to respect the car enough to return to original.
Cocoa Beach fl. I've you go on the squad list click on one of them, not sure which one, and there is a link to the website :salute
www.ah-freebirds.com is the site
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Ring times are more about tires as of recent.
This is why the viper won't be sold with the tires they used to set the production car record.......which makes the time set by them to not really matter.
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they only matter for bragging rights in my eyes.
the fact is that al op has pretty much said that the zl1 would beat the shelby in virtually every catagory.
losses for the zl1 so far:
1)horsepower
2)torque
3)0-60
4)-=100
5)1/4 mile
6)fuel mileage
next up is losing the ring time. :aok
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brainless win for the camero. Who thought that a fixed suspension was a good idea in the 21st century? The accountants made that call not the mechanics. Sure, lots of pros/cons for both sides here, but the camero has a lot more potential for tinkering because it can put more power to the tar.
But really, if i were going for an american car, i would get a vet.
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brainless win for the camero. Who thought that a fixed suspension was a good idea in the 21st century? The accountants made that call not the mechanics. Sure, lots of pros/cons for both sides here, but the camero has a lot more potential for tinkering because it can put more power to the tar.
But really, if i were going for an american car, i would get a vet.
vette in my opinion is a different market than the mustang/camaro.
and are you sure that there's more potential? i'd think that gm would've gone for a knockout punch with this car........
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Hey Cap, My dad wanted to ask if you remember what happened when you took a hydraulic camshaft and set it to 0 lash. :)
(He did that to his 307 and was curious if people here remembered what that did.)
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Hey Cap, My dad wanted to ask if you remember what happened when you took a hydraulic camshaft and set it to 0 lash. :)
(He did that to his 307 and was curious if people here remembered what that did.)
it's been awhile, but i tend to set hydraulic cams with the engine running. i set them till i feel comfortable before starting. i've got 2 valve covers i've cut out. one for fords, one for chevys. i install this valve cover on one bank, start the engine, and slowly tighten the rocker down. i generally went till it juuuuuuuuusssssstttt stopped making noise, then about a half turn further.
i know it doesn't sound right, but it's worked for me for years. the cut out valve cover keeps me from spraying oil all over the place.
if you set them to 0 lash, before letting the lifters pump up, bad things happened if i recall. it's been over 20 years though, because i've been either using solid cams, or roller cams for that long.
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He laughed at the bad things part. :)
he noted that for him it just made it really really easy to over-rev an engine (The death of his 307 was from being over-revved one too many times) :lol
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He laughed at the bad things part. :)
he noted that for him it just made it really really easy to over-rev an engine (The death of his 307 was from being over-revved one too many times) :lol
this talk is almost making me want to go down to the basement, and rummage through my stuff. i've got blocks, cranks, heads.....pretty much everything i need to assemble a couple of really potent 289's. maybe if my part time help at the shop keeps kicking butt, i'll build one of them. :aok
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I know seeing this thread and hearing the stories from my pops, I would love to start some project once I got the money to do so (Maybe once I move out of Virginia..) :)
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it's been awhile, but i tend to set hydraulic cams with the engine running. i set them till i feel comfortable before starting. i've got 2 valve covers i've cut out. one for fords, one for chevys. i install this valve cover on one bank, start the engine, and slowly tighten the rocker down. i generally went till it juuuuuuuuusssssstttt stopped making noise, then about a half turn further.
i know it doesn't sound right, but it's worked for me for years. the cut out valve cover keeps me from spraying oil all over the place.
if you set them to 0 lash, before letting the lifters pump up, bad things happened if i recall. it's been over 20 years though, because i've been either using solid cams, or roller cams for that long.
That is the way I have done for years. Just as long as you know the lifters are all good. :)
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this talk is almost making me want to go down to the basement, and rummage through my stuff. i've got blocks, cranks, heads.....pretty much everything i need to assemble a couple of really potent 289's. maybe if my part time help at the shop keeps kicking butt, i'll build one of them. :aok
I had a nicely built 289 in my 67 mustang.
