Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: -aper- on July 20, 2012, 10:08:30 PM
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Would it be a fair option to be able to trade some perks to get an AI gunner for planes that have gunners but can not fly in formations? (Me-410, 110, Il-2, Ju-87, TBM, SBD etc )
The AI gunner:
1) Must not be operational during high-G maneuvering
2) Could be killed or his gun could be destroyed
3) Could give "6 calls" to the pilot
4) Could level up in accuracy if managed to shot down an enemy plane
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like it but wat would decide the skill of that gunner would he have alot of trouble hiting his target or not
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Why burn perk points for an AI gunner when a player can join and gun for nothing but the effort it takes to make a friend? :D
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like it but wat would decide the skill of that gunner would he have alot of trouble hiting his target or not
Initially accuracy could be similar to that of field guns
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Why burn perk points for an AI gunner when a player can join and gun for nothing but the effort it takes to make a friend? :D
You can make this effort by flying as a wingman :) plus with AI gunner ;)
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aper try flying as a gunner for those planes that you mentioned. then think that if it is added it will be 1/2 of your accuracy. that will more or less give you something to think about.
semp
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As replacment for TT.
One day a week have a jump countries at will for 24 hours.
Give it about 3 months for the gamey finessing to be worked out and be introduced as a one night a week event like JSO almost became an every sunday event. If all of us had to practice impulse control in this game or the planet would explode as our punishment. The human race would be doomed.
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aper try flying as a gunner for those planes that you mentioned. then think that if it is added it will be 1/2 of your accuracy. that will more or less give you something to think about.
I agree that this gunner will not be able to defend your plane effectively but it will be better than nothing as usually you do not have time to jump to gunner position anyway.
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aper try flying as a gunner for those planes that you mentioned. then think that if it is added it will be 1/2 of your accuracy. that will more or less give you something to think about.
I agree that this gunner will not be able to defend your plane effectively but it will be better than nothing as usually you do not have time to jump to gunner position anyway.
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Even if the rear gunner is inaccurate, it gives the enemy pilot something to worry about. A couple of pings might make him break off an attack or at least jink out of the way. Some useful AI gunner commands might be a "fire/hold fire" toggle and a "gunner range" command for what distance he should open fire at. The noise of him firing would probably be all the six call needed.
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greebo if most guys will attack a bomber from their 6 knowing that they're gonna die, it sure wont stop them from attacking a tbm with an ai armed with a .30 cal for sure. it is more a comfort for the pilot than a deterrent for an attacker.
semp
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I know it won't stop the attack, but it might put the attacker off briefly. I occasionally fly TBMs or Ju 88s on torpedo attacks and tend to spend far more time in the pilot's position trying to screw bnzing fighters' shots than in the gunner's positions. If he saddles up then I am history but it is surprising how many players can do nothing but bnz even against almost helpless targets. It would be nice if the pilot could concentrate on defensive flying without having to switch to a gun position at all. Besides I think having the rear gunners firing more of the time would add to the realism of the game.
BTW a TBM has a 0.5 inch gun in the turret and a 0.3 in in the lower gun position.
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sound like a good idea combined with the . commands mentioned b4.
I think it should apply also for regular bombers.
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Why burn perk points for an AI gunner when a player can join and gun for nothing but the effort it takes to make a friend? :D
we dont want friends! this is WAR! :rofl
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I want a AI turret gunner modeled after 999000 for my A-20 please :cheers:
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It's not a bad idea. :aok
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.otto b- 0.5 b+ 4 b++ 4 rt 0 rg D9
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Back in WarBirds, the topic of "Otto" robot gunners was hotly debated during the entire time I played the game. Bomber pilots wanted laser-beam perfect accuracy, fighter pilots wanted something more like Real Life. It was always a very divisive topic.
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Have to say i love the idea of an AI gunner with a realistic level of accuracy.
It would allow planes such as the 410, 110, stukas, tbm, BSD (insert many many more here) to actually have some chance at survival. Especially since currently non formation planes ( attackers like the 410 and il2) have that extra weight yet are virtually dead if the pilot jumps into the gun position. Adding AI would make these much more realistic targets, even if they only could cause minor damage, simply because now a pilot can attempt to maneuver away from potential attacks and still Harv a chance to score a kill with a very lucky ping. Survivability in non formation attack planes is very low because usually the options are incredibly limited on the defensive, usually coming down to "Can i avoid his guns long enough that a friendly might happen to come help, or he runs outta ammo.
Might even pull some planes away from the hangar queen stigma if pilots felt slightly more assured that they could stand a chance given a ftr interception
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Back in WarBirds, the topic of "Otto" robot gunners was hotly debated during the entire time I played the game. Bomber pilots wanted laser-beam perfect accuracy, fighter pilots wanted something more like Real Life. It was always a very divisive topic.
AH current man-gunning system works perfect for heavy bombers flying in formations. Unfortunately it doesn't work well for light bombers, attack planes and heavy fighters with gunner positions. For these planes it would be better and more realistic to have "ottos" (AI gunners) modeled.
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when you ad ai to an online game you remove the player element. you are no longer fighting one of several players flying the plane you are fighting the programmer that coded the ai.
