Author Topic: generaly looking for more planes (Read 2271 times)

Lusche · « **Reply #45 on:** November 16, 2007, 09:49:38 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MORAY37
Spitfire Mk XVI has 15314 Kills of All
Spitfire Mk XVI has 13987 Deaths by All

Straight from the site sir, 2000 possible sorties uncounted by your graph.

First, I'd like to know how you find that number, "2000 possible sorties". You can not subtract "deaths" from "kills" and get "sorties" - the only result you get is that Spit XVI has about 2000 more kills than deaths.

Second, we do not have he means to track sorties. so we have to use what HTC is providing us. Adding Kills and Deaths gives us the closest approximation of plane usage, and for sure the best measure to determine impact and commonnes of a plane.
A fighter that neither kills nor is being killed has not much impact.

Further, if you credit La's, Spit's ect. with a lot of sorties without any events (kill or death), you have to do the same for all other fighters too. And I don't know why La's & spits should have that much more uneventful flights than every other mount in game.

Karnak · « **Reply #46 on:** November 16, 2007, 09:52:26 PM »

How did that graph not count those numbers? It is kills and deaths, not just kills.

The sorties will not make that much difference. Certainly not enough to take the 7% for the P-51D, 7% for the Spitfire Mk XVI and 6% for the La-7 and turn that 20% total into your 60% claim.

You spouted bull****, got called on it and now are too chicken**** to admit it.

TheBug · « **Reply #47 on:** November 16, 2007, 10:57:38 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak
How did that graph not count those numbers? It is kills and deaths, not just kills.

The sorties will not make that much difference. Certainly not enough to take the 7% for the P-51D, 7% for the Spitfire Mk XVI and 6% for the La-7 and turn that 20% total into your 60% claim.

You spouted bull****, got called on it and now are too chicken**** to admit it.

Somehow Lusche says it so more elegantly, but a good point is a good point

Ghastly · « **Reply #48 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:28:23 AM »

The plane that I'm surprised to not see on the first page of the list is the Yak. Maybe they just seem so prevalent because I hate seeing them so much...

Motherland · « **Reply #49 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:46:39 AM »

Out of curiosity, whats at the bottom of the list?

Lusche · « **Reply #50 on:** November 17, 2007, 03:32:38 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Motherland
Out of curiosity, whats at the bottom of the list?

Ar 234, but I think the method really fails to give any useful numbers in this case, because this plane probably ends most of it's sorties without getting a kill or being killed.

(All number still Tour 93 Late War Main Arenas)

SirLoin · « **Reply #51 on:** November 17, 2007, 04:35:24 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Roscoroo
go to the nearest airport ... sit in middle of the runway .

Confusious says..he who sit on middle of runway often get rundown feeling.

MORAY37 · « **Reply #52 on:** November 17, 2007, 12:56:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Lusche
First, I'd like to know how you find that number, "2000 possible sorties". You can not subtract "deaths" from "kills" and get "sorties" - the only result you get is that Spit XVI has about 2000 more kills than deaths.

Second, we do not have he means to track sorties. so we have to use what HTC is providing us. Adding Kills and Deaths gives us the closest approximation of plane usage, and for sure the best measure to determine impact and commonnes of a plane.
A fighter that neither kills nor is being killed has not much impact.

Further, if you credit La's, Spit's ect. with a lot of sorties without any events (kill or death), you have to do the same for all other fighters too. And I don't know why La's & spits should have that much more uneventful flights than every other mount in game.

Lusche, the error in this reporting is such...

I take up a spit16... i kill a p51, a niki and a yak... I land at my base.

My spit16 doesn't get counted on that graph. Only the P51, the niki and the yak are.

Say I'm an AK... I take up a P51, obviously... (all I seem to see them in) I land 4 kills from BnZ'n. My 51 isn't counted in your graph.

I would easily say that it's 30% between three planes... and might be higher...I'll stick to my 40% of all sorties are those three planes. Just using your graph gives me 20% of all sorties are 51's, SPIT16 and LA7, and it doesn't account for landed sorties.

MORAY37 · « **Reply #53 on:** November 17, 2007, 12:58:03 PM »

Your graph...

is of "KILLS OF.." and "DEATHS IN"

A victorious landing plane isn't counted.

MORAY37 · « **Reply #54 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:01:52 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak
How did that graph not count those numbers? It is kills and deaths, not just kills.

The sorties will not make that much difference. Certainly not enough to take the 7% for the P-51D, 7% for the Spitfire Mk XVI and 6% for the La-7 and turn that 20% total into your 60% claim.

You spouted bull****, got called on it and now are too chicken**** to admit it.

Sorry if I offended you, but this is a discussion and I'm not chickensht. You need to check your attitude. I simply said between 40 and 60 percent of all sorties are one of three planes. The numbers bear it out... because a landed sortie by any of those planes, with successful victories, IS NOT COUNTED IN THE GRAPH.

Lusche · « **Reply #55 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:05:47 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MORAY37
Lusche, the error in this reporting is such...

I take up a spit16... i kill a p51, a niki and a yak... I land at my base.

My spit16 doesn't get counted on that graph. Only the P51, the niki and the yak are.

And this is were YOU make a fundamental error. You seem not to grasp how the extended stats scoring system works.
In your example, all 3 get counted in that graph. The Spit gets three kills, the other planes get one death each.

Total kill+death count after this sortie:

Spit 3
Yak 1
P51 1
Nik 1

Quote

Originally posted by MORAY37
The numbers bear it out... because a landed sortie by any of those planes, with successful victories, IS NOT COUNTED IN THE GRAPH.

Wrong. It is.

MORAY37 · « **Reply #56 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:10:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Lusche
And this is were YOU make a fundamental error. You seem not to grasp how the extended stats scoring system works.
In your example, all 3 get counted in that graph. The Spit gets three kills, the other planes get one death each.

Total kill+death count after this sortie:

Spit 3
Yak 1
P51 1
Nik 1

Wrong. It is.

Ok... perhaps this is where we diverged. I'm taking that your graph diagrams KILLS OF and DEATHS IN. Is that wrong? The labelling of said graph lends itself to exactly THAT interpretation.
If I'm wrong, I'm wrong... just don't treat me like I'm the stupid one. Your graph is labelled KILLS OF and DEATHS IN. A LANDING SUCCESSFUL SORTIE WOULD NOT BE COUNTED IN SUCH A GRAPH.

I'm just using the information put in front of me.

stephen · « **Reply #57 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:15:06 PM »

Wow, even I didnt see this coming...

MORAY37 · « **Reply #58 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:15:11 PM »

If that graph does depict the types flown with any accuracy.. which I'm not sold on...but..

1 in every 3 planes... is ether a spit of two models, a lala, a p51 or a niki.

How many plane types are in the current set again?

Tilt · « **Reply #59 on:** November 17, 2007, 01:47:43 PM »

Lusche could you arrange your data to show a distribution curve?

Highest in the middle with the lowest at either ends.

(Sort high to low then cut alternates and sort the remainder low to high then paste the alternates on the bottom of the sort then graph)

could you then mark the columns [under the curve]showing aircraft that can be considered "late war" (use your own definition and I am sure some quible over it (the definition) but it should give an idea of the general distribution)