Herding Arenas !!!

[Reaper90]

But raising the cap just exasperates the problem.  It would keep the disparity between the two arenas even longer.

But why is the disparity between the two arenas a problem as long as they more populated arena isn't "too populated?" The "problem" only becomes a problem when we have 400, 500 or more people in an arena, that it becomes the "cesspool" apparently that Skuzzy referred to. If LWO has 250 and LWB only has 30, why does that matter? LWO in this case has plenty of fights everywhere but not too many people, LWB is empty enough to satisfy low-ENY toolshedders, auto-ack fighters, and undefended base-rollers who don't want a fight.

At least with the 100 or 150 cap the larger arena isn't an issue because there is essentially the same number of people in both arenas.

except for those who didn't log in when they couldn't go where they wanted.

It invalidates the argument that everyone uses about being in the "bigger" arena because there is no "bigger" arena.

Once again, why is one arena being more populated a problem as long as there aren't too many people there?

It seems like your problem is there is only 100 or 150 people to fight instead of the caps.

Kinda yes, and kinda no.

Yes, because most times I've ever been on having as few as 100 or so people in an arena, especially a big map, is a recipe for "not too damm much going on in here," and I pay to have a fight, preferrably a big one. No, because 25 or 30 players per country spread scross a big map is almost as boring as 4 or 5 players per country. And it's not the caps themselves that are the blame, but the rediculously low number they're set at that are to blame.

By the time you get 150 in an arena you're just starting to get the action going. Why cap it at that point just so you can force people into the arena where nothing as happening? It's almost as if the AH god looked down and said "What is this? 150 people in an arena?? We can't have a fun fight starting there, let's cap it before the fun gets better, and force people into LWBoring." At least let the arena fill up to the "optimum number" before locking the door.

I still say caps are good but should never be set below 250 or 300.

[bustr]

Too bad the game doesnt have player numbers responsive "Transformer" maps.

What would be a "Transformer" map?

I'm sure after all this time HiTech has worked out how much territory 20 players really use to fight each other. Create a map that grows or morphs in territory size proportionatly to the number of players using it. Currently the strat moves to the backfeild after a certain number of feilds are taken as a morphing action. Why not have 3 or 4 map overlays like rings that respond to player numbers that ever increase territory equaly outward from a central very small "IDEAL" 20-40 player combat map. Every map transformation just increases the number of additional feilds you have to capture to win the war.

It's probably not fesable but, I get tired of watching you guys chew on each other. I've flown AW and AH for almost 20 years and POTW calls me "grandpaw". In all that time I was impressed with a consistant factor. The overall creativity and intelligence of the kind of person drawn to the game. I don't know that any of us has the answer to this complex issue. But chewing on each other and HiTech has never been very productive. HiTech is concerned about it which is obvious. He split the LWMA , instituted ENY and CAPs. All WE have ever done about it is abuse the game rules on ch200, whine at HiTech and DEMAND MORE or threaten to leave......while you are at it do you want your congress man to hold a hearing and get even for you by nationalising Aces High? I can see it..."Ace the Bammer High" the finest multiculteral online love fest your tax dollars can afford curtosy of a single disgruntled player getting even.

I'm sure the government will chain HiTech to his desk so you can come by on weekdays to horse whip him because he abused you so much by not giving you exactly what you want........ Oooh does this mean 190's that fly faster than 262's and out turn spitfires at any speed while cloked like a Klingon battel cruiser......Sounds like World of Warcraft.........I hear they got nekkid girlies on one of the WoW servers.

[pervert]

Please for the love of god do something about this.  I have no understanding why this is the way it is.  For my monthly subscription I EXPECT to have a choice where I can fly.  With the amount of time available to me to actually get on-line and enjoy some air time, I find it extremely frustrating to see this.  180/100 Orange 46/250 Blue.  If something does not get done about this I am canceling my subscription and wont bother your forums with my whining again.  At the very least some kind of explanation for why this is, cant we just have a cap of 500 per arena and allow those to choose where they fly?  Done!  Guess I'll go wash the car instead of getting some of my monies worth on-line!

Why not just email him this? rather than posting it here? A big arena is actually harder to find an equal fight in TT once a week is a cesspool of dweebery, and always has been even back in the old arena. The whole cancelling my subscription threat how lame    either cancel it or complain to htc posting it in public as a threat is pathetic 'throw my toys out of pram' 

[AWwrgwy]

But why is the disparity between the two arenas a problem as long as they more populated arena isn't "too populated?"
Yes, because most times I've ever been on having as few as 100 or so people in an arena, especially a big map, is a recipe for "not too damm much going on in here," and I pay to have a fight, preferrably a big one. No, because 25 or 30 players per country spread scross a big map is almost as boring as 4 or 5 players per country. And it's not the caps themselves that are the blame, but the rediculously low number they're set at that are to blame.

