Author Topic: Killing a Gunner or starting a Fire, Improvements to Damage Model (Read 254 times)

Vermillion · « **on:** February 28, 2000, 12:51:00 PM »

Was just thinking of a couple of incidents in the past couple of weeks, and realized a couple of places that our damage models were really lacking.

1.) The first is the ability to knock out a gunner. I typically fly .50 cal aircraft, and have to deal with its lack of overall punch. Offsetting this is the increased number of rounds. I notice that when I attack the tail of a bomber, the tail gunner compartment is lit up like a Christmas tree. The ability to wound a gunner (decreased accuracy and response) similar to the pilot wounds, or even the ability to kill one outright would be a great addition to the damage model. Especially since many gunners stations were not armored in any way shape or form.

2.) Fire. I don't know why I never missed this before. One of the most deadly effects a aircraft can suffer is being set on fire in combat. HT, Pyro, and crew did a really nice "fire" effect for Dawn of Aces, and I think it would add alot both visually and to gameplay. Another benefit/problem is aircraft like the Zero. If you don't have fire, you can't model its historical weakness, and therefore must decrease its overall toughness to an absurd point.

Just a couple of thoughts.

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure,
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"

Westy · « **Reply #1 on:** February 28, 2000, 02:12:00 PM »

I'll second both of these in a heart beat!

-Westy

(p.s. Vermillion, did you recieve my reply email regarding what you'd asked me?)

Pyro · « **Reply #2 on:** February 28, 2000, 02:34:00 PM »

Both of those things are already in the game. We'll probably add a fire sound at some point to give you a better cue that you're on fire.

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Doug "Pyro" Balmos
HiTech Creations

"If it's stupid but works, it's not stupid."

Westy · « **Reply #3 on:** February 28, 2000, 02:40:00 PM »

I know I've SEEN myself falling earthward after being shot up and I can often see the flame streaming backwards. I just can't recall ever seeing another plane on fire. Smoke, yes. But not fire. If it's there then it may be too small to see or a graphicsissue for me.
As for shooting out a gunner position being already implemented, thats good news. Granted I don't think I've done it yet but then again my aim isn't the greatest anyway. Is there a message that tells a gunner or the pilot, acting as gunner, that he/she has lost a gunning position?

-Westy

Cobra · « **Reply #4 on:** February 28, 2000, 03:05:00 PM »

Westy,
I've had the tail gunner and the ball turret shot out before. If you pull up the damage screen, Ctrl D, it will show that as damaged.

I think you can still jump into the position, it won't allow you to fire the guns though.

Swager · « **Reply #5 on:** February 28, 2000, 03:30:00 PM »

I have had gunner places shot out in a B17. Could not fire from them.

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JG2 "Richthofen"

"My Brother-In-Law used to work for the
telephone company"

Pilot Office Christopher Hart III
Hornet Squadron, France, May 1940
From Novel "A Piece Of Cake"

Terror · « **Reply #6 on:** February 28, 2000, 04:17:00 PM »

Quoted:
---
... Especially since many gunners stations were not armored in any way shape or form.
---

This is not entirly accurate. The B17G had armor plating in place for every position. It was mostly designed for protection from rear attack, but it was present. The B17 Op Manual rates the armor as able to deflect up to .50cal rounds. I will try to dig up the diagrams of armor plating in the B17G and post them. Even the ball turret gunner had armor plating protecting his back.

In the end though, I agree with your statement. Gunners are "soft" targets. With rounds bouncing around inside a bomber(not to mention shrapnel from the metal fuselage/armor), soft targets would get ripped up pretty quick, armor plating or not! Plus, 20mm rounds would punch through anything in the aircraft anyway!

Seeya!
Aaron "Terror" Edwards

Vermillion · « **Reply #7 on:** February 28, 2000, 05:53:00 PM »

Thanks Pyro, just showing my own stupidity again.

For the life of me, I can't remember being on fire ever, and I have had my share of being shot down. Smoke yes, like Westy said, can't remember seeing fire before on my or my enemy before.

On the buff issue I just need to fly them more then, since again it was something I hadn't noticed.

(yes Westy I did, just need to find you in the arena)

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure,
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"

LLv34_Snefens · « **Reply #8 on:** February 28, 2000, 10:04:00 PM »

I HAVE seen fire, but IMO it could need to be a bit more powerful, at least if for instance fuel/oil leaks occur and a fire is going on.
sort of like this:

Could also be good to have planes keep falling from sky even if the pilot is killed. Smoke trails all the way to ground ending in an explosion would look very cool.

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Vänr. Snefens
RO, Lentolaivue 34

Pongo · « **Reply #9 on:** February 28, 2000, 11:51:00 PM »

I usually attribute faild bails that had plenty of time to fire..It usually happens when my AC is smoking.

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Pongo
The Wrecking Crew

Dinger · « **Reply #10 on:** February 29, 2000, 02:20:00 AM »

Fires are there, but they're tiny. I remember flying a 17 against Daniko's 109. We dueled for 40 miles. At the end, he got a good pass in -- I busted his wing, he gave me a fuel leak. As he twirled earthward, I smirked, having won a hard fought battle. Then I went to outside view. What's this little thing on the wing?
*boom*
You need to get shot down more, Verm