Author Topic: P-61 Black Widow  (Read 6945 times)

Offline 5PointOh

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P-61 Black Widow
« on: January 16, 2008, 08:41:36 AM »
I'd like to see a new fighter/attacker ie:



GENERAL INFORMATION:
Type:
    P-61: Three-seat Night Fighter
    F-15: Two-seat strategic reconaissance
Manufacturer: Northrop
Models: P-61A thru C, F-15 (RF-61C) Reporter
First Flight: May 21, 1942 (XP-61)
Service Delivery:
    May 1944 (P-61A)
    1946 (F-15A)
Final Delivery: N/A
Total Produced: 941 (plus 35 photo-recon versions)
_____________________________ ___________
POWERPLANT:
   Model: Pratt & Whitney R-2800 Double Wasp
   Type: 18-Cyl 2-Row Radials
   Horsepower (P-61A): 2,000hp R-2800-10
   Horsepower (P-61B): 2,000hp R-2800-65
   Horsepower (P-61C and F-15): 2,800hp R-2800-73
FUEL:
   Capacity: N/A
   Type: N/A
DIMENSIONS:
   Wing span: 20.12m (66 ft.)
   Length (P-61A): 14.92m (48 ft. 11 in.)
   Length (P-61B & C): 15.1m (49 ft. 7 in.)
   Length (F-15): 15.3m (50 ft. 3 in.)
   Height: 4.49m (14 ft. 8 in.)
   Wing Surface Area: N/A       WEIGHTS:
   Empty (Typical P-61): 10,886kg (24,000 lbs.)
   Empty (F-15): 9,979kg (22,000 lbs.)
   Maximum, Loaded (P-61A): 14,696kg (32,400 lbs.)
   Maximum, Loaded (P-61B): 17,237kg (38,000 lbs.)
   Maximum, Loaded (P-61C): 18,280kg (40,300 lbs.)
   Maximum, Clean (F-15): 12,700kg (28,000 lbs.)
PERFORMANCE:
   Maximum Speed (P-61A & B): 366 mph (590 km/h)
   Maximum Speed (P-61C): 430 mph (692 km/h)
   Maximum Speed (F-15): 440 mph (708 km/h)
   Initial climb (P-61A & B): 2,200 ft. (670 m) per minute
   Initial climb (P-61C & F-15): 3,000 ft. (914 m) per minute
   Service Ceiling (P-61A & B): 33,000 ft. (10,060 m)
   Service Ceiling (P-61C & F-15): 41,000 ft. (12,500 m)
   Range - Max. Fuel (P-61A): 500 Miles (2360 km)
   Range - Max. Fuel (P-61B & C): 2,800 Miles (4500 km)
   Range - Max. Fuel (F-15): 4,000 Miles (6440 km)
ARMAMENTS:
Four 20mm M-2 Cannon in belly, fixed forward.
Plus
Electric Dorsal turret with four .50 machine guns, remotely controlled
from front or rear sight station and fired by pilot.
(in first 37 A's, last 250 B's and all C's)
Plus (B & C Only)
Wing racks for 6,400 lb. ordnance load.

F-15 carried no armament.
(Taken from http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org)
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Offline minke

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2008, 09:03:46 AM »
would be a nice plane for high alt circling to vulch incoming bombers.It didnt have normal ailerons tho,could be interesting to fly.I'd like to see it in the game

Offline Yossarian

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2008, 10:51:56 AM »
Sounds fun to me :D

Could you tell me what sort of action it saw during the war?

Yossarian
Afk for a year or so.  The name of a gun turret in game.  Falanx, huh? :banana:
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Offline whiteman

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2008, 10:56:34 AM »
BUT THERE'S NO NIGHT!!!!!1!!ELEVEN!!!!!:D

Cool plane , i'd love to see it also. :aok

Offline 5PointOh

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2008, 11:18:28 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yossarian
Could you tell me what sort of action it saw during the war?
Pacific Theatre
The first operational use of the P-61 Black Widow was in the Pacific theatre. The 418th, 419th and 421st Night Fighter Squadrons shipped out to the Southwest Pacific Area late in 1943. The first operational mission by Black Widow took place out of Saipan on June 24, 1944, and the first kill was made on June 30, when a Black Widow piloted by 6th Night Fighter Squadron members 2nd Lt. Dale F. Haversom and radar operator Raymond P. Mooney shot down a Betty bomber. The Black Widows flew numerous missions against Japanese night intruders, which were a real nuisance to American forces and which up to this time had been virtually immune from interception. On typical missions, the Black Widow would be directed to the vicinity of its target by ground based radar. The onboard A/I radar under the control of the radar operator would then be used to direct the pilot to close with and intercept the the enemy. As soon as the Black Widow had gotten close enough to its target to make a visual identification, the guns would be aimed and fired by the pilot or by the gunner. The appearance of the Black Widow in the night skies over the Pacific was a rude and unpleasant surprise for these night raiders.

