Author Topic: UK airline bomb plot thwarted (Read 3306 times)

Masherbrum · « **Reply #60 on:** August 10, 2006, 02:24:57 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Charge
Have you declared war with those countries in question, I mean, officially? -C+

It is my understanding that the last country the US declared war on was Germany in WWII. I could be wrong though.

lazs2 · « **Reply #61 on:** August 10, 2006, 02:25:01 PM »

so cav.... how bad does it have to get "security" wise till you feel that you are in one of those old black and white movies?

How much freedom you willing to give up to feel "safe"?

Anyone who can recall going to an airport of even 10 years ago knows that those people would be apaled at being treated like criminals in an occupied nation like we are today.

when I look at the people in an airport... I get the impression that the terrorists are winning... when I see the patriot act... I feel they are winning.

lazs

Edbert1 · « **Reply #62 on:** August 10, 2006, 02:25:30 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Charge
Have you declared war with those countries in question, I mean, officially?

Hmmm...good question...since none were named individually.....I thought the "all nations that" part covered them...I guess it is a subject open to debate.

[edit]
Jarred my (failing) memory hard enough to make me go look it up...dang you! Here's a transcript (snippage only, the speech was long, entire text to be found here http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/09/20/gen.bush.transcript/) of the president's own words issued before congress and the American public...
Quote

Our war on terror begins with al Qaeda, but it does not end there.

It will not end until every terrorist group of global reach has been found, stopped and defeated.

(APPLAUSE)

Americans are asking "Why do they hate us?"

They hate what they see right here in this chamber: a democratically elected government. Their leaders are self-appointed. They hate our freedoms: our freedom of religion, our freedom of speech, our freedom to vote and assemble and disagree with each other.

They want to overthrow existing governments in many Muslim countries such as Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Jordan. They want to drive Israel out of the Middle East. They want to drive Christians and Jews out of vast regions of Asia and Africa.

These terrorists kill not merely to end lives, but to disrupt and end a way of life. With every atrocity, they hope that America grows fearful, retreating from the world and forsaking our friends. They stand against us because we stand in their way.

We're not deceived by their pretenses to piety.

We have seen their kind before. They're the heirs of all the murderous ideologies of the 20th century. By sacrificing human life to serve their radical visions, by abandoning every value except the will to power, they follow in the path of fascism, Nazism and totalitarianism. And they will follow that path all the way to where it ends in history's unmarked grave of discarded lies. Americans are asking, "How will we fight and win this war?"

We will direct every resource at our command -- every means of diplomacy, every tool of intelligence, every instrument of law enforcement, every financial influence, and every necessary weapon of war -- to the destruction and to the defeat of the global terror network.

Now, this war will not be like the war against Iraq a decade ago, with a decisive liberation of territory and a swift conclusion. It will not look like the air war above Kosovo two years ago, where no ground troops were used and not a single American was lost in combat.

Our response involves far more than instant retaliation and isolated strikes. Americans should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign unlike any other we have ever seen. It may include dramatic strikes visible on TV and covert operations secret even in success.

We will starve terrorists of funding, turn them one against another, drive them from place to place until there is no refuge or no rest.

And we will pursue nations that provide aid or safe haven to terrorism. Every nation in every region now has a decision to make: Either you are with us or you are with the terrorists.

From this day forward, any nation that continues to harbor or support terrorism will be regarded by the United States as a hostile regime. Our nation has been put on notice, we're not immune from attack.

(bold text added by me in an attempt to answer a just question)
He didn't say "all" he said "any", my misquote.

Seagoon · « **Reply #63 on:** August 10, 2006, 02:35:50 PM »

Hi Cpxxx,

Quote

Originally posted by cpxxx
Bloody hell, Seagoon

You want them to let the atrocities happen? Surely 9/11, the London bombings and all the other attacks are enough?

Obviously not, which is why I wrote: "I'm not sad that this didn't come to pass, just sad that we don't have memories longer than one media cycle."

