Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Electroman on October 26, 2016, 07:18:04 PM
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Hi All,
As an avid bomber (predominantly 80% or better of my time) I have tried to give the new AH3 a chance. It has a lot of great graphics and eye candy now - a much welcome improvement. Some of the game play has been improved, but a few key things have not for bomber pilots. In fact, it has taken away from our gameplay.
Bombing strats were effective before for all countries. Now, with a resup time of 30 minutes per drop box it is almost worthless to spend 1 - 2 hours on a long strat run or creating massive bomber missions to do this. By the time you bomb and get back I've seen the strats back up fully. This is ridiculous.
Yes, we can still bomb them...yes, we can bomb other targets...but with the way the game is now setup what is the point of even having strats any longer? Especially with spawn points almost right next to the strats.
I would really appreciate if the resups could at least be changed to a happy medium. Before it was 4 mins. Possibly a 10 min resup...maybe even 15 mins...but 30 is just too much.
I appreciate the improvements but you've taken a significant feature of the game away from our bomber pilots in doing so.
Cheers,
Elec1
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One player shouldn't be able to control so much of the game. By having one player blasting strats he can cripple a whole team. Adjustments were made and now it takes more than a single player. Bring a number of boxes, bomb more targets causing the "enemy" to run more supply runs.
It still works, you just cant do it by your self any more.
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How sad for you.
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I look at it as a chance for more runs, more targets, more combat, more missions. If you can wipe the strats out in one hit then you've just bombed yourself out of a job.
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One player shouldn't be able to control so much of the game. By having one player blasting strats he can cripple a whole team. Adjustments were made and now it takes more than a single player. Bring a number of boxes, bomb more targets causing the "enemy" to run more supply runs.
It still works, you just cant do it by your self any more.
Low numbers and the steady decline of strategic gameplay community wide lead to the one-man band gameplay for buff players. I noticed a significant difference in buff play myself but its the direction the Dev's want to take the game. I think the new style of splash damage for bombs takes on a more historical form when you think about it. AH2 allowed for a good player to drop lazer guided bombs on a target. AH3 building layouts seem more realistic and the splash doesn't seem as precise.
I like the move on the Dev's part. Buffs were OP period and have been De-buffed :x
So yes for lonewolf buff players out there the risk/reward isn't what it used to be. Certainly requires other players to team up to make a significant impact. One can only hope the game snags a few new sticks that might fulfill that role and others ;)
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I don't have as much of a problem with the damage model itself. What pisses me off is spending 1 - 2 hours doing a strat run and then countries resup back to full before I can even get back to my base. Resupping a base in minutes with 3 or 4 players is NOT for the betterment of the game. It's complete nonsense. If your going to have that then get rid of the strats altogether.
For those who say it's more realistic now...ya didn't see people in WWII rebuilding an entire start base in 15 mins.
Seriously...I'm just saying adjust the resup time. Don't have it set at 30 minutes.
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I will join in on bomber runs to starts if required it's relaxing and the sounds are awesome
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I can't count the number of times I've had stop what I was doing to resupply strats, just like others. This in return takes away from our defense to have a few pilots running around to get our strats back to normal. I have not seen an issue in this category, however, if an adjustment is made, I will adjust with it.
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(snark deleted)
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-1 leave them as is! We had one of you strat bomber types take down our AAA from 100 to 22 percent down for 176 min only 8 min over strat.. It was very satisfying for me and one other to resup back to 100 before the bomber pilot could land . it's a no brainer win win for everyone.. You still get to see your name in lights with all that damage and get your perks and those who resup help make sure only one set of Lancs doesn't impact our side as much
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I don't have as much of a problem with the damage model itself.
What new damage model?
HiTech
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What new damage model?
HiTech
Meaning as in the City damage model (many more buildings / harder to take down in a single run).
I do like the fact that the layouts have changed / are spread out more with some of the strats making it more difficult to take a target down in a single run. That was a smart / more challenging improvement and also helped with a single pilot being able to destroy a target easily. However the swing to favor fixing the problem was too much to the other side with the resup time at 30 mins.
I would prefer to see the targets more spaced out making it harder for a single pilot to down a strat (having to take multiple buffs / runs) and leave the resup time down. I think this would be a more fair compromise.
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Seriously...I'm just saying adjust the resup time. Don't have it set at 30 minutes.
For team players there is not any real difference with one player doing a 30min resup run or 3 players doing a 10min resup run. If you want frustration, get into a GV take the town guns down and shell buildings to white flag and all the timers show down for 30-60 minutes. Then watch 3 m3s pile in and do 10min resups and get your tank shot in the asz by a gun you killed 30 seconds ago. Teamwork is awesome.
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-1 leave them as is! We had one of you strat bomber types take down our AAA from 100 to 22 percent down for 176 min only 8 min over strat.. It was very satisfying for me and one other to resup back to 100 before the bomber pilot could land . it's a no brainer win win for everyone.. You still get to see your name in lights with all that damage and get your perks and those who resup help make sure only one set of Lancs doesn't impact our side as much
Right - so take it down 176 minutes...and how fast did you resup that back to 100%? About the same amount of time it took the bomber pilots to drop the strat.
It's not about the points - it's about the strategic effects of using the strat to a countries benefit. It should not be easy for a single pilot to drop a strat and inflict that kind of damage - agreed. As I mentioned to HiTech a moment ago, I would be more in favor of spreading out the strat making it less effective for a single bomber pilot run and force multiple runs, or multiple bombers to inflict that kind of damage.
With the maps and a VH base (i.e. - on the buzzsaw map) right next to a strat you can resup it very quickly making it not worth the effort. Other maps are like this as well...especially with stats buried deep in enemy territory. Having a bomber pilot plan a mission / travel that time / distance only to have no effect within minutes makes no sense.
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Perceived Problem: My time spent attacking strats is not equal to the time spent "resupplying" strats.
Root Problem: One person attacking strats.
As far as I can tell, what is in place is the best balance of not allowing a single AFK person to affect an entire country. Let's be honest here, are you actually in front of your computer for the entire duration of climbout, attack, egress? If you are in front of your computer checking your six, gauges, clipboard map, etc. then well, dam. good for you.
But to say that your time investment is somehow diminished by a game mechanic isn't really fair. I get it man, it's a long haul to the strats for what you believe to be a significant impact than can be mitigated quickly. The solution is to not attack the strats alone, period. :bhead
If you're going it alone, you're correct, the time involved for the attack and the resulting damage the attack can do is not equal to the time it requires for the defenders to negate the damage you've done.
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Right - so take it down 176 minutes...and how fast did you resup that back to 100%? About the same amount of time it took the bomber pilots to drop the strat.
It's not about the points - it's about the strategic effects of using the strat to a countries benefit. It should not be easy for a single pilot to drop a strat and inflict that kind of damage - agreed.
Having a bomber pilot plan a mission / travel that time / distance only to have no effect within minutes makes no sense.
From a strategic standpoint and a tactical one...
If you are taking the time to hit strats and "planning" as you mentioned. Then surely you are working with groups trying to take bases. Otherwise, what is the point of bombing the strats at all? As long as you are working with base takers, it doesn't matter if they get the strats up by the time you land. What matters is during that down time, your allies took advantage of down time to attack a base and get guns and buildings down while the strat was down.
Another way to look at it is other people also like to bomb strats. I know if I see someone hitting strats and it appears the strats may come up before base taking operations are done on a particular side, I may back that bomber up by hitting the strats again. If you hit all the strats and they are down for 3 hours each, the other guys and gals that like to do the same thing have nothing to bomb for 2 to 3 hours.
