Author Topic: Not impressed (Read 499 times)

Gunthr · « **Reply #15 on:** January 04, 2001, 10:54:00 AM »

When I first started sims 3 or 4 years ago I didn't know what stick to buy, and I figured I couldn't go wrong with a stick from a big company. So I bought an MS Sidewinder 3d pro. I was very hard on it and eventually broke it. I called MS and they immediately sent me a new one with no quibbling. (didn't even have to send the broken stick back) I keep that replacement for backup. I then bought a MS Sidewinder PPro USB which I've been using ever since. It's a fine stick, very accurate, and a dream to set up. I can't figure out why people seem to look down their noses at this "twisty" stick. I never have to recalibrate. I don't know what "pots" are. I don't know what "spikes" are. And I know if I ever do have a problem, a single phone call will have a hassle free quick replacement on the way. It's really been trouble free, and I'd recommend it to anyone. Getting used to the twist rudder is easy. I'm pretty happy with it.

Gunthr

Westy · « **Reply #16 on:** January 04, 2001, 11:05:00 AM »

"I was very hard on it and eventually broke it. I called MS and they immediately sent me a new one with no quibbling"

The reason I dislike MS stuff so much was I had the opposite experience. Not that the stick is an All-In-One type with a twisty handle. My stick died sitting on the desktop barely used after 4 mos and they refused to honour the warranty because it had been discontinued. It took me two months and only after getting a hold of a manager did they finally send me a "demo - not for resale" Precision Pro in return. I gave it to my brother for Christmas, bought CH gear and swore to never use MS stuff unless (Like Windows) I absolutely had to.

-Westy

Ripsnort · « **Reply #17 on:** January 04, 2001, 11:08:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Pepino:
I have a Saitek X36 combo (USB). I switched from a very old F-16 figthterstick, since I could not find a fix for the chipset issue that made them unusable with fast motherboards (basically, you can not program buttons).

I find F-16 a LOT more sensitive and nice to fly with, and I would buy another one, but the price tag on X36 is unbeatable. Overall, quality is better with F-16, but Saitek gear is not particularly bad.

Just my € 0.02

Pepe

I agree 100% with this assessment, and I've been very happy with my X36 combo, it certainly has helped me in ATA combat. No more micro-spikes! (USB Baby, only way to go!)

------------------

~Death Rattlers~
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If you cannot do something well,
learn to enjoy doing it poorly!

SKurj · « **Reply #18 on:** January 04, 2001, 11:09:00 AM »

Twisty stick causes gamer Carpal Tunnel Syndrome... Next Oprah!

I find the twisty stick so unprecise (as a rudder) as to be real annoying. I also use an MS SW Ppro USB, but now I use pedals with it. If you've never had pedals.. you'll be amazed. I use TM Supersport racing pedals, which at the time I purchased was $39 USD with a wheel!

AKskurj

[This message has been edited by SKurj (edited 01-04-2001).]

fscott · « **Reply #19 on:** January 04, 2001, 12:06:00 PM »

Half of my requirements which I forgot to mention was that I like to at least somewhat feel like I'm flying a WW2 bird. If all it takes to move the stick around is your pinky then it doesn't feel like I'm flying. If there's a good amount of pressure there and my arm gets tired then that just makes it all the more realistic. Flying with the CH believe it or not actually CHANGED my feeling fo the game! Suddenly it felt more like an arcade shootemup game because I was using this light touch precision "gamestick." Suddenly the feeling of trying to pull my La5 out of a 500mph dive felt, well..arcadish.. just use my finger to pull back on the CH stick.

I dunno, some talk about the precision.. and lining up the target with a little subtle push here and a little pull there... I'm not so sure WW2 combat was this easy where they could put one finger on the stick and "precisely" line up their target with little correction here and there. I've pulled around on a few of the warbird sticks while they weren't flying and I couldn't imagine the difficulty and heaviness of the stick when there's air travelling over the surfaces. I doubt they were easing the stick around.

Anyway, that's why the CH stick made it feel arcadish. At least for now the Suncom is the only stick on the market that has decent resistance. I think most are easy to pull because to make a real tuff pull like with the TM line you would have to actualy put some time and resources into making a stick that won't break under the pressure. Don't eat what they are feeding you! You all are being forcefed these arcadish joysticks that sell to the masses!

Enuff rambling. I still can't see what makes the CH stick worth $80 new. It's certainly not in the materials.

fscott

Wanker · « **Reply #20 on:** January 04, 2001, 12:20:00 PM »

Well, I both agree and disagree with you, fscott.

I used a Talon for all of my flying until I got heavily into WB, and wanted to have a rudder on the stick. This led me from an MS-Sidewinder joystick, to a Saitek X36 combo(blechy POS!) and finally to the CH line of products. While I definately prefer the feel of the Talon, there has yet to be a full HOTAS setup easier to setup and more stable than the CH Pro Throttle/Pro Pedals/Janes Combatstick.

So, I sacrifice the feel for the ease of use and the reliability. Can't wait for the USB Pro Throttle to show up so I can re-buy my setup in USB!

kidcol · « **Reply #21 on:** January 04, 2001, 01:31:00 PM »

Attn: Skurj

I tried asking in another forum about setup configs for the twisty stick/ no pedals, but got answers that basically said: "get peds". So, Ill try another tack. Are the peds you are using with the MSPP run thru the gameport? And if so, did you have any trouble setting them up or with spiking?

