Author Topic: 38 trainer needed!  (Read 1540 times)

Offline 2bighorn

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2006, 08:43:16 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by SuperDud
What's a P38?
It's a baby B-29

Offline SAS_KID

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #16 on: September 24, 2006, 01:56:53 AM »
Its a twin engined bomber duh!:rolleyes:
Quote from: hitech on Today at 09:27:26 AM
What utter and compete BS, quite frankly I should kick you off this bbs for this post.

The real truth is you do not like the answer.

HiTech

Offline SuperDud

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« Reply #17 on: September 24, 2006, 07:19:07 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by 2bighorn
It's a baby B-29
w00t!
SuperDud
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Offline Schatzi

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #18 on: September 24, 2006, 07:30:45 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by 2bighorn
It's a baby B-29




:rofl
21 is only half the truth.

Offline Benny Moore

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #19 on: September 24, 2006, 09:02:18 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
That's because the P-38 sucks.  


I hear you; it's not nearly as good in the game as it was in real life (horsepower, turn radius, dive acceleration, et cetera).  However, it's significantly better than the one I was stuck with in Pacific Fighters.  The reason why I was considered the best P-38 pilot in that pathetic game is because the plane was so miserable that only about a half dozen pilots flew it as a fighter.  But in this respectable simulator, there are many greater P-38 pilots than me.  And frankly, I like it better this way.  I'm with you; it would be best to have a fully accurate P-38.  But that's not ever going to happen in any simulator, and you know it.  This is a reasonable representation, and that's the next best thing.

Offline Schatzi

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« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2006, 09:13:04 PM »
Nice fight this afternoon Aerial! >S<
21 is only half the truth.

Offline Benny Moore

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« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2006, 09:33:25 PM »
Indeed it was!  I look forward to some Hurricane duels; I'm sure to learn a few things, although probably painfully.

Offline Schatzi

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« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2006, 09:42:37 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
Indeed it was!  I look forward to some Hurricane duels; I'm sure to learn a few things, although probably painfully.



Im all sweet and harmless, dont worry ;).
21 is only half the truth.

Offline SAS_KID

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« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2006, 10:47:30 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
I hear you; it's not nearly as good in the game as it was in real life (horsepower, turn radius, dive acceleration, et cetera).  However, it's significantly better than the one I was stuck with in Pacific Fighters.  The reason why I was considered the best P-38 pilot in that pathetic game is because the plane was so miserable that only about a half dozen pilots flew it as a fighter.  But in this respectable simulator, there are many greater P-38 pilots than me.  And frankly, I like it better this way.  I'm with you; it would be best to have a fully accurate P-38.  But that's not ever going to happen in any simulator, and you know it.  This is a reasonable representation, and that's the next best thing.


According to the game the data is probably as accurate as it gets they even said some WW2 38 pilots said it was every close except for elevator response.

Also, btw Ack-Ack is possibly one of the best or the best 38 pilot in the game.
Quote from: hitech on Today at 09:27:26 AM
What utter and compete BS, quite frankly I should kick you off this bbs for this post.

The real truth is you do not like the answer.

HiTech

Offline Benny Moore

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2006, 07:16:56 AM »
I know it's the most accurate P-38 I've seen in a simulator, but it's still not entirely accurate.  For instance, the real Lockheed P-38 could pull a whopping four thousand horsepower at war emergency settings.  The United States Army Air Force simply rated it lower, at three thousand two hundred horsepower (one thousand six hundred per engine).  That didn't stop the crews and pilots from using the maximum power when they needed it.  While in the simulator we are limited to sixty inches of manifold pressure (60 Hg. MAP.) and three thousand revolutions per minute (3000 R.P.M.) for a total of one thousand six hundred horsepower (1600 hp.), the real P-38L was able to pull 64, 66, 70, and even 75 Hg. MAP., and 3200 R.P.M., yielding approximately 1725, 1760, 1870, and 2000 hp., respectively.  We the P-38 pilots, as well as the pilots of other American fighters (the North American P-51 for one), are getting stiffed in all simulators out there.  There's not a single simulator that gives American fighters their true maximum power—the ratings used by the actual ground crews and pilots—instead of their limited official rating decided by a brass hat who never flew one.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2006, 07:25:41 AM by Benny Moore »

Offline Nomak

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2006, 10:10:35 AM »
I would'nt mind some help in the 38.  From anyone who really knows how to fly it.  I am not bad in it but I am not a 38 Guru either.

