Author Topic: 9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!  (Read 2155 times)

Offline TheDudeDVant

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2429
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #45 on: September 10, 2004, 09:53:26 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Well what do you think could have been done to in August 2001 to stop 911 based on the vague memo:

Bin Laden Determined to Strike in USA..

If you are criticizing bush on the assumption that nothing was done you must have some idea that something could have been done based on that info to prevent 911 during august 2001.

What is that?


What was done specifically by our president to follow up this 'vague' threat  after receiving the PDB memo?

Edit: obviously the CIA didnt pull this outta their ass, what follow ups where ordered/performed by our president?
« Last Edit: September 10, 2004, 09:56:43 AM by TheDudeDVant »

Offline GRUNHERZ

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13413
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #46 on: September 10, 2004, 10:00:54 AM »
I dont know, apparently unlike you I'm not privvy to the white house?

Obviously your assumption is that nothing was done. Well prove it...



And again I ask what do you think could have bneen done in august 2001 to stop 911 based on the follwing info:

Bin Laden determined to strike in USA..

That statemt only gives two points of info:

1: Bin Laden wants to attack - NOT that he is  carrying it out or actively planning a specific attcak

2: He wants to attcak in the USA.


The satenment does not give;

NOT EVEN A GENERAL TIMELINE

NO GENERAL LOCATION

NO TARGET TYPE

NO ATTACK TYPE

Offline TheDudeDVant

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2429
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #47 on: September 10, 2004, 10:24:52 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
I dont know, apparently unlike you I'm not privvy to the white house?

Obviously your assumption is that nothing was done. Well prove it...


Would you believe had he done something or attempted to do anything the White House would have let the world know?? I mean it was very near a year, perhaps more, after 9/11 that the country found out about the Aug. 6 PDB.

I will tell you what he did.. Aug 7th the president left Washington for Crawford, Tx for a 30day holiday..

Seeing how the White House would want to defend this issue, wouldnt it be logical that they would let the country know the steps they took to attempt to avoid 9/11? Instead, Rice lies about the memo stating that it said nothing about the attack in the country.

How many 'threating' PDB that specifically list a threat from a specific group do you think passes over the presidents desk?

We need a President Truman back in office. At least he took responsibility if something went wrong..

Offline GRUNHERZ

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13413
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #48 on: September 10, 2004, 10:34:31 AM »
What did the memo say Kappa, beyonf that Bin Laden was determined to attack somewhere on this map in an unspecified timeframe:



Was he goind to accack public busses?
Blow up airplanes?
Blow up shoppiong centers?
Movie theatersa?
Hotels?
stock exchanges?
Nuclear plants?
Bomb Airprt?
Bomb the new years ceremony?
Sinper attack?

etc.. etc..  etc..

Offline Lizking

  • Parolee
  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2502
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #49 on: September 10, 2004, 10:34:43 AM »
Here is the text of the Aug 6 PDB:


Clandestine, foreign government, and media reports indicate bin Laden since 1997 has wanted to conduct terrorist attacks in the U.S. Bin Laden implied in U.S. television interviews in 1997 and 1998 that his followers would follow the example of World Trade Center bomber Ramzi Yousef and "bring the fighting to America."

 
After U.S. missile strikes on his base in Afghanistan in 1998, bin Laden told followers he wanted to retaliate in Washington, according to a . . . service.

An Egyptian Islamic Jihad (E.I.J.) operative told an . . . service at the same time that bin Laden was planning to exploit the operative's access to the U.S. to mount a terrorist strike.

The millennium plotting in Canada in 1999 may have been part of bin Laden's first serious attempt to implement a terrorist strike in the U.S. Convicted plotter Ahmed Ressam has told the F.B.I. that he conceived the idea to attack Los Angeles International Airport himself, but that bin Laden lieutenant Abu Zubaydah encouraged him and helped facilitate the operation. Ressam also said that in 1998 Abu Zubaydah was planning his own U.S. attack.

Ressam says bin Laden was aware of the Los Angeles operation.

Although bin Laden has not succeeded, his attacks against the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania in 1998 demonstrate that he prepares operations years in advance and is not deterred by setbacks. Bin Laden associates surveilled our embassies in Nairobi and Dar es Salaam as early as 1993, and some members of the Nairobi cell planning the bombings were arrested and deported in 1997.

Al Qaeda members — including some who are U.S. citizens — have resided in or traveled to the U.S. for years, and the group apparently maintains a support structure that could aid attacks. Two Al Qaeda members found guilty in the conspiracy to bomb our embassies in East Africa were U.S. citizens, and a senior E.I.J. member lived in California in the mid-1990's.

A clandestine source said in 1998 that a bin Laden cell in New York was recruiting Muslim-American youth for attacks.

We have not been able to corroborate some of the more sensational threat reporting, such as that from a . . . service in 1998 saying that bin Laden wanted to hijack a U.S. aircraft to gain the release of "Blind Sheik" Omar Abdel Rahman and other U.S.-held extremists.

Nevertheless, F.B.I. information since that time indicates patterns of suspicious activity in this country consistent with preparations for hijackings or other types of attacks, including recent surveillance of federal buildings in New York.

The F.B.I. is conducting approximately 70 full field investigations throughout the U.S. that it considers bin Laden-related. C.I.A. and the F.B.I. are investigating a call to our embassy in the U.A.E. in May saying that a group of bin Laden supporters was in the U.S. planning attacks with explosives

Offline Lizking

  • Parolee
  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2502
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #50 on: September 10, 2004, 10:35:51 AM »
Now, other than telling the FBI to "keep after it"  What exactly do you propose he should have done, based on that memo?  Spit it out, and use all your hindsight in doing so, Dude.

