SCRAP ENY ONCE AND FOR ALL

[noman]

It kinda sucks that you think that all that matter's were the ppl in the sqaud with u. If everyone in my sqaud quit today i could and WOULD find some one else to fly with. I been playing this game for 5 years and made enuff friends not in my sqaud to continue playing. I find flying against the horde fun. Makes life interesting flying into horde and getting them excited. But eny usaully not a problem since i fly the 190a8 as a main ride.

[hitech]

None of you guys have even bothered to listen to anything that I have said in this thread.   I've lost the friends that I used to play the game with.   The squad that I was in, the Screaming Devils and its sister squad, the Hades Angels, are no more.  They are Kaput! Finished!  Extinct!

One of their biggest beefs with the game was with ENY.   But it was the latest release of the game that was the straw that broke the camel's back, and caused them to leave and go try another game.

Anyway, now that I lost the people that I enjoyed playing with, the game really has lost its attraction for me.  As I said earlier, I am going to devote more time to my other hobbies, and give up gaming entirely.   It is just not fun for me anymore.

I closed my account a few minutes ago.

--

Many people have listened, but you seem to not really listen to the other people.  You seem to not take into account what other people say, and just repeat what you have said before.

Have you considered that it is not really ENY that is causing people in your squad to leave? How long has ENY been implemented? How many of your squad started playing prior to ENY being implemented? If they started after why is it ENY is now causing them to leave but did not before?

Have you considered that more people were leaving before ENY was implemented. So your argument is that we should have more people leave AH so that you can still play with your squad? Because that is what your desire leads to. So now is this really what your asking for, or is it I am just not listening to you?

HiTech

[Dragon]

Many people have listened, but you seem to not really listen to the other people.  You seem to not take into account what other people say, and just repeat what you have said before.

Have you considered that it is not really ENY that is causing people in your squad to leave? How long has ENY been implemented? How many of your squad started playing prior to ENY being implemented? If they started after why is it ENY is now causing them to leave but did not before?

Have you considered that more people were leaving before ENY was implemented. So your argument is that we should have more people leave AH so that you can still play with your squad? Because that is what your desire leads to. So now is this really what your asking for, or is it I am just not listening to you?

HiTech

+1
ENY whines are really getting old.




WTFG on the spelling BTW. No errors 

[Crash Orange]

Even if they were committed to knights, usually if knights have a numbers advantage in one arena, they are the underdog in the other arena.  Why not just switch to Blue?  Too many lepers in there?

This is massive flaw # 1 in the ENY-apoligetics. Usually Blue IS the arena with the horrible ENY, and you can't just go to Orange because Orange has 280 people online and a cap of 100.

Massive flaw # 2 is "If you want to have your horde..." Wanting has nothing to do with it. No one can make other pilots log off, or make one of the other countries distribute itself more evenly between the arenas. And flying with a horde or away from the horde has little to do with the number of folks online.

So while, yes, it's technically true that ENY problems are linked to players' choices, the game mechanics combine to severely restrict the choices available to any given individual, make the experience depend on a lot besides that player's choices, and aren't tied to the choices that most determine gameplay.

If ENY and arena caps were linked so no one was forced to play in an arena with a big side imbalance (either way) a lot of the problem would go away. I don't see how that could be hard to do or a bad idea. You have to exit the arena to change countries and the arena cap you see is for your country only. Instead of forcing people to switch sides, usher them to the arena where they're needed. I don't think I've ever seen a bad ENY situation in LW that wasn't caused by distribution between the arenas as opposed to the number of people actually online.

I don't understand the contempt so many here have for wanting to play for the same team steadily. But then I don't understand a lot of the contempt this place is dripping with in general. This forum is easily the rudest and most thoughtless hobby forum I've ever seen, and I've seen a LOT of forums for a lot of different hobbies. A lot of folks here need to switch to gel insoles or Wheaties that haven't been peed in or something, I don't know what it is. 

[Lusche]

.If ENY and arena caps were linked so no one was forced to play in an arena with a big side imbalance (either way) a lot of the problem would go away.

ENY was introduced when there was only 1 arena and NO caps at all. Side imbalances did still occur regularly. That's why ENY was invented in the first place.

Instead of forcing people to switch sides

Nobody is forced to switch sides.

[SlapShot]

This is massive flaw # 1 in the ENY-apoligetics. Usually Blue IS the arena with the horrible ENY, and you can't just go to Orange because Orange has 280 people online and a cap of 100.

Massive flaw # 2 is "If you want to have your horde..." Wanting has nothing to do with it. No one can make other pilots log off, or make one of the other countries distribute itself more evenly between the arenas. And flying with a horde or away from the horde has little to do with the number of folks online.

