General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: -ammo- on February 23, 2015, 12:29:19 AM
Title: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 23, 2015, 12:29:19 AM
Not a race - just out for a Sunday drive. The M4 driver was willing to go really fast - I hit 165 just before shutting it down. My winter tires are my limiting factor not to mention the traffic (LOL). They have a W speed rating.
http://youtu.be/KLWFEu5oDwU
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Gman on February 23, 2015, 01:01:55 AM
Hah - awesome. Great sound from the GT500 too.
I'm so envious, I'd love nothing more than to unleash any of the fast cars I've had on those roads over there. I'm sure it's fun needling European drivers with what they believe a la Top Gear to be inferior American cars, and blowing their doors off regularly. A new Z06 or GT500 from the past few years, or one of the new GT series of Mustangs coming - what fun it would be over there.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Volron on February 23, 2015, 01:40:44 AM
Should vest into a camera for rear view as well. Just saw your vid from Mar 14, 2014 about that new Jaguar. :) Would have been nice to see by how much you pulled away from him. :D
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: oldskool65 on February 23, 2015, 04:41:04 AM
Hmm impressive until you want to turn or brake lets see how long you stay with a European sports car round the twisties ohh you can't the gt500 (along with most American cars) handles like an ocean liner
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on February 23, 2015, 05:59:22 AM
Hmm impressive until you want to turn or brake lets see how long you stay with a European sports car round the twisties ohh you can't the gt500 (along with most American cars) handles like an ocean liner
Autobahns rarely have tight turns. Track performance doesn't matter since most people never drive on a track.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: oldskool65 on February 23, 2015, 06:37:09 AM
oh yes and lets not forget awful build quality, prehistoric rear suspension and abysmal fuel consumption also if all your fast driving is done on autobahns and freeways how do you handle the boredom ?
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on February 23, 2015, 07:37:19 AM
oh yes and lets not forget awful build quality, prehistoric rear suspension and abysmal fuel consumption also if all your fast driving is done on autobahns and freeways how do you handle the boredom ?
If I recall correctly the Mustang with the prehistoric suspension beat many euro cars on the Top Gear test track a couple of years ago.
Most people drive out of necessity, not because it's fun.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: SilverZ06 on February 23, 2015, 08:25:55 AM
You could have cut the first 3 minutes out of that video.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Nypsy on February 23, 2015, 09:16:44 AM
oh yes and lets not forget awful build quality, prehistoric rear suspension and abysmal fuel consumption also if all your fast driving is done on autobahns and freeways how do you handle the boredom ?
That's rich, someone from the homeland of the Prince of Darkness bad mouthing American build quality. (http://i1165.photobucket.com/albums/q586/eggshen2912/gxe4esvpbq5vcr4gx1ud_zps58fd500e.png) (http://s1165.photobucket.com/user/eggshen2912/media/gxe4esvpbq5vcr4gx1ud_zps58fd500e.png.html)
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 23, 2015, 10:45:11 AM
Actually, this car handles and brakes pretty darn good. It has both the track pack and performance pack options. There is a network of good curvy roads in the Black Forrest that guys like me take their cars too just to burn fuel and rubber. But mostly a lot of motorcycles.
Z06, sorry you didn't like the video.
GMAn, thanks dude - it's a hoot and I know one day, I'll miss having this opportunity. I'm going to the ring this summer and will be sure to film it. Also have a couple of drag races scheduled as well.
Volron - I have a second camera but I am waiting on a charger cord for the remote - will be up and running soon!
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Volron on February 23, 2015, 01:09:14 PM
That's rich, someone from the homeland of the Prince of Darkness bad mouthing American build quality. (http://i1165.photobucket.com/albums/q586/eggshen2912/gxe4esvpbq5vcr4gx1ud_zps58fd500e.png) (http://s1165.photobucket.com/user/eggshen2912/media/gxe4esvpbq5vcr4gx1ud_zps58fd500e.png.html)
What in the hell is THAT from??? I think it would be safer to set yourself on fire and walk into a 747's central tank filled with vapor... :noid
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: edog1977 on February 23, 2015, 01:17:33 PM
Actually, this car handles and brakes pretty darn good. It has both the track pack and performance pack options. There is a network of good curvy roads in the Black Forrest that guys like me take their cars too just to burn fuel and rubber. But mostly a lot of motorcycles.
Z06, sorry you didn't like the video.
GMAn, thanks dude - it's a hoot and I know one day, I'll miss having this opportunity. I'm going to the ring this summer and will be sure to film it. Also have a couple of drag races scheduled as well.
