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Author Topic: Hopefully not another Waco  (Read 2633 times)

Offline Angus

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #30 on: April 09, 2008, 02:20:59 PM »
Boils down to the same though. All over the world you have highly focused religious groups going "ape", and that goes all the way from abusing to killings and suicide.
I watched a lot of Waco data today, and that means facing 2 theories.
One is the public one, where over religious-doomsday fans torched themselves after a siege.
The other one is the conspiracy one, where the FBI or others in black murdered a group of people and managed to get away with the trick except for some clips now on youtube.
Call me crazy, but I think they torched the complex themselves, and I think the authorities were quite clumsy in their attempts.
Lots of uneccecary deaths.
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Offline AKIron

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #31 on: April 09, 2008, 03:08:20 PM »
Quote from: Angus on April 09, 2008, 02:20:59 PM
Boils down to the same though. All over the world you have highly focused religious groups going "ape", and that goes all the way from abusing to killings and suicide.
I watched a lot of Waco data today, and that means facing 2 theories.
One is the public one, where over religious-doomsday fans torched themselves after a siege.
The other one is the conspiracy one, where the FBI or others in black murdered a group of people and managed to get away with the trick except for some clips now on youtube.
Call me crazy, but I think they torched the complex themselves, and I think the authorities were quite clumsy in their attempts.
Lots of uneccecary deaths.


They may have torched it themselves, I think we'll never know the answer to that. I think the ATF and the FBI were way overzealous in their persecution of those people though which ultimately led to the death of far too many.
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Offline Xargos

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #32 on: April 09, 2008, 03:15:52 PM »
The people at Waco died simply because the ATF was trying to justify it's existence.
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Offline Maverick

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2008, 05:15:55 PM »
There is plenty of blame for the deaths in Waco between both sides in Waco. Neither side is blameless, particularly in the case of the children.
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Offline crockett

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #34 on: April 09, 2008, 05:35:54 PM »
Quote from: Hungry on April 08, 2008, 12:25:37 PM
News this am on NBC, 14 year olds being married ( pledged) to 50 year olds was common practice.  It will come out.

Granted there are likely some sicko's in the bunch.. I really do wonder how much of this has been hyped up by both the athorities and the press.
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Offline RedTop

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #35 on: April 09, 2008, 06:57:04 PM »
Quote from: Ripsnort on April 08, 2008, 08:44:20 AM
We've yet see Chairboy protest this government intrusion on so many lives too!  :noid
:rofl
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Offline Maverick

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #36 on: April 09, 2008, 10:11:49 PM »
News story tonight indicated that the cult's lawyers are now presenting their arguments to suppress the search warrant and anything found in it's execution. If the prosecution can't cough up the girl and corroborate her story (tip) there is going to be a messy legal suit very shortly. Likely to be enough to buy more property build another temple and brainwash a bunch more kids. 
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Offline AKIron

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2008, 02:38:42 PM »
Quote from: Maverick on April 09, 2008, 10:11:49 PM
News story tonight indicated that the cult's lawyers are now presenting their arguments to suppress the search warrant and anything found in it's execution. If the prosecution can't cough up the girl and corroborate her story (tip) there is going to be a messy legal suit very shortly. Likely to be enough to buy more property build another temple and brainwash a bunch more kids. 

Sounds to me like what these people were doing was criminal but if the government can't make a case then I believe they are entitled to a remedy. Our government should do some investigating before it shoots up peoples homes or takes them into custody. We need to fire the lot of them if they can't do their job.
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Offline texasmom

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2008, 03:00:39 PM »
They have her voice recorded from the 911 calls she made. Why can't they just CSI it & compare with the voices of the children interviewed?
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Offline Maverick

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #39 on: April 10, 2008, 09:42:33 PM »
There are 400 children and a considerable number of other women. They may not have the requisite equipment to do a voice comparison and they may also not have a clean enough tape from the original call. In any event you shouldn't confuse the TV show with reality.
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Offline Angus

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #40 on: April 11, 2008, 07:06:08 AM »
Quote from: AKIron on April 09, 2008, 03:08:20 PM
They may have torched it themselves, I think we'll never know the answer to that. I think the ATF and the FBI were way overzealous in their persecution of those people though which ultimately led to the death of far too many.

To me it looks like it, - a bit.
As for the insiders, just not coming out, it means that they were somehow "held".
BTW, even in my small country, there have been cases of both fraud and sexual abusion within pockets of extremely religious groups, - people wha can hardly say good morning without mentioning Jesus.
And they go to great length to hide their stuff....really.
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline Chairboy

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #41 on: April 11, 2008, 07:28:36 AM »
Quote from: Ripsnort on April 08, 2008, 08:44:20 AM
We've yet see Chairboy protest this government intrusion on so many lives too!  :noid
I don't know anything about this story yet, other than some sensational sounding stories I read that suggested there were forced marriages of young girls to older guys with pre-age of consent sex taking place.  I'd like to know a little more before taking a stand.  What happened at Waco was criminal, btw.  Absolutely disgraceful, every aspect of how the government handled it.
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Offline Angus

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #42 on: April 11, 2008, 08:11:58 AM »
The newest I had from news it that a bed is being examined....it was in the church. The theory is that it was perhaps ritual-related. Yeachh. Anyway, never saw a church with a bed in it..
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline texasmom

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #43 on: April 11, 2008, 08:39:48 AM »
At first glance, it appears to be just a bunch of perv's who hijacked a religion for their own deviant, twisted agenda.
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Offline lazs2

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Re: Hopefully not another Waco
« Reply #44 on: April 11, 2008, 09:48:02 AM »
no matter what... the deaths at waco of all those people.. but especially the children were the fault of the government and us for allowing it.  The government shot first and they continued to fire the whole time.  when the first group of ninjas ran out of ammo.. the davidians let them walk/run away in peace.   They could have killed every one of the black clad heros.    The local sheriff said that he could search the place any time he wanted.   You need to listen to the transcripts and the interviews with the local sheriff and the guy who invented the flir system used.

As for churches that "marry" up 14 year olds as a reward to the old limp guys...  well..  that is disgusting.   Notice how they always find a way to make it some leader and his buddies get to bed the youngest.. why not 25 year olds?  If they weren't pervs and only wanted to increase the flock.. why not 18 and older?   

I am all for consenting adults doing whatever they want with each other so far as sex goes.   None of my business.   

I don't believe the government had a right to kill those 28 kids at waco and I don't think any church (or anyone) has a right to pass out underage girls as party favors.

lazs

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