Author Topic: Core-Duo  (Read 1047 times)

Offline Schutt

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« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2007, 03:19:29 AM »
Hi Tigger,

since you want a more detailed anwser than "conroe blows it away" ill give it a try.

First, you cant compare dual core directly to single core performance wise. So i will first assume you only use one of the cores in the conroe.

1.) power : core2duo BOTH cores together use 65W, prescott ONE core uses 100W. If you only use one of the two cores, that uses more than 50% since it uses the whole cache, thats like 40W against 100W. Since you often have the comp swithced on but dont need the cpu for more than 10% of its power and conroe is much better in power saving its probably more like 25W to 80W.

2.) Raw numbers: 1 conroe core does more than 3 times the work of one prescott at the same frequency. Since the rest of the computer is virtually the same, the conroe computer is slowed and does about 2.2 times as much only, the whole computer. That is for a 1.83G Conroe you need at least a 4G Prescott, which doesnt exist. If you overclock your prescott to that level it uses 130W, has a shortend livespan and you still have only 1 core. Still you pit it against a stock conroe which could be overclocked as well, running at performance the prescott never reaches.

3.) Application performance: Compare some numbers on the net, checking the 2 cpu prescott version against the conroe 2 duo, the conroe 1.83 gives about the same performance as the D 960 clocked to 3.9G, slightly better in single threaded apps. It is a lot better in apps that use both cores, since it has a much better dual core design than the pentium D. prescott runs worse than the 8xx /9xx dual cpus.

4.) Conroe 1.83 against prescott 3.2: ONE core is about 1.25 times as fast. Then you have a second core, which can give up to 80% improovement in one app and can give 90% for other work when you do multitasking. Now comes the hard part, usually i do not run 2 full apps but require responsiveness, harddisk, networking, security, gui etc. where i would say the second core adds about 60% of its usefullnes.
That would be total 2 times the performance in the core 2 system.

4.) Efficiency: Take halve power by double performance land at 4x. I am cheating here since the total power consumption of the computer is far less than double, but looking at the cpu that is what it gives. The advantage of using low power is more than just the reduced power, less noise, less cooling trouble, less dust trouble and longer live (for the computer only).

To be short, that is like driving with a 20 year old, no airbag, no impact protection, no abs, loud car that does halve the mgp or with a new, airbag, abs, efficient, more comfortable and faster car that does double the mpg. Now sadly modern cars arent that much better than old ones, and arent aloud to drive at 130mph instead of 65mph. Not talking about they wouldnt be able to do that with using halve the fuel. But probably with halve the maintenance cost.


Or, much shorter: The conroe blows the prescott away, by far. Its better than A64 x2, its better than D9xx / D8xx but ill save you the details. Still, with the dropped prices of the a64 x2 and the EE versions amd gained ground and is no longer that far behind.

Of course, if you put in a budget constrained where core 2 duo is simply to expensive or a home pc with no gaming / other cpu intensive stuff in mind the world looks diffrent and an AMD 3600EE might get intresting. But thats a moot point on a board for AH2 pilots.

Offline Tigger29

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« Reply #16 on: February 08, 2007, 07:48:40 PM »
I'm sold :)

Plus I can do it and still stay well within my budget.

So I'm happy.

I'll report back on how it all works out when I get it together.



One more question.. I've never set up XP to boot from a SATA device... I'm assuming you copy the drivers to a floppy, then at install press F1 to install third party drivers, then load the SATA drivers.. then let it do it's thing?  (I'm assuming it will be similar to a SCSI install).  Or is there more steps I'll need to know?

Thank you thank you thank you

Offline Skuzzy

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« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2007, 06:14:55 AM »
It depends.  If you do not configure your SATA interfaces to use RAID, then you do not need any drivers at all.  At least that is true for the Intel based motherboards.  I am sure it would be true for any other chipsets.  No reason for it not to be.

SATA is just the physical transport.  The interface to it can still look like an IDE interface.
Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
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Offline wooley

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« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2007, 11:04:19 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Tigger29
...I'm still into the old school thought that MORE GHZ is better, and was skeptical about expecting a performance improvement while DECREASING GHZ.