Volron - I have a second camera but I am waiting on a charger cord for the remote - will be up and running soon!
Just make sure you don't get caught. :D
From their website: "It is prohibited to take photographs, film or make video recordings during tourist drives."
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on February 23, 2015, 01:58:14 PM
Hmm impressive until you want to turn or brake lets see how long you stay with a European sports car round the twisties ohh you can't the gt500 (along with most American cars) handles like an ocean liner
:rofl
Talked like a jealous peep pretending to know about cars while frustrated he'll never own a 600HP+ car.
Here mate have a cup of chillax to smooth your day: (http://i3.cpcache.com/product/63991464/captain_obvious_showdown_mug.jpg)
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Volron on February 23, 2015, 02:27:28 PM
I enjoyed the video, well the part where you actually got on it for the last 20 seconds. The first 3 minutes are just an average drive down the highway is all. I love hearing the blower whine. :cheers:
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 23, 2015, 03:26:58 PM
My editing skills are the suck. Using GoPro Studio and it's my first shot at editing. I'll get better and try and put some "Dolby -esque" type video together soon. :cheers:
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: icepac on February 23, 2015, 07:30:45 PM
Watch out for the audi station wagons.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6eX8WNknVo
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Masherbrum on February 23, 2015, 09:36:31 PM
oh yes and lets not forget awful build quality, prehistoric rear suspension and abysmal fuel consumption also if all your fast driving is done on autobahns and freeways how do you handle the boredom ?
You should stop posting, because you are grossly incorrect.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on February 24, 2015, 04:18:37 AM
Well he is correct on the build quality and fuel consumption. They're both way behind the euro competition.
No doubt about build quality. The Porsches for example are just amazing. The AMGs, BMWs, Audis all are made to very high standards. The Italian and British high end sports cars are no exception. What the Shelby GT500, Corvette, Charger, and higher end Camaro's give you is a LOT of performance for the dollar. None of the Euro cars can match that aspect. Btw, the v8 AMGs have similar fuel consumption.
I respect all of the Euro performance cars - super nice and well designed. Still, it is a lot of fun to wax those (not all) in acceleration. Most of the drivers of those euro cars start it. I wished I had a nickel for every time a European in one of the above mentioned hot euro cars came up next to me and gave me the eye or revved his motor. Most give me a thumbs up when it's done. I have a had a couple follow me into rest stop to chat.
For the record, I didn't start this thread to be a sounding board of "who makes he best car" or the negative posts. It was just to show me having a good time. I have had a few requests to post films.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Volron on February 24, 2015, 05:44:53 AM
I wonder how a Ford GT would fair. :headscratch: Hey ammo, get a Ford GT and do some video's with that one as well. :D
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on February 24, 2015, 07:04:33 AM
I wonder how a Ford GT would fair. :headscratch: Hey ammo, get a Ford GT and do some video's with that one as well. :D
I was very strategic in my quest to purchase this expensive arse Mustang :pray I was still reeling from losing my souped up black GT and the wife knew it. That was the time to strike! The house commander was sympathetic at the time, but a new Ford GT, 6 figures, fogetaboutit :old:
I do have a sneaky plan to trade up to a 2016 GT500 though.. if it looks like I can get out of this car without losing money, I might just do it.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on February 24, 2015, 10:42:04 AM
I don't think anyone who buys a V8 sports car seriously cares about fuel consumption. The issue that people have is legacy of the family saloons and sedans which were real gas guzzlers. Large displacement, low power and a hefty gas bill.
I remember our old Chevy Astro van, it took in excess of 20 liters/100km despite only having a V6. Was a fun car (8 soft seats) but expensive to maintain. Fuel cost was high from the beginning and then with mileage growing, reliability problems started. Electric malfunction after another forced the car to be lifted (couldn't even be towed due to 4wd).
A friend of mine had a full size GMC van, we did a midsummer party trip to a festival with it. Ended up paying in excess of 1000 FIM in gas (current adjusted value closer to 900 euros). We split the bill between 7 persons but it still hurt a teenagers wallet lol. But it was worth it. I'll always remember that trip. Pot, booze, loud music, naked women dancing on top of the van with legs shiny from, uh, sweat... and Alphaville (the band) joined us on our bonfire after their concert.
When it was time for me to drive back I hadn't slept for 30 hours. I remember the way back even better than the party. OUCH!
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 24, 2015, 10:46:21 AM
Well yea.... If I cared about fuel economy I would have bought something like a Focus ST.
