Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Tumor on February 07, 2016, 01:56:20 PM
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You had 1 AH life per day?
Or, per hour.
Most of the time, this is how I fly AH... to ~stay alive~, and contribute something worthwhile to the team effort. I routinely run my P-51 out of 100% fuel two or three times (rearm) per flight and even so, my kills per hour is atrocious lol. (my gunnery is really terrible... far worse than way back when I was on cable, I often think it has to do with my backwoods hick run ADSL isp). But, I think this is the cost of maintaining good SA and keeping my paper-mache, bb shooting P-51 free from damage.
It's a fair question I'd like to see discussed.
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Cutting down my aces high time down to about 5 min if that happened
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It's better used in the special events. Too many people would log off, get bored, and never be ever to develop their game based on dying too much. It would kill the fights.
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It's a fair question I'd like to see discussed.
It is a fair question, the answers to which will probably fall into the old simulation v. game categories. From the latter perspective (mine!) I think this would discourage fights because it encourages survival. But there's no doubt that your suggestion more closely resembles real life.
- oldman
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I think way too many people act like this is already the case.
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You had 1 AH life per day?
Or, per hour.
Most of the time, this is how I fly AH... to ~stay alive~, and contribute something worthwhile to the team effort. I routinely run my P-51 out of 100% fuel two or three times (rearm) per flight and even so, my kills per hour is atrocious lol. (my gunnery is really terrible... far worse than way back when I was on cable, I often think it has to do with my backwoods hick run ADSL isp). But, I think this is the cost of maintaining good SA and keeping my paper-mache, bb shooting P-51 free from damage.
It's a fair question I'd like to see discussed.
The chest thumping on 200 would go way way down if this were the case. People fly recklessly because they know they can get another airplane...
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The chest thumping on 200 would go way way down if this were the case. People fly recklessly because they know they can get another airplane...
It'd get rid of the ones who could back it up, I guess, but there would still be plenty of yappers.
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I have absolutely no regard for my cartoon pilot, and am quite fond of making him die a horrific death in all possible methods in game. So the more I have him screaming and messing his flight suit the better
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I think way too many people act like this is already the case.
This. I would not play. Think running is bad now?
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You'd end up with an arena full of players not wanting to fight. There are already enough timid pilots on this game, no need to encourage more.
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You'd end up with an arena full of players not wanting to fight. There are already enough timid pilots on this game, no need to encourage more.
This and Vudak's posts.
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This and Vudak's posts.
yup,you think the runstangs and run90s are bad now :rofl
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It's mostly due to the fact that the planes are not limited to time zones and region barriers in the MA. 190Ds would have a hard time running against p51Ds, high P47s, and Temps. Of course it will be harder to stay alive in mid war-early war planes in the MA. This means more people would fly high late war planes in general very fast and very cautiously.
This scenario of 1 death per pilot is something that works best in the special events arena, like FSO. The planes are more fairly matched, and you partake in actual missions designed to bring a sense of realism.
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I didn't suggest anything. Just a question.
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It's been tried it sucked
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It's been tried it sucked
Now that's an answer to my liking! Nothing rivals experience.
Someone might try to argue that the players have changed since then. No they haven't. They're still human beings.
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My apology to Hitech before I suggest this.
Hitech have you ever thought of posting a sticky of all the ideas that are a no go, or have been tried and canceled by you due to it's bad impact on the game?
Knowing this community that would be a stinker of an idea. Then the usual Robespierre's would whip up the usual lynch mobs to demand you implement every single bad idea on your list so they can be the expert judges of how your game should work.
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I look at it this way. Winning a fight is important. Dying isn't.
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Ok, for those of you challenged by reading comprehension... HOW WOULD YOU CARTOON FLY YOUR CARTOON RIDE, OR DRIVE YOUR CARTOON VEHICLE, OR CARTOON BOAT? IF YOU HAD BUT ONE CARTOON LIFE TO LIVE, BE IT PER CARTOON DAY, OR PER CARTOON HOUR.
