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Author Topic: global warning update.  (Read 6880 times)

Offline Angus

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global warning update.
« Reply #285 on: June 15, 2006, 06:45:33 PM »
Ok Jackal
"They don`t magicaly appear Angus. They will have to be planted . To plant they will have to have machinery. To have the machinery someone has to build it. When built, they have to have and burn fuel. To get the fuel it has to be explored, drilled, tapped, refined and shipped. Just like all of the above. Things simply just do not magical appear. Start at the start of this magical solution of yours. Incluide all steps. Not just the latter.
Then when you get to that point you have forests that will , if not thinned, will have fallen timber , which will rot.decay. In the process not all C02 is bound. It is released into the atmosphere. Just as your global warming theorists suggest. They are worried about the existing, not the mystical, yet to be planted."

Care to bring any numbers here....once again. You seem to be stuck with a theory that you cannot support.
But yet here is one thing:
"Then when you get to that point you have forests that will , if not thinned, will have fallen timber , which will rot.decay. In the process not all C02 is bound"
Not all CO2 is bound. Just the value of the C stuck and piling up in the soil. Just What I keep saying. Then there is a lot of C in the biomass itself. A forest binds C and emits O2, - that is the essence of photosynthesis.
As a sidenote, increased CO2 in the atmosphere increases the C binding in photosyntesis, - this is deliberately used in Greenhouse growing under certain circumstances. I guess you know all about that too?
The mystical yet to be planted doesn't even have to be a forest. Anything at all is better than a desert. Anything.


And Weaselsan. Try a calculator. According to our current sea level rising WITHOUT it increasing, we are not talking about 4 inches, but some 50 feet in the period you mentioned. Your 4 inches happened twice last century (oops, you could twist that one :D)

Anyway, good night Gents...
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Offline lukster

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global warning update.
« Reply #286 on: June 15, 2006, 11:11:53 PM »


Risking another chart here.  ;)

Looks like a slow increase over a long period of time with fluctuations from time to time to me.
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Offline Angus

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global warning update.
« Reply #287 on: June 16, 2006, 04:48:17 AM »
The scale is a bit...rough
Here's one:


From Nasa

Good link:
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Observatory/
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline Angus

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global warning update.
« Reply #288 on: June 16, 2006, 04:52:36 AM »
Another one...Nasa again.
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline Angus

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global warning update.
« Reply #289 on: June 16, 2006, 05:20:18 AM »
And here we have a "natural" swing in temperature that I have mentioned before, the little Ice-age.





(As well as the Warm medieval period.)

Zooming in a bit:




sort of explains why so many are jittery about warming. It happens rather fast.

Well we'll just wait and see ;)
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline Jackal1

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global warning update.
« Reply #290 on: June 16, 2006, 06:47:42 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Angus
Ok Jackal

Care to bring any numbers here....once again. You seem to be stuck with a theory that you cannot support.
 


Once again......I will leave the perfect scenarios to you. You are the perfect scenario paper/computer farmer theorist. This should be no hill for a stepper. :rofl
The numbers cannot be put forth Angus, because just like the unknowns/unpredictables in the global warming theory....they are just that.....unknowns.

Quote
As a sidenote, increased CO2 in the atmosphere increases the C binding in photosyntesis, - this is deliberately used in Greenhouse growing under certain circumstances. I guess you know all about that too?


Yes it will increase it........to a point. The earth is not a friggen geenhouse. It is not a controlled , perfect sceanrio. The earth`s atmosphere has to many unknowns/unpredictables.

Quote
The mystical yet to be planted doesn't even have to be a forest. Anything at all is better than a desert. Anything.


Hilarious.
I can save you some time and trouble. You can put up the pointy toed shoes. You can put up the jars of pixie dust. You can store the magic wand. You can forget about the perfect scenario farming. You can cease the "start in the middle" theories that work out perfect.
Here`s why.............It Ain`t Gonna Happen.
The global warming theory will be hashed around , back and forth, for a while. It will be argued and disputed and argued some more. A little flash will be put forth...just enough to cost us some bucks, but not enough to make a percentage of one percent difference one way or the other. Then it will be shuffled to the bottom of the deck and the next line of doomsdayers will come up with some other off the friggen wall, sky is falling, we`re all doomed fairy tale........and off it will go once again.
In the mean time most people will be dealing with reality. People will not be trying to cure unsupported, unpredictable , unprovable problems that they can do nothing about that has been born in the minds of soothsayers.
The earth will stay in a constant state of change just as it always has. Reality will hold true. Fantasy will stay just that...fantasy.
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Offline Jackal1

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global warning update.
« Reply #291 on: June 16, 2006, 07:15:58 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Angus
I guess you know all about that too?