Think of GHz as equivalent to RPM in cars. My Toyota Yaris may rev to 8000rpm whilst your Corvette only goes to 6500rpm. Which is the faster car?

Offline Skuzzy

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« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2007, 04:39:44 PM »
I like that analogy.  Nice one wooley.
Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
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Offline Tigger29

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WOOHOO!
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2007, 07:46:42 PM »
Got the tax money in the bank!!

  Ordering tonight!  I'll let you know how it turns out!

Offline 38ruk

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« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2007, 12:22:51 AM »
Quote
Cannot figure why anyone would want an AMD CPU right now. Intel owns the price/performance crown right now.


IF i wasnt trying to get the last bit of life out of my 939 system i would be buying intel right now . Any enthusiast / gamer doing a new build and still using AMD must be a loyalist /fanboy.

It makes me wonder what AMD was doing when they had all of the Athlon 64 /FX success, cause AM2 is a weak answer to conroe. Dont get me wrong ive had mostly AMD's since i started building in 1998, but when the performance gap is like it is, it's an easy decision .

Offline Brenjen

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« Reply #22 on: February 20, 2007, 07:14:02 AM »
The socket 939 AMD is mature & you know what you're getting; that's the only reason I can see going with any new build in an AMD.

 I might have a higher opinion of the core2duo mobo offerings if I weren't waiting on an RMA for a fried Asus at the moment. They will be a better choice as time goes on than they are right now, lots of choices for motherboards out for the core2 & they all suck. (imo)

 All I can advise is choose very carefully! Pay close attention to the memory you intend to pair with your chosen mobo & be sure it has the bios revisions to deal with the core2duo. The cpu is great; it's a real strong performer with a very reasonable price tag....it's everything else in that socket that is the problem. If the mobo makers had solid reliable boards & they weren't finicky about what you put on them the core2 cpu's would be walking away with ALL the new builds right now instead of 99% of them.

 Research your build thoroughly, don't just jump on the first parts you see & your build will be sweet. :aok

Offline Tigger29

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« Reply #23 on: February 20, 2007, 12:40:25 PM »
Well yes... this being my first Conroe... I've done a lot of research and while this isn't the best motherboard around, it should suit my needs.

I've also researched it and if it has an old bios that won't accept the Core2Duo, I found a way to update the bios, even if it won't recognize the processor.

I also realize the PCIe slot it has is NOT 16X, but I don't care.  I intend to keep using my AGP card (for budget reasons) and if I need higher performace down the road I have no problems whatsoever installing a new MB.  Right now I'd rather keep my high end AGP card then invest in an economy PCIe, as the good ones are still a bit pricey.

I figure.. worst case scenario, this setup I ordered will outperform my last "good" system (AMD 2200XP that I fried) by at least two fold.  If that is accomplished then I will be more than happy.

Best case.. I have a screaming system (compared to what I'm used to) and won't need to upgrade for awhile.  Right now anything is better than this 450MHZ POS I'm on right now!

Oddly enough I have a 1GHZ P3 system in the basement, and this 450MHZ PII outperforms it in almost every way... I think due to the fact that it has twice the RAM and an AGP video (VS. the onboard INTEL graphics on the 1GHZ).

Oh well.. still waiting for the stuff to get here.. I was hoping it may come today but I didn't really expect to see it this soon.. I'm thinking Thursday.  I'll let you guys know.. and I'm itching to try out the new EW/MW/LW arenas!

Offline Tigger29

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« Reply #24 on: February 23, 2007, 07:05:55 PM »
HOLY MOTHER OF LTAR!

This thing... whoa!

Got it all in yesterday... put it together... no problems whatsoever.. no errors... no goofy stuff... all went smooth as silk!

I absolutely got a kick out of the windows install timer (estimated time to completion:  35 minutes).. well it counted down each minute about every 10 seconds!

Windows updates and SP2 install took pretty much the rest of the evening.

Wife played Sims2 today... had to pry herself off the computer to get some housework done!  She's happy.

I went offline on AH2.. pegged 60FPS no matter what I did at 512 tex's...  at 1024 with the high-res pack it's mostly 55-60FPS... if i do some quick view changes it'll drop to 50 or so... I'm VERY happy!

Thanks for the advice everyone.. so far I'm VERY HAPPY with this E6300 setup!