General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Tripp on June 30, 2019, 11:54:51 PM
Title: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Tripp on June 30, 2019, 11:54:51 PM
With large game producers hitting the market often with the latest and greatest, it no wonders that games like AH are losing participation. That said, I believe there is a good share of the gaming population the if made aware of AH would give it a try. With the first two weeks free as good incentive money should not be a barrier. Perhaps Blakes7 and his boss could offer some strategies for building a campaign to generate some interest across the gaming population. I would be willing to generate content, images or create some web ads if there was some enthusiasm toward the project. This could be done with the approval of AH management and costs would be nominal. Funding would be by donations from the current participants. Those that think the status quo is sufficient because they're having enough fun with things "as is" are kidding themselves. This game is here to earn someone a profit if that ends so does the game. See it happening elsewhere. Without an influx of new blood, we are tenuous at best. An effort could be made by everyone in AH to at the very least encourage friends and others to at least have a look. If anyone is sitting on unused flight gear you could donate it to a newbie for signing on, it could go a long way. I'm sure there's AH pilots out there that could make an effort to encourage others. Posting it on your social media would help get attention! Facebook, Instagram, etc.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 02:12:51 AM
According to HiTech, a lot of new players try Aces High every month. But they don't stick around more than 15-30 minutes.
We need to make Aces High more sticky to new players.
Ah! Virtual brothels!
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Tripp on July 01, 2019, 07:34:00 AM
"According to HiTech, a lot of new players try Aces High every month. But they don't stick around more than 15-30 minutes."
That will be the main issue to overcome. I believe it is the steep learning curve presented them.
It will take a new participate with a deep-rooted reason to take on the challenge. Someone who has a history such as relatives. Could be a Father or a mother that is a current or past military pilot or grandparent that was a WW2 pilot.
Tells me contact should be directed through WW2 combat associations such as USAF, AAF, USNAF associations and forums. Flying clubs, Glider clubs and perhaps R/C clubs as well. Perhaps an ad in foreign countries that were involved directly with WW2? Does anyone have further suggestions?
In real time flying there are demo rides made available to folks interested in learning to fly. Perhaps with AH participation a demo flight event could be developed?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 01, 2019, 01:45:09 PM
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: fd ski on July 01, 2019, 02:00:03 PM
1. Young people don't give a damn about WWII and related aircraft. It as foreign to them as franco-prusian war of 19th century is to us. 2. They don't have joystick setup and play using a mouse. 3. They don't have an underlying passion for aircraft and air combat. So they look around and see nothing that will hold their interest. And off they go.
And frankly i doubt anything can change that - other then Tom Hanks producing 8th AF series....
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Overlag on July 01, 2019, 02:32:25 PM
Young people don't give a damn about WWII and related aircraft. It as foreign to them as franco-prusian war of 19th century is to us.
Well, now, the Franco- Prussian war was indeed a foreign war to us yanks. WWII, however, wasn't all that foreign to most of the world. At least they're into the more obscure war history games like Half Life Two.
(Face it, few of the younger generation have patience for actual history. Its the majors that I'm happy to see.)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 03:06:13 PM
I dont know why people keep saying this. the MANY FPS WWII games are proof this isnt true.
I don't know. FPS in and of itself will attract players. Everyone buys the new CoD or Battlefield just because it is new. I think it is less of an interest in WWII and more of an interest in having the latest game.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 03:39:17 PM
What gets me is how they play all FPS games, historically set or not, like their characters are hopped up on PCP and have springs in their shoes. And huge ammo caches that can reload whatever muddy weapon they find on the ground, along with first aid power ups are just freakin' everywhere. If those games had settings that were closer to real life they would be universally hated. But it never really was about having a realistic historical experience.
You're dead or maimed or you've lost a limb. Start from scratch with a new character.
And, yes, outside of a historical education setting even I would hate ultra realism.
But .... we're talking about Aces High which has no FPS setting and focuses on mainly dog fighting, some tank fighting and some ship fighting. Even then, HT tries to model everything as accurately as they can. 'World of (fill in the blank) as much as admits they wing it and just want to release planes, tanks and ships to make their buck and accuracy be damned (which apparently doesn't phase their customers one bit).
If I could influence those type of gamers to embrace something that took more skill and research than the games that are conning them out of all their daddy's (or mommy's) finances and that it would be a more rewarding experience (if they weren't lazy/instant gratification schmucks) I'd bottle it and become a gazillionaire.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: fd ski on July 01, 2019, 03:46:18 PM
I dont know why people keep saying this. the MANY FPS WWII games are proof this isnt true.
i doubt that. I bet if you asked most young players which games are historical, and which are not, they would have hard time picking right ones...
As someone said, newest flashest game gets it. it has to be action packed, all else is secondary. Did you play Battlefield 1 ? Everyone running around with a submachine gun :)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 01, 2019, 03:57:55 PM
I dont know why people keep saying this. the MANY FPS WWII games are proof this isnt true.
It's like they never sat and considered how many copies of the various Il2 (1946, CloD, Stalingrad, Moscow, Pacific etc ) franchise are sold. Millions and millions.
Battlefield V has sold 8 million at least in the first few months. That game has it's own problems, but it isn't due to lack of interest in a WWII theme. There was intense interest and anticipation of a good WWII game.
It's like they think each of the million and millions that bought Rome:Total War were all PHD candidates in Ancient History.
It's not that anything needs to be improved, it's just that kids nowadays are lazy! And they should GET OF MY LAWN!
[Addendum]
Hitech has stated a while back:
Quote
In the last 100 days aprox 40,000 people have installed Aces High
I'm quite certain these people knew they were downloading a WWII game. It would be ridiculous to think they thought they were downloading a Space shooter.
There seem to be plenty of people willing to give a WWII game a chance. It must be other things about the game that is not convincing them to stay.
:cheers:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Overlag on July 01, 2019, 05:00:19 PM
If just 1% of that 40000 stayed I’d be happy. Forgive me for asking but was this a gradual drop off that wasn’t checked, or a sudden drop due to AH3 or something else? I quit in 2010/11 so I was part of the problem I guess lol just shocked how empty it is now.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Lusche on July 01, 2019, 05:06:12 PM
Forgive me for asking but was this a gradual drop off that wasn’t checked, or a sudden drop due to AH3 or something else? I quit in 2010/11 so I was part of the problem I guess lol just shocked how empty it is now.
Basically a steady loss of total population over the past 10 years.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 100Coogn on July 01, 2019, 05:44:20 PM
If just 1% of that 40000 stayed I’d be happy. Forgive me for asking but was this a gradual drop off that wasn’t checked, or a sudden drop due to AH3 or something else? I quit in 2010/11 so I was part of the problem I guess lol just shocked how empty it is now.
Sorry bro. This game is dated and would need many more than 400 players to save it.
Coogan
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 05:58:39 PM
Sorry bro. This game is dated and would need many more than 400 players to save it.
HT's a small shop. He likely already has more than 500 regular/long term active accounts (whether they actively play is another thing - me being a prime example) and I'd consider that much of a monthly income to be sufficient life support. I think you have 'saving' and 'growing' confused.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 100Coogn on July 01, 2019, 06:06:54 PM
HT's a small shop. He likely already has more than 500 regular/long term active accounts (whether they actively play is another thing - me being a prime example) and I'd consider that much of a monthly income to be sufficient life support. I think you have 'saving' and 'growing' confused.
I am quite aware of this.
Coogan
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 01, 2019, 06:57:32 PM
HT's a small shop. He likely already has more than 500 regular/long term active accounts (whether they actively play is another thing - me being a prime example) and I'd consider that much of a monthly income to be sufficient life support. I think you have 'saving' and 'growing' confused.
I'd hope it is more than that. Have you done that math? It'd hard to run a software company on that.
At what level would you define "saving" mode?
Are you seeing any evidence the attrition has stopped?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 07:22:44 PM
I'd hope it is more than that. Have you done that math? It'd hard to run a software company on that.
At what level would you define "saving" mode?
Are you seeing any evidence the attrition has stopped?
HTC isn't really a typical 'software company.'
Since Skuzzy has retired here is the employee list (including the owner):
Dale "Hitech" Addink CEO
Doug "Pyro" Balmos Simulation Specialist
Carrie "Rosie" Brooks Office Manager
Dan "Waffle" Greve Art Director
Regarding attrition, who sees any evidence, either way? Player time online doesn't always equate to total paid accounts. The community has matured/aged. Most of us are more casual players than we used to be and maybe a few hours a month either tides us over or is all we can devote with real life getting in the way. We can all assume/presume/project/guess all we want. The books are in shop data and the company isn't publicly owned. Even as is, the game has regular upgrades dealing with virtual reality and game tweaking. That's more than some games working on a larger scale.
Many of us saw what a small sim being bought by a larger company with deeper pockets can result in (EA buying AW). Dale saw it, as well. In the 20+ years he's devoted himself to AH it seems quite obvious this is his baby and he'll take care of it as long as humanly possible. I'm not seeing a case of denial or desperation on his part.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 01, 2019, 07:38:11 PM
You think 500 is sustainable? (I'd hope it's closer to 1k), not to mention if it's continuing to decline.
That would be ~89k/yr revenue right?
Salary, health, utilities, server hardware, bandwidth, web/download hosting, dev machines upgrades, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.
That wouldn't meet you criteria for "save" mode yet?
You might have missed this the first time but regarding attrition, who sees any evidence, either way? Player time online doesn't always equate to total paid accounts.
Oh, and the next economic downturn is probably around the corner.
For the vast majority of American citizens it's an ongoing thing. If you can find a way for the entire devoted AH community to remain outside financial struggles of one kind or another then please start a thread focused on such. I would gladly give you a kick-back.
So what's up with the doom and gloom toe to toe forehead bonking you think you need to have with me? I was fairly certain your interests and mine ran the same direction, AH-wise.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Tripp on July 01, 2019, 08:23:18 PM
1. Young people don't give a damn about WWII and related aircraft. It as foreign to them as the franco-prusian war of the 19th century is to us. 2. They don't have joystick setup and play using a mouse. 3. They don't have an underlying passion for aircraft and air combat. So they look around and see nothing that will hold their interest. And off they go.