There, big letters and everything.
"THERE IS NO MENTION ANYWHERE REGARDING CHANGING AH GAME PLAY".
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in 5 minutes, assuming everyone got up and flew..... you'd have 1 guys flying around by himself waiting for everyone to get lives back! LOL!!!
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The chest thumping on 200 would go way way down if this were the case. People fly recklessly because they know they can get another airplane...
Some fly recklessly because we like a fight...and talking crap on 200 normally gets people hunting me...makes it easier to find a fight.
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Ok, for those of you challenged by reading comprehension... HOW WOULD YOU CARTOON FLY YOUR CARTOON RIDE, OR DRIVE YOUR CARTOON VEHICLE, OR CARTOON BOAT? IF YOU HAD BUT ONE CARTOON LIFE TO LIVE, BE IT PER CARTOON DAY, OR PER CARTOON HOUR.
There, big letters and everything.
"THERE IS NO MENTION ANYWHERE REGARDING CHANGING AH GAME PLAY".
Dale's post pretty much eliminates your posturing. But please regale us all with your greatness.
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Dale's post pretty much eliminates your posturing. But please regale us all with your greatness.
:airplane: WOOSH
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The chest thumping on 200 would go way way down if this were the case. People fly recklessly because they know they can get another airplane...
Chest Thumpers = Squelch. Remove their audience and their chest thumping egos are heard by no one.
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This is a combat game not a playing tag game. We have enough p51 and 190 pilots that runs. I agree with what AKAK said.
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Tumor, I don't know what your looking for here. I and most like me would fly/drive like our CARTOON life depended on it. People would only engage when they held all the advantages and disengage when they felt they were losing those advantages. It would make for very boring fights as most would make a single pass and haul donut !
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Tumor, I don't know what your looking for here. I and most like me would fly/drive like our CARTOON life depended on it. People would only engage when they held all the advantages and disengage when they felt they were losing those advantages. It would make for very boring fights as most would make a single pass and haul donut !
Ding Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner.
Thats exactly what happened.
As I have stated before, when you make not dieing so important the way to not die and win is not to play.
HiTech
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Joshua: "A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. How about a nice game of chess?"
semp
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Ding Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner.
Thats exactly what happened.
As I have stated before, when you make not dieing so important the way to not die and win is not to play.
HiTech
What happened where?
...and why is the DA so dead?
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What happened where?
"There's none so blind as those who will not see."
You were given your answer but apparently not the one you wanted.
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What happened where?
...and why is the DA so dead?
I recall you mentioning something about "reading comprehension". :uhoh
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"There's none so blind as those who will not see."
You were given your answer but apparently not the one you wanted.
Yep.
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Tumor, I think your idea is fantastic. Don't let the guys that know what they are talking about and have experienced the dismal failure that resulted from implementing your idea years ago.
Please, by all means, implement your idea personally and maybe it will catch on. Every time you are killed log for 24 hours.
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:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
semp
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I have always believed that one of the biggest dumbest things about AH/AW was.... unlimited planes at a base.
You can have a useless furball or a so called GV battle at spawn point all day long and know one never runs out of planes or tanks.
World War 2 online does a much better job at this than AH, limited numbers of equipment per base that must be resupplied if it is lost in combat.
This would end the food fight between "win the types" and furballers... Furballing would help win the war/battle just by using up the others sides equipment.
Not the same as one life per hour........ but you you would have fly wiser knowing that you need to get that plane home again or run out of them.
CAVALRY
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I have always believed that one of the biggest dumbest things about AH/AW was.... unlimited planes at a base.
You can have a useless furball or a so called GV battle at spawn point all day long and know one never runs out of planes or tanks.
World War 2 online does a much better job at this than AH, limited numbers of equipment per base that must be resupplied if it is lost in combat.