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That is the way I have done for years. Just as long as you know the lifters are all good. :)
yea, i've been lucky enough to never run into a bad one. i was just out in my garage, and for the helluva it i looked on the shelf....i still have those cut valve covers.
what i had done, was to cut a slot wide enough to allow me access to the rocker nuts, but it still covered the pushrod and the valve end of the rockers, so when i had the engine running to do this, i didn't spray oil all over the place.
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I had a nicely built 289 in my 67 mustang.
many moons ago, there was a guy running at atco with a 289 in a 66 fastback. he was running mid 9's, but mannnnn was he pushing that dam thing. i think he was running 5.14s, and the dam thing was screaming for mercy going through the traps........
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OK, how do you post pics on here. Went it comes to computer stuff I as dumb as you can get lol. Just haven't learnedto much about computers. I want to put my pics of the work I've done so far (paint and airbrush work), I wont start the engine swap till next summer, alot of planning to do there!!! :salute
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Man Cap .. runnin hydrastic lifters .. half turn after the noise stops ..slowly.
Been awhile since I have done that ..with the cutout valve covers an all :)
Also get a huge kick outta watchin any of the reality motor rebuild hot rod shops when they do a first fire-up of a motor they put together.
Pops up thru the carb an these rocket scientists have to edit out the hour or so it took 'em to figure out the distributor was 180 out.
LOL.
-Frank aka GE
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Man Cap .. runnin hydrastic lifters .. half turn after the noise stops ..slowly.
Been awhile since I have done that ..with the cutout valve covers an all :)
Also get a huge kick outta watchin any of the reality motor rebuild hot rod shops when they do a first fire-up of a motor they put together.
Pops up thru the carb an these rocket scientists have to edit out the hour or so it took 'em to figure out the distributor was 180 out.
LOL.
-Frank aka GE
180 or way slow.
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OK, how do you post pics on here. Went it comes to computer stuff I as dumb as you can get lol. Just haven't learnedto much about computers. I want to put my pics of the work I've done so far (paint and airbrush work), I wont start the engine swap till next summer, alot of planning to do there!!! :salute
Setup a free account at somewhere like photobucket. Then link the pictures here.
When you see your pic on photobucket under it you'll see the image link. Copy it and paste it in your post.
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OK, how do you post pics on here. Went it comes to computer stuff I as dumb as you can get lol. Just haven't learnedto much about computers. I want to put my pics of the work I've done so far (paint and airbrush work), I wont start the engine swap till next summer, alot of planning to do there!!! :salute
i've been using flicker, because it seems that for about the last year or so, photobucket bogs down my computers.
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Do you guys know why you set hydraulic lifters they way you described?
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Thanks guys, I'll try them!!! :salute
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Do you guys know why you set hydraulic lifters they way you described?
Since they pump up it is not as critical as solids.
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Since they pump up it is not as critical as solids.
if i recall(remember, it's been a looonnnnnnggggg time for me), it's pre-loading the lifter itself. solid lifters, you had to leave lash, unless you enjoyed replacing pushrods, or worse.
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It's to combat damage incurred when the valves get floated.
Lifters feel the play that has been introduced by valve float and adjust accordingly.
A valve may contact a piston top, a retainer might bottom on a valve stem seal, you might run out of slot length of rocker arm, or one of the springs stacks solid..........or you might lucky and experience it without anything breaking.
If you've ever seen someone overrev any 60s/70/80s small block and the engine stalls immediately after or runs missing on multiple cylinders like it's blown up..........but magically repairs itself after a minute or so, then you've seen someone experience lifter pump-up without incurring damage.
The reason you loosen them until they make noise and tighten them a specified amount, is to keep the lifters at the uppermost of thier adjustment range so they can only adjust up a very small amount.
The manufacturers are also assuming you adjust the valves at the published intervals to keep the noise down.
