Tanks rounds shooting down aircraft.

[lyric1]

But you have not given any physical reason as to why it should not happen and that is due to the fact that if a projectile is fired at a moving target and the path of the projectile intersects with the moving target ... the moving target will get hit by the projectile ... doesn't matter if your shooting tank rounds at a plane or shooting arrows at ducks ... somewhere along the line, someone is gonna get lucky coupled with some good aiming sense and their gonna hit the target. Just because you say "it should not happen" doesn't dismiss the fact that it can happen.

Total bollocks ... your embellishing to make your point.

Karaya or Zazen will light you up with unbelievable consistency in flak guns or ostwinds, but I doubt strongly that they could be as prolific in a tank. They just might get you in a tank, but your chances of survival is much better with them in a tank as opposed to flak/ostwinds.

1st issue if you read the entire thread I made the point I am not sure how or why or for that matter how to address it. On the second point no I didn't embellish any thing I have listed & the two players you listed where not involved so it has no relevance.

[Nemisis]

I can & do now my issue is that it should not happen.

Why shouldn't it happen? Tell my why it is PHYSICLY impossibly for a tank (or self propelled artillery piece) to fire a round, and have it intercept the course of a plane flown by someone with really toejamty luck. I don't care if it didn't happen in WW2, because zeros never fought zeros in WW2. P-51's never fought spitfires in WW2. Clearly it is possible because you can hit a plane with the pintle gun.

A tank's shell is nothing but a giant bullet. The gun traverses slower and can't be elevated as much, but it still functions the exact same way.

[SlapShot]

1st issue if you read the entire thread I made the point I am not sure how or why or for that matter how to address it. On the second point no I didn't embellish any thing I have listed & the two players you listed where not involved so it has no relevance.

I have read the entire thread since it was started and all you have to say is ... "it shouldn't happen" ... and many have explained why it could happen, so there is really nothing to address. There is nothing wrong ... except you being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Yes, Karaya and Zazen were not involved, but those 2 are 2 of the most prolific gunners ... so your story of a guy who couldn't hit the broadside of a barn with an Ostwind can magically jump into a tank and be more deadly with it's main gun ... bollocks. If anyone could jump from an AA platform and be prolific in a tank's main gun it would be Karaya/Zazen and even then, they would most likely miss 99% of the time so your "nemesis" that took you down is more than likely a whole lot lucky more than he is deadly in a tank gun ... hence "bollocks" on your story.

[Dr_Death8]

If you subscribe to this point on the Baron no rifle was involved.

http://www.library.act.gov.au/find/history/frequentlyaskedquestions/act_memorial_stories/Red_Baron

I always thought that too, but the Military channel just had a show on last week where they proved that it would be possible for the single shot to take and kill him.  All depends on who you believe, right?

[Dr_Death8]

assuming you have different button for primary/secondary, spray with the coax mg (secondary).. once you start getting pings with the mg, fire main gun     the two diff rounds are close enough in velocity to use the mg's as a marker.

That is the method I use, especially with tanks without a pintle gun (T-34s). Most people don't ever use the coaxial, I use it all the time for the above described, taking down bldgs (ack), and to find range or clear lines of fire at another tank. If you get hit by small arms, then WHAM! DrDeath8 killed you, you know where those small arms are from. 

[lyric1]

Why shouldn't it happen? Tell my why it is PHYSICLY impossibly for a tank (or self propelled artillery piece) to fire a round, and have it intercept the course of a plane flown by someone with really toejamty luck. I don't care if it didn't happen in WW2, because zeros never fought zeros in WW2. P-51's never fought spitfires in WW2. Clearly it is possible because you can hit a plane with the pintle gun.

A tank's shell is nothing but a giant bullet. The gun traverses slower and can't be elevated as much, but it still functions the exact same way.

Only missing part on this issue to me is an actual gun site of the day. If that was there on our gv's & it could be done then fair enough.

Since we don't & HTC needs to have some thing practical for every one. Then we have what we have. I only asked for it to be looked at if they deem this is what we are going to get so be it.

Maybe some one from staff can end this debate with a reply of some kind.

[lyric1]

Yes, Karaya and Zazen were not involved, but those 2 are 2 of the most prolific gunners ... so your story of a guy who couldn't hit the broadside of a barn with an Ostwind can magically jump into a tank and be more deadly with it's main gun ... bollocks. If anyone could jump from an AA platform and be prolific in a tank's main gun it would be Karaya/Zazen and even then, they would most likely miss 99% of the time so your "nemesis" that took you down is more than likely a whole lot lucky more than he is deadly in a tank gun ... hence "bollocks" on your story.

Well you use the term Bollocks from my perspective you say I am not being truthful. I am being truthful & nothing will convince you other wise. So I am done with you on this thread.

[grizz441]

Only missing part on this issue to me is an actual gun site of the day. If that was there on our gv's & it could be done then fair enough.

Since we don't & HTC needs to have some thing practical for every one. Then we have what we have. I only asked for it to be looked at if they deem this is what we are going to get so be it.

