Author Topic: Invasion stripes (Read 1230 times)

Guppy35 · « **on:** September 15, 2004, 03:24:22 PM »

Just an FYI to clarify on invasion stripes as I keep seeing interesting combinations that aren't correct.

Full invasion stripes, meaning the 3 white and 2 black stripes, went around the fuselages and wings of Allied aircraft (not B17s and 24s) on June 5, 1944. The full invasion stripes were modified with the removal of the upper fuselage and wing stripes in early to mid July 1944.

You WOULD NOT see a plane with full fuselage stripes and no wing stripes on top unless it was taken in mid repaint

In September 1944 the underwing stripes were ordered off so you would see planes with only the under fuselage stripes and no wing stripes. During this time you might see natural metal planes with only the black under fuselage stripes and no white.

Finally in January of 45 the planes with remaining fuselage stripes were ordered stripped of them as well.

So your options are

-All on top and bottom
-All on bottom none on top
-lower fuselage stripes, no wing stripes
-no stripes at all.

Dan/Slack

Kev367th · « **Reply #1 on:** September 20, 2004, 03:31:40 AM »

Slightly different for Typhoons -

It is possible to have lower DDay stripes on fuselage, but still with Typhoon ID stripes on lower wings.

Tiffie combinations -
Full invasion, fuselage and wing ,upper and lower.
Invasion lower fuselage, Typhood ID stripes lower wings.

Guppy35 · « **Reply #2 on:** September 20, 2004, 11:00:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
Slightly different for Typhoons -

It is possible to have lower DDay stripes on fuselage, but still with Typhoon ID stripes on lower wings.

Tiffie combinations -
Full invasion, fuselage and wing ,upper and lower.
Invasion lower fuselage, Typhood ID stripes lower wings.

Any chance of posting a photo of one of those Tiffies Kev?

I've never seen one with that combo where it has the 4 black and 3 white on the undersides of the wing and the fuselage D-Day stripes.

It's interesting that the pre-D-Day Tempests had the 4 black, 3 white stripes under the wings too, like the Tiffies.

The later Tiffie and Tempest photos I've seen don't show any stripes under the wings after the D-Day stripes came off.

Dan/Slack

Kev367th · « **Reply #3 on:** September 20, 2004, 12:11:43 PM »

I'll have a dig round.
If I remeber correctly the ID stripes for Tiffs and Temps were to distinguish them from 190s. That was the original intent of the white nose, but was felt it made them stand out too much.
The original ID stripes consisted of the black ones only. The ones with ID stripes and DDay fuselage stripes, the DDay ones were on the lower fuselage only.

Guppy35 · « **Reply #4 on:** September 20, 2004, 12:52:44 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
I'll have a dig round.
If I remeber correctly the ID stripes for Tiffs and Temps were to distinguish them from 190s. That was the original intent of the white nose, but was felt it made them stand out too much.
The original ID stripes consisted of the black ones only. The ones with ID stripes and DDay fuselage stripes, the DDay ones were on the lower fuselage only.

Gonna disagree on the only black ID stripes. Clearly the photo evidence from 43 shows the 4 narrow black and 3 wide white stripes on the undersides of the Tiffie wings. Most definatetly to help seperate them from the 190s.

Ironically the Tiffie drivers had a strong dislike for the clipped wing Spits, thinking they were 109s

But if you can track down a photo to post showing the 4 narrow black ID stripes with the wide white ones, and the lower fuselage D-Day 2 black 3 white stripes that would be great

I can't find anything close in my Tiffie stuff.

Dan/Slack

Kev367th · « **Reply #5 on:** September 21, 2004, 05:30:28 PM »

Try here
http://www.cbrnp.com/profiles/quarter2/typhoons-1.htm

Guppy35 · « **Reply #6 on:** September 21, 2004, 07:39:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
Try here
http://www.cbrnp.com/profiles/quarter2/typhoons-1.htm

Thanks Kev. I'd still like to see a photo to back that up though. I dug through all the Tiffie stuff I could find and couldn't find anything that showed it.

Not saying I don't believe it, just wanting some visible proof to support it.

Very nice Hurri II skins in the other thread BTW. Really like the SEAC one.

Dan/Slack

Kev367th · « **Reply #7 on:** September 21, 2004, 08:08:43 PM »

This lists ref for the xm-m black only underside stripes.

http://www.eaglestrikeproductions.com/cgi-bin/amddecals.pl?scale=48&setid=372&dbs=aeromaster&pgs=2&currpg=2&dclimg=ad48372&prfx=

Thanks comment about hurris, only prob with the SEAC one was the tail band, you can't do a hurri without it

.

And of course Tucks one should have a black underside stbd wing, not possible either.

MnkyMeat · « **Reply #8 on:** September 22, 2004, 12:47:38 PM »

Tyffy stripes....

If i remeber corectly ,, , typhoons had underwing striped before the D-Day invasion. . . . because friendly fire problems. . .. trigger happy spit pilots mistaking them for FW190's.

is this correct? ,,, i remember reading about it a while ago,,,

if you want photo examples... go the Google and in the image search type in "Hawker Typhoon"
you should get plenty of hits.

~~MonkeyMeat~~

Guppy35 · « **Reply #9 on:** September 22, 2004, 01:30:41 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MnkyMeat
Tyffy stripes....

If i remeber corectly ,, , typhoons had underwing striped before the D-Day invasion. . . . because friendly fire problems. . .. trigger happy spit pilots mistaking them for FW190's.

is this correct? ,,, i remember reading about it a while ago,,,

if you want photo examples... go the Google and in the image search type in "Hawker Typhoon"
you should get plenty of hits.

~~MonkeyMeat~~

The Tiffie stripes pre-D-Day were for exactly what you refer to. Spits bounced Tiffies thinking they were 190s. Tiffies bounced clipped wing Spits, thinking they were 109s.

Go figure

Dan/Slack

oboe · « **Reply #10 on:** October 16, 2004, 06:56:57 PM »

Guppy, have you got any info regarding the 352nd stripe patterns? Osprey Mustang Aces of the 8th AF shows Glennon Moran's '51C with underside invasion stripes on wing but none under the fuselage...

That much is clear from the profile; I can't see the upper wing surface but I doubt it would have invasion stripes on top of wing too while not at all on fuselage?

Thanks!

Guppy35 · « **Reply #11 on:** October 16, 2004, 11:24:03 PM »

The "Blue nosers" would have had the same orders for the application of D-Day stripes as the rest of the fighter groups. I grabbed my copy of that book and note that it says he was flying that aircraft in September 44 yet it also says it replaced his first B that was lost in April of 44. I'm betting the photo they based it on was from late June 44 and they messed up on forgetting the fuselage stripes. You'd have the option to do full stripes on both the wing and fuselage or the half stripes on lower wing and fuselage and you'd be right both times.

It's the danger of the profiles. If you look at the 4th birds there is a profile of Willard Millikan's Malcom hooded B model with full invasion stripes, yet he was shot down and made a POW in May 44 before Invasion stripes were applied. That kite never had em!

Dan/Slack