One of the primary missions of the Black Widow squadrons was the protection of B-29 bases on Saipan against night attacks, and these aircraft flew combat air patrols and interception missions. They also aided in the rescue of many crippled and lost B-29s trying to return from raids on Japan.

Black Widows were also based in New Guinea and later in the Philippines. In the Philippines, Black Widows flew night intruder missions against Japanese airfields and ground installations. The Black Widow also participated in the invasion of Iwo Jima and Okinawa.


China-Burma-India Theatre
The Black Widow also served in the China-Burma-India theatre. The first Black Widow kill in that theater took place on October 30, 1944, when a Kunming-based Black Widow flown by Capt. Robert R. Scott and Charles W. Phillips of the 426th Night Fighter Squadron shot down a Japanese twin-engined aircraft. The initial mission of the China-based Black Widows was to destroy Japanese night intruders, but as enemy nighttime flying ceased, the Black Widows went over to night intruder missions, attacking Japanese ground installations in China and Burma.


European Theatre
The first P-61 arrived in Europe on May 23, 1944. The Black Widows were initially based in England, and their first assignment was to chase night-flying V-1 "buzz bombs". The Black Widows would be vectored to intercept approaching V-1s by ground control. Since the V-1 was a little faster than the P-61, the Black Widow had to approach the V-1 from behind and go into a slight dive in order to catch up with it. The first Black Widow V-1 "kill" took place on July 16, 1944, credited to pilot Herman Ernst and radar operator Edward Kopsel of the 422nd Night Fighter Squadron. One of the greatest dangers involved in killing V-1s was the possibility of getting too close to the flying bomb when one fired at it, running the risk of damage to your own plane if the bomb exploded when hit.

After D-Day, many Black Widows moved to France. Although several interceptions of night-flying German aircraft were made, most Black Widow missions were night intruder missions against trains, armor, and other ground targets


Black Widow Wartime Units
Wartime units using the P-61 included:



6th Night Fighter Squadron, Seventh Air Force. Received Black Widows in May 1944. Served in Guadalcanal, New Guinea, Saipan, Iwo Jima. Inactivated February 1947 and reactivated as 339th All Weather Squadron.


414th Night Fighter Squadron, Twelfth Air Force. Received Black Widows in December 1944. Served in Algeria, Sardinia, Corsica, Italy, plus detachment to Belgium. Inactivated August 1947 and reformed as 319th All Weather Squadron.


415th Night Fighter Squadron, Twelfth Air Force. Received Black Widow in March 1945. Served in Italy, Corsica, France, Germany. Inactived September 1947.


416th Night Fighter Squadron, Twelfth Air Force. Received Black Widow in June 1945. Served in Italy, Corsica, France, Germany. Inactived November 1946 and redesignated 2nd Fighter Squadron (All Weather).


417th Night Fighter Squadron, Twelfth Air Force. Received Black Widow in April/May 1945. Served in Italy, Corsica, France, Germany. Inactived November 1946.


418th Night Fighter Squadron, Fifth Air Force. Received Black Widow in September 1944. Served in New Guinea, Philippines. Inactivated February 1947 but reactivated August 1948 as 4th All Weather Squadron.


419th Night Fighter Squadron, Thirteenth Air Force. Received Black Widow in May 1944. Served in New Guinea, Philippines. Inactivated February 1947.


421st Night Fighter Squadron, Fifth Air Force. Received Black Widow June 1944. Served in New Guinea, Philippines. Inactivated February 1947. Reactivated august 1948 as 68th All Weather Squadron.


422nd Night Fighter Squadron, Ninth Air Force. Received Black Widow May 1944. Served in England, France, Belgium, Germany. Inactivated September 1945.


425th Night Fighter Squadron, Ninth Air Force. Served in England, France, and Germany. Inactivated August 1947.


426th Night Fighter Squadron, Fourteenth Air Force. Received Black Widow September 1944. Served in India, China to protect B-29 bases from attack. Inactivated November 1945.


427th Night Fighter Squadron. Served briefly in Italy then moved to India, Burma, China. Received Black Widow in August 1944. Inactivated October 1945.


547th Night Fighter Squadron, Fifth Air Force. Activated March 1944 with P-61. Served in New Guinea, Philippines, Ie Shima, Japan. Inactivated February 1946.


548th Night Fighter Squadron, Seventh Air Force. Activated April 1944 with P-61. Served in Saipan, Iwo Jima, Ie Shima. Inactivated December 1945. Reactivated in 1969 as the 548th Combat Training Squadron. Still in service.