This would end the food fight between "win the types" and furballers... Furballing would help win the war/battle just by using up the others sides equipment.
Not the same as one life per hour........ but you you would have fly wiser knowing that you need to get that plane home again or run out of them.
CAVALRY
Think this through to it's logical conclusion: nobody will fight unless in the safety of a gang. The fight will die, as will the game.
People enjoy the "useless" furball and spawn camping or they wouldn't exist. How do you think they came to be?
You want more realism? Enjoy climbing out for forty minutes in FSO.
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Cav, now lets look at your idea from the "griefers jaundiced eye". There are griefers that love to disrupt anything they can, including their own team mates. One could up Spitfire 16's one after another and crash them to stop anyone else from flying them, or any other aircraft for that matter.
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I have always believed that one of the biggest dumbest things about AH/AW was.... unlimited planes at a base.
You can have a useless furball or a so called GV battle at spawn point all day long and know one never runs out of planes or tanks.
World War 2 online does a much better job at this than AH, limited numbers of equipment per base that must be resupplied if it is lost in combat.
This would end the food fight between "win the types" and furballers... Furballing would help win the war/battle just by using up the others sides equipment.
Not the same as one life per hour........ but you you would have fly wiser knowing that you need to get that plane home again or run out of them.
CAVALRY
we had that in AW and it sucked.
semp
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Cav, now lets look at your idea from the "griefers jaundiced eye".
Odd you do not see a lot of that in WW2OL... maybe we have the wrong type of players in AH. But they have a much more structured game environment than we do.
IRACING with 60,000 members 100's of races a day, but you don't see players driving backwards at Daytona. Why? They get reported and banned from the game.
we had that in AW and it sucked.
You sir, I do not think played AW, because never we never had that in AW. :headscratch: But I still think it was need.
People enjoy the "useless" furball and spawn camping or they wouldn't exist. How do you think they came to be?
They still can furball or camp, but now it is part of the war effort. And at some point one side or the other wins. In most cases the side with the best Pilots!
Think about it you're outnumbered on the defense at a base....But your side is killing them at a higher rate and you can break the back of the attackers by exhausting their supply of planes.
And also maybe do away with eny... You can't do a set number of plane types at each base. AW has to many, so it would have to be a point system something like let say....
500 AC pts at a small base, 1000 AC pts at a mid base, 1500 at a large base. So if your side has the largest population your ride is going to cost more to use than the lower populations.... but you still get that P-51D if that is your ride of choice.
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cav, you sir didnt play aw because there was a limit of how many airplanes could up from a single base. and it sucked.
semp
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From a "staying alive standpoint" lets just be honest, if you don't fly a very fast plane, and/or be very fast at all times, you will be deadmeat most of the time. In an arena such as the MA, where all different time zones and regions can fight against each other, "staying alive" is very difficult against late war super planes.
Flying mid war and early war planes in the MA is a challenge in itself. Imagine if now all these late war plane pilots really had to stay alive. There would be no point in flying harder planes because dying would end the tour.
You have to realise that A. The majority of the arena really isn't up to par with legit ACM training, pilot training, and squad tactics like in real life. Most of them haven't the slightest clue what they are actually doing.
B. Puff ack and Attacking bases would totally suck.
C. Try staying alive for an entire tour with more than 2 kill/sortie and 150 kills. It's actually much harder than you think to stay alive at all times in the MA.
I play to stay to alive in many of the special events like FSO, Combat Challenge, This day in WW2, also, in Tour Jan-2015 for a bet in a Tempest. I love when the plane matchups are on the same scale in terms of time and region. I use quick aggressivene strikes and make sure to drag opponents into 1v1 situations. At times you do have to extend away if there are more than 3 following you. If you get cought with 3 cons and you cannot out run them, it's GG 85% of the time. You really have to look around you to make sure you can make attacks or dive without a high con following. You cannot shoot at a plane too long. You have to make sure when you shoot no one is trailing your 6. It's very smart to stick with your friendlies, but if you are comfortable with defensive manuevers in a 1v1 and a high con jumps your 6, it's sometimes better to drag them out 1v1 away from the fight. Diving is your best friend. If you can kill them, it gives you time to get some alt or go rtb. If you are too aggressive you will get jumped. If you are too timid you won't get any kills.
