Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: mensa180 on January 07, 2014, 10:28:21 AM
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And perhaps a more stratified ENY/OBJ system in general. Right now I can't find a reason to roll a B5N2 or D3A1 over a TBM, or any of those over a Boston III. Likewise a Spit I or C.202 vs a 109F-4 or 109G-2 (or P-38G!). The 109s and 38G are 10 less ENY, but I think generally more capable fighters.
perks = (ENY your plane / ENY enemy plane) * perk point multiplier [ppm]
The best case scenario is to shoot down a plane with 5 ENY. With one of the earlier 109s or a P-38G you would get (30/5)ppm = 6ppm, versus 8ppm for a 40 ENY, but much less capable, ride.
So as it is you'd get 33% more perks in a Spit I than a 38G, but when the best that amounts to is usually a ~2 perk difference, who cares? Maybe my real wish is for a more sensitive perk point multiplier, I'm not sure. That'd seem to encourage more side switching [or logging off, eek], which is dandy, but really my goal is to encourage more flying of 'lesser' planes, not necessarily more even sides. I'm also trying to stick with just higher rewards for more time spent in lesser planes, than trying to punish people for enjoying late war rides. I like late war rides also, but would still enjoy greater diversity in the MA.
tl;dr you should be rewarded with unfathomable riches for going balls out in a Val.
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I remember the ENY used to go up to 60. Don't know why it was changed but I'd like to see it returned that way. A P-40C being only 5 ENY more than a P-38G or P-47D-11 is kind of weird in my opinion. P-40C would definitely be a 60 ENY ride.
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I remember the ENY used to go up to 60. Don't know why it was changed but I'd like to see it returned that way. A P-40C being only 5 ENY more than a P-38G or P-47D-11 is kind of weird in my opinion. P-40C would definitely be a 60 ENY ride.
+1
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Along with a higher any cap...some planes need to be looked at for where they are in terms of ENY.
TA152 vs K4....prime example. I don't think the 152 should have lower any but the K4 should not be higher then it IMO
Brewster should have same ENY has Hurri 2C.
FW190A8 and A5 shouldn't be the same as F8. I understand the words but with its OBJ damage being the same you really don't score much more in perks with the extra ord right now compared to their abilities to take down other fighters. F8 could go to 30
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+1 for a larger ENY scale.
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+1 all for more excessive eny/obj perk point scales
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If we had some real use to the perks (perked loadouts anyone?) I can see the reason for this - but we don't.
A player flying the P-40C is not the kind that is short on perks. Most player will harvest perks in 30s ENY rides anyway. I am a few perks short of 8000 perks and they just keep piling up useless. So what is the point?
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If we had some real use to the perks (perked loadouts anyone?)
We do. Me 262, 163, F4UC, Tempest are all quite popular planes that are heavily controlled by the perk system and players are trying to get perks to fly them. If perks had no point, we could set them free... :noid
I am a few perks short of 8000 perks and they just keep piling up useless. So what is the point?
As above it almost seems to me you are transfering your personal point of view on the player base at large. Only a small minority of players have "thousands of perks" on the bank, and the majority isn't able to "pile them up" in any quick way.
Just for the record, I hardly get ever over 500 fighter perks (and I do earn them at a rate the "average" player can only dream about.)
By the way, this statement is not meant as pro or con to the OP wish :old:
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TA152 vs K4....prime example. I don't think the 152 should have lower any but the K4 should not be higher then it IMO
Yea. The 152 is the most difficult plane to fly well (other than the brainless pick n run), while the K4 is very forgiving, its only downside is the compression at 435. Neither of them are spits though ;)
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I am using OBJ/ENY because it is an existing system that rewards the player, but wouldn't be opposed to non perk incentives for >30 ENY plane use. I just have no clue what they'd be, or if HTC would try to implement something new when there's already a balance system in place.
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Yea. The 152 is the most difficult plane to fly well (other than the brainless pick n run), while the K4 is very forgiving, its only downside is the compression at 435. Neither of them are spits though ;)
Spit 8 and 9 need to see some work...spit 8 should match the LA7, and the spit 9 should be at least a 15 any.
152 is a great plane...pretty good guns, not terrible platform and it's ability to accelerate in a quick shallow dive is something I don't think any other plane has. It should be a 15 any, it has the high alt performance but it just doesn't perform like other "BnZ" style planes.
At MA alt the Mossie is a better ride then the 152.
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We do. Me 262, 163, F4UC, Tempest are all quite popular planes that are heavily controlled by the perk system and players are trying to get perks to fly them. If perks had no point, we could set them free... :noid
As above it almost seems to me you are transfering your personal point of view on the player base at large. Only a small minority of players have "thousands of perks" on the bank, and the majority isn't able to "pile them up" in any quick way.
Just for the record, I hardly get ever over 500 fighter perks (and I do earn them at a rate the "average" player can only dream about.)