My problem is the general desire to forget that there are currently thousands of Jihadis feverishly plotting worldwide to blow up, poison, incinerate, or behead every non-Muslim they can and to act as though there was no danger. The only times we see a brief interruption of that desire is when we don't catch the bad guys, then for a little while Westerners act almost as though there are people out to kill them. Otherwise, its petty party politics as usual in Britain and the USA.

As to "what is the problem with Britain's Muslims" the answer is that Britain's Muslim population is disproportianately drawn from countries with a strong Jihadi presence and did little or nothing to control the more radical Masjids. If you want to learn more about Britain's growing problems in particular, pick up a book written by British Author Melanie Phillips called Londonistan: How Britian is Creating a Terror State Within (Gibson Square Books Ltd, June, 2006)

- SEAGOON

cav58d · « **Reply #64 on:** August 10, 2006, 03:12:30 PM »

quote:Originally posted by lazs2
I drive because so far... It makes me feel less like I live in some old black and white movie of a police state than I do when I go to the airport. I will avoid commercial airlines and airports like the plague.

anyone remmember how scared we all were watching those old movies of nazis or whatever carrying sub guns in their black uniforms and stopping and searching civilians boarding trains or at checkpoints at random? Now.... we ask for it to happen to us. Difference is that our black clad guys wear masks too.

lazs

Bingo. Fuel prices aren't the only reason airlines are going bankrupt.

Seriously guys...Modern medicine has done wonders for people like you! Get some prozac!

rogwar · « **Reply #65 on:** August 10, 2006, 03:16:14 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hawco
Perfect timing for me as i'm flying to the Uk with my wife and inlaws on continental...
Here's what I think should be done:
1. Intern all muslims
2. give the muslim community 5 days to turn over bin laden and his Egyptian boyfriend and ALL other suspects.
3. If nothing after 5 days then drop a bomb on day 1 on the dome on the rock.
4. Day 2. Drop a bomb on Medina
5. Day 3. Drop a bomb on Mecca
Issue an ultimatum to Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Iran, syria and any others I've forgotten about and tell them that they are either for us or against us and we expect/demand Arrests

This is not a time for appeasement, not a time to "sit round a table and talk about it" guns and bombs work well in getting Muslims to listen, lets play by their rules and strike them hard where ever they may be hiding.

I second that...

Neubob · « **Reply #66 on:** August 10, 2006, 04:28:51 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Charge
"Sandy, were our wartime actions in Dresden/Berlin/Tokyo acts of terrorism to you?"

You were i n w a r with Germans and Japanese.

-C+

You can declare a war against a nation, whose soldiers carry flags and do their job out in the open. Not so easy to declare a war against a cockroach who hides in the shadows, and under rocks.

Sandman · « **Reply #67 on:** August 10, 2006, 05:20:09 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by cav58d

Seriously guys...Modern medicine has done wonders for people like you! Get some prozac!

It's reality. Airport security as all but killed the business commuter market. There's no point spending 2+ hours to get on an airplane that's only going to fly for an hour or less. It's faster and cheaper to simply drive.

Golfer · « **Reply #68 on:** August 10, 2006, 05:32:11 PM »

The company I'm at now has done a look at their "typical" customer. Owners of the airplanes that are part 91 (owner used) flights were not considered. It was no surprise but especially since September 11th the business travel segment keeps growing and growing. Seeing as it makes up most of the 135 (charter) trips business keeps growing and growing.

Chartering an entry level jet such as a Citation 500 series airplane at $1500-$2000/flt hr starts to get economical especially when time en route is considered. Just weigh your options. Folks NEED to be someplace, they don't need to be standing in line.

GtoRA2 · « **Reply #69 on:** August 10, 2006, 05:46:34 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sandman
It's reality. Airport security as all but killed the business commuter market. There's no point spending 2+ hours to get on an airplane that's only going to fly for an hour or less. It's faster and cheaper to simply drive.

I am with Sandy and Laz here, security has gotten to the point I would rather driver for 8 hours then fly for 1.

Not to mention the service on planes sucks. The seats suck. Being packing in next to some ******* who is sick sucks. Being stuck on a plane with some *******s crying baby for 3 hours sucks. Air travel sucks ass.

All the added BS security makes it even worse.