I've seen lifters that have a 3/16 inch range of adjustment capability.
Newer cars have rev limiters built into thier engine management so manufacturers are going back toward lifters nearly fully compressed to keep that service interval to just about never.........except lexus who screwed up and had to replace all lifters and valve springs in about 40% of the fleet sold from 2006 to 2011.
Lexus was using lifters near the bottom of thier adjustment but they had an issue with the valve springs weakening and allowing them to float below the rev limiter rpm for the cutoff.
They could have just sent out a new flash calibration for the ecus to lower the rev limiter 500rpms but decided that guaranteeing thier claimed horsepower important enough to replace all the valve springs and lifters.
Lexus claimed it was only the valve springs but I did compare the both upgraded and original lifters and found the upgraded lifters had much less range to take up slack.
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yea.....pre-load. that's what keeps them from doing bad things.
that said........2013 gt500 just went 10.02@141mph.
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that said........2013 gt500 just went 10.02@141mph.
:x Nice! Now lets see it on a track. :D
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:x Nice! Now lets see it on a track. :D
ford's got one over at the 'ring right now. someone over on ls1 said they heard that someone timed it at 7:31 and 7:35. it would make sense really, 'cause it doesn't HAVE to be fabulous in the corners. it only needs to be kinda good. comin' out, it'll rape the blacktop, and hit crazy speeds on the straight runs.
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Non-streetable COPO Camaro coming.... only 69 to be built.
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Non-streetable COPO Camaro coming.... only 69 to be built.
yea. does it run 8.9's? like the non-streetable cobrajet? of which there are only 50 per year? :devil
actually.....it was an 09 cobrajet i think that just went 8.9's, making it the first ever factory production car to run that fast in stock class. i honestly haven't found anything on how fast the 5 liter cobrajets are.
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yea. does it run 8.9's? like the non-streetable cobrajet? of which there are only 50 per year? :devil
actually.....it was an 09 cobrajet i think that just went 8.9's, making it the first ever factory production car to run that fast in stock class. i honestly haven't found anything on how fast the 5 liter cobrajets are.
Nothing is showing numbers yet.
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Nothing is showing numbers yet.
yea...over on ls, i saw a vid of the white copo. good looking car. they keep it from letting us see the timing board though. ford's doing the same thnig. very agitating.
that said, i just read that apparently the shelby's already into the 9's. 9.89@143 to be exact. apparently it didn't take much work to get it there. :devil
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If I may interject..... the Dodge Viper still holds the record at Nurbering. Track mind you.
Debate on Ford and Chevy enthusiasts! 2013 brings back the Viper into production.
And I'm reading a lot of bad press about #8 cylinders in a certain Mustang V8. Maybe they should eliminate #8 and run on 7? ;)
I visited several Mustang boards and many Mustang owners are quite displeased. Seems a lot of Ford Dealerships are
giving them heartache over this issue.
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ford's got one over at the 'ring right now. someone over on ls1 said they heard that someone timed it at 7:31 and 7:35. it would make sense really, 'cause it doesn't HAVE to be fabulous in the corners. it only needs to be kinda good. comin' out, it'll rape the blacktop, and hit crazy speeds on the straight runs.
yeah it does - the start/finish straight is under 2 miles long, the other 10 miles is 150 corners strung together. simple brute force will not yield decent times.
this is a sub-8min pace lap to give you an idea:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlWQy-gljhs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlWQy-gljhs)
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Runnin the 'ring in Forza 3 you really get an idea of how well balanced a car has to be to do well there.
It's gotta have it all .. accel, decel, suspension, horsepower, traction .. it all has to be excellent to do under 8 minutes.
I have probably built over 50 cars in Forza 3 for fun and laffs ..some of the combo's that I can do under 8 mins are a bit surprising.
ie:
I took the boss 429 Mustang in game, took out that huge boat anchor and put in the new much lighter killer motor, converted the car to All Wheel Drive,
.. beefed up everything else I could ..and it flat out does the deed.