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I have always believed that one of the biggest dumbest things about AH/AW was.... unlimited planes at a base.
AW didn't have unlimited planes at a base, it has a zone limit that only allowed 20 players to take off from any given base. If there were more than 20 taking off from a base and you wanted to up there, you had to wait until a spot opened up. If you didn't land, you lost your place and had to wait until a spot opened up.
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See Rule #4
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:airplane: WOOSH
The guy is a troll. He's sharting in another thread unprovoked.
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Ding Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner.
Thats exactly what happened.
As I have stated before, when you make not dieing so important the way to not die and win is not to play.
HiTech
You can force fights if you have the proper player/space ratio though.
It's just that people won't ram, bomb and bail, vulchtard, etc. if Tumor's theory were in place (or something like it).
You might see better fights. People would use real tactics and not some of the silly stuff based on an "all rides are easily replaced" mentality. Sure would be a lot less abuse on 200 toward those who fly smart in any case.
It is an interesting theoretical discussion.
Theory. Probably not the best idea in reality. But...good to chew the fat.
I don't know what variable would create the ideal balance between aggression and smarts. Would be nice to find it, though.
Cheerio!
:salute
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"There's none so blind as those who will not see."
You were given your answer but apparently not the one you wanted.
It is an answer. But not THE answer, as this question likely has more than one--right AND wrong.
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See Rule #4
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Furballing would help win the war/battle just by using up the others sides equipment.
Furballing already does help win the war... It keeps the guys who know what they're doing preoccupied with each other so you win the warriors can capture something once in awhile.
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You might see better fights. People would use real tactics and not some of the silly stuff based on an "all rides are easily replaced" mentality. Sure would be a lot less abuse on 200 toward those who fly smart in any case.
One thing that I find interesting is that many of the people who think they're flying so smart can't figure out how to shoot an enemy down 1v1 when said enemy is aware of their presence.
Also last time I checked, ACM and aggression are real tactics... Some of you guys act like Hartmann's style was the only one...
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Many years ago Tumor's idea was actually put into practice in AH in the form of a monthly competition. The top players (think it was the top 15) were given prizes for coming in at the end of the tour in the top 15. The result was almost a dramatic shift in game play, players started to play less for the fight and instead "flew to live" so they could try and crack into the top 15. It made for a very boring game.
You can force fights if you have the proper player/space ratio though.
No, you can't force someone to fight if they are intent on "living" and not wanting to risk their virtual life by engaging in a fight.
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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Flying to stay alive is quite boring. When I flew the Temp Tour in Jan 2015. I had to extend away from potential 1v1s when they got on my 6, as defense is hard in Temps, and always made sure to never get low n slow, or get ganged. I was able to run away from most trouble and thats what kept me alive. It's quite boring. I went 127-0 before I died blacking out pulling up too hard trying to shoot easy bombers, non the less.
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Flying to stay alive is quite boring. When I flew the Temp Tour in Jan 2015. I had to extend away from potential 1v1s when they got on my 6, as defense is hard in Temps, and always made sure to never get low n slow, or get ganged. I was able to run away from most trouble and thats what kept me alive. It's quite boring. I went 127-0 before I died blacking out pulling up too hard trying to shoot easy bombers, non the less.
Thank you Violator, (and the rest) for the discussion.