Btw, have have you heard that Ford plans to stuff the same ecoboost motor from the 2015 Mustang in the 2016 ST? Now that will be a fun grocery getter.
I just had to edit to respond to your edit. I had a similar trip about 30 years ago from Montgomery to Atlanta for a rock concert in a full sized ford econovan. Memories :cool:
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 24, 2015, 10:52:11 AM
I also have the advantage of the 1950's SOFA agreement which means I get to purchase fuel at the average cost in the U.S. Germany would like to renegotiate the standing SOFA and scratch that addendum from it, with good reason.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: MrRiplEy[H] on February 24, 2015, 10:52:26 AM
Well yea.... If I cared about fuel economy I would have bought something like a Focus ST.
Btw, have have you heard that Ford plans to stuff the same ecoboost motor from the 2015 Mustang in the 2016 ST? Now that will be a fun grocery getter.
Yes I read about it. Although IIRC they plan to detune it for the focus. Unless they changed plans with the new version being AWD and all. The new ST is pretty interesting.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on February 24, 2015, 11:04:38 AM
Most of the drivers of those euro cars start it. I wished I had a nickel for every time a European in one of the above mentioned hot euro cars came up next to me and gave me the eye or revved his motor. Most give me a thumbs up when it's done. I have a had a couple follow me into rest stop to chat.
And that makes sense, you are the rare exotic. There's way more Ferrari/Lambo in the USA per capita than GT500 in Europe I bet. It's natural curiosity over wealthy guy chest pumping. Let's see what 200HP more and and 400 lb extra will do type of deal. Plus most probably still think you have an older Gt500 with slightly over 500HP.
You'd think that with a 2015 Corvette Z06 you'd be pretty set with Tq/aerodynamic/and HP ... yet you no P1 acceleration: :eek: It's really neat to be able to judge/compare visually the 'stats'.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 24, 2015, 11:14:42 AM
Holy shat - Headline! Two UFOs spotted on local racetrack!
I have yet to see a McLaren on the road or racetrack here. Nor a new Z06. I have seen an old Porsche GT, a few 458s, Lambos of different models. I have teed up against a 2014 911 Turbo in my 2010 GT and he cleaned my clock. It was like I was sitting still. I think I have a video of that somewhere... I'll look
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Volron on February 24, 2015, 01:53:13 PM
Comparing the McLaren to the Z06, or even a ZR1 is like comparing the A6M2 to the F-14D. The McLaren is in a league of it's own, and a car I wouldn't mind having. :) Too bad there are only like 2 places in all of the US that could actually support the McLaren properly, and ballz to moving to California for both places. :furious
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: oldskool65 on February 24, 2015, 01:59:46 PM
Just watched Top Gear it looks like at last a Mustang that handles, looks amazing and for £65k a lot of car for the money So it looks like American sports cars are to cease to be the butt of the joke among European petrol heads I haven't seen one for real yet so waiting eagerly .Have they sorted build quality as well ? coz if they have it will sell well here too. Well done Ford ( explain sofa please )
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: SilverZ06 on February 24, 2015, 02:04:30 PM
Just watched Top Gear it looks like at last a Mustang that handles, looks amazing and for £65k a lot of car for the money So it looks like American sports cars are to cease to be the butt of the joke among European petrol heads I haven't seen one for real yet so waiting eagerly .Have they sorted build quality as well ? coz if they have it will sell well here too. Well done Ford ( explain sofa please )
:O I just fell out of my chair. The head basher of all that is American just typed that? Someone must have hacked his account. :uhoh
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 24, 2015, 02:08:10 PM
:O I just fell out of my chair. The head basher of all that is American just typed that? Someone must have hacked his account. :uhoh
Only things that are American and rubbish For example I love American folk music from the Appalachians and Delta Blues , You guys misunderstand I despise American foreign policy ,the obsession with guns and up till the new Mustang your sports cars too I have no problem with the people (the ones i met anyway) thanks ammo
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: ink on February 24, 2015, 04:25:57 PM
:aok
cool vid...
would enjoy taking that thing for a drive. :rock
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Gman on February 24, 2015, 04:52:46 PM
Great video of that new Mac on the track. It's mind boggling when you see something like that first hand, the Z06 must be insane acceleration, I've had numerous hops in various ZR1s in our car clubs in Calgary, and to see that British supercar walk away in the straightaways like that is pretty cool.