The disparity is a problem because the argument that is first and always brought up is "I can't find a good fight". 

At 12:01 central, when caps kick in, the numbers are usually 200ish/100-30/150.

With 24hr caps, where caps would never have to kick in, you would probably see 100/100-130/150, negating the above argument.

except for those who didn't log in when they couldn't go where they wanted.

Why do they want to be where they want to be?  We've removed the "can't find a fight".  It must be the "can't fly with my squaddies".  We know how to fix that.  We can do that now.  Everyone change arenas.

Yes, because most times I've ever been on having as few as 100 or so people in an arena, especially a big map, is a recipe for "not too damm much going on in here," and I pay to have a fight, preferrably a big one. No, because 25 or 30 players per country spread scross a big map is almost as boring as 4 or 5 players per country. And it's not the caps themselves that are the blame, but the rediculously low number they're set at that are to blame.

By the time you get 150 in an arena you're just starting to get the action going. Why cap it at that point just so you can force people into the arena where nothing as happening? It's almost as if the AH god looked down and said "What is this? 150 people in an arena?? We can't have a fun fight starting there, let's cap it before the fun gets better, and force people into LWBoring." At least let the arena fill up to the "optimum number" before locking the door.

The funny thing is is that most of the cap threads that aren't about "I can't fly with my squaddies", IE: prime time USA are about right after caps begin at noon where everyone is in the other arena.  The one you can't get into rarely has more than 200 people in it anyway.

Caps all the time, both arenas would be prime to "just starting to get the action going" all the time when at non-peak times.

9:07 AM July 5th:



By your argument, there's no point in flying anywhere at this time.  With 24hr caps, the numbers would be identical but you, and everyone else, would be forced into the one arena with 20 people, which would fill up quickly and approach the 100 in the full arena in a short time.  I mean, what else are you going to do?   

This may be the fatal flaw of my argument however.  How many would see the 20 and just say "screw it" and not populate the arena?

My solution to that would be, don't show the numbers.  "OPEN" or "FULL" only.

With a hard cap of 100, anyone leaving that arena would open a spot.  The "screw it"s would have a better chance of getting into the "full" arena as well.



wrongway

[Blooz]

Hmmm...searched a bit. Didn't find anything about.......

Anyone thought of floating caps 24hrs and changing the maps at 12noon and 12midnight?

Small maps during off peak hours changing to large maps for prime time?

Only thing is the reset....would that be a problem? I seem to remember resets being a problem people getting dumped in the middle of flights and such. How do we get around that? Even so, if it's not a problem, would a reset at midnight central US time every night be a problem?

[RTHolmes]

How many would see the 20 and just say "screw it" and not populate the arena?

my guess - many

[Reaper90]

The disparity is a problem because the argument that is first and always brought up is "I can't find a good fight". 

Capping the more populated arena at 100 and forcing everyone to the dead arena creates this problem, Wrongway, not solves it, at least not for quite some time until the dead arena slowly populates. By then I've found something better to do.

With 24hr caps, where caps would never have to kick in, you would probably see 100/100-130/150, negating the above argument.

24 hour caps at 100 or 150 per arena would be idiotic, man. Good grief! LOL

Why do they want to be where they want to be?  We've removed the "can't find a fight".  It must be the "can't fly with my squaddies".  We know how to fix that.  We can do that now.  Everyone change arenas.

So if I go to log in, and 3 or 4 or more of our squaddies are in LWO and no one in LWB, I pm them and tell them all to drop the fight they're in and change arenas so they can also not have anyone to fight against? YAY!! Let's all attack the auto-ack together!!!

 

The funny thing is is that most of the cap threads that aren't about "I can't fly with my squaddies", IE: prime time USA are about right after caps begin at noon where everyone is in the other arena.  The one you can't get into rarely has more than 200 people in it anyway.

I'll take an arena with close to 200 people in it over one with 9 or 15 or 20 or whatever, 7 days a week 110% of the time.

By your argument, there's no point in flying anywhere at this time.  With 24hr caps, the numbers would be identical but you, and everyone else, would be forced into the one arena with 20 people, which would fill up quickly and approach the 100 in the full arena in a short time.  I mean, what else are you going to do?   

By your argument, those arenas would be 101/100 and 9/150...... no thanks. I'd rather be the 102nd person, not the 10th. I'd rather have 200+ people to play with, but at 9am, you take what you can get! 

This may be the fatal flaw of my argument however.  How many would see the 20 and just say "screw it" and not populate the arena?

:raises hand:

My solution to that would be, don't show the numbers.  "OPEN" or "FULL" only.

Would solve a lot of problems, wouldn't it? But my guess is people would complain more, not less!

With a hard cap of 100, anyone leaving that arena would open a spot.  The "screw it"s would have a better chance of getting into the "full" arena as well.

How 'bout a hard cap of 300 and we're both happy?