Offline GRUNHERZ

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13413
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #51 on: September 10, 2004, 10:37:28 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Lizking
Now, other than telling the FBI to "keep after it"  What exactly do you propose he should have done, based on that memo?  Spit it out, and use all your hindsight in doing so, Dude.


Bush should have arrested Mohammed Atta!!!  Why didnt he?

Offline TheDudeDVant

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2429
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #52 on: September 10, 2004, 10:44:38 AM »
What did he do Grun? Damn man.. answer it...


Quote
The F.B.I. is conducting approximately 70 full field investigations throughout the U.S. that it considers bin Laden-related. C.I.A. and the F.B.I. are investigating a call to our embassy in the U.A.E. in May saying that a group of bin Laden supporters was in the U.S. planning attacks with explosives


Where more FBI agents added to the case? You guys do understand that the 70 field investigations represent only 70 FBI agents assigned to AQ??

Where the American people warned? They have NO trouble warning us today.

What steps were taken? Who gives a damn what I would have or would do now.. WHAT DID OUR PRESIDENT do?!?!

lol the more you guys beat around this, the funnier it is. I will say AGAIN, the president could have taken action that may or may not have stopped 9/11.. I'm asking specifically what steps were taken to attempt to stop BinLaden from attacking INSIDE the US?? Whether it could have been stopped is Moot, WHAT DID HE DO TO TRY TO STOP IT???

He is the President of the US. The US was attacked with no warning to the people. The government was warned. What did our government, president specifically, do to avoid this??
« Last Edit: September 10, 2004, 11:46:06 AM by TheDudeDVant »

Offline GRUNHERZ

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13413
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #53 on: September 10, 2004, 10:46:07 AM »
Sorry Kappa I missed that white house meeting so I dont know, would you care to fill me in?

Offline ASTAC

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1654
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #54 on: September 10, 2004, 10:47:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by TheDudeDVant
that was not my question. I didnt ask what 'could' have been done.. I asked what 'was' done....


The simple fact is..None of us are privvy to what goes on in the white house, FBI, or CIA...so none of us knows if "nothing" was done.  Another fact..Little could have been done to prevent it...so it's safe to say it would have happened regardless one way or another.
That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety

Offline ASTAC

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1654
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #55 on: September 10, 2004, 10:50:26 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by TheDudeDVant
What did he do Grun? Damn man.. answer it...


 

Where more FBI agents added to the case? You guys do understand that the 70 field investigations represent only 70 FBI agents assigned to AQ??

Where the American people warned? They have NO trouble warning us today.

What steps were taken? Who gives a damn what I would have or would do now.. WHAT DID OUR PRESIDENT do?!?!

lol the more you guys beat around this, the funnier it is. I will say AGAIN, the president could have taken action that may or may not have stopped 9/11.. I'm asking specifically what steps were taken to attempt to stop BinLaden from attacking INSIDE the US?? Whether it could have been stopped is MUTE, WHAT DID HE DO TO TRY TO STOP IT???

He is the President of the US. The US was attacked with no warning to the people. The government was warned. What did our government, president specifically, do to avoid this??


After having had a serious attack like that on US soil of course we are warned. The American people want to be warned. Before all this less than 20% of Americans were concerned about terrorist attacks. No one cared to hear about it before.
That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety

Offline TheDudeDVant

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2429
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #56 on: September 10, 2004, 11:00:36 AM »
wow guys.. such blind loyalty...

In times of war or peace, when concerned with external threats to our country, we the people look to our president to make the right choices for our mutual protection. How can you guys sit there with a sane mind and say that our president is not responsible for his country being attacked? Those numbers add up in Neo-con world? I dont care who is president, if the country is blindsided on their watch, they are responsible. How is that even questionable? Whether the attacks could or could not have been stopped is not the point. The point is nothing was done differently on Aug7th than was done on Aug5th. Our leaders did nothing. You guys can hide behind the, 'we were not privy to such information from the whitehouse' curtain if you must. But it is very obvious that had our president taken specific actions after the PDB on Aug 6th, we the people would know if for no other reason than the WhiteHouse attempting to cover ass.

Responsiblity does not make one a bad person. Rather, IMHO, he would be twice the man if he'd owe up to just one mistake. This one in particular. Whether it is soley his fault is not the point, the point is he is our leader hence he should attempt to act like one and take the responsibility..

LoL Grun, how would Capt. Kirk anwser that question of responsibility??

Offline TheDudeDVant

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2429
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #57 on: September 10, 2004, 11:03:07 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by ASTAC
After having had a serious attack like that on US soil of course we are warned. The American people want to be warned. Before all this less than 20% of Americans were concerned about terrorist attacks. No one cared to hear about it before.


That does not matter. It is our governments responsibility, no DUTY, to warn its citizens of clear and present danger..

Offline Mighty1

  • Parolee
  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1161
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #58 on: September 10, 2004, 11:04:32 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by TheDudeDVant
I will say now though, it could have been stopped. I dont know how, but its not my job. It could have been stopped, but not if we didnt try...


I love this...If you don't know how it could have been stopped then how the hell do you know it could have been?

You work for Kerry? I would have done things better than Bush...not going to tell you how but it would have been better.

In other words you don't know Jack but you still wanna Bltch!
I have been reborn a new man!

Notice I never said a better man.

Offline GRUNHERZ

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13413
9/11 is not Bush's fault!!!!
« Reply #59 on: September 10, 2004, 11:06:41 AM »
I dont know Kappa. Captain Kirk is a fictinal TV charcacter, I'm not suirte how thart character would react... Star Trek is a TV show...