I think it is now more involved and the strategy of the bombers and the base takers have to coordinate their tactics a little better to maintain down times. I like it now however, I would agree that resupply times should be 10 minutes per resup and the down times remain the same as they once were. As long as we don't have to invest 15 plus players to resup something at 4 minutes a pop.
IMHO
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Right - so take it down 176 minutes...and how fast did you resup that back to 100%? About the same amount of time it took the bomber pilots to drop the strat.
It's not about the points - it's about the strategic effects of using the strat to a countries benefit. It should not be easy for a single pilot to drop a strat and inflict that kind of damage - agreed. As I mentioned to HiTech a moment ago, I would be more in favor of spreading out the strat making it less effective for a single bomber pilot run and force multiple runs, or multiple bombers to inflict that kind of damage.
With the maps and a VH base (i.e. - on the buzzsaw map) right next to a strat you can resup it very quickly making it not worth the effort. Other maps are like this as well...especially with stats buried deep in enemy territory. Having a bomber pilot plan a mission / travel that time / distance only to have no effect within minutes makes no sense.
with two of us it took about 25 min of resup to bring it back up took bomber pilot about 35 min to land them but sometimes if I see a bomber heading to our strat I'll be waiting in my m3 or on the way in c47 before the bombs even dropped so I can resup immediately.. There has been more people willing to resup than in the past..a few of us dedicated most of our log time to undue what bombers have done.. strats, towns, guns,ords it's getting rwsupped
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Player based resupply is silly to me all around.
Now rather than defend a target, just start hauling supplies in.
If thats not your thing, sit in a gun.
Two great alternatives to avoid combat, observed reapeatedly, every time i log in.
The same combat that was common in the days of 600-800 players online looking for the aspect of the game that got them hooked
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Perceived Problem: My time spent attacking strats is not equal to the time spent "resupplying" strats.
Root Problem: One person attacking strats.
As far as I can tell, what is in place is the best balance of not allowing a single AFK person to affect an entire country. Let's be honest here, are you actually in front of your computer for the entire duration of climbout, attack, egress? If you are in front of your computer checking your six, gauges, clipboard map, etc. then well, dam. good for you.
But to say that your time investment is somehow diminished by a game mechanic isn't really fair. I get it man, it's a long haul to the strats for what you believe to be a significant impact than can be mitigated quickly. The solution is to not attack the strats alone, period. :bhead
If you're going it alone, you're correct, the time involved for the attack and the resulting damage the attack can do is not equal to the time it requires for the defenders to negate the damage you've done.
I think you have the "Perceived" and "Root" problems confused.
Perceived problem - yes, part of it is time (and yes, I am in front of the computer for almost the whole time when doing this).
Root problem is the damage on a single run / resup time on strats. Let's say its the same thing but on a shorter haul flight. Let's say 2 sectors. The problem is still the same - I can get to the strat quicker and take it down - great so I don't spend as much time in the air. The problem is still the same - the strat can be hit significantly on a single run, can be resupped in no time. Therefore really making hitting a strat useless (except for the vey short window of opportunity while it has been hit before a bunch of GV's resup it in 1-2 loads).
Again - why bother hitting a strat then...or hitting a strat? It serves no purpose to the game the way it is now configured.
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Again - why bother hitting a strat then...or hitting a strat? It serves no purpose to the game the way it is now configured.
And why would anyone bother defending it when there is an option to drop a box of E
supplies.. much faster and efficient then climbing up and risking a cartoon death.
:eek:
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Bombing Strats have become a waste of time... GOOD-if a strat go's down for 176 minutes- it takes approxately 44 trips for a single m3 or c47 to resupply a single strat that is down for that long. I'd rather be fightin and dyin in battle than resupp strats.
I was gone for 7 months-when I finally came back the first thing I noticed was all the strat attacking that was going on. wasen't going on like that when I left.
a 30 min resupp time is great.
I love the Buzzsaw map-bombers have easier time bombing them--m3's have easier time resupping them..plus there a lot of gv battles going on as well as air combat--it's an all aroung good battle map-you don't have to drive forever or fly forever to find a fight.
don't know anything about a damage model except when I drop one on the floor and it busts all to pieces and I have to rebuild it.
plus we just have 4 maps right now-there are at least 8 or 9 more maps to be released. I'm sure you'll like bombing those strats.
to me 30 minute resupp time is fine--plus you only get 3.75 perks per drop. which is also fine.but depends also on how many buildings now..
I also spend less time in bombers more time in fighters and gv's you'll have more fun-good-day :airplane:
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Bombing Strats have become a waste of time... GOOD-if a strat go's down for 176 minutes- it takes approxately 44 trips for a single m3 or c47 to resupply a single strat that is down for that long. I'd rather be fightin and dyin in battle than resupp strats.
:aok I approve of this message
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The reason it takes buffs so long is they're climbing to over 30k. Maybe if buff pilots didn't try and fly in the dweebosphere or bomb and bail there might be some sympathy.
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Player based resupply is silly to me all around.
Now rather than defend a target, just start hauling supplies in.
If thats not your thing, sit in a gun.
Two great alternatives to avoid combat, observed reapeatedly, every time i log in.
The same combat that was common in the days of 600-800 players online looking for the aspect of the game that got them hooked
now you know I love a good dogfight Lazer but my resup missions are more of a message to the strat bombers.. I'm never afraid of cartoon death and will jump in my fighter and fight as soon as I'm done and if vh is down I'll at a vbase I'll jump in a manned gun as well
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Don't climb to 30,000. After you drop bombs bail if no enemy in the area. You will save a lot of time.
If enemy in the area have some fun and fight.
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Some players only care about the fight if they lose the base they are upping from.. No biggy they just up from another but it you care at all about defending or taking bases as Well as dogfighting or gvs then strats become a huge factor for that kind of player such as myself I personally don't view resup as a waste of time nor do I see it as avoiding combat for fear of death it's just a part of the big picture for me... I'm the type of player that enjoys all aspects of the game
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The reason it takes buffs so long is they're climbing to over 30k. Maybe if buff pilots didn't try and fly in the dweebosphere or bomb and bail there might be some sympathy.
I rarely take my buffs over 10k. If on a long run I may approach 15-20 but not often. I enjoy fighters playing with my bombers. Very satisfying to have several chase you and vaporize all of them. I even slow down for single fighters chasing me.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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There are other ways a bomber pilot can have fun. Sometimes I just drop my ordnance on the runway at take off. Then I proceed to situations where the enemy sees a big plump formation of B-17s. Maybe to an enemy strat. Then comes the fun of being killed or sending the attacker to the promised land. The more enemy engagements, the better you become at defeating them. You don't always need to drop ordnance on a target to have fun in a bomber. Although, dropping a couple of salvos on a runway and nailing some enemy landing or taking off is very rewarding.
:D 1i
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I stopped playing, primarily due to players like you, OP, who take an excellent combat sim and try to turn it into the WWII version of chutes & ladders. But I do check into the forums every now & then to check out the whines.
Your whine has, by far, been one of my favorites.
Here's hoping your angst gets the better of you. Your style of play is poison.
Cheers.
P.S. What up guys! Good to see a few familiar faces :)
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What new damage model?
HiTech
graphics wise it appears different :x we are back in school HiTech
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How sad for you.
...Haha....Ahaha.