I also have a Porsche Boxter all turbo'd and maxed out that will cut similar times.
..and a Daytona Charger.. blown 540 Hemi and all.
(the all wheel drive really tames that beast of a car .. it really comes out of a corner HARD with the right power distribution ..just runs off and hides from the Bugatti Veyron)
I'd love to build any one of those in reality .. they would hurt me :)
-Frank aka GE
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can you drop the GT3RS's 500hp 4.0l engine into a Cayman R? I reckon that would just kill the 'ring :D
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If I may interject..... the Dodge Viper still holds the record at Nurbering. Track mind you.
Debate on Ford and Chevy enthusiasts! 2013 brings back the Viper into production.
And I'm reading a lot of bad press about #8 cylinders in a certain Mustang V8. Maybe they should eliminate #8 and run on 7? ;)
I visited several Mustang boards and many Mustang owners are quite displeased. Seems a lot of Ford Dealerships are
giving them heartache over this issue.
they could do that and run on 7. that may let the challengers and camaros keep up. :devil
seriously, everything i've found on #8 has been caused by tuning incorrectly. i've not yet found a #8 problem on an untouched car. if this is the case, then of course ford's not gonna do anything about it. they knew the risk when they tuned.
we had a customer years ago. installed an aftermarket computer system for him, along with his new 600hp turbo engine. we talked directly with both the engine builder, and the computer guys, and set the computer exactly as they told us to set it.
dude came back within a week, with the oil dipstick blowing out anytime he went into boost. claimed he didn't touch the computer at all. the computer guys came up from maryland, and hooked into it, and sure enough this goofball went in there, and changed virtually everything. when we called him on it, he finally admitted it, but still wanted warranty, which we all declined. he was told not to change anything. he did. he lost.
back on ford.....they actually have a tsb specifying to look for evidence of a tune having been installed when they see these.
wasn't the viper on racing tires?
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yeah it does - the start/finish straight is under 2 miles long, the other 10 miles is 150 corners strung together. simple brute force will not yield decent times.
this is a sub-8min pace lap to give you an idea:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlWQy-gljhs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlWQy-gljhs)
wellllll....they hit 196 in a mile in 2,000 elevation, and i think in the vid i saw, density altitude was over 5,000ft, 100f temps.......so in normal good air, closer to sea level.........
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Runnin the 'ring in Forza 3 you really get an idea of how well balanced a car has to be to do well there.
It's gotta have it all .. accel, decel, suspension, horsepower, traction .. it all has to be excellent to do under 8 minutes.
I have probably built over 50 cars in Forza 3 for fun and laffs ..some of the combo's that I can do under 8 mins are a bit surprising.
ie:
I took the boss 429 Mustang in game, took out that huge boat anchor and put in the new much lighter killer motor, converted the car to All Wheel Drive,
.. beefed up everything else I could ..and it flat out does the deed.
I also have a Porsche Boxter all turbo'd and maxed out that will cut similar times.
..and a Daytona Charger.. blown 540 Hemi and all.
(the all wheel drive really tames that beast of a car .. it really comes out of a corner HARD with the right power distribution ..just runs off and hides from the Bugatti Veyron)
I'd love to build any one of those in reality .. they would hurt me :)
-Frank aka GE
one of the other forums i talk on, a guy ran his 4th gen camaro there, claiming to have hit 150 in some straights. he said it's nothing like in forza. i don't know, as i don't have forza, nor have i...or will i ever be able to.....run the ring for real.
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wasn't the viper on racing tires?
That is what they say. That makes it a non event in regards to what we were talking about.
He's flying a jug in the scenario. You know those jug drivers spend a lot of time when flying, sitting on the couch in the cockpit den reading. :P
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That is what they say. That makes it a non event in regards to what we were talking about.
