Author Topic: Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end  (Read 2870 times)

Offline Gixer

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #150 on: May 05, 2005, 09:01:40 PM »
I don't have a GPS to give them to you at home but next time I go flying I'll try and make a note. But even with those I doubt you could point to where I was on a map since it's outside US. :)


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Offline Hangtime

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #151 on: May 05, 2005, 09:34:39 PM »
You aqre correct, we have no maps of the innards of a sheeps Sphincter. However, if you tie a GPS transponder the tail of the sheeps bellybutton your hiding in, then we can conclude the test.

""
The price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, any time and with utter recklessness...

...at home, or abroad.

Offline Gixer

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #152 on: May 05, 2005, 09:49:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hangtime
You aqre correct, we have no maps of the innards of a sheeps Sphincter. However, if you tie a GPS transponder the tail of the sheeps bellybutton your hiding in, then we can conclude the test.

""



Ah the American way,if you don't like the opinion bomb it. And if I didn't bother turning the transponder on you'd just bomb all the sheep and still state "Mission Accomplished"  LOL


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Offline Hangtime

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #153 on: May 05, 2005, 09:55:12 PM »
Yup. 'course, since you wear a sheeps bellybutton for a hat, we'd mourn for the sheep.
The price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, any time and with utter recklessness...

...at home, or abroad.

Offline Gixer

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #154 on: May 05, 2005, 10:00:43 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hangtime
Yup. 'course, since you wear a sheeps bellybutton for a hat, we'd mourn for the sheep.



I strongly doubt you'd mourn for the sheep since you don't bother keeping an official record of sheep casualties. And if anything came out in the future by the sheep farmers as to how many were killed you'd just deny it.

But all in the name of Democracy and protecting the Free World eh?  :rolleyes:


...-Gixer

Offline Hangtime

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #155 on: May 05, 2005, 10:30:18 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gixer
I strongly doubt you'd mourn for the sheep since you don't bother keeping an official record of sheep casualties. And if anything came out in the future by the sheep farmers as to how many were killed you'd just deny it.



Yer right. I lied. We'd inflate the body count to justify the ordinance expenditures. But we'd send Sally Struthers to do TV Commercial appeals for the ophaned lambs while we slowly stoke up the international commodities price index on lamb chops.
The price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, any time and with utter recklessness...

...at home, or abroad.

Offline cpxxx

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #156 on: May 08, 2005, 04:29:07 PM »
I just came back from Vietnam and Cambodia. I was there on my honeymoon, you may be surprised to read. Coincidentally we were there for the anniversary of the supposed 'liberation' of the south. I think things must have changed since Mr Bill's visit. Certainly some of the quotes ring true.  But no one mistakes you for a Russian anymore. Kid's favourite question these days is 'How are you, where you from?' Naturally they have never heard of Ireland and say 'Ah Iceland'

The very first person I met in the immigration queue at Hanoi's airport was a veteran on his first visit back since he was blown up by a mortar bomb in 1970.  Apparently many veterans re visit these days. One guide told me how touching it was to see these guys standing at the scene of their lost youth with tears in their
eyes.

We had three guides at different times during the trip, none were official government. All were fairly open about their attitude to the type of government they live under. None had much in the way of illusions. Contact with knowledgeable foreign tourists educated them to some extent.

Just a few impressions.  

I could detect no anti American bias. In fact the only country to be criticised in any was....ahem France. I found the same in Cambodia interestingly.  In fact they fear the Chinese would like to make Vietnam yet another province. Suspicion of the Chinese is considerable. They are not allowed to fly in or out of Vietnam and are restricted in many ways.  A guide freely admitted that the government forced out many of the Chinese community in previous years. Many of those ethnic Chinese had large businesses. They were not so much fleeing the country as being expelled.

Fear of China is such that the amazing idea of the US military re-occupying Cam Ranh Bay was mentioned by all of the guides we met. Even by the stuffy Northern guide. He thought though that the main objection would be from the veterans who fought the Americans.
Speaking of veterans. There was a massive convoy of mini buses containing Vietnamese veterans retracing their advance in 1975. Ironically they were in Ford Transits. The NVA sponsored by an American company. Apparently these veterans receive a pension of $2 a month.