(https://cdn.meme.am/instances/55805221.jpg)
At last. Banana dances to 2Legit2Quit. :banana:
(http://i.imgur.com/jRJ06EO.gif)
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The OP should ask the community about the perceived attitude over the last 15 years of Hitech to giving any single player, or very small group, absolute control over the majority's fun, by a single action against a target as a country wide choke hold. The OP wants his single finger salute to shut down the fun of a whole country and edify himself when he sees his name in lights. While probably enjoying the whines of outrage on 200 during his trip back to land.
This is not what the customers are paying Hitech for. Nor is how this open arena system been designed. This is not a two country war of domination game. Depending on the terrain, it's up to 200 individual wars staged at 200 individual bases in an open world environment. Winning the war is only one of many possible results available to the players depending on what they like doing for a few hours. But, not crippling the environment of a single country for a sustained time period without having to fight that countries players directly for the result. And even fighting a whole country can be abused, which is how we got ENY.
The OP should know about what the 49ers abused in this vein until Hitech changed the underlying amount of damage needed, and down time to the HQ. What the OP wants was recently super abused because the 49ers enjoyed the game power of their single finger salutes to take away the majorities fun. Hitech made his view clear on the subject by changing the game itself to stop them from driving his paying customers away. Any of you remember just how we got ENY because of organized abuse of the game driving away paying customers...........
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not so fast buster. For the last 9 years we have seen drastic changes when minor adjustments were needed.
The OP has a very good point. resup time going from 4 minutes to 30 minutes is a huge change! why not 10 minutes?
Also, a lone wolf can NOT take down all strats in one run. 70% down at one factory would be a good double drop. that's TWO passes on the target, with a lancaster (bait), that took a long time to get to. All this to have ANY chance at a base take with down times there being one or two enemy sup away from be nullified, unless a strat run is done to increase down times. make strat runs pointless and the entire system fails, gameplay fails, people fail, and the game fails. Add the fact strategic gameplay requires people and time, and there is not many people, and not much time. These issues compound to create a rater uninspired experience online.
The reason furball lake is empty is ... its boring. B O R E I N G .
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Sorry nat disagree.. you get to bomb I get to resup your bombs do 176 min down time damage my resup does 30 min on your 176 and not sure when you log in but I log in later on early evening and 176 logged in and ammo flying everywhere i haven't logged into wow or wot since ah3 went live and it's anything but boring
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Compromise,
A. Keep resupply times at 30mins
B. Keep all strats well removed from GV spawns, and at least .75 sectors from air fields.
C. Add more variability to the wind patterns so the 30k buffs can do very little damage unless they attack in mass.
D. Adjust resupply so M3's or goons can not bring an object to full up, I think a min of 5mins of downtime is sufficient.
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The changes followed hand in hand with money\subscriptions and where organically the game was evolving. There is no longer the numbers to support allowing single finger salutes to ruin the few good hours a larger number of players are paying for at the same time. As the numbers grow, the game will evolve again. That swinging pendulum thing of competing player interests. Anyway Nat, you seem to be using this post to whine about the lack of interest by the current player base in fighter to fighter combat on the levels of a previous generation of paying customers. The numbers may well return but, the motivations of the next generation of players will probably turn furball lake into the gang bang mutual protection society and HO lake snowflake society.
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The reason it takes buffs so long is they're climbing to over 30k. Maybe if buff pilots didn't try and fly in the dweebosphere or bomb and bail there might be some sympathy.
Eventually astronauts will get bit in the rear for 30k drops. Gotta love the clouds! I've tried dropping on the city on crater when that dread cloud bank comes in. Your essentially blind dropping. Love it! So many new elements to learn about and tactics to adjust to.
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I've done a lot of bombing over the years, and I like MOST of the changes. 30 min resupply for each box of supplies does seem like the complete other end of the spectrum to me - I'd think there is no reason to not have it be 10 minutes per box like it is for everything else. Especially if the resupply for strats is a simple M3 drive - which I myself do a lot of.
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I couldn't care less about the resupply times. If Im running a bomber to strats Im in it for the run. Can I make it there? Can I hit the max targets? Can I make it back and get my name in lights?
You want to effect game play? Bring more bombs. Maybe one guys hit bases that could resupply, and you hit the strats? One guy shouldnt be able to effect the the whole game on a single run. As it is not, they no longer can.
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The numbers may well return but, the motivations of the next generation of players will probably turn furball lake into the gang bang mutual protection society and HO lake snowflake society.
I enjoyed reading this. :aok
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The biggest difference in opinion comes from two types. Those that play the game and to who fly a plane. For me, I've done most all opportunities over the years. In that time the game has been adjusted to suit whines or improve graphics. Many adjustments have been to the extreme. 4 minutes to 30 minutes is extreme. That's 7.2 times the previous amount. Read the op. He Flys bombers, you don't. He spent 2 hours in the air to make anot her separate mission possible. Meaning, because of the way the strategy system is set up, his softie must happen before ANY other offensive operation can effectively begin. Now he does not want it, nobody does. It precipitates through the team to result in No offensive action being taken. Have you played lately? Do you see how incessantly boring the game is? Did you notice player numbers down 75-80%? And finally are YOU GOING TO FLY 2 HOURS IN A BOMBER TO EFFECTIVELY DO NOTHING? nope. Again, like most have said. Try the middle road, ten minutes, that 2.5 times the amount we lived with for the last year. P.s. having straps spread about the map is not as logical as centralised straps. Again, not sure why ht had to do the drastic step of removing central straps? The problem was with moving the location, not being centralized. If they left central strats in the rear we would be happier campers. Nope, extreme decisions rule the day, been that way 4 eva.
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Having been in a game where Solo Buffs heavily influenced the map, making it more difficult is a good thing. Now, having read through the post....having your actions totally negated in a few minutes is also a bad thing.
Its possible a middle of the road should be tried...sometimes what looks good on paper doesn't play well and adjustments need to be made.
Dobs
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Imagine if the Bomber pilots decided to group up and fly together against targets :O
(http://thedabbler.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/2formation.jpg)
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Imagine if the Bomber pilots decided to group up and fly together against targets :O
They did it quite a bit when we hat the central strats. Which is about the last time I had seen an actual high altitude, long range escorted bomber mission. We even had B-29 missions back then.
Now I'd almost say it doesn't matter anymore, because numbers are so low you hardly get enough players for anything like that anyway.
Again, not sure why ht had to do the drastic step of removing central straps? The problem was with moving the location, not being centralized. If they left central strats in the rear we would be happier campers. Nope, extreme decisions rule the day, been that way 4 eva.
I may have a vague idea about the reasons, but whatever it was, it was badly executed and resulted in a lot of unbalanced gameplay for the strat game - from uneven locations to retaining settings which were tailored tot he distance and difficulty of the central strats and taking away an incentive for larger raids.
If it had been to provide closer targets, they should have added an additional layer of regionalized targets like railyards with a more local effect.
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I still think zones need to return
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I still think zones need to return
On small maps like the ones in play now, there had been only one zone. :old:
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We now have
gvs attacking strats
gvs defending strats
gvs running resup
jabos hunting gvs at strats
fighters hunting buffs
I think it has been a plus to game play :airplane:
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(...)
I think it has been a plus to game play :airplane:
You could have had that as a plus without taking away a rather unique aspect of the game.
By the way, when we had the central strats, my gameplay mostly revolved around that, both on attack as well in defense.