Dave

Offline Schutt

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« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2006, 01:37:25 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
I know it's the most accurate P-38 I've seen in a simulator, but it's still not entirely accurate.  For instance, the real Lockheed P-38 could pull a whopping four thousand horsepower at war emergency settings.  The United States Army Air Force simply rated it lower, at three thousand two hundred horsepower (one thousand six hundred per engine).  That didn't stop the crews and pilots from using the maximum power when they needed it.  While in the simulator we are limited to sixty inches of manifold pressure (60 Hg. MAP.) and three thousand revolutions per minute (3000 R.P.M.) for a total of one thousand six hundred horsepower (1600 hp.), the real P-38L was able to pull 64, 66, 70, and even 75 Hg. MAP., and 3200 R.P.M., yielding approximately 1725, 1760, 1870, and 2000 hp., respectively.  We the P-38 pilots, as well as the pilots of other American fighters (the North American P-51 for one), are getting stiffed in all simulators out there.  There's not a single simulator that gives American fighters their true maximum power—the ratings used by the actual ground crews and pilots—instead of their limited official rating decided by a brass hat who never flew one.


But also i doubt the original had *exactly* the same horsepower left and right, 2  engines of the same build will take power settings diffrent, i eaven recall reading under certain situations they will take throttle diffrent resulting in verry bad flight characteristics. You go from idle to full and left engine hesitates.... pretty dangerous.

Also i heard the fuel consumption was higher in reality until late in 44?

So while it might be a little low power for the late p38Ls it has some other advantages in game.

Offline Delirium

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« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2006, 02:01:37 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Schutt
You go from idle to full and left engine hesitates.... pretty dangerous.


If they want to model engine difficulties, great... just make sure they model the difficulties they had with the Nik and the 109/190 as well.

Double edged sword.
Delirium
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Retired AH Trainer (but still teach the P38 selectively)

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Offline nick172

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38 trainer needed!
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2006, 02:03:16 PM »
I love the 38 and delirium has been really helping me out, thanks

Offline Benny Moore

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« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2006, 10:06:47 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Schutt
while it might be a little low power for the late p38Ls it has some other advantages in game.


You call approximately 75% of true maximum power "a little low"?  I see you have little love for the P-38.  It is a phenomenon we P-38 people are well aquainted with, to our grief.  Tell me, how would you describe your favorite airplane if it was simulated with only three fourths of its actually utilized power?  Ah, no matter; I am not here to argue for the improvement of the P-38 in this fine simulator.  No, I am content with the reasonably accurate representation we have.  My days of using reason and evidence to urge the improvement of P-38 flight models are over, I think.

However, I must point out that you are wrong in your information.  The P-38 did not normally have tendencies for the engines to be running at different power settings, as a pilot uses the manifold pressure guages and not the throttles as a reference.  Manifold pressure guages do not lie.  The only times at which maintaining equal output was a problem were on the takeoff run (and there the problem was the propellers, not the throttles) and when the turbochargers switched stages at a certain altitude.   They did not both switch at the same time, which was a problem when flying in close formation.  It caused considerable yaw which the pilot would have to correct with rudder each time one of them switched.  Being two stage superchargers, this yaw would only occur twice when passing between ten thousand and fifteen thousand feet.

In addition, the Allison V-1710F-30 did not posess, as far as I know, more efficient fuel consumption than the V-1710F-17.  However, the later P-38s did carry more fuel with the addition of the wing tanks, beginning with one of the middle J production blocks (I think P-38J-10-LO).  The P-38L ended up with a total of approximately four hundred and twenty gallons internal (420 gal.).

Saskid, you asked about power settings.  My answer to you is to never throttle back in combat unless you are going over four hundred miles per hour and cannot pull out of your dive before hitting the ground.  If you need to bleed speed, simply pull back on the yoke.  This is a much more efficient way of ridding yourself of excess speed.  I never, ever throttle down in combat unless I am fully compressing.  Even in my stall fights - especially in my stall fights - I have as much power as I can muster, and to my ears the sound of my war emergency power failing is the knell of doom.  If you want some training from me, look me up in early war or the duelling room.  I go by "Aerial" in game; it's short for "Aerial Target," my name from Pacific Fighters.  I warn you, however, that my trial period expires in a few days, after which I shall be forced to haunt the eight player servers.  I cannot and never will be able to afford a subscription.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2006, 10:26:37 PM by Benny Moore »