I guess it`s off topic a bit , but since you seem to be getting a little touchy here I`m gonna comment.
Angus I know all about absolutely noting. Neither does anyone I have ever known or met. I`ve met some that profess to, but hey............:)
At my age I can`t tell you everything that I have done or been involved with I don`t beleive. I can tell you some.

You mentioned that you were probably the only one here on the board with an agriculture education. For those of my age, in this area, it was pretty common to have at least two to four years of agriculture in your studies. I had four. :)
I was born and raised on the farm. As most here did, we had crop and stock farming. That`s where you learn the realities on farming. You live it. You deal with reality and not a book or theory.
I did a stint With Texas Farm Bureau. A real eye opener.
I drove cross country for quite a few years.
I did carpentry/custom cabinet and trim.
I have done service work.....AC/heating, etc.
I have farmed.
I have been involved with formulating of feeds. cattle/ horse.
I have ran and owned custom farming operations. Custom hay baling operations. Custom combining.
I have been in sales.
I was a fully licensed insurance salesman at one time. (hated it, but probably made more money there than anywhere)
At one time I was running two stock operations. (cattle)
I have raised just about every animal I know of for a sideline at one time or the other.
I have ran and owned welding shops. ( I love it)
I have ran and owned a biker supply business. (loved it/miss it)
I have done auto mechanics/bike mechanics.
I have done high risk security work.
I have done recovery work on a few occasions.
This is not all, but some. Some of these times I had two to three things going at once.
I bore easy. :)
No Angus, I am not an expert at anything. I am a Jack of all trades, master of none.
What can I say. :)

Hehe! Had to come back for an edit to add.........
At one time, one of my cousins and myself had a small 50 acre farm rented. We rented it mainly to have a place to hang out and drink a few cools one at and to grow some veggies for our personal use. The farm had three fairly large barns on it in good shape. We put in a pork raising/fattening operation. We ended up with about 200 porkers at any given time. You want comedy? I should write a book. :)
« Last Edit: June 16, 2006, 07:33:35 AM by Jackal1 »
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Offline lazs2

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global warning update.
« Reply #292 on: June 16, 2006, 08:19:37 AM »
angus.. all your charts show that there are bigger tempreture swings in the past than now.   Looking at 1000 ad to about 1100 ad.... you and beet would have been apopleptic looking at all the global warming....  all those horses or something maybe?  

Then..1200 or so to 1300... the dive in temp...  Both those events would exceed in both change and rapidity of change the changes over our last 100 years..

So then....you show charts that cover 50 years or less up to today showing a huge rise.    How bout you transpose one of the 1000ad charts over the 1900 to date charts.

Point is... there have been much worse, and more rapid tempreture changes in the past... who do you blame them on?   Where was kyoto then?

lazs
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Offline Jackal1

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global warning update.
« Reply #293 on: June 16, 2006, 09:14:57 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
 Where was kyoto then?

lazs


I beleive they were holding meetings in a cave cafe......................... .....in Qatar. :rofl
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Offline GtoRA2

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global warning update.
« Reply #294 on: June 16, 2006, 10:45:53 AM »
Everyone throws those charts around like they prove something. All they show is things are getting warmer or the sea is getting a bit higher.



They do not prove that global warming is man made,  if anything, they show it happend in the past and it looks normal.




This really is very religion like for some of you.

Its funny you don't see it, but hey fanatics are like that.
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Offline Angus

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global warning update.
« Reply #295 on: June 16, 2006, 07:20:11 PM »
Oh, Gtora, quite right. No graphs ever show anything, especially if based on measurements.
OOps, you said they show that things are getting warmer and the sea higher?!?!
The mainstray of the debate is twofold. Whether it's getting warmer and whether it's man-made. I am voting for the first one, and getting a crapload of...crap on my head for it. So on to Jackal:

"Ok Jackal...again...
"Originally posted by Angus
Ok Jackal

Care to bring any numbers here....once again. You seem to be stuck with a theory that you cannot support.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Once again......I will leave the perfect scenarios to you. You are the perfect scenario paper/computer farmer theorist. This should be no hill for a stepper.  
The numbers cannot be put forth Angus, because just like the unknowns/unpredictables in the global warming theory....they are just that.....unknowns. "

Firstly this refers to how much value of energy goes into creating machinery. Even though your impressive CV is there, your statement needs an answer. So step yer hill and explain how a piece of machinerey can be sold at a less price than the energy AND effort that went into it.
Secondly, your reply has the scent of being a bit personal. Want me to compete in a pissing contest about who did what and so on because not being able to focus on the logics burns a bit?
Well, calling me a scenario paper/computer farmer theorist and a perfect one as well, is nothing but a desperate measure. (Actually an insult)
And to quote some of your CV and answer......here ya go:

"I have farmed."

Me too. Am still at it. It's been 19 years now. Not a perfect scenario.

"I have been involved with formulating of feeds. cattle/ horse."

