Astounding Perfomance By RS/KS La-7 Group Leaders

[Strip]

(Killed + Captured + Crashed) = B-25C Losses?

Correct? That number being 25....

Strip

[Krusty]

Oneway, you check your AH stats in the MAs and it'll deduct every lost drone... It counts every formation you up as 3 sorties, and if you don't land 3, your K/D drops significantly.


Hence, when you say "just like the MA" -- makes me think it should do this.

It's not accurate to show it otherwise, since it's got way too many losses "slipping through the cracks" so to speak. Makes the B-25Cs look like they had a positive kill/death ratio! 

So, to avoid confusion I think it should always take this into effect. Always.

[oneway]

(Killed + Captured + Crashed) = B-25C Losses?

Correct? That number being 25....

Strip

No...Losses are everything BUT Shotdown's and Vanished...Losses = Bailed, Ditched, Captured, Crashed...

The only thing impossible to account for in the logs (though not entirely) is planes a pilot loses in maneuvers...

The only thing you can figure out is if a pilot sortie outcome is shotdown, and yet only 1 drone was killed...it can be deduced he lost a plane in manuevers...HOWEVER...it is impossible given the log data to tell if a pilot lost aircraft to manuevers if his sortie outcome was anything BUT a shotdown type...

Thus...I have tabs on all drones...even if the pilot hotpads and turns some back in....

There isn't any stat or calculation I cannot produce...and my Data is rock solid...I have manually checked it hundreds of times against the logs...

Before you guys start questioning the output...first ask me the calculation method used. In this case it EXACTLY MATCHES the format and considerations as expressed in the Public Logs

Oneway

[Strip]

So that is the formula that you used to come up with 25 deaths in the k/d formula?

[oneway]

Oneway, you check your AH stats in the MAs and it'll deduct every lost drone... It counts every formation you up as 3 sorties, and if you don't land 3, your K/D drops significantly.


Hence, when you say "just like the MA" -- makes me think it should do this.

It's not accurate to show it otherwise, since it's got way too many losses "slipping through the cracks" so to speak. Makes the B-25Cs look like they had a positive kill/death ratio! 

So, to avoid confusion I think it should always take this into effect. Always.

It is impossible for Kill Death Ratio to become negative...though Infinity and NaN are possible outcomes...B-25's will nearly always have a positive Kill Death Ratio

Like I said....Losing an aircraft is not a Death...not in my book, whether it is or is not in MA. The ratio simply compares how many times you killed vs how many times you died...

[oneway]

So that is the formula that you used to come up with 25 deaths in the k/d formula?

Death = ShotDown, ShotDownProxy, ShotDownCaptured....that is how AH totals it in the logs...and it seemed nobody had a problem with it until you did...

I posted the code....if its still unclear...I don't know how to explain it further

For Scenarios the ratio that would be the most appropriate is Kills/LivesLost...which would ignore the drones, and apply the rules as written...

Would that work for you guys...its a snap to change it...

Oneway

[Strip]

Well ain't I special....

Using the log summaries, killed, crashed, captured we totaled 21 "deaths" in frame 4 alone.

By the same definition we suffered 18 "deaths" in frame 3.....far above 25 for the scenario.

Strip

[oneway]

Well ain't I special....

Using the log summaries, killed, crashed, captured we totaled 21 "deaths" in frame 4 alone.

By the same definition we suffered 18 "deaths" in frame 3.....far above 25 for the scenario.

Strip

Like I said strip...those are not deaths...

And I gave you the drone report...

There are no holes in the data....

Your B-25C K/Per Machine Not Turned Back In  is   .13

[Strip]

So please enlighten me oh great and mighty Oneway, in non-code talk if you don't mind, how you arrived at 25 deaths.

(If its not too much trouble can you show actual numbers being applied to your process?)

You certainly haven't used any definition of "death" I have seen before. This is what the problem is, by normal MA and Scenario rules the K/D is different.

Strip

[oneway]

So please enlighten me oh great and mighty Oneway, in non-code talk if you don't mind, how you arrived at 25 deaths.

(If its not too much trouble can you show actual numbers being applied to your process?)

You certainly haven't used any definition of "death" I have seen before. This is what the problem is, by normal MA and Scenario rules the K/D is different.

Strip

Scenario Deaths are ShotDown, ShotDownProxy and ShotDownCaptured...