He's flying a jug in the scenario. You know those jug drivers spend a lot of time when flying, sitting on the couch in the cockpit den reading. :P
baZING!! :noid
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Well.....seeing as how the Challenger has won more awards then the Mustang and Camaro since its' inception
I'll leave it at that. Also...I've won two trophies in modern era muscle category. These cruises btw were
the only two to have that category. My competition? The Mustang and the Camaro. They lost.
The MOPAR Hemi is still the icon in which other powerplants are judged. Always was, always will
I remember when both Chevy and Ford told their NHRA drivers in the 60s "Do not get in a match race with a HEMI."
I also remember when both Ford and Chevy cried their wittle hears out about the Daytonas and Superbirds.
NASCAR complied, and the MOPAR drivers boycotted NASCAR. NASCAR then gave in!
Dodge only manufactures 30K to 40K Challengers a year, all categories (V6 etc.) Ford and Chevy
however flood the market. Car and Driver included the Challenger in its list of top 10 of autos that will
be regarded as classic ten years from now. This included some exotic cars. Ford and Chevy had no
entrants in that list. The 2013 year will be the last for the Challenger. They're
going to manufacture the Cuda again. Fiat, Ferrari, Maseratti, Dodge have it right.
BTW Chyrsler is havinge yet another very big year in sales.
I've also won one trophy that included all makes, models and years.
Bantering about your favorite auto and manufacturer is fun....and I do it in jest of course.
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they could do that and run on 7. that may let the challengers and camaros keep up. :devil
seriously, everything i've found on #8 has been caused by tuning incorrectly. i've not yet found a #8 problem on an untouched car. if this is the case, then of course ford's not gonna do anything about it. they knew the risk when they tuned.
we had a customer years ago. installed an aftermarket computer system for him, along with his new 600hp turbo engine. we talked directly with both the engine builder, and the computer guys, and set the computer exactly as they told us to set it.
dude came back within a week, with the oil dipstick blowing out anytime he went into boost. claimed he didn't touch the computer at all. the computer guys came up from maryland, and hooked into it, and sure enough this goofball went in there, and changed virtually everything. when we called him on it, he finally admitted it, but still wanted warranty, which we all declined. he was told not to change anything. he did. he lost.
back on ford.....they actually have a tsb specifying to look for evidence of a tune having been installed when they see these.
wasn't the viper on racing tires?
What else do you run on a race track??? Bicycle tires? :D
Always an excuse somewhere eh? :lol (My dog ate the homework, I was on the phone etc.)
BTW Cap....check the forums...many had no tune, it's a problem from the factory that has been acknowledged.
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Well.....seeing as how the Challenger has won more awards then the Mustang and Camaro since its' inception
I'll leave it at that. Also...I've won two trophies in modern era muscle category. These cruises btw were
the only two to have that category. My competition? The Mustang and the Camaro. They lost.
The MOPAR Hemi is still the icon in which other powerplants are judged. Always was, always will
I remember when both Chevy and Ford told their NHRA drivers in the 60s "Do not get in a match race with a HEMI."
I also remember when both Ford and Chevy cried their wittle hears out about the Daytonas and Superbirds.
NASCAR complied, and the MOPAR drivers boycotted NASCAR. NASCAR then gave in!
Dodge only manufactures 30K to 40K Challengers a year, all categories (V6 etc.) Ford and Chevy
however flood the market. Car and Driver included the Challenger in its list of top 10 of autos that will
be regarded as classic ten years from now. This included some exotic cars. Ford and Chevy had no
entrants in that list. The 2013 year will be the last for the Challenger. They're
going to manufacture the Cuda again. Fiat, Ferrari, Maseratti, Dodge have it right.
BTW Chyrsler is havinge yet another very big year in sales.
I've also won one trophy that included all makes, models and years.
Bantering about your favorite auto and manufacturer is fun....and I do it in jest of course.
My daughter's camaro has several trophies too. Been used in advertising at SEMA and several other places.
All three cars are great IMHO. They have reignited the old three way feud and bragging rights.