If you can get a new 2016 that'd be great Ammo. We had a 2011 version of your car for a short time, and I wish I had been able to drive and experience it more. It's on the list for this year as well, be looking at quite a few cars, so many options now. Unfortunately a 918, P1, LaFerrari, and such will always be outside my price range, seeing them at local car club meets and shows has to suffice. I've had a 45 minute ride in the 918, but it was on busy roads and barely got to see what it was capable of. I'd love a crack at that new Mclaren or Porshe on those great German roads you're on. In central Canada we have some great long, wide, roads, unfortunately the local constabulary gets angry if you go over 80 mph. Very angry.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Widewing on February 24, 2015, 06:34:35 PM
Just keep in mind that the McLaren has over 900 hp, or 1/3 more than the Z06. Yet, the Z06 consistent gained on the twisties....
The McLaren accelerates faster.... It had better for 10 times the cost.
I like old school McLarens... Like a 1968 M6B (customer version of '67 M6A). 725 hp small block Chevy, 1430 lbs. No wings, no ceramic brakes, no traction control (or other electronic nannies), no hyper fast paddle shifting... Just pure driving for a fraction of what a P1 will cost you.
Watch Jim Pace flog one around Road America.... Who is Jim Pace? Winner of 24 hours of Daytona and 12 hours of Sebring in 1996 driving a Riley & Scott.
Just keep in mind that the McLaren has over 900 hp, or 1/3 more than the Z06. Yet, the Z06 consistent gained on the twisties....
The McLaren accelerates faster.... It had better for 10 times the cost.
I like old school McLarens... Like a 1968 M6B (customer version of '67 M6A). 725 hp small block Chevy, 1430 lbs. No wings, no ceramic brakes, no traction control (or other electronic nannies), no hyper fast paddle shifting... Just pure driving for a fraction of what a P1 will cost you.
Watch Jim Pace flog one around Road America.... Who is Jim Pace? Winner of 24 hours of Daytona and 12 hours of Sebring in 1996 driving a Riley & Scott.
This one runs much longer.... A 1974 Shadow, 1971 M8F and the '68 M6B racing for the win. The Shadow and M8F have over 1,000 hp. Not necessarily enough....
This one runs much longer.... A 1974 Shadow, 1971 M8F and the '68 M6B racing for the win. The Shadow and M8F have over 1,000 hp. Not necessarily enough....
I'm not convinced it was the fault of the car, the Z06 driver hit all the marks. Thx for the vid :D
No question that the P1 driver was in a bit over his head. Supercar owners often are. Lot's of money, but shy on skills and talent. We don't know how hard the Z06 driver was pushing. Not terribly hard from what I can tell. He was smooth, staying on line, being consistent. There's that old saying, that "slow is smooth and smooth is fast".
A substantial number of vintage racers are "gentleman" racers... They can't, or won't drive their car anywhere near its limits. They just like motoring around a race course, shall we say, "briskly". Then there's the minority who drive them in anger. Those guys are fun to watch. Some of them have a great deal of racing under their belts and it shows.
I have a love for the Can-Am cars of the 60's and early 70's. From 1965 on, I attended every Can-Am and USRRC race at Bridgehampton, and four Can-Am races at Watkins Glen (as well as two F1 races there). They were, in their day, the fastest road racing cars on earth. Where F1 and Can-Am races were held at the same circuit, the Can-Am cars were faster. Usually several seconds faster. In its heyday, nearly every top tier driver raced Can-Am. It also paid better than F1 at the time. Of course, an Indy 500 win paid vastly more than either.
Think about the technology that was introduced in Can-Am... Jim Hall led the way with his cutting edge Chaparrals. The 2E of 1966 was years ahead of everyone, including Lotus. Movable (two position) rear wing. Hall moved the radiators to the sides to free up the front of the car for an airfoil under the nose. This airfoil would normally direct air up through diffuser vents, up and over the nose. However, it worked along with the rear wing. One straights, Hall would push a pedal and the wing would go to low drag, low downforce. At the same time, the under nose wing would pop up flush to the undertray, and minimized drag up front. Hall could operate a foot pedal because he also introduced an automatic transmission.
All of these new innovations brought with them development bugs. It took most of the 1966 Can-Am season to sort the cars. However, once fully sorted, they were very fast. With Phil Hill in one car and Hall in a second, they utterly crushed the competition at Leguna Seca, finishing 1-2, with no one even close. In the last race of the season at Las Vegas, Hall had the pole, and Hill right behind him. Hill damaged his car's bodywork colliding with the always too aggressive Parnelli Jones. Still, he was in the hunt. Hall was beaten on the start by Surtees, but was clearly faster and it was obvious he would pass him. However, both Chaparrals suffered a failure of a casting on the airfoils. That meant that the wing was no longer controllable for pitch, and they fluttered badly as high speed. Hall parked his car, Hill had his wing removed (he was still in the championship hunt).