All very good points. Here is a comment on each one.
From fd ski
1. “Young people don't give a damn about WWII and related aircraft. It as foreign to them as the Franco-Prussian war of the 19th century is to us.” I agree with this. Given the educational criteria used in public schools these days, it’s understandable. Any effort by us or anyone is not going to change it.
2. “They don't have joystick setup and play using a mouse.” There are ways to help resolve this issue. 1. Whatever it takes to advertise a two or three available low-cost joysticks in a “recommended equipment” section of AH. 2. Refer new people to forum or outside sites to acquire equipment. 3. Work a deal with one supplier to offer discounted equipment through the AH membership process.
3. “They don't have an underlying passion for aircraft and air combat.” Look at the time they spend on videos. Build a section of well thought out video short films of action in WW2. The right choices here could raise awareness and excitement.
"So they look around and see nothing that will hold their interest. And off they go."
And frankly, I doubt anything can change that - other than Tom Hanks producing 8th AF series.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: The Fugitive on July 01, 2019, 08:27:50 PM
Since Skuzzy has retired here is the employee list (including the owner):
Dale "Hitech" Addink CEO
Doug "Pyro" Balmos Simulation Specialist
Carrie "Rosie" Brooks Office Manager
Dan "Waffle" Greve Art Director
Regarding attrition, who sees any evidence, either way? Player time online doesn't always equate to total paid accounts. The community has matured/aged. Most of us are more casual players than we used to be and maybe a few hours a month either tides us over or is all we can devote with real life getting in the way. We can all assume/presume/project/guess all we want. The books are in shop data and the company isn't publicly owned. Even as is, the game has regular upgrades dealing with virtual reality and game tweaking. That's more than some games working on a larger scale.
Many of us saw what a small sim being bought by a larger company with deeper pockets can result in (EA buying AW). Dale saw it, as well. In the 20+ years he's devoted himself to AH it seems quite obvious this is his baby and he'll take care of it as long as humanly possible. I'm not seeing a case of denial or desperation on his part.
I think "Pyro" has been gone for a while now.
So that doesnt leave much to work with.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 08:29:01 PM
If just 1% of that 40000 stayed I’d be happy. Forgive me for asking but was this a gradual drop off that wasn’t checked, or a sudden drop due to AH3 or something else? I quit in 2010/11 so I was part of the problem I guess lol just shocked how empty it is now.
It was a gradual dropoff toward the end of the AH2 era, and when AH3 went live a significant # of people 's computers couldn't handle it. There were also teething problems early with AH3 that made me consider leaving the game even before GV dar pushed me over the edge; and I'm certain I was not alone in that regard. And now it's sort of a momentum thing. People are leaving because it's less fun because fewer people are playing.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 08:46:29 PM
People are leaving because it's less fun because fewer people are playing.
Seems a self-perpetuating problem. I wonder if any of them can figure out what to do about that?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Meatwad on July 01, 2019, 08:48:27 PM
It is just my opinion, but the younger crowd seems to have the ADHD mentality and if they cant get instant action within 5 minutes or less, they are bored and quit
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 01, 2019, 10:18:08 PM
Too lazy. Once they saw they could not buy themselves king.... gone. That and no free handouts.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: FLOOB on July 01, 2019, 10:28:47 PM
According to HiTech, a lot of new players try Aces High every month. But they don't stick around more than 15-30 minutes.
We need to make Aces High more sticky to new players.
I think the majority of all new players are going to leave the game within ten minutes no matter what happens. I think the problem is that we need a bigger net.
Maybe if the AH YouTube channel was about wwII aeroplanes instead of about AH the game.
Ads on the history channel too expensive? Make your own history channel on the YouTube. Nobody watches tv anymore anyway.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 01, 2019, 10:34:40 PM
I was fairly certain your interests and mine ran the same direction, AH-wise.
Why would you assume that because I have a preference to simply look at the reality of a problem with cold hard logic and not through a haze of delusional feel-good my-favorite-pony-rainbow wishful thinking, that I don't still want to see AH succeed.
Problems are not fixed by closing your eyes, holding hands, singing Kumbaya, and thinking happy-thoughts.
Problems are fixed by looking at them unflinchingly, no matter how ugly, formulating a solution, then executing with relentless determination.
If you don't have the courage to even face the problem, then you can't even start.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 01, 2019, 10:35:51 PM
Sorry bro. This game is dated and would need many more than 400 players to save it.
Coogan
Well that 1% would be 400 new players every 90 days. That would be 1600 new subscriptions in a year. I don't know how you do that, but it that isn't salvation, it would do until salvation comes around. :D
:cheers:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 01, 2019, 11:22:27 PM
Why would you assume that because I have a preference to simply look at the reality of a problem with cold hard logic and not through a haze of delusional feel-good my-favorite-pony-rainbow wishful thinking, that I don't still want to see AH succeed.
Problems are not fixed by closing your eyes, holding hands, singing Kumbaya, and thinking happy-thoughts.
Problems are fixed by looking at them unflinchingly, no matter how ugly, formulating a solution, then executing with relentless determination.
If you don't have the courage to even face the problem, then you can't even start.
What is with you? No, seriously. Did I manage to trip your 'Arlo is against facts' button when all I've been saying is that hardly anyone in the community actually has access to them? I'm not the fellow you've suddenly decided to imagine me to be. Have a drink and relax or sumpin'. :cool:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 01, 2019, 11:59:52 PM
What is with you? No, seriously. Did I manage to trip your 'Arlo is against facts' button when all I've been saying is that hardly anyone in the community actually has access to them? I'm not the fellow you've suddenly decided to imagine me to be. Have a drink and relax or sumpin'. :cool:
I know you mean well. I really do. And Shuffler too. And you are both really loyal to the game, and that's great.
However, ...... :rolleyes: Nevermind. More power to you, brother.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Lusche on July 02, 2019, 12:49:43 AM
I think the majority of all new players are going to leave the game within ten minutes no matter what happens. I think the problem is that we need a bigger net.
Maybe if the AH YouTube channel was about wwII aeroplanes instead of about AH the game.
If the retention rate is to small, a bigger net won't you do any good. Bigger nets are more expensive, no matter where you lay them. Youtube, that ain't free either. Just think how many unique viewers one would need (only a tiny fraction would ever even look at the AH website) to make a notable impact we all dream of.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: ccvi on July 02, 2019, 01:57:54 AM
If the retention rate is to small, a bigger net won't you do any good.
Maybe it's not the size if the net, but what gets stuck in it. If it catches a kind of people who are clearly not going to be interested, size does not matter.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Lusche on July 02, 2019, 02:35:38 AM
Maybe it's not the size if the net, but what gets stuck in it. If it catches a kind of people who are clearly not going to be interested, size does not matter.
But the retention rate of people who are interest is what's being too low. People who are downloading and installing the game are not staying. That's the problem. So if only 1 out of 200 downloaders actually subscribes, the net is quickly getting inefficient, as only one in hundred(s) getting caught by the net will even consider to download.
The Steam launch was really an eye opener to me. It brought buttloads of interested people to AH (not just 'gamers'). They did not stay.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: FESS67 on July 02, 2019, 03:54:03 AM
But the retention rate of people who are interest is what's being too low. People who are downloading and installing the game are not staying. That's the problem. So if only 1 out of 200 downloaders actually subscribes, the net is quickly getting inefficient, as only one in hundred(s) getting caught by the net will even consider to download.
The Steam launch was really an eye opener to me. It brought buttloads of interested people to AH (not just 'gamers'). They did not stay.
I think this has been done to death many many times and I do not remember ever seeing a reasonable discussion or brainstorm around why potential subscribers do not stay. What I do see a lot of is accusations of the 'potentials' being too lazy, too stupid, not interested in WW2, not willing to pay...etc, etc. OR, maybe it is HTC's fault because he does not do X, Y, Z...etc, etc.
There may well be elements of truth in all of the discussion points or it may all be Internet blowhards spouting BS from their own partisan viewpoints.
My view is that the community.....yes, YOU GUYS...are not helping. I have never, in a combat game, experienced so much running, hiding, sneaking, <insert preferred adjective> as I did in here. No wonder people do not stay, your welcome is to hammer them on the fields, pick and run them in the air and hide in bushes to snipe them on the ground. THEN, you scold them for not knowing what to do, how to do it and to add insult to injury you accuse them of being lazy when they throw their arms up and say "I am out".
HTC has a part to play for sure in the way he allows combat to happen, or not happen, in the environment he creates however I do not think any of you should be surprised at the lack of players when playing is simply not fun for MOST of the people that play it. Remember, you have lost many many veteran players as well so the issue does not just lie with the new guys.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 02, 2019, 08:03:02 AM
But the retention rate of people who are interest is what's being too low. People who are downloading and installing the game are not staying. That's the problem.
Exactly. Hitech stated himself that new player conversion rate is the primary problem.
Don't mean to jump on ya but on this rare occasion I want to point out how mistaken almost all people on this board are about the dynamics of AH.
In the last 100 days aprox 40,000 people have installed Aces High, 20,000 new people have created accounts and entered an arena. Of the people entering the arena 65% are gone and do never reenter by the 10 minute mark of being in the arena. 75% are gone after 30 Minutes.
So when some one makes a claim that changing to 3 hours will have a measurable impact on attracting new subscribers it makes me :rolleyes:
Don't begin to think I don't that I ignore the issues. The release a few weeks ago was a huge change to how the mouse system works, in an attempt to improve the 75% leaving before 30 minutes of play.
So were the new training video systems. Also not only about 15% of people who try AH have Joy Sticks. Right now Aces Highs biggest issues is conversion rates of players trying the game to players subscribing. For some reason I am not setting the hook quickly enough that a player is having fun when first trying the game.
We used to run between a 10 to 12% conversion rate from entering an arena to subscriber. My goal currently is to substantially raise my current conversion rate which is around 1%. And I do not think the driving forces of that conversions are things like how long between country changes.