[kvuo75]

24 hour caps at 100 or 150 per arena would be idiotic, man. Good grief! LOL

considering hitech himself has suggested he might just try multiple arenas with hard cap of 150 each, I have a feeling 150 is his magic number.

How 'bout a hard cap of 300 and we're both happy?

i think that is into cesspool territory, according to HTC.

[SlapShot]

Change the "Players/Max" column to "Status" ... and the status would only be "Open" or "Full" ... presenting those numbers causes more angst than what their worth as far as I am concerned.

[Lusche]

considering hitech himself has suggested he might just try multiple arenas with hard cap of 150 each, I have a feeling 150 is his magic number.

Unfortunately, 150 is where it's starting to be fun for me. But since caps, I have to stay up until US prime time (about 1-3am here) for such numbers. At my prime time there are 150-250 players online, but split between two arenas.

Yes, I know I sound like a broken record... but along with the recent dar range changes, it's greally building up a lot of frustration for me.

[kvuo75]

Unfortunately, 150 is where it's starting to be fun for me. But since caps, I have to stay up until US prime time (about 1-3am here) for such numbers. At my prime time there are 150-250 players online, but split between two arenas.

Yes, I know I sound like a broken record... but along with the recent dar range changes, it's greally building up a lot of frustration for me.

we're on about the same time of day it seems.. like right now...  its orange(pink) 149/100, blue 103/150..   i can't see what the difference would be if all 252 were in one arena, other than country channel and 200 would scroll faster.  but, if u say it's fun for you, so be it, i cant tell you what's fun for you.. I personally find enough to do right now in blue with 103 ppl.. if it's a little slow at times, I go outside and have a smoke. ( you can alt-tab and work on a chart


 

[RTHolmes]

150 in an arena is the absolute bare minimum for a fight. thats 50 per side, 25 per front. of the 25, 5 afk or sitting in manned guns leaves 20 active on each front. of the 20 maybe 5 in gvs leaves 15 in aircraft. 5 in buffs leaves 10 in fighters/attack planes. say 2 of em doing buff intercept leaves 8v8 fighters/attack planes fight on each front. thats the same as a squad duel, except a couple of those are 2 weekers who are just bait/flying around the first base they arrive at when they log in, killshooting and augering. if you're very lucky, 150 in an arena might make a decent fight at one single base on each front assuming no one wants to take bases and the sides are even and not ganging 2 countries on 1.

if you want to see/take part in the full range of tactical and strategic activities the game offers, or do anything close to historical mission profiles you need min 300 in an arena, at that stage you can choose the kind of game experience you want.

arenas with more than 600 may create bad gameplay issues, but arenas with less that 300 cause different gameplay issues, which are equally detrimental imho.

[kvuo75]

150 in an arena is the absolute bare minimum for a fight. thats 50 per side, 25 per front. of the 25, 5 afk or sitting in manned guns leaves 20 active on each front. of the 20 maybe 5 in gvs leaves 15 in aircraft. 5 in buffs leaves 10 in fighters/attack planes. say 2 of em doing buff intercept leaves 8v8 fighters/attack planes fight on each front. thats the same as a squad duel, except a couple of those are 2 weekers who are just bait/flying around the first base they arrive at when they log in, killshooting and augering. if you're very lucky, 150 in an arena might make a decent fight at one single base on each front assuming no one wants to take bases and the sides are even and not ganging 2 countries on 1.

that all sounds good in principle, but at the moment i count 9 bases flashing on our fronts..  and the countries are 32/33/41.

maybe our idea of a good "fight" is different.. I personally don't care for the full bar vs full bar (or more) cluster-F's that you see when theres 100+ on each side (well, sometimes it's a blast, I must admit), But I usually have better actual fights in things that are usually under 5v5. more commonly even less..

[RTHolmes]

that all sounds good in principle, but at the moment i count 9 bases flashing on our fronts..  and the countries are 32/33/41.

yeah but 1 wirb rolling to a town/ 1 buff or suicide attack plane on a pork sortie does not constitute a "fight" for me. 5v5 at 9 bases (10v10 inc buffs and GVs) is 350ish (inc afks) ...

[kvuo75]

yeah but 1 wirb rolling to a town/ 1 buff or suicide attack plane on a pork sortie does not constitute a "fight" for me. 5v5 at 9 bases (10v10 inc buffs and GVs) is 350ish (inc afks) ...

that also looks good, but does not match experience... with 350 ppl, I expect to see giant missions because "screw the furballers" -- it looks like 2 full bar of people not trying to "win the war" , so the generals go "anyone not in the furball, let's take a base", and you end up with 30 people in a frickin mission.  you dont end up with 5v5's or anything close to it.


also, sometimes 1 good wirble (practice long range dive/toss bombin) or a solo set of buffs (practice 21cm rockets) is just what I wanna deal with and it's fun!