Complaining how or what a person flys.

[Elfie]

I don't complain about how others play the game, it is after all thier 14.95. Otoh do I think some stuff is rediculous? I sure do. I'll give ya a couple examples.

The other night on Trinity I was flying a P-38 and this Mustang makes a high speed pass that I easily avoid. He zooms above me, dives in for another high speed pass that I evade, then he runs out of icon range. After several more high speed passes followed by him running out of icon range I turned on the film so I could see who it was later. A couple more high speed passes and he blows his advantage. Now he starts running to his own base. By this time I was so annoyed and wanted him dead so bad that I followed him home, perfectly willing to die in acks as long as I killed this guy.

As I approach the Rook base. I can see the 51 low, setting up a landing approach. I dive in and he sees me coming and trys to evade my pass.....I didnt miss and got out of acks unscathed  Interesting to note, that was the second time I killed this same guy in exactly the same way.

Why do I think this situation is rediculous? Because the 51 driver *could* have very easily bnz'd me to death with his initial alt/e advantage. I had no help near, and niether did he. He had no worries about more people jumping the fight. Instead of fighting he chose to run.

2nd situation: Again on Trinity, this time I am flying a Hurricane. Knights are pushing hard on a Rook base. By the time I get close to the Rook base, Knights outnumber the Rooks at this particular base about 3 - 1. Knights killed the vh (wtg Knights) and then killed ALL the fh's as well. A few minutes later we have a successful base capture. The Knights who killed the fh's had absolutely no interest in fighting for the base, they just wanted to take it uncontested. Why play a game online that is designed to pit human opponents against each other if all you want to do is take undefended bases?

After the base capture Knights were all saying WTG! to each other on vox. I said on vox....."Why are you guys slapping each other on the back for taking an undefended base? You guys act like you actually fought for this base when in fact you didnt. You guys should all be playing offline games if you dont want human competition and only want to fight computer AI."  Simply amazing how quiet the range channel got after that.

[kj714]

OMG!

"The Knights who killed the fh's had absolutely no interest in fighting for the base"

They stole the vulch! Bastiges.

[rod367th]

Originally posted by Elfie
I don't complain about how others play the game, it is after all thier 14.95. Otoh do I think some stuff is rediculous? I sure do. I'll give ya a couple examples.

The other night on Trinity I was flying a P-38 and this Mustang makes a high speed pass that I easily avoid. He zooms above me, dives in for another high speed pass that I evade, then he runs out of icon range. After several more high speed passes followed by him running out of icon range I turned on the film so I could see who it was later. A couple more high speed passes and he blows his advantage. Now he starts running to his own base. By this time I was so annoyed and wanted him dead so bad that I followed him home, perfectly willing to die in acks as long as I killed this guy.

As I approach the Rook base. I can see the 51 low, setting up a landing approach. I dive in and he sees me coming and trys to evade my pass.....I didnt miss and got out of acks unscathed  Interesting to note, that was the second time I killed this same guy in exactly the same way.

Why do I think this situation is rediculous? Because the 51 driver *could* have very easily bnz'd me to death with his initial alt/e advantage. I had no help near, and niether did he. He had no worries about more people jumping the fight. Instead of fighting he chose to run.


sounds like knights wanted base instead of vulches that you wanted . 1st story is absoulty how planes fought ww2. IF you think your in trouble get out go for help or home..................

2nd situation: Again on Trinity, this time I am flying a Hurricane. Knights are pushing hard on a Rook base. By the time I get close to the Rook base, Knights outnumber the Rooks at this particular base about 3 - 1. Knights killed the vh (wtg Knights) and then killed ALL the fh's as well. A few minutes later we have a successful base capture. The Knights who killed the fh's had absolutely no interest in fighting for the base, they just wanted to take it uncontested. Why play a game online that is designed to pit human opponents against each other if all you want to do is take undefended bases?

After the base capture Knights were all saying WTG! to each other on vox. I said on vox....."Why are you guys slapping each other on the back for taking an undefended base? You guys act like you actually fought for this base when in fact you didnt. You guys should all be playing offline games if you dont want human competition and only want to fight computer AI."  Simply amazing how quiet the range channel got after that.

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by Elfie

Why do I think this situation is rediculous? Because the 51 driver *could* have very easily bnz'd me to death with his initial alt/e advantage. I had no help near, and niether did he. He had no worries about more people jumping the fight. Instead of fighting he chose to run.

 

This is not necessarily true. I am about as good at the BnZ as anyone, but if the guy in the superior turning aircraft is any good he can avoid my passes almost indefinately. This is regardless of my inital advantage or how well I maintain my advantage. Turning is a defensive manuever in essence and if you are worth a crap at turning and have some modicum of SA you should not be 'BnZ'd to death' 1 vs. 1 ever....

Zazen

[Elfie]

Originally posted by kj714
OMG!

"The Knights who killed the fh's had absolutely no interest in fighting for the base"

They stole the vulch! Bastiges.

