A brief history of squads and their rides

[Stoney74]

348th doesn't ever request bombers because we don't want to fly them.  If assigned, we'll fly 'em.  I guess CIC's have just been giving us what we request.

[FiLtH]

Shifty Im sorry if I upset you. On a wim I decided to look back at what our squad had done in the past frames. After seeing that over 34 frames we have had full bomber twice, 1/2 fighter and 1/2 bomber squad splits 10 times, 15 out of 22 pure fighter being axis rides, 7 being allied fighter, all but 2 P51D and 2 F4uD, the remaining being Hurri1s I wanted to see what other squads were doing.

  All that info is on the Logs, open for all to see. Its not like I broke into your squad rooms and stole the info. But comparisons have to be made to get my point across. It just takes a little research.

   Many in my squad prefer flying fighters too over bombers, but we have had our share. I would just like the CiCs to take the time before assigning rides to see what a squad flew last frame, so if a bomber duty is needed, the guys who flew the past 2 frames as buff or split would have a chance to do fighter, and that following frame buff duty would be assigned to a squad who flew pure fighters last frame.

   If every squad in here only flew when they had what they wanted, not many would be in bombers as the fighters are the most fun for many of us.

   Also if the CMs could check what side a squad was on last FSO and could rotate axis duty it would help.

    Remember we all want to enjoy FSOs. I'd just like to see every squad give full committment to whatever ride they get, and each have their turn in the barrel.

[Shifty]

This is the point where you lost me.

Originally posted by FiLtH
  When I was CiC about a year ago I saw the trend of small 1-4, 4-8 person squads rarely if ever in bombers. It seemed the way around getting tagged for it. So what I did was take all these small squads and put them in as my bomber force. I wasnt surprised to see on frameday that 3/4s of the guys of those squads who regularly attend when in fighters, were absent for that frame they were selected to fly bombers.
 

Up until that point I would have agreed with you. Your the first one to point the buff problem out. I don't know about anyone else, but I was never aware that people flying buffs frequently were not volunteering for it. Much less that your enjoyment of FSO is suffering because of the squads you mentioned. Say what you want, but you could have handled this much better. If your squad is not getting it's fair share of fighter time all you had to do was go to the guys running the setup, or like I mentioned before, contact Squadron CO's for some relief.  I still can't figure out why you posted in this manner at all, unless you meant to stir something up.

[sqwigly]

as the cic for this frame, i will not be looking at past rides or how often you flew what. What i will look at is the ride request first. The last thing i need  is a attack group that doesnt wanna fly what they have,nor is any good in it.second i look at ranks of a squad in the ma.You can easily see who is proficiant and whos not in one thing or another.the 3rd is numbers of the squad.if neccesary 2 squads or more are grouped but i try to avoid this for comunication purposes.

i dissagree that everyone should have to pull bomber duty.if you dont like it you shouldnt have to fly it just because you havent lately. Its about winning the war,and a squad that likes bombers is more likely to to well than one that doesnt.

[FiLtH]

Its come to my attention that my boss has replied to the side and and ride requests in a somewhat laid back manner, basically saying "Put us where you need us."  

    That was news to me. I had thought he was requesting allies and fighters mostly, as thats what most of us seem to prefer. Although many of us do like bombing at times.

   So I hope you can see why I was concerned, where I thought we were requesting but being denied.

   Thats what I was trying to get to the bottom to, but alas it was answered for me. He will be requesting more of the allied fighter rides, unless its a big b17/B24 mission which we do like to do. After a few weeks I'll see how we have been doing with granted requests and reply back to the progress, and hopefully improvements made.

   As for the people not wanting to fly bomber ever, I still think its only fair to give 100% squad attendance whenever you are called to do so.

  Again I was merely raising a red flag to a problem I thought we had at the placement level. Im happy its on our end, and that it should be easy enough to resolve. Sorry if I ruffled anyones feathers, but I hope you see my side of it.

[daddog]

Also if the CMs could check what side a squad was on last FSO and could rotate axis duty it would help.

They should be. No one should be flying Axis more than twice in a row that does not want to.  If they are then someone is dropping the ball.

