U.S. Army 2nd Lieut. Emily Perez

[eskimo2]

[GtoRA2]

Truely sad

[Gh0stFT]

Changing someones mind/beliefs with weapons dont  work, maybe a few days long but thats all, otherwise you have to stay there almost forever...

[AquaShrimp]

The Iraq situation is so FUBAR, heres what I think we (the U.S.) should do-

Bring in alot of military scientists and analysts.  Let them devise new tactics and strategies for combatting insurgency.  See which ones work, which don't.  Document them in a training guide.

[lasersailor184]

If America left it would explode into full civil war.

War?  Yes.  Civil War?  No.  Civil War implies that it will be iraqi's vs. iraqi's.  Do you honestly believe it's the iraqi's who are fighting us?




But I am starting to agree with yeager, not for the same reasons though.  I believe the costs to bring freedom the Iraq are worth it.  However, I am beginning to think that Muslims are incapable of freedom.


The only way I'll accept withdraw on the account of us being wrong now, is if we drop 5 MOABS on each major (non-kurdish) town on the way out.

[Hawco]

Ya know, mixed emotions from me on this one.
I fought in the first one and as a consequence of an AT-7 or an RPG round hitting the side of our AVF, i'm left 60% disabled, hearing gone in my left ear,, left eye is almost shot, I have a piece of sharpnel still lodged above it that they don't want to remove, My left ankle was broken into ( According to the doc)  "cookie dough" I have numerous plates and screws in there and I'm on 3 different meds that I have to take every 4 hours for numerous other things such as PTSD, so I do have some knowledge of what people are saying and what a guy can go through over there.
to me (and every other guy i knew over there) we left the job unfinished, we pulled out when we could have had that despot and his cronies no problem.
I'll never forgive Bush senior for pulling the plug when we could have finished it and we would not have been killed and maimed for nothing.
In a way i'm glad that we got Saddam and in another I'm sad that it wasn't done the first time round. I'm sad becuase there's probably a kid right now who was the same age as me, waking up to a life that  never should have been his to live.
I know I don't agree politically with a lot of the guys on here and that's fair enough, but one thing we can all agree on is that there has to be a line when enough is enough and I think we are  fast  approaching that, latest poll shows that 70% of Iraqis want us out.
I say fine, I say %%%% of and kill each other for all I care.

Hawco

[lasersailor184]

I'll never forgive Bush senior for pulling the plug when we could have finished it and we would not have been killed and maimed for nothing.

It wasn't Bush Sr. who pulled the plug, but the UN.  Just as the forces cleared out Kuwait, they turned straight for baghdad.  The UN passed a resolution, and Bush supported the resolution at a time when the UN was still sort of important and had meaning.  Or at least was thought to be important and thought to have meaning.

[x0847Marine]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
War?  Yes.  Civil War?  No.  Civil War implies that it will be iraqi's vs. iraqi's.  Do you honestly believe it's the iraqi's who are fighting us?

 

Absolutely. Can you imagine a forgien Govt invading & occupying your country, reducing it to rubble, and screwing up the things that used to make life in Iraq tolerable?

A good friend is with the 8th Marines, in his e-mails he tells me this is what they hear/ see all the time...

Before the Americans came to save Iraq they had power, running water, flush toilets, the sewers didnt flow into the streets, some Saddam loyalist even collected the trash, 60+ people were not showing up dead in the streets. Maybe a few of your family or friends were killed by US fire, or picked up by the still brutal Iraqi police backed with US Muscle.

If I was a young kid witnessing that, I'd sure as hell pick up a gun and blow some fools up... they ruined my quality of life, killed my friends and turned my neighborhood into war zone... and their leader gets on TV saying all is well.

Its the younger kids that were far removed from Saddam's politics who are the angriest, as they see it their life has been literally been ruined by the arrival of US troops... and from where they stand I don't blame them.

20 years from now, if these kids are still alive & free, MAYBE they'll look back and see it was a good idea after all.. but for now they are pissed and fighting back.

ed
I forgot to mention the best part, the Iraqi Govt is doing nothing for the people, the average Iraqi is left to hang... but the terrorists?, they are handing out lots of Iranian $$, feeding families, collecting garbage.. loyality comes cheaper when you're hungry.

[lasersailor184]

Can you imagine a forgien Govt invading & occupying your country, reducing it to rubble, and screwing up the things that used to make life in Iraq tolerable?

These ****ups place religion over country.  Any shi'ite is cool with them, as long as they are killing Sunnis.

[Gunslinger]

Here's my take on Iraq.

If we lose there....and by lose I mean do not make the country stable then we lose a major battle in the war on terror.

jihadis will then branch out to fight us and the rest of the world on other fronts to include main st. USA

[Hawco]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
It wasn't Bush Sr. who pulled the plug, but the UN.  Just as the forces cleared out Kuwait, they turned straight for baghdad.  The UN passed a resolution, and Bush supported the resolution at a time when the UN was still sort of important and had meaning.  Or at least was thought to be important and thought to have meaning.

It was bush senoir who told the marsh arabs near Basra to rise up in revolt, ceaefire came and they were %%%%D, Saddam near enough killed them all, that wasn't the UN.

[bj229r]

If we can't beat em there, won't be able to beat em anywhere else either

[john9001]

Originally posted by x0847Marine

Before the Americans came to save Iraq they had power, running water, flush toilets, the sewers didnt flow into the streets, some Saddam loyalist even collected the trash, 60+ people were not showing up dead in the streets. Maybe a few of your family or friends were killed by US fire, or picked up by the still brutal Iraqi police backed with US Muscle.

 

yes,life was wonderful under the benevolent saddam and his two idiot sons.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Originally posted by john9001
yes,life was wonderful under the benevolent saddam and his two idiot sons.

What you fail to understand and what was stated before the offensive is, Saddam's dictatorship was a requirement for a functional government in Iraq. There were an abundance of fears of civil war after the invasion (even on this UBB) which now proved to be dead on the money.

Nobody denies that Saddam was a cruel dictator and committing a lot of crimes in his time. But if you're saying that life in current Iraq is better than back then - boy you're either brainwashed good or smoking crack. Invading Iraq was the best gift your country could give after having defeated Osama in Afghanistan. His plan of attrition now works to the full not in Afghanistan, but in Iraq.

[john9001]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Saddam's dictatorship was a requirement for a functional government in Iraq.  

so you support evil dictators as long as they have a functional government?  now you sound like a NEO-CON.

hitler would have loved you, also the leaders of Iran, north Korea, Sudan, somalia, Syria, etc.