Gay Marriage

[SOB]

So as not to hijack the other thread about child custody, I'll bring this to a new thread.

Originally posted by Urchin
No way.. marriage is a sanctified relationship between a man and a woman under the eyes of God.  It has always been defined that way, and it should stay that way.

Not to single out Urchin, but I think this statement sums up exactly the misconception that fuels the drive against gay marriage.  This issue is not about religious marriage.  It is about civil marriage, and in no way involves any church that doesn't want to be a part of it.  Civil marriage is performed by a civil authority and the church is not involved...you are just legally recognized as a married couple.

Were it not for this misconception, I think a lot more of the middle-of-the-road folks would be leaning the othe rway on this issue.  I imagine a lot of folks just don't like the idea that this would be forced on their church, and mistakenly think that's what at stake here.

[Skydancer]

Ah well thats allright then.

Don't want none of them momosecshuals in church huh



What in gods name does it matter what they do with each other and why shouldn't they have some legal status as a couple. Call it marriage, coupledom whatever but give them some legal status.

My best two neighbours are the gay couple next door.

[SOB]

I don't go to church, or believe in god, but I do believe in the right of a church to believe what they want and worship how they want within the limits of reason...(ie, no human sacrifices or sex with alter boys).  But excluding homosexuals from their church, not allowing women to be priests, etc, that's their business not mine or the government's.

-edit- And in case it wasn't clear, I am in support of gay marriage.  More specifically in support of including homosexuals in the current definition of civil marriage, rather than a separate civil union.  Separate but equal has been done before, and it didn't work out all that well.

[StarOfAfrica2]

Personally (just my opinion), the govt should stay the heck out of it.  I dont even like the idea of JOP or judges marrying people, but I suppose Athiests have to go somewhere.  In my personal opinion, marriage is a religious issue.  If there's a church out there that wants the flak from performing gay marriages, then more power to them.  If a couple goes through the motions of their professed religion and gets married, and fills out the proper forms at City Hall, they should receive legal recognition as a married couple.  Period.  I think the only reason its such a big issue is that gays are currently denied marriage.  If it were allowed, you'd have a brief flurry of marriages, and then it would die off into nothing.  It's just like drugs or anything else "banned".  People want what they cant have.  

Are there bennies for gay folks to getting married?  Sure.  Are there bad things about it too?  Most definitely.  Mostly the recognition.  They cant hide and be anonymous if they have to submit to public record and submit those records to the insurance folks at work.  Anyway, let it happen and let the situation regulate itself.  As it will.

[Nash]

Originally posted by SOB
Were it not for this misconception, I think a lot more of the middle-of-the-road folks would be leaning the othe rway on this issue.  I imagine a lot of folks just don't like the idea that this would be forced on their church, and mistakenly think that's what at stake here.

Whoah. I love optimism.

However out to lunch it may be....

If you think this simple semantic solution will quiet their jihad, then be prepared for a shock.

There's no backing down. There's no "well okay, we can agree to disagree."

Capitulating to any other point of view - giving up any ground -  is nothing other than a capitulation to Satan. Sound crazy? Yeah, me too.

You think they gonna compromise on hell? Come on. No - they aint. Their whole entire gig can be summed up as:

"Our way or bust." Because....

Thars no way to negotiate with Satan. There's no middle ground. Them and the Devil aren't gonna craft some nifty piece of bipartisan legislation. Forget about it.

There is only "my way" or highw... er, hell. So - not an option.

The sooner folks get that, the better they understand where these folks are coming from.

[SOB]

It may be a little optomistic, but I don't think by much.  I think there are a lot more middle-of-the-road folks out there than by-the-book Christians or outright religious fanatics, and I think the latter two are what would more fit your description.

Frankly, given Oregon's leanings toward these types of issues in the past, I was suprised as hell to see it pass here...and that's the only thing I can figure.  Well, that, or I was just way off in my perception of the situation here.

[Nash]

Originally posted by SOB
I think there are a lot more middle-of-the-road folks out there than by-the-book Christians or outright religious fanatics...

You're absolutely right. There are.

They aint bustin' loose a la Daltrey with the mic under a multi-million dollar "palace"....

.... but they're out there.

I wish to hell they'd speak up.

[lada]

Originally posted by FaliFan
People were getting married all over Europe and the rest of the world thousands of years before Christianity.

Infidel !!!!



Good point

[Dowding]

There was gay marriage in North Africa at the time of Alexander the Great.

[Saintaw]

This is dissapointing. I thought SOB was going to propose me, and that we would move in (steal!) Fish's pink bubble house, and be happy forever.

[SOB]

NEVAR give up, Saw!  If there's any way to do it, I'm sure that way is in SF!

[lada]

deleted - rule #7

[SMIDSY]

you are all forgetting that this is not just a religious matter, married couples in the US get tax breaks and benefiets that gay couples could never hope to get regardless of how dedicated they are to each other. i dont believe that the pejudices are based on religion but rather "eeew thats nasty...how can we stop it?" kinda like anti-sodamy laws that were finaly repealed by the supreme court (now my girlfirend has no excuse:aok ). anyhow, i think all marriage should be like in france: legal cerimony in a courthouse followed by an optional religious cerimony.

[Mini D]

I'm all for gay couples having the same rights that married couples have... especially in regards to medical coverage and taxes. I'm just growing increadibly weary of the fundamental errosion of the concept of "the married couple".

[Suave]

I think the gays should wait untill gay divorces are legal before they get married.