You do realize that the HEMI is just the hemipherical heads. The legend of the HEMI was 60s big blocks thumping down some huge power. The word hemi is just a marketing term now. That is not to say they do not have power.... but nothing impressive over any other flavor.
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Funny thing is. If I remember right, the majority of GM engines are now 'Hemi' iirc. They just can't market it cause Chrysler would have a cow. :)
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Shuffler you forget I was there. :lol
I was driving these things when you were in grade school ;)
And coming from Chevy who....if I remember correctly didn't put a V8 in a car until what.....1955 or 56?
And a 265cu. in. V8 at that.
The DeSoto at that time already had a 355 Hemi in it.
They're all great cars! I like them all. I just find it very refreshing that the discussion has been reborn.
And I stand by what I say. The Hemi is still the icon by which all others are judged.
I'm getting the same HP from a fuel injected Hemi that an SS Camro is getting with a supercharger.
Without the supercharger. I was parked next to a black one last nite at a show. Nice car.
Same HP...stamped 426hp under the SS. His supercharged....mine just fuel injected. Splain Dat Lucy :O
We talked a great length, guy and his wife. Nice people. More people were looking under the Hood of the
R/T and commenting on it and asking questions about it. They asked me how much HP...told them.
They said you getting that without the supercharger? Yup....then they made the comparison with his SS.
I just explained...well....it's a Hemi! They all said...yep...it surely is. :aok
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Well.....seeing as how the Challenger has won more awards then the Mustang and Camaro since its' inception
I'll leave it at that. Also...I've won two trophies in modern era muscle category. These cruises btw were
the only two to have that category. My competition? The Mustang and the Camaro. They lost.
The MOPAR Hemi is still the icon in which other powerplants are judged. Always was, always will
I remember when both Chevy and Ford told their NHRA drivers in the 60s "Do not get in a match race with a HEMI."
I also remember when both Ford and Chevy cried their wittle hears out about the Daytonas and Superbirds.
NASCAR complied, and the MOPAR drivers boycotted NASCAR. NASCAR then gave in!
Dodge only manufactures 30K to 40K Challengers a year, all categories (V6 etc.) Ford and Chevy
however flood the market. Car and Driver included the Challenger in its list of top 10 of autos that will
be regarded as classic ten years from now. This included some exotic cars. Ford and Chevy had no
entrants in that list. The 2013 year will be the last for the Challenger. They're
going to manufacture the Cuda again. Fiat, Ferrari, Maseratti, Dodge have it right.
BTW Chyrsler is havinge yet another very big year in sales.
I've also won one trophy that included all makes, models and years.
Bantering about your favorite auto and manufacturer is fun....and I do it in jest of course.
yes. but don't forget......both chrysler and chevy cried their wittle eyes out about the 427sohc. thus it was never allowed to compete. had it been, ford would've beaten chrysler to 200mph.
ford built a hemi before chrysler. it wasn't successful, but they built it. :devil
that all being said, i've been seeing more challengers in my little corner of nj than mustangs or camaros as of late. most are 6 bangers though. chrysler is making a big mistake i think, discontinuing the challenger. it's a beautiful car, and could be made to compete with the other 2 if they really tried.
i'll banter about em all. i love my fords. one of my favorite cars i got to work on was the 69 302 z28. stupid fast, and beautiful lines. the last of the true camaros in my opinion.
i remember when chrysler products used to wipe up the streets with pretty much anything. i owned 2 73 roadrunners, and a 74 scamp(plymouth version of a dart).
i like em all, and as long as we can keep having our new hotrods with stupid power, i'll be happy. :cheers:
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What else do you run on a race track??? Bicycle tires? :D
Always an excuse somewhere eh? :lol (My dog ate the homework, I was on the phone etc.)
BTW Cap....check the forums...many had no tune, it's a problem from the factory that has been acknowledged.
i think the zl1 did it's time on the tires that would come on it if you bought one.
i'll look again, as i know that cylinder runs hot......but the last i looked, they'd all been tuned.