With the key factories split up and move to the fon (but retaining the downtime settings and global impact), I greatly reduced my attacks and almost completely stopped defending them, because the latter one was suddenly pointless. And all the great escorted bomber missions at altitude I so much enjoyed were alsmost extinct overnight, too.
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Hi All,
As an avid bomber (predominantly 80% or better of my time) I have tried to give the new AH3 a chance. It has a lot of great graphics and eye candy now - a much welcome improvement. Some of the game play has been improved, but a few key things have not for bomber pilots. In fact, it has taken away from our gameplay.
Bombing strats were effective before for all countries. Now, with a resup time of 30 minutes per drop box it is almost worthless to spend 1 - 2 hours on a long strat run or creating massive bomber missions to do this. By the time you bomb and get back I've seen the strats back up fully. This is ridiculous.
Yes, we can still bomb them...yes, we can bomb other targets...but with the way the game is now setup what is the point of even having strats any longer? Especially with spawn points almost right next to the strats.
I would really appreciate if the resups could at least be changed to a happy medium. Before it was 4 mins. Possibly a 10 min resup...maybe even 15 mins...but 30 is just too much.
I appreciate the improvements but you've taken a significant feature of the game away from our bomber pilots in doing so.
Cheers,
Elec1
The current setting of 30 Minutes is simply an oversight that did not get set to the same as AHII when we setup the system variables in AHIII.
I'll adjust to to something lower that also reflects the less distance of flight to attack them.
HiTech
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It seems to me a short down time for the strats would encourage
more team co-opertation :D
But thats just me :devil
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It certainly garnered one evening of fun while a group of GVers and bombers worked on the combination of "down" for the HQ and city to extend the HQ down time. Players in general seem a bit more interested in pushing initiatives during prime time now, since they don't have to worry as much about keeping an eye on the HQ. Group activity attracts attention and participation, and that keeps customers coming back. But, lone wolf players tend to be much more vocal in these forums than the prime time happy herd players.
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I wish more players played the game. What happened??
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I wish more players played the game. What happened??
not sure.. Some people say economics or advertising or the Steep learning curve ..I don't agree with the learning curve part tho. I'm an idiot with 0 ACM ability but if there was a score card or graph measuring fun like they do for fighter scores I bet i would be in the top 5 for many years now this game should be huge it's a one of a kind.. it's not just the graphics, damage modeling, or what's available for you to fly, drive or steer that makes this a unique experience... What makes this so much fun for me and others is you knuckle heads.. The aces high community..
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The current setting of 30 Minutes is simply an oversight that did not get set to the same as AHII when we setup the system variables in AHIII.
I'll adjust to to something lower that also reflects the less distance of flight to attack them.
HiTech
Please don't set it back to 4 minutes per drop :(
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The current setting of 30 Minutes is simply an oversight that did not get set to the same as AHII when we setup the system variables in AHIII.
I'll adjust to to something lower that also reflects the less distance of flight to attack them.
HiTech
HiTech, it WORKS as is now.... why fix something that isn't broken? Just take the temperature of the number of posts in this thread alone.
The BALANCE is just about spot on, like someone pointed out the amount of time spent from a single individual spread across the impact on multiple players. Leaving as is, puts more bombers in the air not less.
I actually attributed it to a spot of genius on your part :cool: I seriously implore you to consider that any adjustment to lowering the resupply time might result in zero interest in resupply at all and in effect undo any "proportional" balance measures.
The real genius of the current resupply time for strats, places the downtimes (which is really the conversation) around the time envelop in which a coordinated attack would be needed to benefit one country over another. Screw with this and the country side balance will seriously skew. Been there and done that..... Log in and see a pointless country situation and simply log off.
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Yes Chilli :aok
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HiTech, it WORKS as is now.... why fix something that isn't broken? Just take the temperature of the number of posts in this thread alone.
The BALANCE is just about spot on, like someone pointed out the amount of time spent from a single individual spread across the impact on multiple players. Leaving as is, puts more bombers in the air not less.
I actually attributed it to a spot of genius on your part :cool: I seriously implore you to consider that any adjustment to lowering the resupply time might result in zero interest in resupply at all and in effect undo any "proportional" balance measures.
The real genius of the current resupply time for strats, places the downtimes (which is really the conversation) around the time envelop in which a coordinated attack would be needed to benefit one country over another. Screw with this and the country side balance will seriously skew. Been there and done that..... Log in and see a pointless country situation and simply log off.
This. Please no change to resupply values. :aok
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Some of the problem with bombing strats is also the construction rational of the terrains. Many of them were built to slow down a hoard while giving bomber pilots a chance to make a difference against the strat periodically effecting the hoards. Times have changed, now we get a max number of players at prime time that would have accounted for a single country back in the hoard era of this game. Not enough people to go around allowing single finger salutes to take their precious short play time away from them.
Using the new game AA base objects and the rational that players need to be brought closer to each other showcased very well with buzzsaw. I've created a terrain that allows bombers NOE or high alt, or NOE jabo from CV to throw themselves against the HQ and city. While everyone else in the center of the terrain can find each other to furball, or in the mid band of the terrain, grab land, squat on strats, and play win the war. I've also given the tankers back what they loved from the AH2 tank town in a tiny 8 mile diameter central crater GV arena. You don't need a tanker to run an M3 or C47 with troops or supplies. Just someone in the tower.
I just tested placing a 3000ft cloud layer over a field today and it worked very well. So the tank mini-volcano will have a 3000ft cloud layer over it to mess with level bomber greifers. Since the crater walls run from 1800-2000ft high, jabo and tank killers will be wirbel fodder or crater wall lawndarts. Trying to jabo with a medium or heavy bomber may pay you in crater wall collisions for your trouble. The highest point inside of the crater is a 900ft step that slopes to 25ft at the bottom. The three tiny un-capturable GV bases sit up on that where I'm sure many wirbles will await the jabo and bombers.
The root of the strat problem lays in what the terrain was built to do in the AH era it was created. Buzzsaw reflects the current AH3 era, so I took cues from that in mind of bringing players together versus allowing them to spread out and use up the momentum of super hoards on gigantic maps.
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I always felt like 4 minutes was a bit on the extreme side for the numbers AH2 had its last 2 years. 30 minutes is a bit on the strong side. Happy to see Hi-tech on it and whatever is decided on will do just fine.
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It is a bit sad to see that strats are back up, before I even have a chance to land my bombers...
Coogan
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Coogan, I originally had agreed with your position UNTIL I saw it in action (which I sincerely attribute reduce in numbers of participants).
Take a strat down.... what does that even mean?? Okay, I will explain a bit what this means. It means that the factories significantly prolong the damage done to key GAME resources. Some of these resources actually help players find ACTION.
Why is it okay for your damage to be repaired before you land? My understanding is that although the damage done to factory has been repaired, any damage to the actual base, for example AAA downtimes remains at the value that it was if attacked under the damaged factory condition.
What does that mean?? It means, instead of lone wolf action lingering over the heads of entire countries for hours and hours, a COORDINATED plan of attack is NOW necessary to take advantage of the damage done by your bombers.
Why is that BETTER for the GAME?? It places more bombers in the air at multiple locations and does not stagnate game play during low populated online activity. Think of it this way, you are sharing the arena with all of its participants, why should you single handedly be allowed to treat the entire map as only your sandbox???
LocoMoto, with downtimes of 180 minutes (yes 3 hours), 6 boxes of supplies does seem just about correct. Reduce it significantly say even to 20 minutes and not many will bother to participate. Mark my words, on many maps, the time and effort it takes just to get to the resupply region is bothersome enough. As I should have stated in the beginning of this post, "be careful of what you ask for".