My next attempt is to try get free Match play populated. I am doing so by creating tournament structures. With prizes in the future.
HiTech
So with an inefficient conversion rate, advertising costs become proportionally more expensive because it costs more to acquire each customer. At some point it is a financial loss because they cost more to acquire than they will return in revenue, on average.
However, it seems we are getting a lot of eyes on the product. It just seems that the current market, whether you like it or not, is not finding the current feature set compelling enough to subscribe. So we can just insult them, and that may sooth our ego and make us feel better in the short term, but that doesn't solve the problem. People need to decide, do we want to feel good short term, or do we want the solve the problem?
Or maybe we just want to stick our heads in the sand and pretend the problem doesn't exist? Because that too can feel good...in the short term.
:cheers:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 09:20:27 AM
So we can just insult them, and that may sooth our ego and make us feel better in the short term, but that doesn't solve the problem. People need to decide, do we want to feel good short term, or do we want the solve the problem?
Or maybe we just want to stick our heads in the sand and pretend the problem doesn't exist? Because that too can feel good...in the short term.
Your recommended practical solutions that you highlight in your post without personal insult and purely without ego are somewhat underwhelming, sir. I've read it three times now and couldn't actually break the code and find them. Humbly and with hat in hand, could you present them plainly for all to see? :)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: The Fugitive on July 02, 2019, 10:02:12 AM
I think the first thing that needs to be done is make mouse and game pad flying as easy as joystick flying. When you log in you should be able to control a plane first flight off the runway with either setup. The majority of gamers dont have a joystick and flying with a mouse or gamepad right. ow takes hours of tweaking and hunting for information on HOW to set it up so it is usable. Use other games as a model to make a default setting so these guys can launch in the first 2 minutes with out any work.
Second set a free set of planes allowed in the MA. If you can fly for the first month or two for free with a limited set you may get hooked and upgrade. It also adds numbers to the arena which down the line will add more numbers.
third, add content. use social media to build anticipation of a release every 3 to 4 months of a plane, vehicle or new map.
Hows that for practical solutions?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 10:21:05 AM
I think the first thing that needs to be done is make mouse and game pad flying as easy as joystick flying. When you log in you should be able to control a plane first flight off the runway with either setup. The majority of gamers dont have a joystick and flying with a mouse or gamepad right. ow takes hours of tweaking and hunting for information on HOW to set it up so it is usable. Use other games as a model to make a default setting so these guys can launch in the first 2 minutes with out any work.
Second set a free set of planes allowed in the MA. If you can fly for the first month or two for free with a limited set you may get hooked and upgrade. It also adds numbers to the arena which down the line will add more numbers.
third, add content. use social media to build anticipation of a release every 3 to 4 months of a plane, vehicle or new map.
Hows that for practical solutions?
I like most of it but I'm not sure HTC can practically add a new model every season of the year. That's a heavy workload for a shop his size (my unskilled opinion). Maybe 6 months? That's half the rate you suggest but a lot faster than current.
Someone mentioned earlier about target marketing the history geeks of the flight sim community by creating professional looking media clips, each one featuring a plane already modeled in AH. That's 100 right there. Adding vehicles and ships would make even more. Say, for instance, the P-40 with public domain original footage featuring the most interesting information about its capabilities and the units and pilots that flew it. As the video clip plays it can slowly begin to transition to how it was modeled for AH and have the historical portion switch back and forth with in game clips.
As stated, the product should be presented as professionally as possible with narration by volunteers with the most appealing 'voice actor' qualities. If any music is incorporated it should be from the WWII era. The game logo should be the only logos used other than possibly squadron markings for that specific plane.
Bearing in mind that this would be a community driven project, we would still need to present them for AH's approval and initial presentation but once the official OK is given I would suggest players share them on their FB pages, Twitter and whatnot to increase their circulation.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 11:06:39 AM
Second set a free set of planes allowed in the MA. If you can fly for the first month or two for free with a limited set you may get hooked and upgrade. It also adds numbers to the arena which down the line will add more numbers.
This is the set I recommended last year and it's certainly up for community discussion:
C-47A F4F-4 P-40B Hurricane Mk I Spitfire Mk I Bf 109E-4 Fi 156 D3A1 I-16 Jeep M-3 SdKfz 251
(9 planes and 3 vehicles ... early war or support)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 11:29:56 AM
This is the set I recommended last year and it's certainly up for community discussion:
C-47A F4F-4 P-40B Hurricane Mk I Spitfire Mk I Bf 109E-4 Fi 156 D3A1 I-16 Jeep M-3 SdKfz 251
(9 planes and 3 vehicles ... early war or support)
Not entirely sure if having troops/sups available for a free account is a good idea. If I cared about them I'd be inclined to 2 box the heck out of that. I think it would really change the face of the arena, quite likely not for the better.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 11:35:37 AM
Not entirely sure if having troops/sups available for a free account is a good idea. If I cared about them I'd be inclined to 2 box the heck out of that. I think it would really change the face of the arena, quite likely not for the better.
Wiley.
Objection noted. Alternative?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 11:40:35 AM
Um... Not giving them the support vehicles? 38G would likely be a good addition. One or both of the Stukas. Maybe something like the JU88 or HE111 for bombing.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Archie on July 02, 2019, 11:43:13 AM
We will see soon what competition is bringing in a new form to the table and if it will have any effect on the future of online flight sims, maybe it will have some effect on AH also? :cool:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 02, 2019, 11:48:34 AM
Your recommended practical solutions that you highlight in your post without personal insult and purely without ego are somewhat underwhelming, sir. I've read it three times now and couldn't actually break the code and find them. Humbly and with hat in hand, could you present them plainly for all to see? :)
I can’t decipher your post. Are you saying I called you a name?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 11:48:54 AM
Um... Not giving them the support vehicles? 38G would likely be a good addition. One or both of the Stukas. Maybe something like the JU88 or HE111 for bombing.
Wiley.
Encouraging free account players to provide the support that players with paid accounts often shun was indeed part of my reasoning and I actually thought of doing so as beneficial, so I'm curious as to why you think making the support vehicles available for free would be disastrous. If you want, offer some perceived scenarios that could convince me. I'm willing to recant if they are convincing.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 11:54:40 AM
I can’t decipher your post. Are you saying I called you a name?
I'm saying that your cold, calculating, steely-eyed vision for improvement of the game, no matter how uncomfortable you project it will make the rest of us feel, is kinda missing something.
I'll dumb it down for you. What exactly are your suggestions for improvement, leaving your feelings about the rest of us out of it?
(Do you really need this deciphered?) :D
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 11:58:43 AM
Encouraging free account players to provide the support that player with paid accounts often shun was indeed part of my reasoning and I actually thought of doing so as beneficial, so I'm curious as to why you think making the support vehicles available for free would be disastrous. If you want, offer some perceived scenarios that could convince me. I'm willing to recant if they are convincing.
Guys sitting on the concrete with their Tiger 2 and a literally constant supply of vehicle supplies sitting behind them from their second computer, without needing to be relying on another player to bring them. Running sups/troops while you cover them in an aircraft without having to rely on other players. Single player base sneaks, tank to down/deack the town, troops on instant standby. Double (or more) the number of troops or supplies for every application of them.
Off the top of my head. There are likely other applications the haven't occurred to me.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 02, 2019, 12:04:21 PM
Ok, because I was very careful not to personally insult anyone.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 12:06:52 PM
Actually forget the guys sitting on concrete. Guys sitting pretty much anywhere in a tank with a constant set of supplies right behind them. Would completely change the dynamics of an attack on a base.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 12:13:16 PM
Guys sitting on the concrete with their Tiger 2 and a literally constant supply of vehicle supplies sitting behind them from their second computer, without needing to be relying on another player to bring them. Running sups/troops while you cover them in an aircraft without having to rely on other players. Single player base sneaks, tank to down/deack the town, troops on instant standby. Double (or more) the number of troops or supplies for every application of them.
Off the top of my head. There are likely other applications the haven't occurred to me.
Wiley.
So it's a case of too many sups and troops taking the place of too few because you think it'll be a common practice for players to have a second free account and desire to go to the trouble of doing this on a regular basis with a second computer instead of it providing a useful set of limited free stuff for new players to stick around long enough to get a better grasp of the game as a whole? I dunno, that seems like a rather pessimistic viewpoint and even a bit far fetched. But I said I'd keep an open mind on what suggestions I offer that are hopelessly broken ideas. I'll ponder on that.
As far as replacing support vehicles with P-38s, Stukas, Ju-88s and He-111s, well, I'm not sure the encouragement to create a paid account would be greater from doing so.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 12:15:12 PM
Ok, because I was very careful not to personally insult anyone.
Just add some useful suggestions and get over the ever-lovin' character assessment of the community as your only input and you can be as insulting as you think you can get away with. :D
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 12:20:48 PM
So it's a case of too many sups and troops taking the place of too few because you think it'll be a common practice for players to have a second free account and desire to go to the trouble of doing this on a regular basis with a second computer instead of it providing a useful set of limited free stuff for new players to stick around long enough to get a better grasp of the game as a whole? I dunno, that seems like a rather pessimistic viewpoint and even a bit far fetched. But I said I'd keep an open mind on what suggestions I offer that are hopelessly broken ideas. I'll ponder on that.
Did you expect a squad of guys to drive 8 hours to exploit the loopholes in the base flashing code to shut down the HQs of the other sides for hours on end, using the .target command to line up their long distance gunnery? Did you expect them to do it often enough that HTC changed the hardness of the HQ?
If it's possible, people will do it.
When people propose ideas, from what I've seen they rarely if ever consider how someone might exploit it.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 02, 2019, 12:25:03 PM
I think the majority of all new players are going to leave the game within ten minutes no matter what happens. I think the problem is that we need a bigger net.
Maybe if the AH YouTube channel was about wwII aeroplanes instead of about AH the game.
Ads on the history channel too expensive? Make your own history channel on the YouTube. Nobody watches tv anymore anyway.
Nothing on the history channel about history any more. :)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 02, 2019, 12:26:13 PM
Or they find the concern over such overrated. Exaggerated fear over spying was how we ended up with side switch limitation, if you recall.