People are better off now since they opened the economy. Nearly everyone has a moped. The streets are absolutely clogged by them in spite of the fact that their price is artificially inflated by the government. $2000. Same with cars. There are lots of Toyota Camry's. They love the Camry.  Crossing the street in any city is a nightmare. You must not run or stop. Just keep walking slowly so the bikes dodge around you. Most of the bikes and cars I saw were fairly new which seems to point to people having obtained their money recently. There is clearly a lot of money floating around alongside considerable poverty.

It's not a free country. They point out the goverment is no longer Communist because of the Capitalist economy. It's just repressive. There is a lot of corruption too. In every aspect of the economy. Millions are skimmed off every project.  The Police have to be bribed when they stop you, but discreetly. They don't bother tourists though.

It is a beautiful country. Hanoi is interesting in parts. Hue is amazing. The citadel made famous during the Tet offensive is well worth a visit and still shows scars of the battle. Da Nang is dull and uninteresting. We didn't see China Beach. But we went to Hoi An which has fabulous beaches and hotels as good as any resort you'll see in the world.  The official name for Saigon nowdays is Ho Chi Minh city but everyone still calls it Saigon.  The Cu Chi tunnels are fascinating. The area is still pockmarked with bomb craters. Ironically one the chief guides for the tunnels is ex ARVN. I got to fire an AK47 for the first time.

Of our three guides only one actually served in the army. The others dodged it for various reasons. The one who did served in Cambodia. He proudly reckoned he had killed nearly 50 Khymer Rouge. Despite all this he considered the celebrations for the 30th anniversary as a complete waste of money. You should have heard him and our driver laughing at a mock up tank intended for a parade.

I visited the war museums in Hanoi and Saigon. They have a Mig 21 which supposedly shot down a number of US aircraft. It's badly neglected. Ironically nearby is a UH1D in immaculate condition wrongly painted as US AIR FORCE.  It's the same in Saigon. They display a Skyraider, an F5A, a T37 and a Cessna U17 painted in badly applied US markings when clearly they were originally South Vietnamese. They don't like talking about the 'puppet' goverment.  In Hanoi, what made a big emotional impact on me was the sight of flight helmets stacked in a display case. It left me wondering as to the fate of the owners.

One day in Saigon I heard a familiar whop whop sound. A Huey, still in service after all these years. The only other aircraft I saw flying were two Mi8's near Hanoi. Although there were several Migs based at Hanoi's airport.

The famous Presidental Palace or 'Unification Palace' which featured in those famous pictures of the tanks crashing the gates has being preserved as it was in 1975. Seventies decor and all. It's an amazing time capsule. In the operations rooms in the cellars the the ORBAT for 1968 is on display. Virtually nothing has been touched.  They even placed a Huey on the roof to represent the escape helicopter. This time correctly painted.

I could go on and on. But the main impression I was left with was that it is a country in a state of transition. Not free yet but will be eventually. Not rich yet but give them ten years.

The women are as beautiful as many a GI described them. If I wasn't on my honeymoon.................... .......

The whole trip was fascinating. It's changed my view of the country. I will no longer simply associate it with the war. Frankly they have been screwed royally by the French, the Americans and latterly by their own government. The worst thing that happened to them was winning the war. Not my words but theirs.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2005, 06:09:34 PM by cpxxx »

Offline NUKE

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #157 on: May 08, 2005, 05:00:32 PM »
Great read cpxxx.

Seems like a really cool place to go visit and it sounds like you had a great time.

Thanks for sharing.

Offline cpxxx

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Vietnam marks 30th anniversary of war's end
« Reply #158 on: May 08, 2005, 06:19:19 PM »
Eh thanks Nuke.........I think. !!

But it is well worth a visit.  Safe for Americans as one guide pointed out. No terrorists!