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The current setting of 30 Minutes is simply an oversight that did not get set to the same as AHII when we setup the system variables in AHIII.
I'll adjust to to something lower that also reflects the less distance of flight to attack them.
HiTech
Very, very glad to hear that. I'd've been gone from AH3 because of the 30min resup if I hadn't discovered the Wirblewind was fun and useful, and I'm still only spending ~70% as much time on the game as before because the thing I like doing most matters a lot less nowadays...
Bomber pilots mostly play the game because they want what they do to, directly or indirectly, help their side achieve objectives (base takes/map wins). As others said before, if the strats can be full up before you even land your planes, why take an hour or two out of your life to bomb them?
One of the "solutions" offered to those buff pilots unhappy with 30min resups was (summarized) "Well, don't just bring one set of buffs! Bring a mission in!" That's ignorant, and paradoxically even less effective than the lone wolf strat runs in achieving persistent downtimes: someone--often many someones--always resups after a major strat run, and (except for the city strat, which is hit much less frequently nowadays) a c47 or m3's sup drop generally covers all the damaged areas. So what does it matter if you get the strat to 30% or 90%? The same guy or guys can bring it to 100% in the same amount of time if they want to. And the lower the strat %, the greater incentive to resup from your counterparts on the other side who also play the game to win.
Said another way, what took a single bomber pilot an hour or more of either watching the map or doing something afk, with no certainty of that hour spent being productive, to eventually do takes a resupper 20 minutes to undo in perfect safety! How much sense does that make?
Glad it's going to be fixed. I vote with the 10 minute crowd--that seems a reasonable balance.
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Why is it okay for your damage to be repaired before you land? My understanding is that although the damage done to factory has been repaired, any damage to the actual base, for example AAA downtimes remains at the value that it was if attacked under the damaged factory condition.
What does that mean?? It means, instead of lone wolf action lingering over the heads of entire countries for hours and hours, a COORDINATED plan of attack is NOW necessary to take advantage of the damage done by your bombers.
Chili, most players are in small squads or no squads at all, and coordination even amongst squad members is often sketchy, if not non-existent. It's unreasonable to expect people to be available as soon as you manage to hit strats to take advantage of the damage you've done to them; or to be waiting in tower to see if you actually manage to achieve said damage and then up to do something about it before resuppers can undo the damage.
In my previous post I said it can take one player only 20 minutes to fully resup a damaged strat. Last time bish were on the side of Mindinao rooks currently have, I timed it: took less than 4min for my c47 to not only reach the AAA strat, but for my sups to have effect. Bail and repeat. Boring, but if you want to help your team to win, you suck it up and do it.
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HiTech, it WORKS as is now.... why fix something that isn't broken? Just take the temperature of the number of posts in this thread alone.
The BALANCE is just about spot on, like someone pointed out the amount of time spent from a single individual spread across the impact on multiple players. Leaving as is, puts more bombers in the air not less.
I actually attributed it to a spot of genius on your part :cool: I seriously implore you to consider that any adjustment to lowering the resupply time might result in zero interest in resupply at all and in effect undo any "proportional" balance measures.
The real genius of the current resupply time for strats, places the downtimes (which is really the conversation) around the time envelop in which a coordinated attack would be needed to benefit one country over another. Screw with this and the country side balance will seriously skew. Been there and done that..... Log in and see a pointless country situation and simply log off.
:aok
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This. Please no change to resupply values. :aok
:aok
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you know this just occurred to me--don't know if somebody said this,but here goes--if you bomb the strats down to any time 50% 80% 40% etc. it's up to your country men to pork the bases to kill that particular element--for example-ammo strat down for 120 mins. if your countrymen pork the ords at all frontline bases or even 2nd line bases-reupping the strats does not shorten the downtime of those ords on those bases. and to resupp the base ords is still 10 mins per drop.
what do you say to that? :D
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I think this is a perfect area for micropayments in Aces High, for 5$ i can purchase Bombing Group of B17s - 15 bombers ( or whatever right size was ) to bomb target selected by me, and heck, i can fly as part of it.
It will give bomber killers targets, things to resupply and maybe some extra cash for HTC :)
Than again, we would need to go back to OTTO discussions, but it works quite well offline from what i've seen....
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In AH 2 a set of B-17 could nock down AAA strats to ~30%, that is way too much. Even though the new strats have turned the KI-67 into a hangar queen it is an improvement that the new factories are harder to take out.
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One player shouldn't be able to control so much of the game. By having one player blasting strats he can cripple a whole team. Adjustments were made and now it takes more than a single player. Bring a number of boxes, bomb more targets causing the "enemy" to run more supply runs.
It still works, you just cant do it by your self any more.
Another example of why the Zone based system is better. Yes it needed some tweeks because you would have milk runners just milking local strats. BUT those milk runners would only be local
It has two benifits. It only effects the local strats and one person could make a difference at least locally but coudnt effect an entire side.
The national strats should be larger and take nothing less then a good sized mission with heavy bombers to take down completely.
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HiTech, it WORKS as is now.... why fix something that isn't broken? Just take the temperature of the number of posts in this thread alone.
The BALANCE is just about spot on, like someone pointed out the amount of time spent from a single individual spread across the impact on multiple players. Leaving as is, puts more bombers in the air not less.
I actually attributed it to a spot of genius on your part :cool: I seriously implore you to consider that any adjustment to lowering the resupply time might result in zero interest in resupply at all and in effect undo any "proportional" balance measures.
The real genius of the current resupply time for strats, places the downtimes (which is really the conversation) around the time envelop in which a coordinated attack would be needed to benefit one country over another. Screw with this and the country side balance will seriously skew. Been there and done that..... Log in and see a pointless country situation and simply log off.
:aok
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The biggest difference in opinion comes from two types. Those that play the game and to who fly a plane. For me, I've done most all opportunities over the years. In that time the game has been adjusted to suit whines or improve graphics. Many adjustments have been to the extreme. 4 minutes to 30 minutes is extreme. That's 7.2 times the previous amount. Read the op. He Flys bombers, you don't. He spent 2 hours in the air to make anot her separate mission possible. Meaning, because of the way the strategy system is set up, his softie must happen before ANY other offensive operation can effectively begin. Now he does not want it, nobody does. It precipitates through the team to result in No offensive action being taken. Have you played lately? Do you see how incessantly boring the game is? Did you notice player numbers down 75-80%? And finally are YOU GOING TO FLY 2 HOURS IN A BOMBER TO EFFECTIVELY DO NOTHING? nope. Again, like most have said. Try the middle road, ten minutes, that 2.5 times the amount we lived with for the last year. P.s. having straps spread about the map is not as logical as centralised straps. Again, not sure why ht had to do the drastic step of removing central straps? The problem was with moving the location, not being centralized. If they left central strats in the rear we would be happier campers. Nope, extreme decisions rule the day, been that way 4 eva.
You just shot the ops argument down. What team? The op was told to get more bombers together, a team , to get his/her job done. It is no longer a single person job. It takes a team effort.
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It takes a village to destroy a village.
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you know this just occurred to me--don't know if somebody said this,but here goes--if you bomb the strats down to any time 50% 80% 40% etc. it's up to your country men to pork the bases to kill that particular element--for example-ammo strat down for 120 mins. if your countrymen pork the ords at all frontline bases or even 2nd line bases-reupping the strats does not shorten the downtime of those ords on those bases. and to resupp the base ords is still 10 mins per drop.
what do you say to that? :D
lunatic... hence my post :aok
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Two types of players: Those who like to 'win the game', and those that like to fight.