Nope. Per Hitech, if you'll recall it's because ENY needs a spring and a damper so the sides don't swing wildly from one side to the other over short time. I happen to disagree with that, but I've said my piece about it years ago and apparently it didn't convince him.
The spiez is just what people talk about, not HT's reason.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 12:52:45 PM
By the way, shouldn't the freebie list be easily adjusted if need be. I mean, if HT can create a list of freebies, couldn't he add or subtract from it if an outright disaster happens because, well, the veteran player population, all or part, is more inclined to grief than grow the population and promote the game?
Here's the entire list of AH toys (Early Arena) (Mid-war Arena) (Late-war Arena) (Unsure):
A-20G B-17G B-24J B-25C B-25H B-26B B-29 C-47A F4F-4 F4U-1 F4U-1A F4U-1C F4U-1D F4U-4 F6F-5 FM2 P-38G P-38J P-38L P-39D P-39Q P-40B P-40E P-40F P-40N P-47D-11 P-47D-25 P-47D-40 P-47M P-47N P-51B P-51D SBD-5 TBM-3 Boston Mk III Hurricane Mk I Hurricane Mk IIC Hurricane Mk IID Lancaster III Mosquito Mk VI Mosquito Mk XVI Seafire Mk II Sea Hurricane Mk I Spitfire Mk I Spitfire Mk V Spitfire Mk VIII Spitfire Mk IX Spitfire Mk XIV Spitfire Mk XVI Tempest Mk V Typhoon Mk I B-239 Ar 234B Bf 109E-4 Bf 109F-4 Bf 109G-2 Bf 109G-6 Bf 109G-14 Bf 109K-4 Bf 110C-4b Bf 110G-2 Fi 156 Fw 190A-5 Fw 190A-8 Fw 190D-9 Fw 190F-8 He 111H Ju 87D-3 Ju 87G-2 Ju 88A-4 Me 163 Me 262 Me 410 Ta 152H C.202 C.205 A6M2 A6M3 A6M5b B5N2 D3A1 G4M1 Ki-43-II Ki-61-I-KAIc Ki-67 Ki-84-la N1K2-J I-16 Il-2 Type 3 La-5FN La-7 Tu-2S Yak-3 Yak-7B Yak-9T Yak-9U Jeep LVT(A)2 LVT(A)4 M-3 M4A3(75) M4A3(76)W M-8 M-16 M-18 Sherman VC Jagdpanther Jagdpanzer IV Jagdpanzer 38 Ostwind Panther G Panzer IV Panzer IV F SdKfz 251 Tiger I Tiger 2 Wirbelwind Elco 80' PT Boat
If you or anyone wants to suggest an entire alternative list from scratch then give it a go. (I might respectfully suggest avoiding the jets and high perkies - that would indeed be too tempting.) :)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 01:14:44 PM
If you or anyone wants to suggest an entire alternative list from scratch then give it a go. (I might respectfully suggest avoiding the jets and high perkies - that would indeed be too tempting.) :)
Do you really think it's important for the players to outline the specifics? The idea is "give free players enough vehicles to supposedly entice them to subscribe." Possibly HT might be able to figure out a planeset? I was just pointing out a way your initial proposal of the concept could be abused.
Implementing stuff in an online game with no eye toward abuse is just flat out not a good idea.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 01:28:45 PM
Do you really think it's important for the players to outline the specifics? The idea is "give free players enough vehicles to supposedly entice them to subscribe." Possibly HT might be able to figure out a planeset? I was just pointing out a way your initial proposal of the concept could be abused.
Implementing stuff in an online game with no eye toward abuse is just flat out not a good idea.
Wiley.
You started out with suggestions. I figured you'd have more. Maybe others will. It will, in the long run, be left up to HT, true. Occasionally, he can be influenced. ;)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 01:59:34 PM
You started out with suggestions. I figured you'd have more. Maybe others will. It will, in the long run, be left up to HT, true. Occasionally, he can be influenced. ;)
As far as this idea goes, I don't think the specifics are going to make that much difference. I mentioned bombers because there were none in your list, and felt that's a broad category that should be addressed. I gave my reasons for why I think adding support vehicles is a bad idea.
Constant Storch parked in the area letting the guy have vehicle icons on his second monitor is another thing that could be easily abused, btw. A lot easier and faster than pop out, run film, pop in too.
I've made my suggestions in the past. There isn't much point in belaboring them. Personally I don't think the incremental stuff people are proposing will make a noticeable difference. They can advertise all they want, apparently a lot of people seem to think the solution to the previous advertising not making a difference is more advertising, not changing the game into something more people will want to play.
This type of game is simply not popular. Stuff like WT/Battlefield is. That's about the end of it. People want more of a "game" like is provided elsewhere as opposed to an arena that is provided here.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 02:13:53 PM
This type of game is simply not popular. Stuff like WT/Battlefield is. That's about the end of it. People want more of a "game" like is provided elsewhere as opposed to an arena that is provided here.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 02:27:57 PM
Well seriously, how do you explain the fact that there are only 2 other games in the world that use mechanics similar to this one, and they're both about as active as this one or less? (cue Archie talking about how the new WB is going to revitalize the entire industry)
I simply don't understand how giving people early war planes and support vehicles for free so they can go to the main arena to be slaughtered en masse by late war planes and allow people to 2 box free supplies will rejuvenate the game back to its halcyon days. But, allegedly that's an ironclad constructive suggestion that should be beyond criticism.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 02:35:09 PM
Adding boats isn't going to do it either. :grin: :bolt:
Wiley.
Yeah yeah. We get it. Nothing will work. I'm not sure this is the cold, calculating, razor-edge, logical face it thing Trips was suggesting. Or maybe it is?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 02:58:33 PM
Yeah yeah. We get it. Nothing will work. I'm not sure this is the cold, calculating, razor-edge, logical face it thing Trips was suggesting. Or maybe it is?
Well, tell me how I'm wrong. This is one of 3 games on Earth that is structured like this one. They're all wildly unpopular compared to stuff like WT. They all had periods of high population before there were alternatives that don't have that structure.
How does changing small things and leaving that structure intact make the game more popular?
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 03:03:57 PM
I get it. It's your take. I won't argue it to death with you. AAMOF, you should repeat it in as many threads like this on the forum as often as possible. It's helpful.
I get it. It's your take. I won't argue it to death with you. AAMOF, you should repeat it in as many threads like this on the forum as often as possible. It's helpful.
Before we started talking about other stuff, all my point was was to improve your idea because I saw an easy exploit. Then you went into the usual "This isn't helpful because it's not discussing whether it's a good idea, or a really good idea."
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 02, 2019, 03:13:49 PM
Before we started talking about other stuff, all my point was was to improve your idea because I saw an easy exploit. Then you went into the usual "This isn't helpful because it's not discussing whether it's a good idea, or a really good idea.
This type of game is simply not popular. Stuff like WT/Battlefield is. That's about the end of it. People want more of a "game" like is provided elsewhere as opposed to an arena that is provided here.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 02, 2019, 03:34:26 PM
...Yeah, I'll grant you the point. You asked for more suggestions, I explained why I don't have more. Well, none that I think would work with the game as it is.
You're right though, I did start it.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 02, 2019, 04:08:44 PM
My suggestion.... play the game more, the BBS less. :D
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 02, 2019, 04:10:21 PM
With large game producers hitting the market often with the latest and greatest, it no wonders that games like AH are losing participation. That said, I believe there is a good share of the gaming population the if made aware of AH would give it a try. With the first two weeks free as good incentive money should not be a barrier. Perhaps Blakes7 and his boss could offer some strategies for building a campaign to generate some interest across the gaming population. I would be willing to generate content, images or create some web ads if there was some enthusiasm toward the project. This could be done with the approval of AH management and costs would be nominal. Funding would be by donations from the current participants. Those that think the status quo is sufficient because they're having enough fun with things "as is" are kidding themselves. This game is here to earn someone a profit if that ends so does the game. See it happening elsewhere. Without an influx of new blood, we are tenuous at best. An effort could be made by everyone in AH to at the very least encourage friends and others to at least have a look. If anyone is sitting on unused flight gear you could donate it to a newbie for signing on, it could go a long way. I'm sure there's AH pilots out there that could make an effort to encourage others. Posting it on your social media would help get attention! Facebook, Instagram, etc.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: flippz on July 02, 2019, 10:11:08 PM
capttrips is about the only one in here with a grip on the idea. all the twenty plus year vets are happy with the game.
people dont want to log in and spend 10 mins getting to a fight to have to either hover over a field forever and dive into a swarm of red guys in super over powered ack. you repeat that just say 6 times, thats 60 mins of useless time in a game wasted. say we dont pick up alot of new guys, why not make it fun for the guys that are here. maybe get soem fo the older guys back. i understand not everyone wants a knife fight in a phone booth constantly but i can bet that its more than want to fly around hunting single dars or diving on to ack flight after flight after flight. for the new guys that come in, give them gamey crap for a lil while. give them a decent opening learning course. give them lead computing sights and harden there plane and take it away a lil at a time. announce to the country when a new player enters the game so guys can help them.
change the maps. make them a lot smaller give a lil faster action to the fights give guys a reason to leave the ack. i believe if bases were a bit closer you wouldnt get the stagnate up and stay low in the ack melodrama we have now.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Chris79 on July 02, 2019, 10:50:03 PM
capttrips is about the only one in here with a grip on the idea. all the twenty plus year vets are happy with the game.
people dont want to log in and spend 10 mins getting to a fight to have to either hover over a field forever and dive into a swarm of red guys in super over powered ack. you repeat that just say 6 times, thats 60 mins of useless time in a game wasted. say we dont pick up alot of new guys, why not make it fun for the guys that are here. maybe get soem fo the older guys back. i understand not everyone wants a knife fight in a phone booth constantly but i can bet that its more than want to fly around hunting single dars or diving on to ack flight after flight after flight. for the new guys that come in, give them gamey crap for a lil while. give them a decent opening learning course. give them lead computing sights and harden there plane and take it away a lil at a time. announce to the country when a new player enters the game so guys can help them.
change the maps. make them a lot smaller give a lil faster action to the fights give guys a reason to leave the ack. i believe if bases were a bit closer you wouldnt get the stagnate up and stay low in the ack melodrama we have now.