549th Night Fighter Squadron, Seventh Air Force. Activated May 1944 with P-61. Served on Saipan, Iwo Jima. Inactivated February 1946.


550th Night Fighter Squadron. Activated June 1944. Received first Black Widows January 1945. Served in New Guinea, Philippines. Inactivated January 1946.
The Black Widow did not rack up an impressive list of kills. Its entry into the war was relatively late, at a time when the Allies had already established almost complete control of the air. Consequently, enemy aircraft were at this time relatively few and far between, even at night. Nevertheless, there were a few Black Widow aces. In accounting for Black Widow aces, there is a complication since the aircraft had more than one crew member. Does only the pilot get credit for the kill, or does the radar operator get credit as well? What happens if the pilot has had different radar operators on different missions? What if a radar operator has had more than one pilot? In the European theatre, there was an additional complication because some of the Black Widow kills were against unmanned V-1 'buzz bombs". Should these V-1s kills be included in the count? If V-1s are included, and if both pilots and radar operators are to be given credit for the kill, in Europe, there were two sets of pilots and radar operators who achieved six victories. These were the pair 1st Lt. Herman E. Ernst (pilot) and 2nd Lt. Edward H. Kopsel (radar operator) and the pair Lt. Paul A. Smith (pilot) and Lt. Robert E. Tierney (radar operator). One V-1 is included in the count for each pair of crew members. All of these crew members were from the 418th Night Fighter Squadron. The leading Black Widow crew in the Pacific was the pair Major Carrol C. Smith (pilot) and Lt. Philip B. Porter (radar operator) of the 418th Night Fighter Squadron, who destroyed five Japanese aircraft.

So far as I am aware, the Black Widow never served with any foreign air forces.

Sources:



Northrop P-61 Black Widow--The Complete History and Combat Record, Garry R. Pape, John M. Campbell and Donna Campbell, Motorbooks International, 1991.


The American Fighter, Enzo Angelucci and Peter Bowers, Orion, 1987.


Warplanes of the Second World War, Fighters, Volume 4, William Green, 1964.


American Combat Planes, Ray Wagner, Third Enlarged Edition, Doubleday, 1982.


United States Military Aircraft since 1909, Gordon Swanborough and Peter M. Bowers, Smithsonian, 1989.


Northrop P-61 Black Widow, Warren Thompson, Wings of Fame Vol 15, 1999.


E-mail from Eric Shulenberger on 548th NFS.


E-mail from James Truman on 547th NFS, which is still active as the 547th Intelligence Squadron.
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Offline splitatom

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2008, 05:04:35 PM »
they were used long enough for only one night ace and many more kills
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Offline Spikes

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« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2008, 05:27:05 PM »
Too bad we ain't got no night. :(
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Offline Karnak

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2008, 05:38:46 PM »
Remember, the versions that saw service in WWII were the A and B with the 366mph top speed.

It would be fun, yes, but it isn't going to be the 430mph monster some hope for.



(Best bet for that would be a Mosquito NF.Mk 30, which did about 425mph.  :D  )

(( Mind you, the NF.30 would be slower at most AH combat alts than our FB.VI due to high blown engines; top speed at sea level of about 320mph.))
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Offline 5PointOh

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2008, 11:04:53 AM »
Sure that isn't a real dark night in AH but theres semi night. Anyway I think this would be a great fighter/attacker to add in to the AH world even if it was the A/B models.
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Offline LLogann

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2008, 02:46:43 PM »
It would be a nice addition for sure!
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Offline DaddyAck

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P-61 Black Widow
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2008, 11:47:15 PM »
Yeah I like the P-61.  I actually had a dude on Ch.200 a day or so ago that tried to tell me it had a bombsite and a glass nose.  I politely tried to explain that with a radome for a nose that there was no bombadier as it was a night fighter.  Then they wanted to tell me that it only had the .50s OR the 20mm, again i tried to be nice and explain that no it has BOTH but whoomever it was just kept on insisting I was wrong so.... Anyway I digress, yes for the 61.
:aok

Offline Gowan

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« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2008, 12:09:05 AM »
i really like it, (and it looks hecksa cool too)

:aok

Offline lyric1

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« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2008, 07:50:07 AM »
This picture was taken in Indonesia at Morotai 1944-1945.

Offline 5PointOh

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« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2008, 08:56:12 AM »
Nice picture Lyric, the P-61 is a great looking ride and would be a great upgrade from the A20.  

Heres a P-61 landing at Iwo Jima
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Offline oakranger

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« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2008, 11:00:56 PM »
Japs hated the p-61 due to the color.  they fear the color black.
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