Hall's next car was the 2F coupe, designed for European competition. The aerodynamics were improved, and a 427 Chevy replaced the aluminum 327. As is common with that kind of upgrade, the engine power proved too much for the driveline, in this case, for the automatic transmission. It wasn't until season's end that they obtained the reliability needed. They won the last race of the season at Brands Hatch, and did so with relative ease. For the 1967 Can-Am season, Hall updated the 2E, redesignated the 2G. Like the 2F, it also ran a 427 Chevy. However, with most of their resources devoted to the 2F program, the 2G was nowhere near being sorted for the Can-Am season. The extra power was too much for the tires used the year before. Over the course of the season, Hall corrected that until it was competitive with McLaren at season's end. Still, he ran only one car to McLaren's two. Chaparral reliability wasn't much worse than McLaren's, but when you only have a single car, if it breaks, there's no second car to gain wins and points. Hall had designed a new car for 1968, the 2H. It was a complete departure from his previous designs, and it was proving to be a difficult car to get working well. So, he upgraded the 2G and ran the entire season with it. It was exceptionally fast at times, especially on high speed circuits. However, it proved to be insufficient to win, although he led often, only to break down, or suffer some issue that slowed the car. Hall was nearly killed in a spectacular crash at the season ending race at Las Vegas. Hall's Can-Am racing was over. For 1969 he rolled out the under-performing 2H and had hired John Surtees to drive it. It was awful and Hall bought a McLaren M12 for Surtees to drive for the rest of the season. Surtees did well enough to finish 4th in the championship.
For 1970, Hall had another technological marvel. This was the 2J vacuum car. Aside from a 7.7 liter Chevy, it also had a second 2-stroke engine that turned two exhaust fans. The car was sealed to the road surface by Lexan skirts. Just starting the 2-stroke in the pits sucked the car down two inches on its suspension. There were no wings. The 2J cornered faster than anything else in the series, it also braked better. Its boxy shape garnered many comments, such as it "looks like the crate they shipped it in". However, when it rolled out on the track, the snickering turned into gasps. It debuted at Watkins Glen, qualifying 3rd with Jackie Stewart driving. In the race, it turned the fastest lap. Due to mechanical trouble, it retired. It did, however, put a fright into the rest of the teams. Vic Elford next drove the car, and it proved 2 seconds faster than either of the Team McLaren cars. In just four appearances, it set Can-Am on its ear with three poles, four fastest laps and three course records. Reliability would come eventually. Everyone knew that 1971 would bring a fully sorted 2J, and reports that it was breaking course records in shakedown runs prompted the bigger teams to howl like scalded dogs. They complained that it would make every car obsolete and effectively end Can-Am. As if four consecutive championships by McLaren didn't count... So, under pressure, the SCCA banned the 2J. They claimed that the fans were illegal movable aerodynamic surfaces. Even though the FIA disagreed, the ban was not lifted. Jim Hall walked away from Can-Am. McLaren won another championship. However, 1972 changed everything. The Penske 900 hp twin turbo 917/10 Porsche crushed McLaren in 1972, and the 1,100 hp (over 1,500 hp using qualifying boost) 917/30 was even faster in 1973. However, McLaren had already seen the grim future and abandoned Can-Am after 1972 to concentrate on F1 and Indianapolis.
Hall moved on to Indy cars, where he introduced the first ground effects Indy car in 1980, the 2K. It won Indy, and the USAC and CART championships that year.
Those amazing days of minimal rules and vast horsepower are gone now. Everything, every class has a firm formula that largely limits innovation in comparison to the old days of Can-Am. Even LMP-1 is boring... The GT category is hamstrung by numbing rules. F1 has become routine. In the past decade we had the Ferrari show, the Red Bull Show, and now the Mercedes show. Racing desperately needs a new formula libre series like the old Group 7 class, where almost anything goes...