:aok
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 03, 2019, 07:35:10 AM
capttrips is about the only one in here with a grip on the idea. all the twenty plus year vets are happy with the game.
people dont want to log in and spend 10 mins getting to a fight to have to either hover over a field forever and dive into a swarm of red guys in super over powered ack. you repeat that just say 6 times, thats 60 mins of useless time in a game wasted. say we dont pick up alot of new guys, why not make it fun for the guys that are here. maybe get soem fo the older guys back. i understand not everyone wants a knife fight in a phone booth constantly but i can bet that its more than want to fly around hunting single dars or diving on to ack flight after flight after flight. for the new guys that come in, give them gamey crap for a lil while. give them a decent opening learning course. give them lead computing sights and harden there plane and take it away a lil at a time. announce to the country when a new player enters the game so guys can help them.
change the maps. make them a lot smaller give a lil faster action to the fights give guys a reason to leave the ack. i believe if bases were a bit closer you wouldnt get the stagnate up and stay low in the ack melodrama we have now.
I find that you do not have to worry about ack if you are not vulching a field.
Move back from the field and there will be fights. You might still have one run to a field.... if he is close enough.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: BTPommyB on July 03, 2019, 08:31:35 AM
1) Aces High is a a fantastic VR game, but I can't find any reviews of AH on Youtube VR game or flight-sim reviews. Warthunder and IL2, but no Aces High reviews.
2) If you read the steam reviews of AH, you will see that many are negative and that they think existing players are stunninghunks. We seem to come across as cliquey and aggressive. We know that this is not true, but many of us have known each other for 15 years or more and have forgotten what it is like to be a newbie, and how short your life expectancy is. If we can get new players into squads quickly, then we can mentor them through those early tough first few weeks (years for me), and give them a sense of belonging to a team. Maybe Hi-Tech should think about automatically allocating newbies to squads as well as countries.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 03, 2019, 09:16:42 AM
Maybe Hi-Tech should think about automatically allocating newbies to squads as well as countries.
I don't think Dale is that hard-handed with the customer. Maybe he can have a message of the day that mentions active squads. Active is the key. Currently, it seems, that would be the POTW as everyone else (own squad included) seems rather casual and occasional. Imagine most of all new accounts being part of that squad right off the bat. I'm not saying the POTW is a bad squad but a sudden population explosion of any squad could be detrimental (to both the squad and the community).
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 03, 2019, 09:21:41 AM
1) Aces High is a a fantastic VR game, but I can't find any reviews of AH on Youtube VR game or flight-sim reviews. Warthunder and IL2, but no Aces High reviews.
I had played Aces High for about the first six years from beta. I had burned out and left and only poked in every couple of years to check progress. I re-upped last October when I ran across Aces High again on steam when looking for cool VR games.
It is one of the best VR implementations I've come across, and I've tried a LOT of them. The WWI combat is especially nice because the closer rates are so much slower and the turn circles smaller so you are much closer to the enemy during dogfight so it really make the best VR experience.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Mister Fork on July 03, 2019, 10:27:34 AM
I had played Aces High for about the first six years from beta. I had burned out and left and only poked in every couple of years to check progress. I re-upped last October when I ran across Aces High again on steam when looking for cool VR games.
It is one of the best VR implementations I've come across, and I've tried a LOT of them. The WWI combat is especially nice because the closer rates are so much slower and the turn circles smaller so you are much closer to the enemy during dogfight so it really make the best VR experience.
+1 CptTrips - I can't fly Aces High in 2D anymore - I love the immersion feeling with VR. And you're right - it's the best VR experience out there.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: fd ski on July 03, 2019, 10:40:17 AM
I had played Aces High for about the first six years from beta. I had burned out and left and only poked in every couple of years to check progress. I re-upped last October when I ran across Aces High again on steam when looking for cool VR games.
It is one of the best VR implementations I've come across, and I've tried a LOT of them. The WWI combat is especially nice because the closer rates are so much slower and the turn circles smaller so you are much closer to the enemy during dogfight so it really make the best VR experience.
+1. I wouldn't be playing if it wasn't for VR. What helps AH in this resepct is somewhat dated graphics. Even mid range computer runs VR smoothly - which is not a case for IL2 and DCS - where you need a powerhouse of a PC.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 03, 2019, 10:42:56 AM
I'd give CT a thumbs up but I'm afraid it would somehow invite a diatribe filled with 'rainbow unicorn farts' or 'tie-dyed thongs' or something just as bizarre. :D
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: waystin2 on July 03, 2019, 11:18:51 AM
I don't think Dale is that hard-handed with the customer. Maybe he can have a message of the day that mentions active squads. Active is the key. Currently, it seems, that would be the POTW as everyone else (own squad included) seems rather casual and occasional. Imagine most of all new accounts being part of that squad right off the bat. I'm not saying the POTW is a bad squad but a sudden population explosion of any squad could be detrimental (to both the squad and the community).
I concur and for other reasons as well. Most of us have been in the squad for 4-5 years (some as many as 15+ years) so throwing some unknown person into our mix of crusty old male swine is not going to be a good idea. Also, getting invited to be a part of this tight group of friends is an honor, not something you are given. We ask folks to spend a few weeks on vox with us before we even discuss an invite to the squad. Just my .02 cents. See you up there...
Way
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 03, 2019, 12:02:44 PM
I'd give CT a thumbs up but I'm afraid it would somehow invite a diatribe filled with 'rainbow unicorn farts' or 'tie-dyed thongs' or something just as bizarre. :D
Yawn. Try harder. ;)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 03, 2019, 12:21:19 PM
ROTFLMAO
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 03, 2019, 12:49:19 PM
(https://i.imgflip.com/1fr95g.jpg)
:aok
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Meatwad on July 03, 2019, 01:15:12 PM
I think your assessment of both VR and WWI dog fighting is spot on and I've been very supportive from day one. Granted, not being able to experience either since you made your worthy offering is frustrating .... but that didn't make my appreciation less genuine.
Is that what you meant? :D :salute :cheers:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 03, 2019, 02:37:44 PM
Whaaaaat? You mean inbred hicks on meth looking for ginseng in the woods isnt history????
Could be, I guess, in the broad sense of the term (everything that actually happens can shortly be considered history). It just isn't very meaningful, interesting or entertaining history (to most of us, I suppose). :cool:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 03, 2019, 03:42:49 PM
Whaaaaat? You mean inbred hicks on meth looking for ginseng in the woods isnt history????
DOH! snicker
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Meatwad on July 03, 2019, 04:09:35 PM
I quit watching the history channel when all the good stuff went to the military channel. And then its being weeded out for reality tv trash. I would pay for a "retro" version of the military channel, with some of the shows that were broadcast back in the 80's-90's. I watched many an episode of Firepower and Wings.
And heck, even throw in some declassified testing and documentaries on aircraft and weapons that were made back in the 40's to 70's. Those are very interesting to watch
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: flippz on July 03, 2019, 04:15:44 PM
I find that you do not have to worry about ack if you are not vulching a field.
Move back from the field and there will be fights. You might still have one run to a field.... if he is close enough.
Then there would be even less fighting. Last night was a perfect example. If I flew the way everyone recommended I would be part of the problem. I mean I guess hovering over my base for 30-45 min and never leaving my dar ring and only engaging a plane when I have at least two others with me. Oh and I will fly the fastest plane I can possibly get. That should solve and ack ganging running issues huh.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 03, 2019, 04:49:43 PM
Then there would be even less fighting. Last night was a perfect example. If I flew the way everyone recommended I would be part of the problem. I mean I guess hovering over my base for 30-45 min and never leaving my dar ring and only engaging a plane when I have at least two others with me. Oh and I will fly the fastest plane I can possibly get. That should solve and ack ganging running issues huh.
Well, that kinda proves you either didn't read or understand a thing Shuf posted. But that's OK. If you wanted a vantage point outside your own you woulda tried harder. :D
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 03, 2019, 05:00:48 PM
I think your assessment of both VR and WWI dog fighting is spot on and I've been very supportive from day one. Granted, not being able to experience either since you made your worthy offering is frustrating .... but that didn't make my appreciation less genuine.
Is that what you meant? :D :salute :cheers:
That's exactly what I meant. ;)
I will say this about VR.
I was impressed with AH VR enough to sign back up again when I hadn't had an interest in AH in almost a decade. I was learning the mission system and had a WWI furball setup one time and I was circling just over the swirling AI about 500 ft below me and we were all about 1k alt. The sense of 3d space was completely intoxicating. I literally felt like I might tip out of the cockpit and I banked hard above them. It was amazing. One of those pivotal moments when you realize, this is what I've been looking for. It was impressive enough to convince me to spend 8 months creating an AI populated world were I could go do that whenever I wanted. For a game I thought I was long done with.
As long gone players start getting VR, maybe it will encourage many of those to come back too.
All of the family and friends I have demo'd VR have been totally mesmerized by it. It's hard to convey the total immersion of actually being in the scene suddenly rather than looking at a projection of a scene on a 2-d screen. You can literally forget you are not there, even with the comparatively low resolution.
And what is striking is these are all non-gamers. Just regular civilians who would normally show no interest in my 2-d games. You put the VR goggle on them and you practically have to taze them to get it back. People can just spend hours zipping around the planet in Google EarthVR. That suggests to me VR could have a huge effect on electronic entertainment long term.
However, my current advise to people is, if you are not a game nerd, or bleeding-edger, wait a bit. A year or two? The true ver. 2 of this technology (not just v. 1.5) will be four times as good and half the price and content will have caught up and development will have figured out the proper design grammar to make great VR experiences.
And HTC has one of the best implementations early on in the race. There are possibilities there if they can figure out how to exploit it, and don't go tits up before they can.