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yes. but don't forget......both chrysler and chevy cried their wittle eyes out about the 427sohc. thus it was never allowed to compete. had it been, ford would've beaten chrysler to 200mph.
ford built a hemi before chrysler. it wasn't successful, but they built it. :devil
that all being said, i've been seeing more challengers in my little corner of nj than mustangs or camaros as of late. most are 6 bangers though. chrysler is making a big mistake i think, discontinuing the challenger. it's a beautiful car, and could be made to compete with the other 2 if they really tried.
i'll banter about em all. i love my fords. one of my favorite cars i got to work on was the 69 302 z28. stupid fast, and beautiful lines. the last of the true camaros in my opinion.
i remember when chrysler products used to wipe up the streets with pretty much anything. i owned 2 73 roadrunners, and a 74 scamp(plymouth version of a dart).
i like em all, and as long as we can keep having our new hotrods with stupid power, i'll be happy. :cheers:
Cap and Shuff....well said........that dam R/T makes me feel like a kid again :cheers: The Mustang and Camaro are fantastic also.
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Shuffler you forget I was there. :lol
I was driving these things when you were in grade school ;)
And coming from Chevy who....if I remember correctly didn't put a V8 in a car until what.....1955 or 56?
And a 265cu. in. V8 at that.
The DeSoto at that time already had a 355 Hemi in it.
They're all great cars! I like them all. I just find it very refreshing that the discussion has been reborn.
And I stand by what I say. The Hemi is still the icon by which all others are judged.
I'm getting the same HP from a fuel injected Hemi that an SS Camro is getting with a supercharger.
Without the supercharger. I was parked next to a black one last nite at a show. Nice car.
Same HP...stamped 426hp under the SS. His supercharged....mine just fuel injected. Splain Dat Lucy :O
We talked a great length, guy and his wife. Nice people. More people were looking under the Hood of the
R/T and commenting on it and asking questions about it. They asked me how much HP...told them.
They said you getting that without the supercharger? Yup....then they made the comparison with his SS.
I just explained...well....it's a Hemi! They all said...yep...it surely is. :aok
Camaro SS is 426 from the factory fuel injected, naturally asperated. He was not showing his colors. :)
The 6cyl camaro is putting out 323 hp.
The folks asking the questions may have liked cars but they were not up to snuff on any data.
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i think the zl1 did it's time on the tires that would come on it if you bought one.
i'll look again, as i know that cylinder runs hot......but the last i looked, they'd all been tuned.
The ZL1 was all factory spec as you'd buy it off the showroom floor.
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The ZL1 was all factory spec as you'd buy it off the showroom floor.
'cept for rollcage. i heard it had that.
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'cept for rollcage. i heard it had that.
Track requirement
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Oh, you guys talk about banter. Being in a family that is half diehard Ford fans and the other half being diehard Chevy fans. The banter that normally follows any family reunions can get pretty good. :rofl
Example being my dad still sometimes pokes fun about when Grandpa had to explain why his ford van shuts off the A/C going up hills or being heavy with the throttle to maximize engine power... :D
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Track requirement
yea i figured.....i'm just being a nitpicky bastage. :neener:
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Oh, you guys talk about banter. Being in a family that is half diehard Ford fans and the other half being diehard Chevy fans. The banter that normally follows any family reunions can get pretty good. :rofl
Example being my dad still sometimes pokes fun about when Grandpa had to explain why his ford van shuts off the A/C going up hills or being heavy with the throttle to maximize engine power... :D
i visited a friend in hazelton pa a few years back. didn't feel like spending much on gas, so i took my geo prism. i had to kill the a/c to maintain highway speed on some of those dam hills. :rofl
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To be fair, I helped instigate the banter on road trips when I was younger. I had discovered that if I shook my foot juuuust right whenever we came to a stop that I could trick my elders into thinking the engine was missing/running rough.
