Be able to shut Combat Trim off for one axis.

[BnZs]

I think it would be useful to be able to trim nose down (to account for flaps and to give a more stable slightly nose-heavy "feel") while simultaneously being able to leave CT in effect for the rudders and ailerons. Thank you, that is all.  

[Saxman]

I'd like to see trim remodeled into ACTUALLY being the trim tabs being adjusted, rather than adjusting the entire control surface.

Oh, and remove trim axes that weren't present in the actual aircraft (IE, IIRC the 190s didn't have rudder trim IRL).

[Someguy63]

+1 To this!

[FLS]

I'd like to see trim remodeled into ACTUALLY being the trim tabs being adjusted, rather than adjusting the entire control surface.

How would that be different? When you change the trim it moves the control surface.

[BnZs]

Oh, and remove trim axes that weren't present in the actual aircraft (IE, IIRC the 190s didn't have rudder trim IRL).

190 pilots actually had their butt in seats feeling how the plane was flying, which we don't have, and they had rudder pedals, which a lot of us don't have. Combat trim was invented because trimming in a sim is way more of headache than in a real airplane right? Here is the post in which Hitech explains why he invented CT:

The first facts you must understand about trim is that there is no way possible to
Make it work like a real plane. The joystick interaction with the controls is a complete different
Mechanical setup.

In a real plane you would be holding the stick back to maintain level flight.
You would then turn the trim knob to relieve any pressure on the stick, with out the stick moving.
With a computer joystick this simply isn't possible. When you let go of the stick it will always go back to center.
Even force feedback sticks do not have the ability of adjusting stick spring center.


2nd problem is stick feel.
When pyro and I originally did some early models for CK we tried setting real settings for elevator deflection.

For example the spit's stick setup is capable of generating about 38 deg. AOA, and the plane stalls at around 17 degs AOA.
This would equate to pulling the stick less then halfway back would stall the plane.

Now from a purely mathematical realistic point of view that’s the way the plane was set up it should be the same in the sim,

But if you step back and look at things another way, what did the plane feel like to fly and
Does it "FEEL" realistic things change.

When flying a real aircraft I since very little stick movement,
I perceive much more on how hard i'm pulling, how much i'm grunting, how much the stick is vibrating, then how much I’m moving the stick.
To accomplish some of this we use the stall horn, now the stall horn is NOT realistic by any means, but some method is needed to give
You the same realistic feed back from the plane that you get in real life so in the perception since it is very realistic.

Therefore you are forced to choose a method that works and gives the perception of reality.

We chose to setup controls that will let you stall with full stick deflection unless you are limited by control force.

Now comes the trim problem.
At slower speeds where do you scale the stick movement from and how do you add in trim.
The method we have been using was to always give you x degs. Of elevator travel then
just add that deg to the current trim deg.
This leads to problems if you are slow with nose down trim you could no longer pull the plane to the edge of stall.
This isn't how real planes fly in the slower flight envelope,
Very few planes could you not generate enough stick force to pull into stall at slower speeds.
This over sight is why people use trim when in a slower turn fight and hence get an advantage by giving more up trim at slower speeds.

Under 1.04 we have change the control setup slightly. We now scale the elevator/stick deflection to the same ending
Angle no matter where the trim tab is positioned.

There is another misconception that trimming your plane perfectly gives you a flight advantage.
Trimming your plane or just holding controls and pressing rudder to center the ball is exactly the same thing.
And the plane will fly the same under both methods.

Now onto how the combat trim works. It's not a perfect trimming system.
Best way to describe how it works is take your plane and trim it constantly in a dive from slow speed to high speed.
Now make a table of trim positions at all speeds.
All the combat trim system does is use this table to set the trims based on your speed.
Everything else still functions the same, you pull back on the stick you still get adverse yaw, you turn you still will need to add in rudder.
You change throttle settings the plane still rolls do to torque. Add flaps trim settings will be completely different and the system won't account for it.
Drop gear you will again be out of trim. If you’re climbing or diving your plane is still out of trim.

In the end all the combat trim system does is keep you in a trim envelope that you can override with normal controls.

As to how its controls work first there is a key to toggle it on or off.
2nd touching manual trim will always turn it off.
3rd there is a setting to weather you want it to always be on or off when coming out of existing auto pilots mode.

Now as to are we loosing sight of pleasing the realism crowd?

That is for you to judge.

At the same time we are adding things like combat trim, we are also adding things like icons now disappear
If an enemy plane is behind a canopy rail, under wings, your low 6, behind hill's or under the nose excreta.

We have spent a lot of time researching and changing pieces of the flight model that we were not
Hitting real world numbers. Now these changes really won't effect the "GAME" much, they will change tactics used.
Things like horizontal to vertical transitions will be much more effective. Things like lead turns will be more effect because
After a 180-deg turn you will have more speed left to take the shot on the b&z bogie.
But in the end neither combat trim nor the flight model effect the game play in any way.
It's still who can fly the plane to the edge, knows ACM best, who know his planes abilities vs. his opponents, who can shoot well,
Who can chose his fights or which plane to shoot first.
All these things still make the best pilots what they are.


HiTech

[bustr]

I think it would be useful to be able to trim nose down (to account for flaps and to give a more stable slightly nose-heavy "feel") while simultaneously being able to leave CT in effect for the rudders and ailerons. Thank you, that is all.  

Not a bad idea and it could be mapped to another key as a CT subset toggle.

CT off\CT on\CT+Pitch off

After reading Hitech's 2000 explanation for CT, this is not any different in your intent towards personal ride control than Hitech's original reasoning. After 14 years, some evolution is warranted visa very long term testing under game conditions. In practical use, this may save a lot of newbies from lawndarts if they learn how to make use of it sooner than later. Or now the game will get that much more complicated for some.

[FLS]

Nice quote BnZs, I don't think I've seen that before. So trim up to turn better actually was a thing once. The part about limiting elevator travel may answer questions I've had about stalled and post departure handling and why we can't do a better Lomcevak.

[BnZs]

I have a button mapped to my stick that I plug a good bit of nose-down trim with as soon as a maneuvering fight becomes apparent in a flaps-dependent plane. It could be made as simple as that I suppose.

Not a bad idea and it could be mapped to another key as a CT subset toggle.

CT off\CT on\CT+Pitch off

After reading Hitech's 2000 explanation for CT, this is not any different in your intent towards personal ride control than Hitech's original reasoning. After 14 years, some evolution is warranted visa very long term testing under game conditions. In practical use, this may save a lot of newbies from lawndarts if they learn how to make use of it sooner than later. Or now the game will get that much more complicated for some.

[bustr]

The first spit14 I ever flew lawn darted. The nose just got heavier the faster I went. Same for the first 262.

Back then I didn't know, just like most new players, how CT worked or even that it existed. Here in the present, with more experience, I agree with this modification to CT. There are now times I want auto trim in real time for my ailerons and rudder but, my pitch nose heavy as a constant. I think many players who jabo frequently will appreciate this. I can see it as an aid to gunnery with the B-25H,  IL2, and Ju-87G2.

I've tried the key that fixes a snapshot of your current trim settings then every time after when you hit it, you are returned to those settings. I couldn't flush the flag for it to return it to a first time state every time I spawned in a new plane. I was never sure I was even using it correctly. The how to was kind of arcane even for this game with so many poorly documented things.