Author Topic: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren  (Read 1861 times)

Offline moot

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Offline lazs2

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #76 on: August 19, 2008, 08:26:53 AM »
yep skyrock..  in kalifornia we pay our teachers about 150,000 a year (based on actual time working) and we end up with... well.. almost literate graduates.   Yep.. that is the solution.. just throw more and more money at the useless and failing public schools like in kalifornia and that will fix the problem.... or.. pay less than half as much for a catholic school education and get twice the results.

As for your stand on abortion..  you say it is a 50/50 decision between the man and woman but because the woman carries.. her 50 trumps your 50..   the only way to translate that (unless you are a public school teacher or student) is..   she has 100% of the decision and the father has 0%.. he is allowed to beg tho.

Of all the positions I take on all things.. my position on abortion has always bothered me the most... it is the most cowardly of all my moral positions... I have always said that so long as the baby is not viable outside the mother it is not a person.   I think that is a cowardly dodge of the issue but have never been able to come up with anything else.   I would love to see a morning after pill that worked 100% and then say any worthless slut who didn't take it would have to carry to term.

lazs

Offline RedTop

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #77 on: August 19, 2008, 11:34:12 AM »
Is there a link for this?

At the risk of being flamed... :lol

Try Hannity.com  its prolly archivied there for last Friday
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Offline Elfie

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #78 on: August 20, 2008, 08:57:16 AM »
Quote
Of all the positions I take on all things.. my position on abortion has always bothered me the most... it is the most cowardly of all my moral positions... I have always said that so long as the baby is not viable outside the mother it is not a person.   I think that is a cowardly dodge of the issue but have never been able to come up with anything else.   I would love to see a morning after pill that worked 100% and then say any worthless slut who didn't take it would have to carry to term.

lazs

Google up some pictures Lazs, that might help you solve your moral dilemma.  :salute
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Offline Elfie

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #79 on: August 20, 2008, 09:09:12 AM »
Quote
Try Hannity.com  its prolly archivied there for last Friday

I'm not seeing a way to check the archives, if they even exist.
Corkyjr on country jumping:
In the end you should be thankful for those players like us who switch to try and help keep things even because our willingness to do so, helps a more selfish, I want it my way player, get to fly his latewar uber ride.

Offline RedTop

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #80 on: August 20, 2008, 09:30:08 AM »
I'm not seeing a way to check the archives, if they even exist.

I'll look around and see if I can find it
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Offline SkyRock

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #81 on: August 20, 2008, 11:50:28 AM »
yep skyrock..  in kalifornia we pay our teachers about 150,000 a year (based on actual time working) and we end up with... well.. almost literate graduates.   Yep.. that is the solution.. just throw more and more money at the useless and failing public schools like in kalifornia and that will fix the problem....
:huh  46k a year doesn't quite add up to 150k a year.  

NCLB requires teachers finish an equivilant of 6 semester hours each year in PD(professional development).  The amount of hours worked during the actual "school year"(for me, it has averaged out to be about 10 hours a day), plus the PD during the summer(which we pay for ourselves), plus the extra-carricular activities that we are contractually bound to lead, my hours per year average out to be around.....1800 hours worked a year.  This is what I know personally and I have friends(teachers) who work much more than that.  1800 hours for 46k.  46k for 1800 hours of what is reguarded as the most important job for america's future. :rolleyes:

As for your stand on abortion..  you say it is a 50/50 decision between the man and woman but because the woman carries.. her 50 trumps your 50..   the only way to translate that (unless you are a public school teacher or student) is..   she has 100% of the decision and the father has 0%.. he is allowed to beg tho.
Pretty much.  It is her body.  