Trikky · « **Reply #70 on:** August 10, 2006, 08:06:02 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Neubob
Remember guys, they're only acting out of desperation. These tactics are their only means to get ahead in the war that the West started, and perpetuates. The brave, honorable jihadists need to be respected, statues need to be erected in their names. Allah be praised.

Now we play the waiting game. See how many ways reasonable, intelligent people can find to blame Israel and the West for forcing these fine human beings into a state of such hopeless oppression.

PS: WTG UK <>

Some undoubtedly will blame the West, the London bombers blamed UK foreign policy for their actions in a martyr video. They said the UK people had voted the govt into power and so were directly responsible for British troops killing their muslim brothers and sisters and therefore legitimate targets.
22% of UK Muslims believe the bombings were justified because of British support for the war on terror, which to me is just mind boggling.

Research, for what its worth, is suggesting most suicide bombers are politically motivated and not crazed religious fanatics, some aren’t even particularly religious.

We do need more, dare I say it, understanding of what causes them to do what they do, not only to prevent them like today but also long term. True democracy will always defeat fanaticism, but governments need to wake up and start serving the people who elected them, not the lobbyists or the select few, maybe start telling the truth for once.

Blair stands up and says, Ok ok you win, we’re all in the middle east for the oil, we’re gonna lose a few, they’re gonna lose plenty, but its good for business and frankly, the British public wouldn’t be able to cope it if we didn’t go in.

Public says ‘Nooooo! Think of the children! Its immoral!

Blair – Ok troops back on Monday. Every household is allowed one car, to be used every 2nd week for 50 miles only. All non seasonal or foreign food is beyond the reach of all except the super rich elite, you’ve had your last Australian prawns. Holidays will now be on rotation and restricted to mainland UK only. Because BP and various other British companies have been paying an ungodly amount of money in taxes to all your pensions, and now of course wont, you all have to work a bit longer before getting your lovely pensions. OK?

Public – Bloody hell!

Maverick · « **Reply #71 on:** August 10, 2006, 08:58:05 PM »

First off------ Way to freaking go Brits!!!!! Outfreakinstanding bit of work there!!!!

Secondly,

The Brits were able to find a plot that would have sailed right through securuty as we had known it. They had to go to a rather esoteric method of explosives and a rather cumbersome method of assembly and ignition. Why did they have to go to that extreme? Because there IS security at airports.

I recall when the planes were hijacked and the results of 9/11. I recall some of the things asked was how could that happen? How did they get those weapons ON airplanes? Why didn't THEY stop them before the terrosts got on the plane? Why didn't THEY find them before they finshed the preperation for this act?

Well it's been some time and ANOTHER plot involving airlines has come about. What's the biggest complaint about this?

WHY do we have to go through all this _)(*&^$&^%$#&^)*&^%!!!! security at the airport???? WWWAAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! we are SO infringed, inconvenienced and it's so bad, poor poor me!!!!!

GROW THE FREAK UP PEOPLE!!!! You whine when the security is lax and bad things happen. You whined when that hugahunk got the "shoebomb" got on the airplane. Most of all you WHINE because there is security in the airport and you are SO inconvenienced. Too damn bad! The world is obviously NOT a friendly place. Get over it. Drive then if you just can't bear security at airports but start being an adult and STFU about it.

midnight Target · « **Reply #72 on:** August 10, 2006, 10:19:43 PM »

Excellent job by the Brits...

Now somebody tell me how the Iraq war helped in all this? I wonder how much easier it would be to fight "terror" if we had all those resources actually fighting "terror".

Sandman · « **Reply #73 on:** August 10, 2006, 10:24:23 PM »

The small minded ****s didn't think it through. I wonder how much terror they expected to extract by knocking down 10 aircraft.

Big ****ing deal. If this is the best that they can come up with, they are doomed.

Shuckins · « **Reply #74 on:** August 10, 2006, 10:41:35 PM »

This is a rather ominous wake up call.

The public has been steadily going back to sleep for the last four years.

Many Americans have some dangerous attitude about all this. With every successful interdiction against terrorist plots, their arrogance grows, and they start to underestimate the enemy.

But the growing apathy of the public is even more dangerous.