You can check it yourself...smart ass

Oneway

[Krusty]

Not to nitpick, but an "even" kill/death would be 1. A "positive" kill/death is above 1. A "negative" kill/death is below 1 (a decimal). This is commonly accepted, and arguing the semantics isn't the point of the post.

If you two could tone back the hostility a bit, I think we do have a bit of confusion that needs clearing up. Perhaps I can help both sides.

Strip, I think he's only counting when somebody gets credit for your last drone. I.e. me in frame1:

15:20:14 Was shot down by lothmog.

I think the methodology is very flawed, since the kills/deaths for the fighters shooting down the bombers suddenly out-pace actual losses by leaps and bounds. "Magic" kills start showing up. Logically speaking that makes no sense. I'm thinking the methodology is flawed, and should be redone to include these.

Oneway, that's also one thing that's been an issue with the logs pages on ahevents.org for ... well since forever: doesn't list bomber deaths properly. It's a choice they made to simplify the logs. Not equatable to "MA scoring" or anything -- just the way they formatted these. When scenarios or FSOs are run that add points for lost bombers, killed bombers, etc, they do go in and count specifically how many were lost and add the details up as needed. It's just that for the general public they don't re-write the code. This may be where we disagree with you. That's not a "standard" -- it's just the way they format the logs for public viewing. It's not indicative of how the actual scenarios are scored for losses based on plane types or anything.

Hope this helps clear things up a bit.

[oneway]

.

[Strip]

Why bother anymore....

[Krusty]

Frame 1: 13 GvBAP lists 4 pilots "killed" on our side of the logs, 251 GvBAP lists 3 (counting "by unknown players" -- not sure if 1way doing that also)

Basically only when it lists "15:21:02 Was shot down by HotRod1 (crashed)." [from tudza, frame1] does it add 1 to the death list.

That's how he added those up. So frame 1 would only net 7 by that criteria (as mentioned I disagree, I'm just trying to explain it more as it stands)

Edit: Checking the logs and updating as I do: By that criteria, no "deaths" in frame 2 at all. checking frame 3 and 4

Frame 3 would be 12 total for both units

Frame 4 would be 4 total for both. So given that I probably missed a couple here and there, like my disco counted as a death to somebody, that's around the 25 deaths listed. Again, not saying I agree, just clearing up the issue.

[oneway]

I did, your numbers are wrong....

Frame 4 Shotdown + ShotDownProxy + ShotDownCaptured = 21

Frame 3 Shotdown + ShotDownProxy + ShotDownCaptured = 18

Thats way above 25 for the scenario and that is not counting drones, I still don't see anyway to get that number.

Strip

STOP IT STRIP!

THE LOGS SAY NOTHING OF THE SORT!!!!!!!!

I already told you that Drones are not being counted...

If you want to count drones write your own program...

My program CAN ACCOUNT for DRONES....BUT THE K/D IS NOT COUNTING DRONES....

Get it through your thick head....

Across all 4 Frames....B-25C pilots had their Sortie Ended in a ShootDown ONLY 25 times

B-25 sorties whose outcome WasShotDown 25
frame1  GypsyB  Outcome: ShotDown at 15:18:42
frame1  GypsyB  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:18:45
frame1  Krusty  Outcome: ShotDown at 15:20:14
frame1  Soulyss  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 15:19:37
frame1  gas50  Outcome: ShotDown at 15:20:51
frame1  tudza  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 15:21:02
frame1  tudza  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:16:08
frame1  Teufel  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:36:13
frame3  cactus  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:14:49
frame3  cactus  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:55:47
frame3  GypsyB  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:11:22
frame3  GypsyB  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:53:20
frame3  Krusty  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:15:48
frame3  Soulyss  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:11:56
frame3  Soulyss  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:58:19
frame3  gas50  Outcome: ShotDown at 14:39:09
frame3  Strip  Outcome: ShotDown at 14:39:35
frame3  Beefcake  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:01:53
frame3  Beefcake  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:54:10
frame3  A8hunter  Outcome: ShotDown at 16:56:17
frame3  Duke  Outcome: ShotDown at 14:40:25
frame4  GypsyB  Outcome: ShotDown at 14:54:44
frame4  Popsman  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 14:54:37
frame4  gas50  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 16:38:50
frame4  Strip  Outcome: ShotDownProxy at 14:59:01