It has nothing to do with the vulch and everything to do with the fight. When you outnumber your opponent almost 3-1 in that area it's not going to be much of a fight, but at least it is A fight. And the fight is against human opponents, which is my reason for being here.

[Elfie]

Originally posted by Zazen13
This is not necessarily true. I am about as good at the BnZ as anyone, but if the guy in the superior turning aircraft is any good he can avoid my passes almost indefinately. This is regardless of my inital advantage or how well I maintain my advantage. Turning is a defensive manuever in essence and if you are worth a crap at turning and have some modicum of SA you should not be 'BnZ'd to death' 1 vs. 1 ever....

Zazen

Thats not true Zazen. In that same situation if I had been the 51  pilot attacking the 38, my initial goal is not an immediate kill, but to push him to the deck where he cant trade altitude for speed. Once you have done that, you can burn his remaining e and score the kill.

[kj714]

"Regardless of what anyone says, including you beet, they fighting in AH1 was on a different lvl than the fighting that goes on in AH2 now in the MA. Not only were there better fights back then but there were many more of them."

I agree with ya, was more fun before I think.  Still fun enough now though too. Who know's why the dynamics have changed really? The major changes in the game IMHO have been:

1. Fuel burn
2. fuel porkage
3. Maps?
4. Much harder to capture bases (my #1 guess of a reason for dynamics change)
5. better, harder to kill ack.
6. More difficult gv terrain.

I know the plane and gunnery characteristics changed too but that doesn't seem like it would have a lasting impact as people adapted to the new models pretty quickly.

As far as # 4 goes, I think it just changed things a lot now that 4 or 5 guys can't have a 50-50 shot at taking a base anymore.

Anyway, I won't gripe about the hordfights, everybody's doing it. And if everybody's doing it, that's a lot of guys doing it. It's a game for bangers, not real the real game... hehe, watched "Color of Money" over the weekend, good enough analogy though.

Anyway, the last few times I did a fighter sweep on my lonesome I got exactly nothing to show for it. So be it.

[Elfie]

"Regardless of what anyone says, including you beet, they fighting in AH1 was on a different lvl than the fighting that goes on in AH2 now in the MA. Not only were there better fights back then but there were many more of them."

Very true imo

[vorticon]

200 has become as bad as 1 use to be. Most argue fight on how others fly or politics.

not the point, the important thing is 200 is optional, 1 wasnt

[thebest1]

heheeheee rod said doggy poop

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by Elfie
Thats not true Zazen. In that same situation if I had been the 51  pilot attacking the 38, my initial goal is not an immediate kill, but to push him to the deck where he cant trade altitude for speed. Once you have done that, you can burn his remaining e and score the kill.

Possibly, but that's not really BnZ'ing, that's E fighting. Presumably a high P51 didn't climb up there just to get down to deck after one kill. More often than not he will give up before that point, I know I would in most situations. I want 3 or 4 kills for my time at least, not just 1. Ending up low and slow on the deck for my trouble with 10 minutes of re-alting to look forward to if I don't end up getting wacked in my vulnerable state by an opportunist is pretty dumb and a waste of time.

Zazen

[Elfie]

If you re-read the entire situation Zazen, there was no one else in the area, friendly or enemy, during or after the confrontation. In that situation, yes, you can bnz almost anyone to death. It was a perfect opportunity for a 1 - 1 fight and he chose to run away, pretty rediculous imo.

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by Elfie
If you re-read the entire situation Zazen, there was no one else in the area, friendly or enemy, during or after the confrontation. In that situation, yes, you can bnz almost anyone to death. It was a perfect opportunity for a 1 - 1 fight and he chose to run away, pretty rediculous imo.

It was when you engaged, but who's to say after he chases you down to deck and presumably kills you that he will not be bounced himself by an opportunistic enemy, there's always that risk. Getting an intelligent turn fighter down to deck takes alot of time, it's just not worth it in most siutations. There's always the chance when down on the deck the fight goes to angles, then the P51 is not even guarenteed a kill and has just blown all his altitude, is low and slow and extremely vulnerable.

Most people who are on a BnZ mission are not particularly looking for vintage film library fights, they are looking to surgically destroy as many enemy as they can per unit time and survive. Trying to reconclie that mode of  thinking with the average TnB pilot's idea of a 'successfull' mission is not going to happen...ever..

Zazen

[Elfie]

What you just arent getting Zazen is there were TWO planes in the entire area.....his and mine, no one showed up during or after. There was no one around to be *opportunistic*. If he flys his plane better than I fly mine he wont get into a tnb situation. Pushing a good tnb pilot to the deck can be a chore, I'll give ya that.

In this situation the 51 pilot was holding all the aces and all I had was a pair of deuces. Why not fight? Even if I do manage to get on his 6, his superior speed and superior high speed handling will allow him to get away.


IF there had been other planes in the area your reasoning would hold true but with the lack of other planes (both friendly and enemy) it fails to hold even a drop of water

[opus]

Too much game time. I think you can find problems in any game you spend over 60 hours a month on. If you're in the 30 hour area, you're probably still having fun.