My main comment was more about having more use for perks rather than saying the we earn enough perk points. The second part of what I was claiming is that setting the P-40C ENY to 60 will not help much with perk farming. The level of player required to use the P-40C as a an effective perk farmer will almost guarantee that it is the kind of player that already earns lots of perks. Most players will get more perks by flying MUCH more capable ENY 30 planes.
The main reason I swim in perks is that my regular rides are Mosquitos, P47D11/25 or F6Fs and I target mostly fighters, so ENY<10 are a large fraction of my kills. This nets somewhere between 2 and 3 perks per kill on average, before any multipliers.
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maybe they should link the new achievment system to the current perk system...as a player gets more achievments,he gets a discount of cost of a perk ride. alot of achievements are for early or midwar planes.
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maybe they should link the new achievment system to the current perk system...as a player gets more achievments,he gets a discount of cost of a perk ride. alot of achievements are for early or midwar planes.
I respectfully, completely disagree.
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The level of player required to use the P-40C as a an effective perk farmer will almost guarantee that it is the kind of player that already earns lots of perks. Most players will get more perks by flying MUCH more capable ENY 30 planes.
Now with that I can fully agree. I'd say the current ENY 20-30 range is the most 'effective' perk farmers available. And indeed you are spot on when saying that someone being able to score in a ENY 40 ride on a regular base will not be 'desperate for perks' in the first place
The main reason I swim in perks is that my regular rides are Mosquitos, P47D11/25 or F6Fs and I target mostly fighters, so ENY<10 are a large fraction of my kills. This nets somewhere between 2 and 3 perks per kill on average, before any multipliers.
And you are far above 'average' level :) (which is constantly overestimated)
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I have analysed that with different methods before, and given the average ENY of killers and victims in the arena and the average k/h of the ordinary AH player, the net perk earn for him is in the range of like 2-5 fighter perks per hour of flight time. New players even less.
The new achievements gave me also an opportunity to take a peek at the peak amount fighter perks for random players. And as expected, few were "swimming in perks" at all. (Taking up the occasional Me 262 is a very expensive undertaking for most, considering the jet's average K/D of 5-7...)
With a more extreme ENY scaling, we would probably end up with more perks for the 'better' pilots, which would benefit most from it. The question would be if the anticipated increase in usage of 'lesser' rides would offset that change in overall perk balance.
And that's not entirely hypothetical - We had been there before, until autumn 2006 we had exactly this bigger ENY range, with for example the C.205 being at 40 and Hurri I at 60(?). (I made my top record perk farming sorties back at that time :D)
But even back then, the usual supects (like P-51D, Spit 16, La-7, N1k) were making up most of the arena.
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,he gets a discount of cost of a perk ride. alot of achievements are for early or midwar planes.
The P-40C is actually already being THE dominating plane in the EW stats, and it's easy to figure out why. Give discounts for perk rides by having lots of kills in EW or MW planes, and you will see what happens... :noid
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With a more extreme ENY scaling, we would probably end up with more perks for the 'better' pilots, which would benefit most from it. \
This is the best reason in favor of it yet offered on this thread.
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This is the best reason in favor of it yet offered on this thread.
With higher ENY values for 'lesser rides', I would have to spend less time in them and can spend more time in the Me 262, Me 163 and Tempest. You really want that? :old:
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I don`t have a problem with that if I also am earning perks faster. You have shown repeatedly, via statistics, that most everyone reading this bbs is relatively "elite". You have shown compelling logic in arguing that this change would mostly benefit this "elite". Therefore, you have convinced me ;)
With higher ENY values for 'lesser rides', I would have to spend less time in them and can spend more time in the Me 262, Me 163 and Tempest. You really want that? :old:
:aok
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:lol
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Hmm excellent points, back to the drawing board then.
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Hmm excellent points, back to the drawing board then.
Keep thinking. A good idea is rarely thought by all.
If AH staff were to pull rides that had little or no use in the late war, a lot of the high ENY would be locked in midwar. I think they don't do that so one can experience most any ride he or she wants with the exception of the biplanes.
As a side thought on how get the hanger queens out, the torpedo planes might get more use if AH had a good way to train a person on their use or even better let the offline green cross hair come into play on the torpedo runs. The bombers have their semi automated system why not the torpedo planes.
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The P-40C is actually already being THE dominating plane in the EW stats, and it's easy to figure out why. Give discounts for perk rides by having lots of kills in EW or MW planes, and you will see what happens... :noid
The P39D has surpassed the P-40C now that WWIIluv has shot down AngryBrd in B-25s 38 times even though he has 16 kills on AngryBrd in the P40C.
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Snailman, why did you make me look. LOL at the T-34/76
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Snailman, why did you make me look. LOL at the T-34/76
Now you have an idea why I absolutely want the perks & achievements strictly seperate between arenas
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delete
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Now you have an idea why I absolutely want the perks & achievements strictly seperate between arenas
One of the better ideas posted on this board.