:cheers:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: atlau on July 03, 2019, 05:53:34 PM
Then there would be even less fighting. Last night was a perfect example. If I flew the way everyone recommended I would be part of the problem. I mean I guess hovering over my base for 30-45 min and never leaving my dar ring and only engaging a plane when I have at least two others with me. Oh and I will fly the fastest plane I can possibly get. That should solve and ack ganging running issues huh.
People will eventually stop upping into numerically superior forces capping over a field. It's not fun for them. They aren't here for your amusement. You need to provide them an incentive. Either show up with less overwhelming odds or start capturing the town and at least you will get the win the war defender types to up.
That same night once the numbers evened up and the fight got pushed away from the knight field, many of the bish left to switch to attack and overwhelm to the rook front instead since their attempt to capture the field was blown. (#s were 44-34-22 when I checked... so the rooks were in for a world of hurt).
This is why I do wish there was a furball pit in the middle of the map for the quick action furballers to get their fix in and then let the outside of the map create fights while people try to act strategically using surprise and overwhelming odds to capture bases so everyone gets to play the way they want to.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 1stpar3 on July 03, 2019, 06:24:47 PM
People will eventually stop upping into numerically superior forces capping over a field. It's not fun for them. They aren't here for your amusement. You need to provide them an incentive. Either show up with less overwhelming odds or start capturing the town and at least you will get the win the war defender types to up.
That same night once the numbers evened up and the fight got pushed away from the knight field, many of the bish left to switch to attack and overwhelm to the rook front instead since their attempt to capture the field was blown. (#s were 44-34-22 when I checked... so the rooks were in for a world of hurt).
This is why I do wish there was a furball pit in the middle of the map for the quick action furballers to get their fix in and then let the outside of the map create fights while people try to act strategically using surprise and overwhelming odds to capture bases so everyone gets to play the way they want to.
:furious Well at least you werent in a 262...I can die to C205... :rofl Those were some good fights...till I lost SA...CRAP forgot about that 205 :furious :rofl Had fun at same fight for 3 hours or more, till numbers got bad. Eh, its just the nature of the beast. Good times draw a crowd...some times advantage other times not :cheers:
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: flippz on July 03, 2019, 08:15:54 PM
People will eventually stop upping into numerically superior forces capping over a field. It's not fun for them. They aren't here for your amusement. You need to provide them an incentive. Either show up with less overwhelming odds or start capturing the town and at least you will get the win the war defender types to up.
That same night once the numbers evened up and the fight got pushed away from the knight field, many of the bish left to switch to attack and overwhelm to the rook front instead since their attempt to capture the field was blown. (#s were 44-34-22 when I checked... so the rooks were in for a world of hurt).
This is why I do wish there was a furball pit in the middle of the map for the quick action furballers to get their fix in and then let the outside of the map create fights while people try to act strategically using surprise and overwhelming odds to capture bases so everyone gets to play the way they want to.
Yeah I agree with the numbers. I had chased a la over there and went back to that field three times before 88 was captured. Then I started venturing out to the northern fields and the field further back trying to find stragglers. But again we are talking about two sectors of flight in a 21 eny planes TRYING to find a fight. I know no one is here for my amusement just get aggravated with steadily climbing to fields of other countries to find a fight.
Last night I am up to 72 flights (not counting porkers) going to opposing country bases for a fight. That’s in the 3 nights of my home pc not counting the day time flights at work. I guess like fess said. There is just to much down time now between take a finding a fight. And I don’t mean the swarming pack in the ack.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Oldman731 on July 03, 2019, 08:52:20 PM
And what is striking is these are all non-gamers. Just regular civilians who would normally show no interest in my 2-d games. You put the VR goggle on them and you practically have to taze them to get it back.
Something tells me this is important.
- oldman
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 03, 2019, 10:48:58 PM
I've come to a theory that there is a certain percentage of the population that are more "3-D Suggestable" than the majority. Like a certain percentage of the population that are highly susceptible hypnotism. Their brains find it easier to suspend disbelief and place their sense of self into a 3-d representation of a game-world projected on a 2-d screen. These people become gamers because, when all the conditions are right, they can approach an immersion experience that they find extremely compelling.
Most other people see the 3-D pictures on the screen, but their brains seldom make the full leap to inject their sense of self into the world being projected in 2-dimensions. Their brain can never break the fourth wall, and so they never achieve the intense sense of immersion that hooks more susceptible gamers.
VR however lowers the threshold so that even non-gamers become totally immersed. VR smashes that fourth wall and throws you directly into the game-world head first. Gamers reach Nirvana because they finally have reached the kind of experience they had previously on gotten glimpses of during moments of peak-flow. Civilians have their noodle completely baked because they never suspected anything like that could ever be possible.
VR is going to be the textbook, porn, television, movie and gaming industries of the future all rolled up.
Oh brave new world...
A lot of people will think I'm crazy, but keep in mind what we have now is:
:furious Well at least you werent in a 262...I can die to C205... :rofl Those were some good fights...till I lost SA...CRAP forgot about that 205 :furious :rofl Had fun at same fight for 3 hours or more, till numbers got bad. Eh, its just the nature of the beast. Good times draw a crowd...some times advantage other times not :cheers:
Yeah I decided to fly the 205 as my main ride last tour. Good climb and does well in dives. Decent guns and ammo load and maneuverability as well. Average top speed is really its biggest weakness. Still deciding what plane to use next tour.
I've been busting out the 262 mainly when the numbers get outta hand and cut off the enemy on climbout and slow them from getting to the base they are attacking. Realistically though it's best for buff and goon killing
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 1stpar3 on July 04, 2019, 03:44:39 AM
Yeah I decided to fly the 205 as my main ride last tour. Good climb and does well in dives. Decent guns and ammo load and maneuverability as well. Average top speed is really its biggest weakness. Still deciding what plane to use next tour.
I've been busting out the 262 mainly when the numbers get outta hand and cut off the enemy on climbout and slow them from getting to the base they are attacking. Realistically though it's best for buff and goon killing
:aok Still HATE/LOVE ya! Its complicated :devil Just like with Copprhed :devil Really miss that SOB :salute Almost to the point of asking him what he needs...to come home! I would donate to his "Get eyes fixed" fund! As for "next plane" ......STORCH/FI! Hey, Crabby flew a C47 one whole tour...you would at least have a gun :rofl
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: atlau on July 04, 2019, 08:08:49 AM
Yeah man f77 and copperhead were my squaddies when I first started playing again. Miss them both
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 04, 2019, 10:07:16 AM
Most other people see the 3-D pictures on the screen, but their brains seldom make the full leap to inject their sense of self into the world being projected in 2-dimensions. Their brain can never break the fourth wall, and so they never achieve the intense sense of immersion that hooks more susceptible gamers.
I tried a VR system at one point, just a Vive. I was playing a DnD type game and I was on top of a pillar and looking down. I have a medium sized problem with heights and I realized I was right at the edge and had a visceral reaction to looking down over the edge at my feet, and immediately took a step back. When I realized what I'd done, I laughed at myself. And that's with cartoony graphics. I really want to try AH with it.
I want it, but it means a complete computer replacement to work well and I don't have the money for it.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Pluto on July 04, 2019, 11:10:43 AM
I tried a VR system at one point, just a Vive. I was playing a DnD type game and I was on top of a pillar and looking down. I have a medium sized problem with heights and I realized I was right at the edge and had a visceral reaction to looking down over the edge at my feet, and immediately took a step back. When I realized what I'd done, I laughed at myself. And that's with cartoony graphics. I really want to try AH with it.
I want it, but it means a complete computer replacement to work well and I don't have the money for it.
Wiley.
First thing you have to do is bail out of a plane and watch the ground. That still gets me occasionally
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Wiley on July 04, 2019, 11:29:41 AM
First thing you have to do is bail out of a plane and watch the ground. That still gets me occasionally
I am a touch concerned about motion sickness. I think I'll likely be ok, but I was playing an FPS that I was moving quickly through, and I kept dying in one area so kept going through it faster and faster and faster, and it got to the point I had to end my session because I was going to paint a picasso on the floor. My equilibrium was screwy for about 3 hours after. But I think (hope) maneuvering a plane from a chair should be easier to deal with. I'll be pretty sad if I can't use it in here.
Wiley.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 04, 2019, 11:39:59 AM
I tried a VR system at one point, just a Vive. I was playing a DnD type game and I was on top of a pillar and looking down. I have a medium sized problem with heights and I realized I was right at the edge and had a visceral reaction to looking down over the edge at my feet, and immediately took a step back. When I realized what I'd done, I laughed at myself. And that's with cartoony graphics. I really want to try AH with it.
I want it, but it means a complete computer replacement to work well and I don't have the money for it.
Wiley.
LoL. :rofl
I was playing this game and was at a point where I was standing next to the edge of a high drop off. I pause and wanted to reach over and get my beer on the table. I knew where it was, or close enough I could feel for it, but it would require that I walk out across the open air of the drop off.
I knew intellectually that there was floor there, but the instinctive impulse to avoid stepping off into space was SOOOOOO strong it was amazing.
That tells you just how deeply you are messing with your brain.
:rofl :rofl :rofl
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Pluto on July 04, 2019, 11:44:37 AM
I am a touch concerned about motion sickness. I think I'll likely be ok, but I was playing an FPS that I was moving quickly through, and I kept dying in one area so kept going through it faster and faster and faster, and it got to the point I had to end my session because I was going to paint a picasso on the floor. My equilibrium was screwy for about 3 hours after. But I think (hope) maneuvering a plane from a chair should be easier to deal with. I'll be pretty sad if I can't use it in here.
Wiley.
I had to limit my playing time to 30 minutes at a time for the first week or so due to motion sickness but eventually I got used to it and have even been able to play 12 hour scenarios. Just don't over do it at first
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: The Fugitive on July 04, 2019, 11:48:47 AM
First off, I love the VR. I have no issues with the "screen door" stuff as I normally wear glasses and dont in VR so I dont see it.
