Author Topic: Ramming other planes.  (Read 499 times)

Offline Spatula

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Ramming other planes.
« on: January 17, 2001, 05:10:00 PM »
Had a rough time with ramming other planes last night. I tend to rope-a-dope alot and that leads to a vertical HO at times with my nose facing downwards and if its timed not quite right i run the real risk of hitting the other plane.

Now what bugs me is that it seems to be me that always dies. It seems the ramming rules favour the person who has the either the lower airspeed or has his nose facing upward - not sure which.

Now the thing that really bugs me is that one plane gets wrecked (normally me) and other flys off like nothing happened - sometimes even gets a kill     . I vote to make ramming a mutually damaging affair - as it should be...

This "two planes collide, and only one gets damaged" rule is plain wrong.

Please i ask HTC to, at the very least, clarify the ramming logic used, and i petition them to change it to mutual damage.

Just so people dont start saying "well you should be more carefull", thats probably true, but it is not the point im trying to make.

Please reply to support or critique.

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[This message has been edited by Spatula (edited 01-17-2001).]
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Offline Karnak

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2001, 05:14:00 PM »
It favors whoever was on the front end on which the collision did not occur.  Due to internet lag when you collide, odds are their front end does not show a collision.  Even if their front end shows an eminent collision you lose because it happened first on your front end.

It can't really be done any other way.  They have to give each front end a chance to dodge the collision.

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Offline Spatula

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2001, 05:25:00 PM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Karnak:

It can't really be done any other way.  They have to give each front end a chance to dodge the collision.

I disagree, gun damage is calculated on your FE and sent to the other parties FE to inflict the damage necessary. Why is this any different? If they get the chance to avoid the collision then if they manage to, it should tell your FE that the collision was avoided, and no damage should be taken by either.

If both FEs get a collision then dmg is mutual. If only on determines a collision then no dmg should be taken by either (cause one plane must have avoided it).
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Offline Wingnut_0

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2001, 05:27:00 PM »
Spatula, I was just headed here to post the same dam thing..  

Karnak, so are u saying it's down to who ever see's the collision?

I've ended up colliding with roughly 10 planes in the last 2 months.  Some my fault, others not.  Usually the collision happens out of my sight "under my nose" and I have never flown away from one.  The other plane always fly's off to shoot my chute or whatever.

Intentional ramming is not a problem here and both planes should receive the damage imo.

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[This message has been edited by Wingnut_0 (edited 01-17-2001).]

Offline Dinger

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2001, 05:32:00 PM »
Uh... have any of you ever tried one of those sims where indeed rams kill both parties?  Trust me, the whines the current system generates are far fewer.

LJK Raubvogel

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2001, 05:34:00 PM »
Preach on Spatula! I've been noticing this for a while now. Seems that the guy with the lower airspeed wins everytime. Really annoying to watch from your rear view as the other guy flies away with no damage.

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[This message has been edited by LJK Raubvogel (edited 01-17-2001).]

Offline Torgo

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2001, 06:11:00 PM »
Indeed.

The current collision system is fine. (Indicated by the fact that it's whined about so little.)

In other games complaints about collisions have made CHog-whining in AH look like child's play. Dinger is right. You have NO idea.

Just trust me on this one..you DON'T want a system other than one where you die when your FE sees a collision.

Offline bowser

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2001, 06:27:00 PM »
If there were damage to both planes you can be sure the intentional rams would increase dramatically.  If a player doesn't care whether he dies or not, he probably wouldn't hesitate to ram the other guy.

bowser

[This message has been edited by bowser (edited 01-18-2001).]

Offline Dinger

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2001, 08:26:00 PM »
Because, experience from playing games with 2-party collisions shows that what you see as an intentional ram isn't.  Lag is about 1/2 to 1 second, folks (it's not just ping times).  So when the guy whom you think is intentionally ramming you actually slams into your plane, he's looking at an HO from 300 yards.  2-party collisions are a real eye-opener when your plane explodes 500 yards from the other guy's.
With the lag, it's very hard to intentionally ram somebody.  I have done it. Once.  In a c-47 vs. c-47 duel, when the other guy thought he could just fly straight and level away from me.

[edit: ok, so I didn't quite get Bowser's point the first time through.  Still, this is how 2-plane collisions work]

[This message has been edited by Dinger (edited 01-17-2001).]

Offline Fishu

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2001, 10:24:00 PM »
hihi.. I once rammed B-26 in my fockewulf accidentally when I misjudged my ability to turn.
Came with 6 hi attack against unaware B26, hit just couple and compressed below him, then decided to pull up if I'd get nice belly shots, but instead I did fly right past front of him and wondered next time did my SA break up or whered did that B26 dissapear - it had collided on my fockewulf going right up at 300mph. (guess I can call me lucky and him verry unlucky for colliding that fast plane going almost right up)

so hmm.. bit unfair things in the collision things if someone would train alot to abuse those.
although, this is probably best way to make it work.
but these accidental rammings without head on are quite funny

Offline Jimdandy

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2001, 10:36:00 PM »
I'm  always getting rammed.  

[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-17-2001).]

Offline Jekyll

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2001, 12:02:00 AM »
OK let me understand this.  You are advocating a system whereby BOTH parties take damage?

So you go vertical, I follow, you reverse at the top and I pull hard before collision and miss you.  Meanwhile, you are screaming straight down towards where I used to be, intent only on gunning me in the face.

On your FE, you collide.  On my FE, I miss (because of my evasive).

And you want ME to take collision damage?

Sorry, think again  

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Offline Spatula

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2001, 01:46:00 AM »
   
Quote
Originally posted by Jekyll:
OK let me understand this.  You are advocating a system whereby BOTH parties take damage?

So you go vertical, I follow, you reverse at the top and I pull hard before collision and miss you.  Meanwhile, you are screaming straight down towards where I used to be, intent only on gunning me in the face.

On your FE, you collide.  On my FE, I miss (because of my evasive).

And you want ME to take collision damage?

Sorry, think again    


No, *read* my second post. It said that if both parties FEs agree that a ram has occured (ie seen on both FEs) then damage is mutual. If FEs disagree then someone must have avoided the ram so no-one takes any damage.

[This message has been edited by Spatula (edited 01-18-2001).]
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Offline StSanta

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2001, 05:45:00 AM »
Yah agreed with Spatula, that rule makes sense.

Either there is a collision, and both take damage, or there ain't.

Not both  .


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Offline Lephturn

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Ramming other planes.
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2001, 07:39:00 AM »
Sorry Spatula, it would never work.  One person would normally ALWAYS avoid, even if by accident.   Unless the two planes were perfectly aligned from a long way out, you would NEVER have both guys colliding.  One player would see the collision, and the other would see a near-miss almost every time.  The end result of this system would be fly-through gunnery passes, and you don't want to go there.  I could bounce a buff by diving on it and flying STRAIGHT THROUGH, firing away, using your system and not have to worry about dying.  Net lag would mean that I passed behind the buff on his FE, so on mine I get a fly-through gunnery pass.

The current system is the only one that makes sense given the reality of the network environment we operate in.

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