I would prefer full control of the plane from gun positions before diminishing the variety of human interaction by having ai do all the work. I know this would work because of how hated ar234 rear guns are. (I hate them)
the human gunners are somthing treasured and respected when skilled in this game.
I ended up trying to shoot 999000 the other day and was vaporized at long range trying to setup a 50mm shot in my 410 hizookamobile. I thought to myself... damn I wish I was that good at defensive fire gunnery.
add in the reviled otto and you have essentially removed one of the few elements of bombers that is actually envied and enjoyable for many people.
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when you ad ai to an online game you remove the player element. you are no longer fighting one of several players flying the plane you are fighting the programmer that coded the ai.
I would prefer full control of the plane from gun positions before diminishing the variety of human interaction by having ai do all the work. I know this would work because of how hated ar234 rear guns are. (I hate them)
the human gunners are somthing treasured and respected when skilled in this game.
I ended up trying to shoot 999000 the other day and was vaporized at long range trying to setup a 50mm shot in my 410 hizookamobile. I thought to myself... damn I wish I was that good at defensive fire gunnery.
add in the reviled otto and you have essentially removed one of the few elements of bombers that is actually envied and enjoyable for many people.
It is pretty obvious that there are some planes that do not need ai gunners (heavy bombers flying in formations). And there are some planes that need ai gunners (Light bombers, attack planes and heavy fighters). Nothing wrong to get AH system implemented for heavy bombers and WB system implemented to other planes with gunners.
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Back in WarBirds, the topic of "Otto" robot gunners was hotly debated during the entire time I played the game. Bomber pilots wanted laser-beam perfect accuracy, fighter pilots wanted something more like Real Life. It was always a very divisive topic.
A AH defensive formation of 3 B17s are more accurate and deadly that a whole section of 18 where IRL.
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The OP was only wanting otto gunners for heavy fighters and attack planes, not for large level bombers. This does beg the question of where you draw the line however. Should an attack plane like the B-25H have otto gunners for instance?
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The OP was only wanting otto gunners for heavy fighters and attack planes, not for large level bombers. This does beg the question of where you draw the line however. Should an attack plane like the B-25H have otto gunners for instance?
I see no reason it shouldn't, it doesn't fly in formation - same as Il-2 and A-20.
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I don't want to fight AI.
find a way to make rear gunning in weak defense attack aircraft if you want (normal controls from gunenr position and mouse controlling gun movement)
but be honest about what your asking for.
you can currently gun and do limited turns and climb or dive on autopilot while manning your own gun. you cant gun and do offensive dogfighting at the same time.
you can have a gunner join you but then you have to fly level for them to have any chance of landing a shot because they cant anticipate your movements which are made worse by netlag.
id propose making the attack aircraft flyable from gunner positions because they have such weak defensive fire that flying level with them like a heavy bomber ends in death almost every time.
the real reason people dont use the rear guns as much is because the destructive power of the defensive fire is inferior to the fighters attacking resulting in the defenders death.
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Cobia38 I wish i was 1/2 as good as you in my B17 as you are in the A20!!!!
999000 <S>
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I could use someone to sight and pull the trigger in MY light bomber. My gunnery sux
Stab
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I don't want to fight AI.
Most of the field guns are ai-operated. Is it a big deal?
id propose making the attack aircraft flyable from gunner positions because they have such weak defensive fire that flying level with them like a heavy bomber ends in death almost every time.
I have no idea how are you going to control a plane while operating the turret and MG. Flying forward, sitting backward controlling plane with joystick & pedals plus MG with a mouse at the same time. If you master it I vote for Defiant ;)
the real reason people don't use the rear guns as much is because the destructive power of the defensive fire is inferior to the fighters attacking resulting in the defenders death.
So, what is your point? The defensive fire is inferior to that of the fighters and ai gunner will not ruin the gameplay and will not create a problem here. Right?
The real reason people do not use rear gunners is because when you jump into the gunner position you plane instantly becomes a very easy target. Is it realistic? No
Is is good to gameplay? No. Does it make sense? No. So why not try to fix this problem by adding an ai gunner ?
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+1
Otherwise every such A/C might as well just empty the rear gun ammo and sling the weapon and mount over the side before upping. Is the raer crewmember's weight modelled as well. If so he can get out too. if not it should be if/when ai is included
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+1
Otherwise every such A/C might as well just empty the rear gun ammo and sling the weapon and mount over the side before upping. Is the raer crewmember's weight modelled as well. If so he can get out too. if not it should be if/when ai is included
I am sure it is, just as I am sure my navigator's weight is modeled.
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Have you are gone soft?
A1 gunners are a disgrace.
If you cant get into your guns and fire them yourself drive a jeep.
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Have you are gone soft?
A1 gunners are a disgrace.
If you cant get into your guns and fire them yourself drive a jeep.
who's gonna help shoot the mg in the jeep?
semp
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Have you are gone soft?
A1 gunners are a disgrace.
Show us some films how you kill fighters sitting in a gunner position in bf110 or TBM for example. If you do not have any you can simply go to DA and make them ;)
If you cant get into your guns and fire them yourself drive a jeep.
And you will be my gunner ? I would like to see you films first :)