Chaparral 2D (European endurance racing. Chaparrals won at Sebring and Nurburgring): (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/a7/76/16/a776165c1f9df43b7d7359b2eba238cf.jpg)
Chaparral 2G: (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/63/f7/e4/63f7e4273ef2554b55fa180fcf711760.jpg) Comparing the 2G of '67 to 2G of '68: (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/70/b5/70/70b5700a3f900e53ca45b52f4e58c19d.jpg)
Hmm impressive until you want to turn or brake lets see how long you stay with a European sports car round the twisties ohh you can't the gt500 (along with most American cars) handles like an ocean liner
There is a factory camaro that runs with the super cars on the track.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Gman on February 25, 2015, 11:13:25 AM
Now that is an accurate write up Widewing. Apparently you have a vast repository of info on not just WW2 aviation but racing as well. I have an extended family member, a cousin of some sort of my mothers, who was the only Can-Am champion other than Jaques Villeneuve in the later Can Am years, and I used to hear about it a lot when I was younger. Horst Kroll, he had a VW shop as well, and always worked on my parents VW Bugs and VW Van when I was a kid.
SO much technology was invented back in that series, I wish something along those lines would return, as I agree, the current racing series are very limited by rules, regulations, and other bureaucratic BS that it's hampering not just the racing, but the innovations. F1 this year - this is the first time I've never watched any of the races live, it's completely lost so many people, guys I know that used to be so invested in following it.
Same goes with so many other series. I'd rather watch street racing videos online than many of the racing series I used to follow, at least there it isn't governed by a bunch of bureaucrats, and driven by competition even if it's in an amateur-hour way.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Widewing on February 26, 2015, 08:03:27 PM
Now that is an accurate write up Widewing. Apparently you have a vast repository of info on not just WW2 aviation but racing as well. I have an extended family member, a cousin of some sort of my mothers, who was the only Can-Am champion other than Jaques Villeneuve in the later Can Am years, and I used to hear about it a lot when I was younger. Horst Kroll, he had a VW shop as well, and always worked on my parents VW Bugs and VW Van when I was a kid.
SO much technology was invented back in that series, I wish something along those lines would return, as I agree, the current racing series are very limited by rules, regulations, and other bureaucratic BS that it's hampering not just the racing, but the innovations. F1 this year - this is the first time I've never watched any of the races live, it's completely lost so many people, guys I know that used to be so invested in following it.
Same goes with so many other series. I'd rather watch street racing videos online than many of the racing series I used to follow, at least there it isn't governed by a bunch of bureaucrats, and driven by competition even if it's in an amateur-hour way.
Gman, when I was a kid, I had two passions... Airplanes and racing cars. The best I could do at 13 was race slot cars, and I did that for a couple of years. When we went to a race, it was for the entire weekend. We brought tents and coolers packed into the family station wagon. I got to meet, shake hands with and chat with most of the Can-Am drivers of the era. In those days, it was very informal in the paddock, completely unlike today. Those drivers always took time for kids. Dan Gurney, Bruce McLaren and Denny Hulme were especially gracious. Jim Hall was not much of a talker, but if you asked the right question, he'd open up.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on February 28, 2015, 12:15:12 PM
I never really hit it with Can Am nor Open Wheel even F1.
I am a GT guy with my golden area in the late 50s early 60s, I'm a sucker for those body style and sounds.
Here some car porn. :kiss: Aston DBR1, 250TR, D type, Maserati 300S ... (http://img.favcars.com/aston-martin/dbr1/pictures_aston-martin_dbr1_1957_2.jpg)
In the 80s I was obcessed by British TOCA and DTM. But today's racing I'm still a GT class guy, that's where the best racing is to me. AMLS, Pirelli Challenge, any world GT3/GT4. Here's 2015 12H Bathurst finish ... Audi/Bentley/Aston/GTR/Porsche :cool:
I wished those type of racing were properly covered in the US. :frown:
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on February 28, 2015, 03:11:54 PM
Took advantage of the sunny weather today got more video. I had two cameras running. If I can figure out to piece them together... I did a burnout with a rear facing view and a 0-150 sprint. If want to see it, just search YT. I should have it posted later this week.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: SFRT - Frenchy on February 28, 2015, 06:32:18 PM
I use windows movie maker. U can import the vids and cut/merge as necessary as well as direct upload to youtube.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on March 06, 2015, 02:43:28 PM
Bump - a short vid of a burnout and a sprint to 150 MPH on the A8
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: ink on March 06, 2015, 03:06:49 PM
nice Ammo
A8 is the Autobahn right?
could you explain that to me?
does it just straight up not have a speed limit?
only the far lane is limitless?
with the speeds that are done on that highway....are there lots of crashes? (im thinking less then ours)
I always heard of the Autobahn, would love to have a road like that in the states...
supposedly out west there are highways that have no speed limit, but I haven't seen any, I only visited a few states though so I suppose there could be some.
out in Texas... Arizona.... new mexico...ECT ECT,.....there certainly could easily be roads that have no speed limit.
man that would be fun :D
you are lucky :cheers:
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Skuzzy on March 06, 2015, 03:25:03 PM
In Texas, we have stretches of highways with 75, 80, and 85MPH speed limits.