So while, yes, it's technically true that ENY problems are linked to players' choices, the game mechanics combine to severely restrict the choices available to any given individual, make the experience depend on a lot besides that player's choices, and aren't tied to the choices that most determine gameplay.

If ENY and arena caps were linked so no one was forced to play in an arena with a big side imbalance (either way) a lot of the problem would go away. I don't see how that could be hard to do or a bad idea. You have to exit the arena to change countries and the arena cap you see is for your country only. Instead of forcing people to switch sides, usher them to the arena where they're needed. I don't think I've ever seen a bad ENY situation in LW that wasn't caused by distribution between the arenas as opposed to the number of people actually online.

I don't understand the contempt so many here have for wanting to play for the same team steadily. But then I don't understand a lot of the contempt this place is dripping with in general. This forum is easily the rudest and most thoughtless hobby forum I've ever seen, and I've seen a LOT of forums for a lot of different hobbies. A lot of folks here need to switch to gel insoles or Wheaties that haven't been peed in or something, I don't know what it is. 

If ENY and arena caps were linked so no one was forced to play in an arena with a big side imbalance (either way) a lot of the problem would go away.

Not necessarily true.

Instead of forcing people to switch sides, usher them to the arena where they're needed.

Take your example ... Orange is locked out and the balance within Orange is fine and there is no ENY in effect ... so you log in and your are "ushered" to Blue where "you are needed" and the ENY for Knights is 20 and you are a devote Knight ... now what ? ... you don't want to switch sides, so you are basically in the same exact spot as you are now.

"Ushering" people is not going to solve the problem and more than likely cause a bigger problem.

[Soulyss]

So while, yes, it's technically true that ENY problems are linked to players' choices, the game mechanics combine to severely restrict the choices available to any given individual, make the experience depend on a lot besides that player's choices, and aren't tied to the choices that most determine gameplay.

The game mechanics actually do far less than the personal internal limitations the player places on himself.  Most the arguments I see about arena caps and ENY are made by people who seem to not be able to see the choice that they can make or have made.

[Crash Orange]

ENY was introduced when there was only 1 arena and NO caps at all. Side imbalances did still occur regularly. That's why ENY was invented in the first place.

Which is why I propose that ENY and arena caps work with each other instead of at cross purposes.

Take your example ... Orange is locked out and the balance within Orange is fine and there is no ENY in effect ... so you log in and your are "ushered" to Blue where "you are needed" and the ENY for Knights is 20 and you are a devote Knight ... now what ? ... you don't want to switch sides, so you are basically in the same exact spot as you are now.

Aside from late nights I don't believe I've ever seen a situation where one arena had a big imbalance and the other was even-Steven. I won't swear it doesn't happen occasionally, but I think it's very much the exception.

I think the root cause of the dispute is that like many here Hitech doesn't want to allow for people wanting to play for the same team all the time. That seems bizarre to me, but hey, it's his game and he can make whatever rules he wants, and overall it's a great game. But I don't see why anyone should be attacked and insulted for opining that the current ENY system doesn't work well and proposing an alternative approach.

[TheZohan]

you think the russians had envy to protect them .. no they had the numbers and mass produced  cheap equipment.
envy is just HTC's way of trying to make it fair and in away that may be true. but if your a good pilot the plane isnt gonna make much different. if your a newb your still gonna be shot down.

[RTHolmes]

The game mechanics actually do far less than the personal internal limitations the player places on himself.  Most the arguments I see about arena caps and ENY are made by people who seem to not be able to see the choice that they can make or have made.

+1

[hitech]

I think the root cause of the dispute is that like many here Hitech doesn't want to allow for people wanting to play for the same team all the time. That seems bizarre to me, but hey, it's his game and he can make whatever rules he wants, and overall it's a great game. But I don't see why anyone should be attacked and insulted for opining that the current ENY system doesn't work well and proposing an alternative approach.

And you are very mistaken, I really do not care what team anyone plays for.

HiTech

[Ack-Ack]

But I don't see why anyone should be attacked and insulted for opining that the current ENY system doesn't work well and proposing an alternative approach.

Explain how the ENY system doesn't work because from my standpoint it works very well for its intended purposes.  Could it be that you don't understand how the ENY system works and therefore are basing your opinion on faulty information?


ack-ack

[SlapShot]

Which is why I propose that ENY and arena caps work with each other instead of at cross purposes.

Aside from late nights I don't believe I've ever seen a situation where one arena had a big imbalance and the other was even-Steven. I won't swear it doesn't happen occasionally, but I think it's very much the exception.