Of all the positions I take on all things.. my position on abortion has always bothered me the most... it is the most cowardly of all my moral positions... I have always said that so long as the baby is not viable outside the mother it is not a person.   I think that is a cowardly dodge of the issue but have never been able to come up with anything else.   I would love to see a morning after pill that worked 100% and then say any worthless slut who didn't take it would have to carry to term.

lazs
Well, we're actually close on this one.  In those first few months, it's just a part of "her" body.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2008, 11:52:12 AM by SkyRock »

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Offline 1pLUs44

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #82 on: August 20, 2008, 12:03:14 PM »
I was watching a debate or something a while back, and someone asked obama what a question was... and I still cant remember the question. :(
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Offline AKIron

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #83 on: August 20, 2008, 12:07:53 PM »
Of all the positions I take on all things.. my position on abortion has always bothered me the most... it is the most cowardly of all my moral positions... I have always said that so long as the baby is not viable outside the mother it is not a person.   I think that is a cowardly dodge of the issue but have never been able to come up with anything else.   I would love to see a morning after pill that worked 100% and then say any worthless slut who didn't take it would have to carry to term.

lazs

Here's one way to look at. How viable is a 2 year old outside the parent's care? Will it starve or freeze to death if it isn't sheltered? Would it be criminal to let it fend for itself and die trying? For that matter, how about all these people on welfare? Would it be reasonable to let them all starve to death? Well, that latter is aimed more at the bleeding heart pro-choicers.
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Offline BTW

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #84 on: August 20, 2008, 12:16:27 PM »
:huh  46k a year doesn't quite add up to 150k a year. 


Pretty much.  It is her body. 


Then why can she go to jail if her fetus body part is born addicted to crack?

Offline AKIron

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #85 on: August 20, 2008, 12:22:09 PM »
:huh  46k a year doesn't quite add up to 150k a year.  


I believe private schools on average pay their teachers less than do public schools. However, private schools do better academically than their public school counterparts. More money for better education is just so much BS and the proof is in the pudding.
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Offline SkyRock

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #86 on: August 20, 2008, 01:28:29 PM »
I believe private schools on average pay their teachers less than do public schools. However, private schools do better academically than their public school counterparts. More money for better education is just so much BS and the proof is in the pudding.
Take a look at socio-economic status of students and student teacher ratio, these two are prime indicators in any school be it private or public.

The issue of more money for teachers is to attract more teachers.  I think the certification rate of teachers in the classroom was around 30% just a few years ago.  There are so many students and not enough teachers that most states are forced to use teachers aides and substitutes as teachers.  Right now, the limit is set to 30 students per teacher mainly because there is not enough teachers to do the work. 

Now, moron got into office and pushed for NCLB, which basically put an enormous amount of paper work on teachers and holds them responsible for learning growth(even in SPED students) up to 100% proficiency by 2013.  Now, who would want to do this job for 45K a year?  It is very easy to post data about a teacher making $36 an hour to argue a point, but in reality the money does not equal the responsibility.  In many other "professions" a manager with this many people under him and this type of responsibility would be making 6 figures. 

If you want better education, you need to pay for the teachers.  Many are the first to blame teachers, yet the last to want to pay for them.   Teachers have been going "beyond the call of duty" for so long that most are accustomed to that and expect that.  Yet if you ask these people will they work 10 hours overtime a week without pay, and be responsible for the growth of 150 people a week, they will tell you where to stuff it.


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Offline SkyRock

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #87 on: August 20, 2008, 01:32:05 PM »
Then why can she go to jail if her fetus body part is born addicted to crack?
the laws are so messed up in this country that your question cannot logically be answered.  The way we handle our addicts is at best, criminal, and at worst, stupid as ****.

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"

Offline AKIron

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #88 on: August 20, 2008, 02:58:23 PM »
Take a look at socio-economic status of students and student teacher ratio, these two are prime indicators in any school be it private or public.


I thought you implied it was about teacher's pay and not the students? Which is it?
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Offline SkyRock

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Re: Saddleback forum: Obama and McCain answer Rick Warren
« Reply #89 on: August 20, 2008, 03:05:11 PM »
I thought you implied it was about teacher's pay and not the students? Which is it?
I stated it was about teacher pay, which is not high enough to attract enough people into the field. :aok

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"