Those who like to win the game, and play as required to do so (hoard attacks, dropping strats, etc) will, in time, eventually tire of it. You can be plate-spinning autistic and you're still going to eventually tire of the repetition. It's a mindless, skill-less endeavor.
Those who like to fight are a different story. They never tire of it, because until they're #1, there's always a challenge ahead of them. And once they reach number one - which is rare and always open to interpretation - they've got one heck of a job ahead of them to hold it.
It would seem to me that AH has made a big mistake catering to the first group, which continues to further alienate the second group. And in my opinion - the second group is where the money is, where the longevity is, and where the loyalty is (or perhaps was).
All of the guys who have been your bread and butter over the years - guys I remember thoroughly enjoying fighting with and against - are telling you to leave things the way they are. But no - let's cater to the first group instead?? Doesn't make any sense to me.
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I dont think it caters to the first so much as the second group doesn't need anything but people who fight. All the options added, old and new are to give a wider base to pull in a more diverse crowd.... hoping to keep this crowd for income.
The win the game group isn't bad, after all they do provide targets for those of us that only care about fighting :) I think the trick is going to be to get the win the war group into learning different ways to win the war. This way they don't get bored, and if the missions are more exciting they may actually enjoy fighting for that win more than they are now.
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I agree with Fugitive. That is why the more big fat bomber icons seen on the map, the better. 30 minute resupply time helps to achieve just that. Bombers in turn become :airplane: targets .... and the real warz begin :rock
Otherwise, strats would be flat all the time. If there were an area of resupply that needed adjusting it would be the towns, and even there, not sure if we want to mess with the balance.
As it is now, we have plenty of bomber targets, at the same time we have defenders willing to break off from their attacks to rebuild their factories, because it does not become an insurmountable task, and soon they are back :airplane: making the AH3 World Go Round!! :aok
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Two types of players: Those who like to 'win the game', and those that like to fight.
Those who like to win the game, and play as required to do so (hoard attacks, dropping strats, etc) will, in time, eventually tire of it. You can be plate-spinning autistic and you're still going to eventually tire of the repetition. It's a mindless, skill-less endeavor.
Those who like to fight are a different story. They never tire of it, because until they're #1, there's always a challenge ahead of them. And once they reach number one - which is rare and always open to interpretation - they've got one heck of a job ahead of them to hold it.
It would seem to me that AH has made a big mistake catering to the first group, which continues to further alienate the second group. And in my opinion - the second group is where the money is, where the longevity is, and where the loyalty is (or perhaps was).
All of the guys who have been your bread and butter over the years - guys I remember thoroughly enjoying fighting with and against - are telling you to leave things the way they are. But no - let's cater to the first group instead?? Doesn't make any sense to me.
And if you want to see what happens when the first group gets the "catering to" well....you can go look at HT's old game and see how many people are left. A balance must be achieved to allow everyone to play the game they like, but finding that balance is not as easy as you think. If you make a game that people can play "unopposed" or "minimize" their risk and still get points....people will do that. If you make a game where you can avoid a fight, people do that. If you make a game where people will retreat from the air and sit in a ackwagon or field gun hoping something flies by to shoot at....well you might as well make a virtual "Dove Hunt" game:) It blows my mind to think that logging into a MMO game and trying to avoid people is a definition of "fun", but amazingly it is.
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I worked from home one day, spend time working while "bombing" strat targets. It would seem that out of 30+ people in arena at that time, about 20 were doing something similar as myself :) Normally i would fly a fighter and fight it out, but trying to join work with pleasure results in B29 strat runs :D
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The OP should ask the community about the perceived attitude over the last 15 years of Hitech to giving any single player, or very small group, absolute control over the majority's fun, by a single action against a target as a country wide choke hold. The OP wants his single finger salute to shut down the fun of a whole country and edify himself when he sees his name in lights. While probably enjoying the whines of outrage on 200 during his trip back to land.
This is not what the customers are paying Hitech for. Nor is how this open arena system been designed. This is not a two country war of domination game. Depending on the terrain, it's up to 200 individual wars staged at 200 individual bases in an open world environment. Winning the war is only one of many possible results available to the players depending on what they like doing for a few hours. But, not crippling the environment of a single country for a sustained time period without having to fight that countries players directly for the result. And even fighting a whole country can be abused, which is how we got ENY.
The OP should know about what the 49ers abused in this vein until Hitech changed the underlying amount of damage needed, and down time to the HQ. What the OP wants was recently super abused because the 49ers enjoyed the game power of their single finger salutes to take away the majorities fun. Hitech made his view clear on the subject by changing the game itself to stop them from driving his paying customers away. Any of you remember just how we got ENY because of organized abuse of the game driving away paying customers...........
I decided to wait a bit and see others comments before replying to this post.
First, I've been around for the past 15+ years. I took a long hiatus from the game largely due to the activities (such as 49'ers activities) among other reasons. So yes, I have been around - and - I have seen the results from before and to now. Yes, some of those activities drove people away...as it was going to do it again now with the way the game changed significantly too much to the other way. There needed to be a happy medium. 30 minute resup time was not a happy middle ground.
As I said, the time needed to be adjusted to something fair for both sides, but, along with this I made other suggestions. It should not be the case where a single bomber can cripple strats damage so much in a single run. Having multiple bombers is more effective (agreed - always has been the case) but even with that the targets should be more difficult to hit. I propose:
- 10 min (or even 15 min) resup times
- redesign strat target objects further apart so they can't be taken out easily in a single pass
- relocate strat objects to a reasonable distance away from a base so that quick resups (or for that matter when a base is captured near a strat) it is not easily resupplied or taken down quickly
Let's try to find a better middle ground - I don't think the above is trying to propose putting it back to favor one side or another but trying to find a constructive balance of fairness.
As for one last item regarding long flight times / name in lights / 1 finger salutes...I'll simply put it this way. I'm a bomber pilot predominantly. I don't always fly at 30K+, I quite often fly at altitudes much lower than that, and I like doing long strat runs with squaddies or other country members (at least we used to before the 30 min resup times) because we chat and enjoy the ride / challenge of multiple fighters intercepting us along the way. It's not about the stardom at the end of the night, it's about the mission and we always assume the risk of getting shot down on those long runs (more often then not once we are discovered).
Take into consideration as a bomber pilot if I fly long strat runs that take me 1.5 - 2 hours each, and am online for 4 - 6 hours at a time...how many runs / missions do I do compared to many others that GV / Ftr pilot? No where near as many...and I pay the same as everyone else. So All I have asked is to balance things out to make things more fair across the board. We may not completely agree on how we get there but I am hoping the above proposal is a start.
Thanks HiTech for making some adjustments and hope that the above is constructive moving forward.
Cheers,
Elec1
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Or............. leave it as it has been in AH3. Much simpler... :salute
I still don't get your argument.... especially when you say you are working with a group. Let me let the cat out of the bag..... Take out factory, assign group member(s) to take out corresponding strat, town buildings or AAA guns. Mission complete! What else did you WANT? :headscratch:...... to hear 200 whine about how long they have to wait while their strats will be down.......