The problem I have is it does take getting use to. Your controls are the same, but you dont realize how often you still use the keyboard. I have a warthog and a CH throttle, plenty of buttons, but still not enough when in VR. I have tried voice attack or what ever the voice control software suggested by many but it has a hard time recognizing my voice.... new england accent :) Also you still need the view switches because spinning all the way around is not an option unless all controls.... including pedals are attached to the chair.
The biggest hurdle is that for over 20 years I have been playing this game with stick/keyboard/looking strait ahead and changing all that even just the small bit is hard. Old dog new tricks syndrome :) Add in that I play very little these days as the numbers are so low I hate "wasting" that time to play by "training" myself to fly all over again.
If Hitech came in here today and said by this time next year we would be back to 200 week night/400 weekend numbers GUARANTEED Id take the time to learn it, but as it is, Im thinking of selling it.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on July 04, 2019, 11:51:47 AM
I had to limit my playing time to 30 minutes at a time for the first week or so due to motion sickness but eventually I got used to it and have even been able to play 12 hour scenarios. Just don't over do it at first
Yeah, I didn't have too much problem, but had some brief moments of woosey at first. That soon went away. You get your sea legs.
I played 11 hours straight in VR on Bavaria. No problem. Diving in to mass of B-17 all guns blazing was almost a sexual experience! :D
You know what gets me though? Watching someone else playing mirrored on the monitor. I have to be careful not to watch that too long. I think my brain is now trained to try and put me in those worlds, but i am not controlling the view movement. I think that dissonance me motion sick pretty quickly.
I can play all day long, I just can't watch more than a couple of minutes. :noid
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Pluto on July 04, 2019, 11:57:00 AM
I think some people will judge vr by the videos or mirrors they see of it because it looks so shaky or twitchy, but they don't understand that when the headset is on everything is moving with you so it is not as bad as it looks
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: atlau on July 04, 2019, 12:11:19 PM
I am a touch concerned about motion sickness. I think I'll likely be ok, but I was playing an FPS that I was moving quickly through, and I kept dying in one area so kept going through it faster and faster and faster, and it got to the point I had to end my session because I was going to paint a picasso on the floor. My equilibrium was screwy for about 3 hours after. But I think (hope) maneuvering a plane from a chair should be easier to deal with. I'll be pretty sad if I can't use it in here.
Wiley.
Took me about a week and could only play 15 min at a time. But now I dont even get any motion sickness. Except with gvs when in the gunner view
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 1stpar3 on July 04, 2019, 05:43:45 PM
First thing you have to do is bail out of a plane and watch the ground. That still gets me occasionally
:rofl Even better than that...."The 3 Seconds of Air Time in a Jeep" OMG. Messa Map....AWESOME :devil
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Squire on July 04, 2019, 07:13:56 PM
WW2 FPS Games = Instant Action.
Its the latter they are drawn to...not the former. FPS (insert whatever the hell you want here) will be popular and not because the BF 109G-10 flight model is just so historically accurate...ect...they just get to blow s*** up.
AH? its going to be more than an hour to even get anywhere near something from download to rolling in an arena with your controls functioning.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Tripp on July 12, 2019, 10:22:55 PM
Hitech has stated a while back: There seem to be plenty of people willing to give a WWII game a chance. It must be other things about the game that is not convincing them to stay.
How about some input as to just what "other things" might be to hopefully narrow down these reasons. More minds the better? 1. Learning curve and training process. 2. Lack of visual motivation on the home page to gain curiosity. 3. Equipment requirements. A $30 J-stick will do the job, big expensive equipment is not needed. 4. 5. 6. please add to the list
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: FESS67 on July 21, 2019, 12:52:58 AM
How about some input as to just what "other things" might be to hopefully narrow down these reasons. More minds the better? 1. Learning curve and training process. 2. Lack of visual motivation on the home page to gain curiosity. 3. Equipment requirements. A $30 J-stick will do the job, big expensive equipment is not needed. 4. 5. 6. please add to the list
#1 not accepted. Every other game has a learning curve and if you hop over to DCS or IL2 they are on a par IMO with the learning curve. 2. Home page is like something from the 90's BUT does it really affect the issue? HTC has openly stated they can get them in the door but cannot keep them much past 30 minutes.
I believe that is the issue your many brains need to consider.
I think there are a couple of problems.
1...the game is called Aces High. It will naturally attract 'fighter pilot' type players. Fighter combat is lacking. Much hitting and running but not much fighting 2...Invisible GVs. I have never understood that. 3...The lack of a balanced fight. 2 sides can be going at it but the third is sat idle with no combat. That does not promote a fun time. 4...ENY - whichever way you look at it this is a divisive element of the game especially when combined with point #3. I can be denied a plane based on ENY yet be locally outnumbered. Of course people will leave. 5...Trees at the end of a runway. Why have 'auto takeoff' when if you take a heavy fighter if smashes you into a tree and you die. Does not seem in the spirit of 'Auto takeoff' 6...Points system - yeah we all need a way to measure performance however the AH system rewards hit and run over stay and fight. I can name many players who I can beat 1 on 1 but never get the chance because they run. Yeah yeah, it is an open sandpit. I get it. But if you want to know why people leave or do not stay, I believe it is a factor. Links in with #1
To many these may seem trivial however to a new player these are fun killers and you lose them before you had the chance to get them.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: bozon on July 21, 2019, 03:54:46 AM
Its the latter they are drawn to...not the former. FPS (insert whatever the hell you want here) will be popular and not because the BF 109G-10 flight model is just so historically accurate...ect...they just get to blow s*** up.
AH? its going to be more than an hour to even get anywhere near something from download to rolling in an arena with your controls functioning.
I bet 99% of under 25 year olds will not be able to tell the difference between a WW1 and WW2 game. I don’t blame them if their education comes from Battlefield series games - they all play exactly alike no matter if it is WW2 Ardens, WW1 Somme, or starwars battle of Hoth. They all look like bunny hopping soldiers with some kind of a shooting equipment and health bars.
Now get into a combat flight sim where physics matter. You can’t just point at where you want to go, twitch is a lot less important than forward thinking and understanding of flight physics. The age of planes (WW1, WW2, and jets) make all the difference of how these planes move and what they can and cannot do. It is complicated before you even fired a gun.
Now gear - it is not a mouse or a game pad that goes with the other games. “A stick? Really? Just to play this one game I downloaded on w whim? Pass.”
I you don’t get a hard on from imagining that you are in a Mosquito, Spitfire, Mustang, etc... games like AH will not be able to keep you. On the ither hand, if you are the kind that like extreme modeling accuracy of every switch and knob and don’t care much about the actual combat, then DCS probably got you, not AH. I have friends that like flight sims, but will never play an open PvP game - I’ve been trying to get them into AH for nearly 20 years.
What is left is a super nitch of players that were already highly interested in WWII aviation and are competative enough to want to play PvP online. I am afraid that we are talking about a ridiculously small fraction of the population that keeps getting smaller as the “glory” of WWII fades into anchient history.
The only thing that I can see somehow reviving this kind of games is a crossbreed of DCS and AH that completely focuses on the planes and air combat without any playable ground combat component - the latter is poison. It will have to mix players and AI. It will still be a super nitch game, but at least the sim-nerds, the history buffs, and the PvP aircombat guys could be in it together.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CAV on July 21, 2019, 08:24:07 PM
Quote
The only thing that I can see somehow reviving this kind of games is a crossbreed of DCS and AH that completely focuses on the planes and air combat without any playable ground combat component - the latter is poison.
Odd............ WW2OL is doing Ok with combined arms combat. And IL-2 is adding tanks to the mix, but these are still trying to be a simulation not a game. As to were did they go? WW2OL, IL-2, IRACING & DCS has many ex-AW/AH players they didn't stop playing, they just stopped playing AH. Maybe they needed something than a Furballers club to make them stay.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: The Fugitive on July 21, 2019, 09:22:37 PM
Odd............ WW2OL is doing Ok with combined arms combat. And IL-2 is adding tanks to the mix, but these are still trying to be a simulation not a game. As to were did they go? WW2OL, IL-2, IRACING & DCS has many ex-AW/AH players they didn't stop playing, they just stopped playing AH. Maybe they needed something than a Furballers club to make them stay.
I think the "Furballers Club" is BS. The fights are few and far between more often than not these days. The issue with the "war" game play is the players have melted it down to the least common denominator. Dive bombing buffs, over whelming attack forces and such have killed the "war" aspect of the game. OddCAF use to run squad missions inviting anyone along that wanted join in. Once it got to the point that you needed 50 players in an attack force there was no longer any point in running them.
I still think there are game adjustments HTC could do to to move players into better game play that would bring back the "war" aspect of the game with missions and all.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: guncrasher on July 21, 2019, 10:09:25 PM
Fugitive please be specific about what those game changes could be.
Semp
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: usvi on July 21, 2019, 11:48:53 PM
A simple one word answer...work. That is all.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: bozon on July 22, 2019, 02:59:02 AM
Odd............ WW2OL is doing Ok with combined arms combat. And IL-2 is adding tanks to the mix, but these are still trying to be a simulation not a game. As to were did they go? WW2OL, IL-2, IRACING & DCS has many ex-AW/AH players they didn't stop playing, they just stopped playing AH. Maybe they needed something than a Furballers club to make them stay.
WW2OL is a ground game with planes. By the way, “Combined arms” means “shit flight sim” in Armenian.
DCS multiplayer is like the old LAN games. I really wish they had company run servers with more substance.
IL-2 I never liked, but some ex AH players enjoy mods of it with multiplayer. I would call it “small scale multiplayer” if AH numbers were not down to this level.
IRACING, I have no idea what is that. Does not sound interesting at all.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Lusche on July 22, 2019, 04:27:17 AM
I just looked up where I actually went - This is what I have been playing in the last 14 months:
(https://i.imgur.com/qI4lXtO.png)
(measured by recording 'time in focus', which is somewhat incomplete for games where I use to 'tab out' a lot like AH or Elite)
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Icer on July 22, 2019, 05:02:30 AM
Yeah, the 15 years of difference I see is the days of 2-300 players online stopped sometime during my absence! 30 people up, how it it even still viable?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: The Fugitive on July 22, 2019, 03:55:06 PM
Fugitive please be specific about what those game changes could be.