Once a year, the state closes a stretch of road for a race. http://www.bborr.com/ There is an "unlimited" class which has no speed limit, or you can settle for one of the other classes which range in average speed limits from 112MPH to 180MPH.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Gman on March 06, 2015, 03:48:16 PM
Highway 130 in Texas right Skuzzy? I've read it's about 75km of 85 mph limit. I don't know why this isn't adopted in Canada in more places. There are a few roads that have 120 kmh limit, call it 75 ish, but a huge majority of the Trans Canada highway is 110, which is ridiculous considering how wide, long, and flat a majority of it is. They always say it's for "safety", IMO it's mainly about "revenue", if it's safe enough for 10 year old beat up RCMP cars to cruise at 140 everywhere I see them, it should be safe enough for a 100$k high performance car, or any modern car that's built to cruise comfortably and safely at these still moderate speeds.
That race looks like a lot of fun, I wish we had something similar, that was done monthly on various roads in the summer.
Nice vid Ammo. You must get velocitized pretty badly on that A8 and other German highways, when you come back to the USA or have to drive on 100kmh posted roads there, it must feel like walking. I know after a few higher speed runs I've done back in the day, doing the posted limit here on Canadian highways that you can see straight ahead for about 50 miles with no curves, it feels like you're in 1st gear on a treadmill- SO slow.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: ink on March 06, 2015, 03:54:36 PM
In Texas, we have stretches of highways with 75, 80, and 85MPH speed limits.
Once a year, the state closes a stretch of road for a race. http://www.bborr.com/ There is an "unlimited" class which has no speed limit, or you can settle for one of the other classes which range in average speed limits from 112MPH to 180MPH.
Texas would be the perfect place to have some highways with no speed limit.
hell in NH now they upped the limit to 75 recently...
personally I think they should start teaching drivers ED right in the 4th grade learn all the road laws and the physics and then when you hit 8th grade they have driving sims to practice on...then in 9th grade you take it to the road, when you graduate you have certified to drive on the roads.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Zoney on March 06, 2015, 03:58:49 PM
Arizona has 75 mph limits on highways outside of cities, and I have found law enforcement forgiving for speeds far above that. I got pulled over doing 108 in a 70 on the I-8 to San Diego just inside the California border on my motorcycle. He did not just let me go but wrote me a ticket for 75 in a 70. I'd say that was pretty forgiving.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on March 06, 2015, 04:37:19 PM
As we all know, the Autobahn system was the brainchild of Adolph Hitler. IMO, it is the single positive legacy of an otherwise evil person.
Not unlike the US Interstate system, the main highways are numbered in single digits while secondary highways numbered double and triple digits. The US interstate system number north/south highways in odd numbers and east/west in even numbers. Germany doesn't do that.
The Autobahn is not completely unrestricted - from what I just gathered from wikipedia, about 50% of the entire system is unrestricted (with a recommended speed of 130 kph) with the other 48% controlled at a lawful speed.
The A8 is a main artery highway that runs NW to SE through the center of the Stuttgart metroplex. It is contolled atb 100-120 kph through town but is unrestricted just outside of the city. the quickest way for me to find a spot to open the car up is head NW toward Karsrühl. The 3-4 lane stretch of unrestricted highway is about 30 kilometers long. There are better highways - the A7 toward Austria through Ulm; The A5 from Heidelberg to France, the 81 from Herrenberg to Switzerland..etc
German law is you must always pass on the left.
Crashes are fewer than in town but when they happen, they can be catastrophic
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: ink on March 06, 2015, 04:40:10 PM
:aok
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Skuzzy on March 06, 2015, 04:45:07 PM
Texas would be the perfect place to have some highways with no speed limit.
hell in NH now they upped the limit to 75 recently...
personally I think they should start teaching drivers ED right in the 4th grade learn all the road laws and the physics and then when you hit 8th grade they have driving sims to practice on...then in 9th grade you take it to the road, when you graduate you have certified to drive on the roads.