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I fly f4f all the time and do pretty well with it. Yet I'm still always starving for fighter perks and I'm ranked 26th in fighter kill points lol. Damn my 262 addiction (it's a real disease with doctors and medicine and everything).
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A Hurricane Mk I gets 1.33 perks for shooting down a Mosquito Mk VI. A Mosquito Mk VI gets .75 perks for shooting down a Hurricane Mk I.
A Hurricane Mk I gets 8 perks for shooting down a P-51D. A Mosquito Mk VI gets 6 perks for shooting down a P-51D.
The Hurricane Mk I does 260mph on the deck, 316mph at best alt, climbs at about 2800fpm, has ~25 minutes of internal fuel, has below average visibility, has eight .303s with 334rpg, suffers from a float carburetor, but turns well. Cannot carry external ordnance. ENY 40
The Mosquito Mk VI does 357mph on the deck, 384mph at best alt, climbs at about 3700fpm, has 68 minutes of internal fuel, has good visibility, has four Hispano Mk II 20mm cannons in the nose with 175rpg and four .303s with 780rpg but doesn't turn very well. It can carry 2,000lbs of bombs or 1,000lbs of bombs and eight rockets. ENY 30.
P-51D does 367mph on the deck, 437mph at best altitude, climbs at about 3500fpm, has ~60 minutes of internal fuel, has excellent visibility, has six .50s with ~400rpg, but doesn't turn very well. It can carry 2,000lbs of bombs and six rockets. ENY 5.
40, 30 and 5. Does that seem right?
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You're right. The Mossie should be around 15 ENY.
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You're right. The Mossie should be around 15 ENY.
No!!! It's big and wooden
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since the A8 is eny 20 I would want the mossie lower than that since it turn better, have better guns and just fly away from a 4 gun A8 ( if you dont wep, and then you never get temperature back to normal)
Dive speed and roll is Mossie's bad things compared, and maybe its more vulnerable.
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You're right. The Mossie should be around 15 ENY.
20 or 22 was my recommendation as I recall. It isn't used enough to be ENY 15. Shortly afterwards HTC revised the ENY numbers and all of the aircraft I thought had significantly off ENYs were changed, except for the Mosquito. It seems HTC wants the Mosquito at ENY 30. That being the case, ENY 40 for things like the Hurricane Mk I seem too low.
since the A8 is eny 20 I would want the mossie lower than that since it turn better, have better guns and just fly away from a 4 gun A8 ( if you dont wep, and then you never get temperature back to normal)
Dive speed and roll is Mossie's bad things compared, and maybe its more vulnerable.
The Fw190A-8 is used much, much more. That plays a not insignificant role in ENY value.
Fw190A-8 is also faster at altitude and once the Mossie's 5 minutes of WEP are done.
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I like the ME109F-4 as a perk farmer, it is a surprising plane in performance. I rarely use perk Rides anyway even with the 6.500+ fighter perks I have along with about the same in bomber perks and close to 9.000 GV perks. However I do use some perk GVs now and then. :cheers:
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20 or 22 was my recommendation as I recall. It isn't used enough to be ENY 15. Shortly afterwards HTC revised the ENY numbers and all of the aircraft I thought had significantly off ENYs were changed, except for the Mosquito. It seems HTC wants the Mosquito at ENY 30. That being the case, ENY 40 for things like the Hurricane Mk I seem too low.
The Fw190A-8 is used much, much more. That plays a not insignificant role in ENY value.
Fw190A-8 is also faster at altitude and once the Mossie's 5 minutes of WEP are done.
I agree one of the most used fighters IRL in ww2 are well-used in AH, despite its shortcomings, mostly due to its guns (which is less effective than the center-mounted Mossies both in range and damage.
The problem is a normal fight is all over long before those 5 minutes expire.
If the Mossie pilot have any smartness built in him, he only use it in bursts and can recharge them, while a overheated A8 more or less has to go and replace the bird for a new one, since 190-A recharge time suck.
I regularly fly with Bozon as a wingman and I struggle to keep up with him, and have to select fights much more to have any chance of success.
If i switch to the 190A5 its quite the opposite climbing all the way to war zone.
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If the Mossie pilot have any smartness built in him, he only use it in bursts and can recharge them, while a overheated A8 more or less has to go and replace the bird for a new one, since 190-A recharge time suck.
For the folks following this discussion, the Mossie VI has a 5/15 minute WEP cycle, the 190A's and F-8 10/20 minutes. (per AH Wiki)
Personally, I would consider WEP advantage as being on the FW side.
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For the folks following this discussion, the Mossie VI has a 5/15 minute WEP cycle, the 190A's and F-8 10/20 minutes. (per AH Wiki)
Personally, I would consider WEP advantage as being on the FW side.
Yeah, RAF WEP recycle times suck in AH.