Semp
I and others have made many suggestions, you want to read them do a search. The point is when a company stagnates and doesnt continue to change with the times it falls behind and can never catch back up.
I dont know if Hitech plays the game any more. After coding and working on the game all day Im guessing his "release" is to unwind with a glass of scotch and hang out with his wife and kids. If that is so, he dosent see what the game has turned into. I dont think what we play these days is any where close to the game he use to play when he first started.
I know its not like I remember it. Of course with the lower numbers the "issues" become a bit more glaring. Yes we have the HOin and ganging and so on just like we did before, but now you cant move to "another fight" to try and get away from it as there is only the one fight, unless you the lucky team being ignored by the other two and so have no fights. You cant defend another base because they are not attacking another base, they are all on one because due to lack of skill and planning its the only way they CAN take a base.
The last game play change that HTC made I think was the GV dar. While it was a good idea to make it easier for new players to find a fight, I think it proved to be a bit over the top and the almost "pin pointing" the spot an enemy gv was in chased away many of the GV crowd and didnt seem to really help bring in/keep new players.
Changes need to be made to make game play better. Changes need to be made to make it easier for gamers and their mouse/gamepad setups to be able to compete in the MA. Changes need to be made to the subscription model to give an option to play for free as much as gamers want. Give them transaction for perks, or planes or vehicles. If they would rather be nickeled and dimed in stead of paying the flat rate that the rest of us do, who am I to care. If it makes them more comfortable with that type of pay model why not.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 22, 2019, 11:27:18 PM
I had fun this evening.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: TequilaChaser on July 23, 2019, 07:24:54 AM
Because you don't talk about furballers club. Duh!
Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
Oh yeah, forgot about rule # 1
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 100Coogn on July 23, 2019, 09:04:44 AM
Some people got their own click.
(https://i.imgur.com/cORGmPV.jpg)
Coogan
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Mano on July 23, 2019, 03:23:01 PM
Spanky and the other members of the He-Man Woman Haters Club find out that Alfalfa has been secretly courting Darla. After a trial they sentence him to forget about her and other girls forever. Alfalfa is having trouble with his punishment, particularly since the new rich kid is moving in on his territory, and he works to win her back.
:D
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 100Coogn on July 23, 2019, 03:52:08 PM
Spanky and the other members of the He-Man Woman Haters Club find out that Alfalfa has been secretly courting Darla. After a trial they sentence him to forget about her and other girls forever. Alfalfa is having trouble with his punishment, particularly since the new rich kid is moving in on his territory, and he works to win her back.
:D
He's a spy I say! :old:
Coogan
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Shuffler on July 23, 2019, 11:01:52 PM
Spanky and the other members of the He-Man Woman Haters Club find out that Alfalfa has been secretly courting Darla. After a trial they sentence him to forget about her and other girls forever. Alfalfa is having trouble with his punishment, particularly since the new rich kid is moving in on his territory, and he works to win her back.
:D
Since he gave up women.... his spike has laid down.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: The Fugitive on July 24, 2019, 09:20:32 AM
some times I wonder how much Hitech pays you guys to side track these types of threads.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Arlo on July 24, 2019, 09:37:18 AM
#1 not accepted. Every other game has a learning curve and if you hop over to DCS or IL2 they are on a par IMO with the learning curve. 2. Home page is like something from the 90's BUT does it really affect the issue? HTC has openly stated they can get them in the door but cannot keep them much past 30 minutes.
I believe that is the issue your many brains need to consider.
I think there are a couple of problems.
1...the game is called Aces High. It will naturally attract 'fighter pilot' type players. Fighter combat is lacking. Much hitting and running but not much fighting 2...Invisible GVs. I have never understood that. 3...The lack of a balanced fight. 2 sides can be going at it but the third is sat idle with no combat. That does not promote a fun time. 4...ENY - whichever way you look at it this is a divisive element of the game especially when combined with point #3. I can be denied a plane based on ENY yet be locally outnumbered. Of course people will leave. 5...Trees at the end of a runway. Why have 'auto takeoff' when if you take a heavy fighter if smashes you into a tree and you die. Does not seem in the spirit of 'Auto takeoff' 6...Points system - yeah we all need a way to measure performance however the AH system rewards hit and run over stay and fight. I can name many players who I can beat 1 on 1 but never get the chance because they run. Yeah yeah, it is an open sandpit. I get it. But if you want to know why people leave or do not stay, I believe it is a factor. Links in with #1
To many these may seem trivial however to a new player these are fun killers and you lose them before you had the chance to get them.
Cant really argue about you post! Then again....I wish to return to the Dagobah system...to finish my P-51 training. :rofl It breaks my heart seeing you guys flustered in these times of reduced numbers! Especially the Folk I truly/Honestly respect! Like it or not....you folk are family in my eyes :rock
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: madrid311 on August 01, 2019, 07:45:33 AM
When I'm home I play everyday usually 5:30am PAC time. Not many on at that time but I still have fun. I love this game. It's not for everybody that's for sure. But the people in it, get it. I'm out of town at the moment and I wanted to log on to the website and get up to speed on aces high world and couldn't get to the web page...( The hotel blocks it.) I was panicked! I thought that the game finally closed shop. So it told me that I do really love this game and am ok with it as long as it's still available, with 20 people or 100. I only got to experience more than 100 a few times when I first started, and I admit it was awesome. It would be great to have that again but we are a special breed of gamer, Becoming extinct. +1 for aces high, never quit!
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Vudu15 on August 01, 2019, 07:55:08 PM
The above points being good ones, having FSO and Scenarios run into the ground was another killer and is showing with loses in the squads participating in FSO and lackluster involvement in the last few scenarios.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: guncrasher on August 01, 2019, 11:47:33 PM
The above points being good ones, having FSO and Scenarios run into the ground was another killer and is showing with loses in the squads participating in FSO and lackluster involvement in the last few scenarios.
I am still having fun in fso and scenarios. lots of players there. not as many as before but considering the number of players logging in, i say it's not bad.
you can say not as many players as before and that would be true, saying running into the ground, well not actually acurate.
semp
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: ULPink on August 02, 2019, 01:53:45 PM
I am 27, there are plenty of people out there who would like this game my age or older. I have seem no marketing efforts at all anywhere. Maybe we should post more videos. Maybe change the trail model to allow people to play for free with spitfires, lancasters, panzers jeeps and m3s? They will get addicted, want better planes and eventually pay. The price is the highest I ave seen for any other gaming. DCS does well just charging for planes. I think they pre-sold a few million dollars worth of their new f-16c model that releases in September. That game is always free to play and they have a lot of players buying planes. It would be hard for people with no experience flying PC games or real planes to learn this in just 30 days. I had a few people help me get used to this game but I flew ww2 games already so the learning curve for me was more just how things work in here. I have seen people help new players...and that was nice. A few months of flying spitfires around, they will get used to it and want better planes. Giving the 30 days to learn how to fly, fight and win, well that was a lot like the real deal in ww2 lol. On the other hand...not having 50,000 people online but only 150 at a time, allows you to get to know everyone and makes a competitive community...just not a good biz model.
I have to say my grandfather played for awhile and was made to feel welcomed by some of the better players. He flew Phantoms in Vietnam. The veteran aces in here probably would have liked to talk to him and learn from him. Instead, they said he was a liar and that he was really someone else. I get the same treatment at times but enjoy beating the best in here either because I am getting better or just not afraid to die trying and get lucky!
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on August 02, 2019, 02:47:43 PM
I am 27, there are plenty of people out there who would like this game my age or older. I have seem no marketing efforts at all anywhere. Maybe we should post more videos. Maybe change the trail model to allow people to play for free with spitfires, lancasters, panzers jeeps and m3s? They will get addicted, want better planes and eventually pay. The price is the highest I ave seen for any other gaming. DCS does well just charging for planes. I think they pre-sold a few million dollars worth of their new f-16c model that releases in September. That game is always free to play and they have a lot of players buying planes. It would be hard for people with no experience flying PC games or real planes to learn this in just 30 days. I had a few people help me get used to this game but I flew ww2 games already so the learning curve for me was more just how things work in here. I have seen people help new players...and that was nice. A few months of flying spitfires around, they will get used to it and want better planes. Giving the 30 days to learn how to fly, fight and win, well that was a lot like the real deal in ww2 lol. On the other hand...not having 50,000 people online but only 150 at a time, allows you to get to know everyone and makes a competitive community...just not a good biz model.
I have to say my grandfather played for awhile and was made to feel welcomed by some of the better players. He flew Phantoms in Vietnam. The veteran aces in here probably would have liked to talk to him and learn from him. Instead, they said he was a liar and that he was really someone else. I get the same treatment at times but enjoy beating the best in here either because I am getting better or just not afraid to die trying and get lucky!
The most expensive big games on the market are so called free games.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: CptTrips on August 03, 2019, 08:33:26 AM
The most expensive big games on the market are so called free games.
They are only as expensive as the player makes them out to be. If some one wants to spend $300 a year to get all of the equipment piecemeal instead of spending $180 a year for the subscription why would HTC complain?
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: scott66 on August 06, 2019, 09:18:24 PM
Still here just busy with IRL
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: warhed on August 06, 2019, 10:16:04 PM
I got married to a workaholic Chinese scientist, and if she saw me flying games, she'd probably leave me. But man I miss you all!!
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: Oldman731 on August 06, 2019, 10:23:26 PM
My risk-gain analysis suggests that you should shut up about WWII.
- Oldman
This is what I miss most about AH, the elders passing down wisdom. I would come back in a heartbeat if HiTech would stop being lazy and bring back the sheep.
Title: Re: Follow up on "Were did everyone go"?
Post by: 1stpar3 on August 07, 2019, 03:55:29 PM
This is what I miss most about AH, the elders passing down wisdom. I would come back in a heartbeat if HiTech would stop being lazy and bring back the sheep.
Nah...they cant shoot at your cartoon plane...dont mean they arent trying to "GET YOU SHOT" :x :devil