I agree about the education, but we also need better traffic laws and traffic management before we plunge into open ended speeds. The lunatics around here would drive with both feet flat on the floor, if they could, all the while swerving all over the road passing slower traffic. It would be a disaster to let the untrained loose at full speed without the proper infrastructure to support it.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: -ammo- on March 06, 2015, 05:03:55 PM
I agree about the education, but we also need better traffic laws and traffic management before we plunge into open ended speeds. The lunatics around here would drive with both feet flat on the floor, if they could, all the while swerving all over the road passing slower traffic. It would be a disaster to let the untrained loose at full speed without the proper infrastructure to support it.
not just around there :rofl
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Wmaker on March 07, 2015, 07:46:39 AM
I never really hit it with Can Am nor Open Wheel even F1.
I am a GT guy with my golden area in the late 50s early 60s, I'm a sucker for those body style and sounds.
While I think F1 and Can Am have/had some amazingly cool things in them, you to tally said it. In those races, at that era, the cars were the coolest ever, sex was safe and motorsport was very dangerous!
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Gman on March 07, 2015, 03:57:06 PM
I agree with that Skuzzy. I think a graduated license system, a class that, if you had proper training, would give you a sticker on your plate and a number on your license that authorized higher speed driving. Something like that for a start, I agree about the infrastructure and laws as well. I just believe that our huge, wide, long, straight highways here can safely support much higher speeds than 70mph/110 kmh. I've always pushed that by 20kmh, always, and never once had an accident on the highway, and nor do I think it jeopardized anyone else. I drive/drove a lot of miles every year, going between Vancouver, Calgary, and Toronto by car a lot.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Widewing on March 08, 2015, 07:44:51 PM
While I think F1 and Can Am have/had some amazingly cool things in them, you to tally said it. In those races, at that era, the cars were the coolest ever, sex was safe and motorsport was very dangerous!
Can-Am and endurance racing had very cool cars... Can-Am cars were always faster than F1 on the same circuit...
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/e9/4d/51/e94d5176f11d532817b06e26fa2071cd.jpg) Chaparral 2A, June 1965.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/9d/0d/fa/9d0dfa5751f690a7f24b9eb21e9b3399.jpg) Chaparral 2C and 2A, December of 1965
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/7d/c1/c8/7dc1c8a2d0fde13651df31727cd27a7d.jpg) Carroll Shelby poses with the GT-40 Mk.IV that would win the '67 Le Mans. Photo taken at airport prior to loading the car on the TWA cargo plane.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/dd/20/a5/dd20a5416e390b87118a880414b310ca.jpg) John Surtees in a Lola T70 Mk.2 leads Bruce McLaren in his M1B, Leguna Seca, 1966.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/f4/b9/18/f4b9186e5be4a564569150b8419299ec.jpg) Ford GT-40 MK.II cars waiting to load up for Paris, 1966.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/44/76/6a/44766ae8edc5516842954a2fabf31d8c.jpg) Bruce McLaren drives his M8A at Riverside, 1968.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/52/7e/a1/527ea185b450b39caf28416dd24aea63.jpg) Chris Amon and Bruce McLaren win the 1966 Le Mans in their GT-40 MK.II
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/t31.0-8/11021355_10206190618669800_3223275736569499870_o.jpg) Jim Hall in his Chaparral 2G leads Mark Donahue, Riverside, 1968.
(https://scontent-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/t31.0-8/11025835_10206160902886924_5242867050990986496_o.jpg) George Folmer driving his Penske-Porsche 917/10 twin turbo, 1972.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/66/9a/71/669a714f8f62becabf8b93dcd03cf39b.jpg) Chaparral 2J of 1970, which will easily out-corner a modern F1 car.
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: fbEagle on March 10, 2015, 02:50:17 PM
Man what i wouldn't give to drive the autobahn when i go to work at 11Pm :t
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Widewing on March 11, 2015, 12:59:57 AM
Gents, check out the entry list for the 1963 L.A. Times Grand Prix... A who's who of the best in the world.
3 F1 world champions, 5 indy 500 winners, 7 F1 GP winners and many of the best sports car drivers in the world at the time... Chaparral took the pole in a record time...
Title: Re: 2014 GT500 vs BMW M4
Post by: Gman on March 11, 2015, 09:47:45 AM
Love that Chap 2j, I'd love it if someone built a scale electric r/c car for me to goof around with, good conversation piece as virtually nobody, even guys into F1 and other racing, have any idea it even existed, much less what an incredible thing it was. Be neat to see mini little ground skirts dragging along at 50mph in the parking lot next door, that'll be as close as I'd ever get to anything like it.
Such an amazing car for its time, one of those things in world history that just seems to exist outside of time.