That turned many quiet boring car trips into fairly amusing trips listening to my elders bantering over things like reliability and if the vehicle we were in was crap or not. :devil
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Cap,
You can have your stangs,my honda does 0 to 60 by sometime next week,on the other hand it does like to visit gas stations very often! :neener:
:salute
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Cap,
You can have your stangs,my honda does 0 to 60 by sometime next week,on the other hand it does like to visit gas stations very often! :neener:
:salute
my old geo was getting upwards of 35mpg on the highway. that's why i still ain't gotten rid of it.........it's a pos....but it always runs, and doesn't burn much gas, when i need to not burn much.
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my old geo was getting upwards of 35mpg on the highway. that's why i still ain't gotten rid of it.........it's a pos....but it always runs, and doesn't burn much gas, when i need to not burn much.
I get about that,35 mpg but it's all wheel drive! Really need it for about 6 months out of every year.... :furious
Of course when it gets real bad I just get the dogsled out,it will take me through anything! :devil
:salute
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To be fair, I helped instigate the banter on road trips when I was younger. I had discovered that if I shook my foot juuuust right whenever we came to a stop that I could trick my elders into thinking the engine was missing/running rough.
That turned many quiet boring car trips into fairly amusing trips listening to my elders bantering over things like reliability and if the vehicle we were in was crap or not. :devil
lol evil man evil :)
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was just on evolution performances site.........street car in the 8's. :devil
http://www.stangtv.com/news/video-2011-mustang-gt-street-car-breaks-into-the-8s/
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Speakin o' bone stock an goin that fast ..
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/01/12/chevy-sending-off-c6-corvette-with-427-convertible-and-60th-anni/
Of course they say 'it should' in the article ..not that someone has.. yet.
Nice lookin rag top tho :)
3350lbs, 505hp 427, big tars, and the top comes down ..what's not to like?
-Frank aka GE
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Speakin o' bone stock an goin that fast ..
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/01/12/chevy-sending-off-c6-corvette-with-427-convertible-and-60th-anni/
Of course they say 'it should' in the article ..not that someone has.. yet.
Nice lookin rag top tho :)
3350lbs, 505hp 427, big tars, and the top comes down ..what's not to like?
-Frank aka GE
hot looking car, although i like the coupes better.
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Aye Cap .. ragtops are nice to look at .. I have owned one (a '63 Ford Galaxy vert with the 390) .. doubt if I will ever own another.
Reason is the temperature outside has to be in a pretty narrow range for it to be a top down day.
If it's way cold out, ragtops are just not well insulated.
If it's way hot out, see above.
One of the features I really like about the coupe Vette's is that panel across the top comes off for the 'top down' days,
..and it's fairly well insulated to handle all the other days.
(the small volume that needs heating/cooling helps also)
I am spoiled rotten just settin the temp at 70 degrees
and the heating/AC in the car just keeps it pegged there no matter what's goin on outside.
-Frank aka GE
-
Aye Cap .. ragtops are nice to look at .. I have owned one (a '63 Ford Galaxy vert with the 390) .. doubt if I will ever own another.
Reason is the temperature outside has to be in a pretty narrow range for it to be a top down day.
If it's way cold out, ragtops are just not well insulated.
If it's way hot out, see above.
One of the features I really like about the coupe Vette's is that panel across the top comes off for the 'top down' days,
..and it's fairly well insulated to handle all the other days.
(the small volume that needs heating/cooling helps also)
I am spoiled rotten just settin the temp at 70 degrees
and the heating/AC in the car just keeps it pegged there no matter what's goin on outside.
-Frank aka GE
that's funny. i had a 64 galaxy500 ragtop with a 352. i loved that car, but as you said, i'll not own another ragtop('cept my jeep wrangler)
that said, this is a bit more of a realistic "open letter" to shelby owners, than the "open" letter to camaro owners awhile back was........
http://www.streetsideauto.com/blog/uncategorized/an-open-letter-to-2013-gt500-owners/
if i had a way to cough up 65k, i'd be in a fully loaded one next week..........