I really don't think you are the griefer type.... but your posts sure do have that content, even if it is not your intention. I frequently fly bombers, and for the most part have no problem with doing your job in much less time..... besides taking down factories and town centers without coordinated effort seems way too much self absorbed, and score padding..... and that's okay and I am not without fault, but it shouldn't matter to you that team B repaired the damage that you did, it doesn't erase the fact that you receive credit for the damage.
With 30 minutes factory resupply times, 180 minutes YES 3 HOURS is no longer an insurmountable task. So guess what? I grab a box of supplies and take it to the damaged factory .... WHEN TIME SUITS ME. In other words, your 1 sortie no longer dictates that I either dedicate time away from what I enjoy doing or suffer a broken country resource and maybe even log off.
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Or............. leave it as it has been in AH3. Much simpler... :salute
I still don't get your argument.... especially when you say you are working with a group. Let me let the cat out of the bag..... Take out factory, assign group member(s) to take out corresponding strat, town buildings or AAA guns. Mission complete! What else did you WANT? :headscratch:...... to hear 200 whine about how long they have to wait while their strats will be down.......
I really don't think you are the griefer type.... but your posts sure do have that content, even if it is not your intention. I frequently fly bombers, and for the most part have no problem with doing your job in much less time..... besides taking down factories and town centers without coordinated effort seems way too much self absorbed, and score padding..... and that's okay and I am not without fault, but it shouldn't matter to you that team B repaired the damage that you did, it doesn't erase the fact that you receive credit for the damage.
With 30 minutes factory resupply times, 180 minutes YES 3 HOURS is no longer an insurmountable task. So guess what? I grab a box of supplies and take it to the damaged factory .... WHEN TIME SUITS ME. In other words, your 1 sortie no longer dictates that I either dedicate time away from what I enjoy doing or suffer a broken country resource and maybe even log off.
Chilli - With respect...I understand what you are saying however your logic does not fix the root problem that we have been facing with the resup time.
Everyone keeps focusing on the "180 minutes / 3 hours downtime". Yes, if it is completely wiped out to 0%, but again resupping that strat quickly from a nearby spawn nullifies that very quickly. Even if you takeout strategic resup spawn points on most maps there are multiple respawns. Trying to coordinate every resup spawn point takeout would be quite the challenge...and even then...those will be resupped quickly as well. The problem has been the 30 min resup time - period. It was too big of a swing to the other side.
I agree - take multiple people to hit strat / surrounding targets is one method to hit targets. However, when having to fly long distances for 1+ hours it is not easy to get enough pilots that are willing (or have the time) to do so. Many times it is one or 2 guys that take their time to do this to help their country benefit from the strat hit for a period of time. As for you being able to do the same job in less time...is there some special high speed / light weight fuel efficient bomber you are using that I'm unaware of? Distance & altitude all play a factor.
Sure, I can go at 5000 ft and reduce my time for climbing and save some time. I could take a faster bomber such as TU2's but with a reduced payload which makes it less of an impact. All of this is taken into consideration when hitting a strat when by myself, or, with a group - the choice is based on the situation (location of strat, time to get there, fuel required, number of people in mission, etc etc). It's not my first rodeo ya know...I have been around and bombing for a while now.
My comments / proposal was to try and make things still somewhat effective - for both sides. Make it challenging for both bombers (wider spread out targets or adjust damage model of strat targets), and resuppers (less time per drop, adjust spawn points). Your comments to leave as is does nothing to find middle ground but simply leave it swayed to one side and you think that is fine...and that is your opinion and I respect that. My comments are meant to find a middle ground because there are many of us (bomber pilots in particular) that feel the strats have now become useless to waste time on bombing for the time invested to hit them - and that takes away from the game.
:salute
Elec1
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I agree with Fugitive. That is why the more big fat bomber icons seen on the map, the better. 30 minute resupply time helps to achieve just that. Bombers in turn become :airplane: targets .... and the real warz begin :rock
Otherwise, strats would be flat all the time. If there were an area of resupply that needed adjusting it would be the towns, and even there, not sure if we want to mess with the balance.
As it is now, we have plenty of bomber targets, at the same time we have defenders willing to break off from their attacks to rebuild their factories, because it does not become an insurmountable task, and soon they are back :airplane: making the AH3 World Go Round!! :aok
I see the opposite of this. I believe we would see less bombers due to people not wanting to waste the time of it being easily resupplied.
Just how I look at it. I randomly bomb strats when i get the urge. I wouldnt waste the time if I knew it was going to be almost immediately supplied.
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I set it to 10 mins today.
HiTech
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I set it to 10 mins today.
HiTech
I think thats perfect. Bombers will continue to bomb, defenders can defend, and suppliers can supply.
Maybe the fact it wont be supplied so easily will convince them to defend and create some memorable combat moments. (The things that get people hooked)
Not just another drive in a supply truck. :cheers:
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It seems strange to me when people ask for more combat, yet want resupply to be a much better option than defense?
"Look, a darbar going to the AA factory!" - "Don't worry, we are already waiting here in a m3" ;)
The op was told to get more bombers together, a team , to get his/her job done. It is no longer a single person job. It takes a team effort.
Team effort would be adjusted by size, number, location and hardness/defense of strategic objects, not by making them easily resupplyable by a just two people.
No matter if it's 1 or 10 players in a strat raid, it takes absolutely the same effort to undo the damage caused by them.
Now with 10 minutes, it's somewhat better balanced in my opinion, but the basic problems of the strats are still there.
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10 mins seems like an awsome choice for strat resup 4 minutes was not enough in aces high 2 and 30 minutes was over kill. Thank you
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Now the M3 drivers are going to want three M3s like the buff drivers get three buffs. Lol
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Now the M3 drivers are going to want three M3s like the buff drivers get three buffs. Lol
why didn't I think of that!? :bhead
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So ack, radar and ords will be down longer. Not sure how that contributes to more air-air combat.
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I set it to 10 mins today.
HiTech
Thank You Sir! :salute
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So ack, radar and ords will be down longer. Not sure how that contributes to more air-air combat.
Defense of the strats could be an option.
Wiley.
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Defense of the strats could be an option.
Wiley.
I'm guessing that players won't be any more inclined to defend strats than when resupply time was 4 minutes -- especially during off-peak hours. However, with the change from 30 to 10 minutes players will be more inclined to attack strats (see OP) and less inclined to resupply. So (I'm guessing) ack, radar and ord will be down longer.
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I decided to wait a bit and see others comments before replying to this post.
First, I've been around for the past 15+ years. I took a long hiatus from the game largely due to the activities (such as 49'ers activities) among other reasons. So yes, I have been around - and - I have seen the results from before and to now. Yes, some of those activities drove people away...as it was going to do it again now with the way the game changed significantly too much to the other way. There needed to be a happy medium. 30 minute resup time was not a happy middle ground.
As I said, the time needed to be adjusted to something fair for both sides, but, along with this I made other suggestions. It should not be the case where a single bomber can cripple strats damage so much in a single run. Having multiple bombers is more effective (agreed - always has been the case) but even with that the targets should be more difficult to hit. I propose:
- 10 min (or even 15 min) resup times
- redesign strat target objects further apart so they can't be taken out easily in a single pass
- relocate strat objects to a reasonable distance away from a base so that quick resups (or for that matter when a base is captured near a strat) it is not easily resupplied or taken down quickly
Let's try to find a better middle ground - I don't think the above is trying to propose putting it back to favor one side or another but trying to find a constructive balance of fairness.