Everydays business

"I have ran and owned custom farming operations. Custom hay baling operations. Custom combining."

Very much a part of my game. Mostly bailing and seeding.

I'll give you some fun facts.

I worked as a farm hand in Germany.
I worked in the fish industries.
I have planted thousands of hectares of various herbs.
I have milked 35 cows with bucket machines while I had 3 ribs broken.
I also pulled out a tooth of mine myself. (make that ...more)
My accountant told me I should never be left in the same room as a sheet of paper.
My household people call me the local "Neanderthal".
I lived in a tent for some 4 months. Twice. (was easy)
I was welding the other day. Succeeded, which was good for I didn't have the bloody helmet.
I have a Russian shotgun who is held together with tape. I use it.
I have a barrel outside with salted horsemeat.
I smoke my saltmeat with sheepdung and birch.
I shoot some of my to-be dinners myself.
My socks have holes in them. Despite those:

I still have a whiff of global warming.

I can forget that for a moment though for saying:
" You are the perfect scenario paper/computer farmer theorist"
Is a very miscalculated assumption, or just an insult.
Well, yell when you're out of ammo....
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline Holden McGroin

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global warning update.
« Reply #296 on: June 17, 2006, 04:01:22 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Angus
I was welding the other day. Succeeded, which was good for I didn't have the bloody helmet.

Ray Charles tried welding without a helmet...
Quote

I have a barrel outside with salted horsemeat.
I smoke my saltmeat with sheepdung and birch.

Sounds delicious (cough cough)
Quote

My socks have holes in them.  

All my socks have at least one hole, otherwise I could not pull them over my feet.
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Offline Angus

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global warning update.
« Reply #297 on: June 17, 2006, 05:30:06 AM »
HoleS. Plural :D
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline sharp8th

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global warning update.
« Reply #298 on: June 17, 2006, 05:45:55 AM »
well all i can say is wait and i hope the end is near for are lil earth =)
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Offline Jackal1

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global warning update.
« Reply #299 on: June 17, 2006, 06:17:29 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Angus

Firstly this refers to how much value of energy goes into creating machinery. Even though your impressive CV is there, your statement needs an answer. So step yer hill and explain how a piece of machinerey can be sold at a less price than the energy AND effort that went into it.


Ummmmm......Angus...we`re talking C02 ouput to the atmosphere.  The point is...if you start at the BEGINNING of the process , instead of in the middle or near the end, such as you seem to do, you will be producing more C02 than you can ever hope to take care of.Remember?  Remember the global warming theory you`re so fond of? Could care less about dollars/cents as stated before. It doesn`t enter into global warming...........other than it will end up costing us in the long run for nothing....or be forgotten all together.



Quote
Secondly, your reply has the scent of being a bit personal. Want me to compete in a pissing contest about who did what and so on because not being able to focus on the logics burns a bit?


There is one of us here who can`t focus on logics. It`s not me. :)

Quote
Well, calling me a scenario paper/computer farmer theorist and a perfect one as well, is nothing but a desperate measure. (Actually an insult)


Angus maybe you need to work on not being so sensitive and not worry so much about unsubstantiated fairy tales. . :)
You are the one throwing out perfect , sterile, scenario formulas and such.
Once again, it you are insulted it is self inflicted.



Quote
I'll give you some fun facts.I worked as a farm hand in Germany.
I worked in the fish industries.
I have planted thousands of hectares of various herbs.
I have milked 35 cows with bucket machines while I had 3 ribs broken.
I also pulled out a tooth of mine myself. (make that ...more)
My accountant told me I should never be left in the same room as a sheet of paper.
My household people call me the local "Neanderthal".
I lived in a tent for some 4 months. Twice. (was easy)
I was welding the other day. Succeeded, which was good for I didn't have the bloody helmet.
I have a Russian shotgun who is held together with tape. I use it.
I have a barrel outside with salted horsemeat.
I smoke my saltmeat with sheepdung and birch.
I shoot some of my to-be dinners myself.
My socks have holes in them. Despite those:


Ummmmm..that`s.............errrrrr...........ummmm.............great Angus. :rolleyes:  Put down the paper and mend those socks. :)
If you wish to get off into exploits...well don`t believe there is enough room here. :)
By chance did you have to walk to school, in the snow, uphill both ways...with  a cold biscuit?

Quote
I can forget that for a moment though for saying:" You are the perfect scenario paper/computer farmer theorist"
Is a very miscalculated assumption, or just an insult.


Best way I can help you on this Angus, if it`s causing you such anguish, is to quit formulating perfect scenarios and trying to make them fly. It`s the same thing the global warming theorists/scientists are trying to do. They don`t fly either.

Quote
Well, yell when you're out of ammo....


Ahhhhhh don`t be so down hearted. You will come up with something. :):rofl
« Last Edit: June 17, 2006, 06:19:46 AM by Jackal1 »
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