[Valkyrie]

Filth,

Look, there is no great conspriacy here. Your squad from what I remember doobs putting down normally places a bomber pref with a fighter pref.

so reasons why you get buffs

1. Big squads normally get buffs just for tonnage
2. Certain squads like mine will have hots nights with kill ratios of 8:1 occasionally and we get fighters for that reason
3. Some squads like mine flat out suck in buffs and we wouldn't accomplish a mission, we flew 1 buff raid in November and did OK not great considering our numbers aloft
4. When I am planning mission I remember certain people as buff people, people you count on hitting, your one of those people who I remember from way back who flew buffs
5. I think of your squad in buffs, not the first thing that comes to mine in fighters, maybe that will change now but that was how I saw it.
6. Your ride requests always have buffs in it from what I remember, and because of that your going to get them


Now....
Addressing those

1. Your posts have changed that
2. you'll amend your ride request

and all will be well with the world in a few frames. BTW please don't put the 56th in bombers because our numbers will drop 30%. I love buffs and I do put a full effort into everytime I lead them as does everyone else who flies with the 56th but the results are not as good as when we fly our 47's.


Vlkryie1

XO 56th Fighter group

[FiLtH]

Neg daddog...its on our end.

  Rgr Valk, thx

[Sled]

Just got home from the long weekend, let me look this thread over, I will post something in the next couple of days.

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by FiLtH
Its come to my attention that my boss has replied to the side and and ride requests in a somewhat laid back manner, basically saying "Put us where you need us."  

As for the people not wanting to fly bomber ever, I still think its only fair to give 100% squad attendance whenever you are called to do so.

Sorry if I ruffled anyones feathers, but I hope you see my side of it.

We get bombers, we match our commitment level.  We'll also do a good job.  

You know, besides a couple of better ways to address this on your end, if you don't want people getting snippy, next time avoid calling out specific squadrons.  It makes their leadership a little less prone to think you're trying to sniff out some sort of "Small Squad FSO Fighter Mafia".  Use language like "it looks like some squads fly fighters all the time" instead of "the XXth FG flies fighters, the XXth FG flies fighters, and so on...

And, 348th flies Allies one frame and Axis another.  Luckily, the last couple of times of PTO setups, they've fallen inline with our allied/axis flip-flop.  I've been CIC before and its amazing how many squads don't take care of their squad assignment requests in advance.  

Last, you should have checked with your CO before starting this--because you didn't, I don't really see your side of it.  I did get my feathers ruffled, but I'll get over it.

[Sled]

I have had some time to scan this.

It looks like most of the "issues" mentioned have been given a method of resolution.

A few tips about side and ride request.

Communication inside a squad is very important, if the members of that squad want to have any say in what they are going to do in FSO.

Squadron CO's and XO's need to always send in their side and ride request to the Admin CM. Those squads that don't, tend to get the "left overs".

Admin CM's should try to make sure that squads are not getting "stuck in a rut" in FSO. Even if a squad wants to fly Axis in JU-87s all the time. They need to move around at last every once and a while.

----------------------------

Keep in mind that the larger squads do see most of the bomber duty. The main reason for this? The large squads tend to have more guys that want to fly bombers. When you give a large squad bomber duty, there is normally enough guys to fill the bomber slots, and still have some squad mates left over to fly escort duty. Most bomber pilots will tell you, they feel much better having some of their own guys flying escort for them.

[FiLtH]

Good Stoney.

   Im not a politician and tend to say whats on my mind. If I had posted "some squads fly fighters all the time" its possible some CO or CM would say "I doubt that very much" and then Id have to post it to prove my point etc. I was just trying to nip it in the bud.

   I honestly started this thread with no ill intent to the squads listed. But after doing all that work and being told it didnt matter, who cares, it caused me to get a little bitter. But its moot.

[Easyscor]

Originally posted by FiLtH
...He will be requesting more of the allied fighter rides, unless its a big b17/B24 mission which we do like to do...

Is there really ever a problem filling B17/B24 slots? IMO the squads that take the Bostons, and the Ju88s etc week after week, are the ones that deserve the heavy 8th AF rides when they come up. I can't speak to what we request but it's logical that as a small squad, we'll never be assigned in B17/B24s. It's Jabos mostly, or fighters every week, we take the assignments and do our best.

[doobs]

easyscore should never be allowed in a fiter, no bombsight

[Easyscor]

 I'll remember that the next time you need your 6 cleared.