I think the root cause of the dispute is that like many here Hitech doesn't want to allow for people wanting to play for the same team all the time. That seems bizarre to me, but hey, it's his game and he can make whatever rules he wants, and overall it's a great game. But I don't see why anyone should be attacked and insulted for opining that the current ENY system doesn't work well and proposing an alternative approach.

Please expound/explain your proposal on how one could connect CAPS and ENY and how it would be better than what we have now ... I am very curious.

Exception or not ... if it's a possibilty, then it will happen, and when it happens, under the conditions that you layed out ... it won't solve anything.

I believe that HiTech has gone to great lengths allowing for people to "play for the same team all the time" ... I don't believe that he will ever force/usher anyone to fly for a country that they don't want to.

What he has done is introduce a "limiter" that will "even things" up in an arena that has numerical imbalances and if YOU CHOOSE to fly for a country that has a superior numerical imbalance ... then you will be limited.

I don't think you were here before ENY was introduced, but the whineage and more than likely loss of subscriptions due to consistent (months at a time) country numbers imbalance was far more prevelent and damaging than ENY limiter could ever be.

Trying getting ganged day in and day out against a country that has 2 to 3 times more people than yours and they were all flying ENY 5 planes ... to put it in a word it ... SUCKED ... BIG TIME ... I have been here now for 7 years and it was just before ENY was introduced I had seriously considered packing it in.

[batch]

Im not a big fan of ENY but since I spend the majority of my time on the ground it rarely effects me. The times that it gets so high that I cant drive the tanks I want are very rare and usually last a very short time.

I can see the side of the argument that says arena caps (which Im not a fan of either) can promote continuation of high ENY. As this argument is basically stating that if 1 side is heavily outnumbered then more people for that side cant get in to even it as long as caps are in place. It is then suggested that placing an option on the front screen that allows only the lower numbered sides to enter a capped arena would fix this problem.

While I have no statistics or evidence that would or wouldnt work, nor does anyone else, I would say this about it. From what Ive seen the ENY is typically not caused by the caps and allowing more of the lower number side in wouldnt resolve the situation. I base that on the observation that most times when 1 side is low on numbers in 1 arena and has the highest numbers in the other arena its caused by 1 thing, people leaving the first arena to goto the other arena (usually caused by the other 2 sides ganging them). As was the case for several days last week, Rooks and Bish had high ENY in Orange and very few Knights in there at all. Meanwhile in Blue the Knights had high ENY with very few Rooks or Bish.

This was cause IMO by all the Knights who were "getting ganged" in Orange migrating over to the Blue arena where they knew they would be the horde. Nothing wrong with this if you want to be the horde and not the hordee, however its very clear once again that its players actions dictating and not the ENY or Caps.

So by allowing only the lower numbered country to enter a capped arena where 1 side is way outnumbered wouldnt solve much as players always want to go where they feel they have the superiority. Having that feature on both arenas could prevent that sure..... but then youre introducing just 1 more factor that someone will complain about. Now instead of me seeing Orange with 206/200 and thinking hmmm I might get in there in a few minutes, now Im going to see Orange with 85 Rooks/85 Bish/46 Knights and say...... no chance of getting in there for a few hours. Then look at blue with 100 Knights/30 Rooks/30 Bish and say ya I really want to donate kills to the horde.


Edit: wow that was long winded and probably doesnt make sense, I assure you it sounded wonderful in my head

[5PointOh]

ENY is not that bad.  Would you prefer ACS (Auto Country Selection).

Example:
Rooks:100
Bish:100
Knits:70

You log in and get a message that states you are defaulted to Knights due to low player count. After the Knights reach 100 then it just alternates which county gets each player as they log in. Wow, then those who wish to only fly to certain country would really have something to complain about.

Theres also plenty of planes that can take on the LW monsters that have ENY 25+.  Example 2: P-40E 6 .50s, dives nice and turns OK, and with the use of some tactics is a fun plane to fly.  Plenty of other planes too (I fly 95% American so I really cant comment on others).

I'm not saying ENY is perfect, but it could be a hell of a lot worse. I think HTC does whats best for everyone, not just one person/one squad/one country. HTC also gives the option to go to EW, MW, 2 LW, and DA arenas, a long with switching sides.  I also feel this is usually a one sided discussion.  If you're on the side that has ENY 0 and the other countries have ENY in the 20+ range, then I'm sure the low number side isn't saying "OMG Rooks have ENY 27, and Bish have ENY 21, and we have ENY 0, DOWN WITH ENY".  I think most are happy there is ENY when it effects the others.

This is just my opinion.

Have a great weekend.