It does get boring at times. Running a Pony with 100% gas and rearming 4 times... that takes awhile. That said, I started the stay-alive thing mostly because for years every fight I got in, the inevitable Spit/Lala/Yak came along and ended it for me (the same ones that whine about getting picked, funny enough). I don't see (any more) turny burny skill as the ultimate challenge, I just don't... and since I try to keep it "somewhat" realistic (read: try not to engage in silly unrealistic maneuvers), I will never compete at the highest level as a so-called dogfighter. Actively engaging in something (whatever, a mix of Fighter/Attack) that is beneficial to the Rookland AND landing kills is where I get the most fun. At the moment, I try and do a little bomb****ing of GV's, then switch to full fighter mode (and land'em), it's definitely a challenge. Someone earlier said, "this will fall into the old game vs sim argument", which was not my intent, however accurate. I TREAT this (fully realized) game as a Sim... because there's no game/sim out there that offers anything better. Really, DCS is fun as hell but the multiplayer aspect is terrible at the moment. I guess I'm easily bored by the same old thing, and given the time I have in AH, picking as opposed to getting picked has my attention.
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Thank you Violator, (and the rest) for the discussion.
It does get boring at times. Running a Pony with 100% gas and rearming 4 times... that takes awhile. That said, I started the stay-alive thing mostly because for years every fight I got in, the inevitable Spit/Lala/Yak came along and ended it for me (the same ones that whine about getting picked, funny enough). I don't see (any more) turny burny skill as the ultimate challenge, I just don't... and since I try to keep it "somewhat" realistic (read: try not to engage in silly unrealistic maneuvers), I will never compete at the highest level as a so-called dogfighter. Actively engaging in something (whatever, a mix of Fighter/Attack) that is beneficial to the Rookland AND landing kills is where I get the most fun. At the moment, I try and do a little bomb****ing of GV's, then switch to full fighter mode (and land'em), it's definitely a challenge. Someone earlier said, "this will fall into the old game vs sim argument", which was not my intent, however accurate. I TREAT this (fully realized) game as a Sim... because there's no game/sim out there that offers anything better. Really, DCS is fun as hell but the multiplayer aspect is terrible at the moment. I guess I'm easily bored by the same old thing, and given the time I have in AH, picking as opposed to getting picked has my attention.
Yeah tumor, it is fun to fly to stay alive if you are into it. What many of us correlate staying alive to " flying timid" is wrong, although in lesser turning planes you cannot afford to get slow in a turn fight or pull a rope with a lot of cons around. There are certain circumstances in which you should be aggressive, pull quick emmils on the first merge, zoom through furballs hopping on people's 6 unexpectedly and then extending out. You have to be quick and create good merges on your opponents to get snap shops. It's best to be unexpected in your actions.
One of the best things I read when trying to figure out ACM is that getting merges right (as in putting your nose where you think they will be to gain the quickest distance point to the foe) will make you 10Xs more deadly and unexpected.
The second best thing you can learn is defense. How to drag opponents out into 1V1 odds to better your chances in a reversal. How to dip and dodge to force an overshoot. How to avoid planes jumping on your 6 while you are shooting someone down. When to split-S. Why 5-8 point rolls are actually important. When you can pull a counterpunch in a nose down dive while using your E to escape the fight zone.
The last thing that's important is to know the plane you are flying's strengths and weaknesses against the planes you are fighting agaisnt. If you are in a mid-early war plane than you have to stay fast and high to avoid getting ganged. You have to win the 1v1 fights because you will be dragging cons out. The mid-early war planes generally turn better but you have to be much more aware of the cons around you. It's difficult in the MA, because all it takes is a La7 to catch you for the gang to finish you off.
In the late war planes, you have to judge when and where to turn, you have to judge the planes you fight 1v1 agaisnt so you can get away if they turn inside you. You have to be quick in any plane you fly as well as know the ACM nesseccary to perform manuevers and merges to really actually get kills.
The two tours I tried to stay alive were last Jan 15 in a Temp with 229kills -8 deaths and Dec15 in a P-40N for 105-38 which was pretty damn hard lol.