As for one last item regarding long flight times / name in lights / 1 finger salutes...I'll simply put it this way. I'm a bomber pilot predominantly. I don't always fly at 30K+, I quite often fly at altitudes much lower than that, and I like doing long strat runs with squaddies or other country members (at least we used to before the 30 min resup times) because we chat and enjoy the ride / challenge of multiple fighters intercepting us along the way. It's not about the stardom at the end of the night, it's about the mission and we always assume the risk of getting shot down on those long runs (more often then not once we are discovered).
Take into consideration as a bomber pilot if I fly long strat runs that take me 1.5 - 2 hours each, and am online for 4 - 6 hours at a time...how many runs / missions do I do compared to many others that GV / Ftr pilot? No where near as many...and I pay the same as everyone else. So All I have asked is to balance things out to make things more fair across the board. We may not completely agree on how we get there but I am hoping the above proposal is a start.
Thanks HiTech for making some adjustments and hope that the above is constructive moving forward.
Cheers,
Elec1
going back in time...town buildings were not supplyabe, guns were but that is another story, and that time was 45 minutes. @ 45 minutes a individual or group could get two effective sorties in, it was always close but could be done. this was a good thing to have a chance at a successful attack (a good topic here if you want to talk fights and fun), it also allowed soloist to succeed, but so what? a feat mostly reserved for sleepy times of 100 players in the arena ;). then with the strat change town buildings went to 30 minutes down time. nobody, NOBODY can do two sorties in this time without bailing, again ;) additionally, buildings could be supplied by user, changing defense tactics and further making capture impossible...long story short hordes took over as the only method of probable success. not fun. Pilots were forced to the strat to increase down times before an attack could begin. Its hard enough to get the timing of players together, but now we have to do a two hour tour before we begin. sheesh. :uhoh
I said it 6 years ago "you need people like me, so you can point your finger and say thats the bad guy!" The attack makes the world go round, some never carry ords! It is not fun to fly 15 minutes or two hours for nothing. No attacks = no fun . No matter how much fun you think showing off your kill skills make me log in, it does not. you fighters will always have targets if im will to spend 15 minutes to fly to you. If i dont you have nothing to shoot at. Ill go toolshed some other game. dweeb.
:D
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I remember the good old days of the CavemanJ raids where huge formations of B24s would decimate Radar, Cities, and HQs for hours on end. Sucked to be on the receiving end but man there were some fights.
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Defense of the strats could be an option.
Wiley.
Not really. Bomb n bailers.
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Not really. Bomb n bailers.
If they bail before they drop, I count that as a win for my side. The strat was successfully defended.
Wiley.
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Like I have said before, I originally thought that strats should stay down longer..... BOY WAS I WRONG......
Well, at least I can admit when I make a mistake....... unfortunately, all I have to lose is the NUMBER of players that I have been accustomed to playing with.... :salute
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If they bail before they drop, I count that as a win for my side. The strat was successfully defended.
Wiley.
Read again.... BOMB n bailers
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Read again.... BOMB n bailers
If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
Wiley.
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one thing that I really liked was the 30 min resupp time, now its gone.
last night 3 sets of buffs in the stratosphere hit one of our Strats - ran a load of cargo since I had just got on.
when it said 10 min off downtime I just figured why bother, im not running 18 loads.
so I got off the game - tired of 2 or 3 guys screwing up the game for one third of the rest of us.
very sick of radar or ack being down for two and a half hours.
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If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
Wiley.
If I have come all that way, I am not turning back.
I really do not care if they only want to hit strats. It takes those in buffs out of the game where they can't defend a base. It allows those that like to take bases to do so with greater ease.
I can still up my plane and go to a fight..... I don't need strats.
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how many B29s have you seen in AH3. i have seen one single b29 goofing off in a furball. i have not upped a set and i used to up them alot what is the point if the strats will be up before i get half way home.
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Tell me, how does a few people hitting your strats hamper your fun. If anything, having down times remain at 30mins does nothing but encourage a horde mentality and gives a decided advantage to the side with numbers. Having longer down times allows a few people to let's say pirk ords thus slowing down the side with numbers.
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Tell me, how does a few people hitting your strats hamper your fun. If anything, having down times remain at 30mins does nothing but encourage a horde mentality and gives a decided advantage to the side with numbers. Having longer down times allows a few people to let's say pirk ords thus slowing down the side with numbers.
If a "few guys" bomb radar and drop radar for 30 minutes it spoils my fun by making it much harder to find a fight. And before anyone says it, no I do not consider chasing buffs to the strats fun, ever.
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Radar is a privilege not a right :old:
:banana:
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If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
Wiley.
No, it's shooting at bombers, a.k.a. "combat". A bomber without bombs is still a target.
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Tell me, how does a few people hitting your strats hamper your fun. If anything, having down times remain at 30mins does nothing but encourage a horde mentality and gives a decided advantage to the side with numbers. Having longer down times allows a few people to let's say pirk ords thus slowing down the side with numbers.
It seems most of the strat raids are to the radar - which only inhibits the ability to find a fight. If priority were made to downing strats that only inhibit bast taking, then most of us fighter sticks would be fine with it, since it would result in prolonging fights.
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If you're hitting them after they drop, that's not defense, that is revenge.
Wiley.
That's Sig. material there. May I?
Coogan
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That's Sig. material there. May I?
Coogan
Sure. I get 5% of the gross of any revenue you make off of it. ;)
No, it's shooting at bombers, a.k.a. "combat". A bomber without bombs is still a target.
Yes. Yes it is. Not exactly sure what your point is, but yes, you are correct.
Wiley.
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Thanks Wiley.
Hope we get rich on this one. :cheers:
Coogan
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Maybe its just me.. but if there are fights going on.. i dont need a little plane icon on my map to find it.
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From a strategic standpoint and a tactical one...
If you are taking the time to hit strats and "planning" as you mentioned. Then surely you are working with groups trying to take bases. Otherwise, what is the point of bombing the strats at all? As long as you are working with base takers, it doesn't matter if they get the strats up by the time you land. What matters is during that down time, your allies took advantage of down time to attack a base and get guns and buildings down while the strat was down.
Another way to look at it is other people also like to bomb strats. I know if I see someone hitting strats and it appears the strats may come up before base taking operations are done on a particular side, I may back that bomber up by hitting the strats again. If you hit all the strats and they are down for 3 hours each, the other guys and gals that like to do the same thing have nothing to bomb for 2 to 3 hours.
I think it is now more involved and the strategy of the bombers and the base takers have to coordinate their tactics a little better to maintain down times. I like it now however, I would agree that resupply times should be 10 minutes per resup and the down times remain the same as they once were. As long as we don't have to invest 15 plus players to resup something at 4 minutes a pop.
IMHO
The resup time for each load of cargo dumped at a strat is 30 minutes less downtime ( the old setting was 4 minutes less downtime).... if the strat is down for 180 min, it only takes 6 loads of cargo to bring the strat up to 100%. you get about 2 sectors away and the strat you bombed is back up to 100%. If you resup a base the cargo is worth 10 minutes less downtime...I'm not sure why the strats cargo is worth more than if you were resupping a base.
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The resup time for each load of cargo dumped at a strat is 30 minutes less downtime ( the old setting was 4 minutes less downtime).... if the strat is down for 180 min, it only takes 6 loads of cargo to bring the strat up to 100%. you get about 2 sectors away and the strat you bombed is back up to 100%. If you resup a base the cargo is worth 10 minutes less downtime...I'm not sure why the strats cargo is worth more than if you were resupping a base.
Wrong, its 10 minute per drop. Hitech reset it this past week.