Maybe some one from staff can end this debate with a reply of some kind.

How about for the sake of fun, tankers can lob up 1:1000 shots at 2k-3k planes in the sky and waste their ammo for a small chance.  If they hit one once a year, consider it like a hole in one and have yourself a laugh over it.  It is actually pretty unbelievable/incredible to have happen to you if you stop your blithering excuse making for a minute to think about it.

[Wmaker]

I agree that there are several points that most probably make this particular feat easier...but there aren't too much that can be done about it. One would of course be a look into the optics. I don't know if the magnifying abilities of the optics in different tanks are accurate or not. It is very cool if this is true. Another thing that would be cool to see would be real life sighting imaginary/symbols on all tanks. Unless I'm mistaken the current generic tank's gun sight resembles the one used in the Sherman series of tanks. Personally I don't see this as a problem at all. At least in my experience it's still quite rare occurrence one way or another.

Anyway, this thread made me think about a photo I first saw about 10 years ago or so and seems to be found online aswell...


"This haunting photograph, which graced every Caribou briefing room, was a grim reminder that the Viet Cong and the NVA were  not the only problem for pilots in Vietnam.  This incident occurred in August of 1967 when the Caribou (tail number 62-4161 - c/n  #99) flew  into the line of fire of a 155mm howitzer.  This was early in the transition of the Caribou from the Army to the Air Force and  highlighted the need for far better coordination amongst the services. The aircraft was assigned to the USAF  483rdTAW/459thTAS.

This photo is from book of photographs by combat photographers called Requiem.  The photo credit is as follows:  HIROMICHI MINE   Ha Phan (sic), Vietnam, 1967

A U.S. twin-engine transport Caribou crashes after being hit by American artillery near Duc Pho on August 3, 1967.  U.S. artillery  accidentally shot down the ammunition-laden plane, which crossed a firing zone while trying to land at the U.S. Special Forces  camp.  All three crewman died in the crash. Thanks to Peter Bird and the Caribou Association"
http://www.dhc4and5.org/USAF_1.html

You never know when it's your time...

[lyric1]

How about for the sake of fun, tankers can lob up 1:1000 shots at 2k-3k planes in the sky and waste their ammo for a small chance.  If they hit one once a year, consider it like a hole in one and have yourself a laugh over it.  It is actually pretty unbelievable/incredible to have happen to you if you stop your blithering excuse making for a minute to think about it.

Sure butt it happened back to back with two different guys. Odds would be on par with winning mega millions & power ball all in the same week on the jackpot. Guess I should go out & buy some huh?

[grizz441]

Sure butt it happened back to back with two different guys. Odds would be on par with winning mega millions & power ball all in the same week on the jackpot. Guess I should go out & buy some huh?

Idk... me thinks your story isn't as likely then as you claim to have been "several Ks out".  Embellished^3 perhaps?

[lyric1]

I agree that there are several points that most probably make this particular feat easier...but there aren't too much that can be done about it. One would of course be a look into the optics. I don't know if the magnifying abilities of the optics in different tanks are accurate or not. It is very cool if this is true. Another thing that would be cool to see would be real life sighting imaginary/symbols on all tanks. Unless I'm mistaken the current generic tank's gun sight resembles the one used in the Sherman series of tanks. Personally I don't see this as a problem at all. At least in my experience it's still quite rare occurrence one way or another.

Anyway, this thread made me think about a photo I first saw about 10 years ago or so and seems to be found online aswell...

(Image removed from quote.)
"This haunting photograph, which graced every Caribou briefing room, was a grim reminder that the Viet Cong and the NVA were  not the only problem for pilots in Vietnam.  This incident occurred in August of 1967 when the Caribou (tail number 62-4161 - c/n  #99) flew  into the line of fire of a 155mm howitzer.  This was early in the transition of the Caribou from the Army to the Air Force and  highlighted the need for far better coordination amongst the services. The aircraft was assigned to the USAF  483rdTAW/459thTAS.

This photo is from book of photographs by combat photographers called Requiem.  The photo credit is as follows:  HIROMICHI MINE   Ha Phan (sic), Vietnam, 1967

A U.S. twin-engine transport Caribou crashes after being hit by American artillery near Duc Pho on August 3, 1967.  U.S. artillery  accidentally shot down the ammunition-laden plane, which crossed a firing zone while trying to land at the U.S. Special Forces  camp.  All three crewman died in the crash. Thanks to Peter Bird and the Caribou Association"
http://www.dhc4and5.org/USAF_1.html

You never know when it's your time...

Interesting stuff Now that is what you would call a freak shot with no intent for it to happen it did.

[lyric1]

Idk... me thinks your story isn't as likely then as you claim to have been "several Ks out".  Embellished^3 perhaps?

No it is what happened in each case that was point of impact with the numbers I listed. The rounds would have been fired futher out than that until I was hit.

[grizz441]

No it is what happened in each case that was point of impact with the numbers I listed. The rounds would have been fired futher out than that until I was hit.

What were you in?

[lyric1]

What were you in?

Il2 I think. Possibly A20? Have to look at stats.