Cherry Picking Evasive

[kj714]

Here's the situation:

You see a high 51 above you and he's just waiting to c-pick. He starts his dive on ya. What's the best evasive? what I'm doing now is to go into a hard spiral down edging on black out with target view lock on so I can see when he gets past. I try to do this losing as little alt as possible. When he blows past and goes for the regain on alt I either deck it to get out or go into a shallow climb away from the cpicker to increase distance and get some alt back on him.  

Any other ideas?

[Reschke]

Let anyone get real committed to the attack and then just inside of 1k you break hard and then split S out. Yes you give up altitude to them but you do increase the distance and have a better chance at breaking the stalemate you were in. Once you do that just get your head back on a swivel and make sure the guy didn't try to reverse on you while you were in the Split S and starting your shallow climb out of the cellar.

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by kj714
Here's the situation:

You see a high 51 above you and he's just waiting to c-pick. He starts his dive on ya. What's the best evasive? what I'm doing now is to go into a hard spiral down edging on black out with target view lock on so I can see when he gets past. I try to do this losing as little alt as possible. When he blows past and goes for the regain on alt I either deck it to get out or go into a shallow climb away from the cpicker to increase distance and get some alt back on him.  

Any other ideas?

Use his speed against him. The best thing to do is pass under his nose with a split-S and force him to pull G's to try and track you. If he has a decent roll rate he can roll inverted to track if he chops throttle drastically, but then you pull up and at an angle causing him to overshoot while maintaing most of your altitude and gaining some E in the process. I would only do the sprial dive if you notice him too late to suck him into the rolling reversal. THe idea is not only to evade his pass but work to equalize E states. The best way to accomplish this is to force overshoots by making him overcommit and dump E. No smart cherry picker is going to blow much E on a spiral diver, he'll just sit on his perch, shadow you, not let you alt, and probably make more passes.

Zazen

[kj714]

I've used the split S before, but I only used it when I know I'm gonna deck it and run. I guess I fell into the spiral thing cause I felt it gave me more options, but some guys see read it well. Good suggestion though, thanks! If you are in the 51 what's the best option to counter? Chop throttle and oblique turn to get on the 6 shot?

Zazen - that puts you on top with him having to climb past you or extend out, so you just follow him right?

[Arlo]

Pop flares.

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by kj714
I've used the split S before, but I only used it when I know I'm gonna deck it and run. I guess I fell into the spiral thing cause I felt it gave me more options, but some guys see read it well. Good suggestion though, thanks! If you are in the 51 what's the best option to counter? Chop throttle and oblique turn to get on the 6 shot?

Zazen - that puts you on top with him having to climb past you or extend out, so you just follow him right?

If I were the 51 and someone did what I described I would not follow him through the reversal, I would pull up, perform an immelman hope he pulled up toward me, stall him out and wack him as he falls off. If he didn't pull up toward me I would myself split-S with lead pusuit in the hopes he goes vertical. It would usually be a mistake to follow his defensive manuever unless you had a clear manueverability advantage as you are sacraficing alot of E to get that angle.

Zazen

[Steve]

kj, before you split S, ask the 51 if it's me in it.  Split S on me and I'll get you first pass.

The best thing to do is pass under his nose with a split-S and force him to pull G's to try and track you. If he has a decent roll rate he can roll inverted to track if he chops throttle drastically, but then you pull up and

Well, I don't know how others do it, but I'd see the split S coming and use negative G's to get a shot, kill the guy and go happily about my business.  Forget that fancy roll inverted pull hard G fancy pilot stuff.. too complicated for me.  

[GODO]

kj714, being the P51 a decent pilot/shooter (he will not dive very fast on u ...), you can do just NONE to evade effectively the attack. But if you keep fast enough and with good separation, you can try pointing on him when he dives to force a vertical HO.

[Shamus]

What are you flying?

shamus

[Kweassa]

Turn into him and pass under his nose as he attacks.

  Only a handful of the best of the best pilots, can force a shot in, in that situation. Repeat that a few times and the P-51, will soon have to decide whether he will; a) run away, or b) commit himself to a closer fight.

 If he does neither, he will usually get caught in his next zoom climb and get shot down.

[Glasses]

Just hide in the bushes. It works well.

[Hammy]

If he gets you
Blame Him --->

[Octavius]

Depending on what plane you're in, let him get within 7-800 then break very hard into a tight barrel roll (or snap roll if you can control it).  If he's not cautious, and again, depending on your ride (and your relativel E states), you have a small window to open fire on him.

[beet1e]

Originally posted by Steve
kj, before you split S, ask the 51 if it's me in it.  Split S on me and I'll get you first pass.

Don't worry, Steve's plane is easy to spot - it has a picture of a cat on the fuselage.

Sorry Steve - just trawling.

[Steve]

It's a big "E" ....     easymode