Thanks,

kidcol
VMF111

Stiglr · « **Reply #22 on:** January 04, 2001, 03:54:00 PM »

Another thing about Talons: Suncom the company is GREAT about support for bad pots and shorted controls, porked wires, etc. You box it up, ship it back, and they send you a new one. Same with throttles.

Now, I've got two of each, and if one goes bad, I have a backup to rotate to while one is in the repair loop.

Suncom has a USB stick, but not a USB throttle; it seems the multicontroller thing is really stumping them, and they were supposed to have one out this time LAST YEAR. No mention on their site at all whether it's close, rumored, cancelled, whatever. It's bumming me out, because I want to go ALL USB soon, and I'm wanting to stay with Suncom. But eventually, I'll tire of waiting and in that case, I'll go all CH. Their products are also pretty solid.

Wingnut_0 · « **Reply #23 on:** January 04, 2001, 04:09:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by SKurj:
Twisty stick causes gamer Carpal Tunnel Syndrome... Next Oprah!

I use TM Supersport racing pedals, which at the time I purchased was $39 USD with a wheel!

AKskurj

[This message has been edited by SKurj (edited 01-04-2001).]

Skurj,

I do have carpal Tunnel flare up's from years of working punching keyboards and typewriters...you said u use a racing set? I've never asked but didn't know if a set of racing style pedals would do a very good job.

I don't really care for all the sliding, toe brake style features..I just want something that I don't have to use my wrist with.

------------------
Wingnut
Luftjagerkorps

The quality of the box matters little. Success depends upon the man who sits in it - Baron Manfred von Richthofen

[This message has been edited by Wingnut_0 (edited 01-04-2001).]

SKurj · « **Reply #24 on:** January 04, 2001, 05:46:00 PM »

Well, this only works in games which can support multiple controllers and those which can support both USB and gameport controllers at the same time. I've used this setup with SBK, CFS2, and Aces High. It doesn't work in games like Aw3, Redbaron2, Crimson skies.

I simply have the wheel installed per instructions that came with it. Its a thrustmaster supersport, hooked up to the gameport of my soundcard (Awe64 value). The stick is just hooked up USB.
The pedals are configureable to use Single or dual axis. Single is all thats neccessary for rudder anyways. I haven't noticed any spiking at all with my setup.
The only problem I had when I originally signed on to Aces for my 2 week trial, was that the pedal axis was reversed. At the time there was no "reverse axis" option in calibration. I have got used to "pushing" the nose of the aircraft. When I push the right pedal it pushes the nose left. Now you can reverse the axis such that it is no longer a problem.

The pedals that came with this wheel are as good or better than most I've seen with cheap racing sets. They don't have a huge amount of travel, and they are much closer together than your typical rudder pedals.
Huge improvement over twisty stix no matter how you look at it tho.

I guess the only downside to this setup, is what if you want to go play Crimson skies fer abit. Well, all I do is remove the wheel in control panel, gaming options, and play. When I want to go back to Aces, I just add the TM wheel setup again. With the TM the wheel MUST be device #1 or it won't owrk, but thats a minor detail.

Hope this helps

AKskurj

Mighty1 · « **Reply #25 on:** January 05, 2001, 09:26:00 AM »

I have the same stick Betown and I love it.

I use the SW pro with CH throttle and peddles.

I tried the x36 when it first came out but the pots went out within 2 months and I couldn't get them to replace them. I ended up with 2 sets of them and they are both on the shelve with bad pots.

After hearing some of you guys talking about the new USB x36 I decided to buy another set and now IT'S on the shelf. Not bad pots but I just didn't like the feel of it.

Robert · « **Reply #26 on:** January 05, 2001, 10:05:00 AM »

check this out !!
first link shows the modes i made to my joystick. if you want to see the complete set of pictures on the simulator i've been working on go to the second link.

http://rwy0.tripod.com/ahfilms/simm6.html
http://home.midsouth.rr.com/rwysairwar/

RWY out!!

Torque · « **Reply #27 on:** January 05, 2001, 11:52:00 AM »

RWY that rocks buddy no wonder you kicked my butt in TA.!!!

Torque · « **Reply #28 on:** January 05, 2001, 11:57:00 AM »

RWY that rocks buddy no wonder you kicked my butt in TA.!!!

AKSneaky · « **Reply #29 on:** January 05, 2001, 12:13:00 PM »

Hey Skurj I thought I was the only one silly enuff to use driving pedals to fly with. Before I got the Sidewinder Ff twisty stick I used my TM T-2 pedals and had to teach myself the 'kick the nose over' routine. As for carpal tunnel, my wrist now cracks all the time from months of flying the Snipe in Red Baron. Had to give up the Snipe because of it and have made Aces my primary sim. I find I don't use rudders as heavily as I did in the WW1 sims. I have a set of CH pedals SWulfe sent me and a set of TM pedals DJV sent me so's I can trade off from my twisty stick, but I am so used to the Sidewinder set up that I always go back to it.

AKSneaky (AKSneeky)
Brigade Operations Officer
Arabian Knights