HVAC guys

[Dichotomy]

After dealing with the electric bills of the past summer and the house barely being able to hold 85 degrees I think it's time for a new system

Current

OLD 3.5 ton
lousy duct work
'insulation' is a joke

House is 35 years old and I'm betting this was the original unit.  1700 sq ft.

Got a bid on a 4 ton with new insulation, ducts, vents, adding a return in the garage conversion, for 13k.  Is this reasonable?  I'm getting additional bids but I'm out of my depth here.

[Meatwad]

Got a bid of a 90% efficient Trane furnace 80,000 BTU with 3.5 ton AC, installed for I think $3500.

Repaired the older one but its sucks the electric when the AC runs

Maybe its 90,000, cant remember

[NOT]

Get more bids, that is WAY to much. Even with duct work.





NOT

[Dragon]

After dealing with the electric bills of the past summer and the house barely being able to hold 85 degrees I think it's time for a new system

Current

OLD 3.5 ton
lousy duct work
'insulation' is a joke

House is 35 years old and I'm betting this was the original unit.  1700 sq ft.

Got a bid on a 4 ton with new insulation, ducts, vents, adding a return in the garage conversion, for 13k.  Is this reasonable?  I'm getting additional bids but I'm out of my depth here.

I hope not, most don't make it past 20.  13k is still too high unless that includes insulating the home and new windows too. 

Depending on the layout, the converted garage return could cost some coin, but normally it's just a matter of busting out some brick and running the duct through.

Is the furnace in basement, crawl space or attic?  How much access is there if in attic or crawl?

Was it 1700 before the addition or after?

Even a nightmare situation I don't think it would be more than 7-9k.  It does also depend on what part of the country you live in.

Contractor pulling permits or doing it on the "down low"?

[Dichotomy]

Permits

Attic

no busting necessary.. garage apt is closer to the unit than my room and has ducts but no return

[CAP1]

at least you have ac.

[TequilaChaser]

Dicho,
does the 1700 sq ft include the garage apt. ?

what part of the US are you in?

a 4 Ton seems to large for 1700 sq ft if you are also having new insulation put in.......... you should be pushing closer to 2,000 sq ft before thinking 4 Ton


just a quick figuring  a 3 or 3.5 ton (MAX )  would be better for your 1700 sq ft.............. if the unit is to large it will short cycle, which will not remove the humidity in the summertime and will just run up the utility bill both summer and winter.....

a 35 yr old 3.5 ton would be lucky if it could provide 60 to 70 % eff.   but todays standards, the equipment will perform efficiently very well, provided the contractor does a proper installation and sizes the duct work correctly......

most contractors undersize their ductwork installations to cut fdown on cost, which in return chokes the new equipment down and causes premature component failure....

Icould talk about this stuff for days..........

shoot me a PM or email if you need any help or tips ........ get at least a minimum of 3 quotes....... 5 preferably...

edit: you also didn't post what SEER rating that 4 Ton had ,  or if it is a single stage or 2 stage compressor ( heat pump I am assuming )......  also are they using distribution type duct layout,  or a full blown sheetmetal duct system?

or are they using Flex & Ductboard?

lot of variables to look at............ did they include any type of air purification, air filtration, air cleaner, germicidal units, UV lights, etc???   


hope this helps

TC

edit:  my old email e-card   I did HVAC for over 25 years....

--
RETIRED
Johnny L. Spencer ( NC / FL  Energy Analysis Consultant & HVAC Design-Implementation )

*Green Building Designation Certifying Agent for State of Florida
*Licensed Energy Rater  #814 - Commercial, Public Bldgs, Residential
*HERS Rater & EEM Qualifier
*Senior Consultant for Energy  Analysis
*Energy Sheets Preparer
*HVAC Take Off & Estimation
*Load Calculations for-
 -Residential/Commercial Buildings
*Custom System design/ Custom Duct design
*Indoor Air Quality Specialist

(***) ***-****  work mobile number

*This e-mail message is intended for the named recipient(s) above only, and may contain information that is confidential and/or privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this e-mail and any attachment(s) thereto is prohibited.
 

[Dichotomy]

TC I'll shoot you a pm.  The quote sheet is at the house right now.  I thought 13 k was a bit much but I know jack about this stuff. 

[Tac]

After dealing with the electric bills of the past summer and the house barely being able to hold 85 degrees I think it's time for a new system

Current

OLD 3.5 ton
lousy duct work
'insulation' is a joke

House is 35 years old and I'm betting this was the original unit.  1700 sq ft.

Got a bid on a 4 ton with new insulation, ducts, vents, adding a return in the garage conversion, for 13k.  Is this reasonable?  I'm getting additional bids but I'm out of my depth here.

My parents had their HVAC unit die 2 months ago. 15 year old unit. 5 ton unit. For the past 2 years the thing had been leaking the coolant and the house would take forever to cool down...and electric bill was coming in higher. $400 or so per month.

The coolant containment tore to pieces and you could see long crack lines along the pump and copper tubing. The inside unit had been replaced 5 years ago because it too had flipped out and died.

For $9k they got a 5 ton, 18 SEER Amana HVAC (heat pump) installed & with a 10 year parts and labor warranty.

I was there when the installation had finished. Let me tell you the house had been without AC for 2 days and in florida that is grounds for insanity. The unit was turned on and in less than 10 minutes it was at 70F. I was dumbstruck.

Compared to their old unit this one is 80% more efficient, removes up to 60% moisture from the air (which helps lot to reduce mold in the home and makes the air feel colder inside so you dont have to put it so low). 4 days later the house was a completely different place. You walk in and you can feel a huge difference from what it was before.

Power bill went down from $400 to $280'ish. Not bad at all.


You will obviously need to fix your tubing and insulation though or no matter what air you get you'll have issues with it.   

[TequilaChaser]

For $9k they got a 5 ton, 18 SEER Amana HVAC (heat pump) installed & with a 10 year parts and labor warranty.
 

that is in the top 1/3 median  price range and sounds right, least back when I left FL in Feb of 2009.......... our 5 ton 18 SEER 2 stage Amana HP systems were going from 8800 to 11K depending on what all was involved.......

those Amana units back then had a lifetime condenser replacement warranty as well as the 10 yr P&L extended warranty


CC Dicho.... got it


TC

[Sonicblu]

Not knocking what TC said, just adding to it.

get at least a minimum of 3 quotes....... 5 preferably...

Get referrals from people you trust first..... I'm a service contractor and I will get the bid 95% of the time if I'm the third or more quote. It boils down to value not just price.

I know if I am second third or tenth quote that it is based on nothing but trust. Or they would have already made the purchase. The more quotes the higher the price I can get.

Never make a decision based on the price.

Know what you need and want first then find a contractor you can trust to give you the most value.

[TequilaChaser]

Not knocking what TC said, just adding to it.
Get referrals from people you trust first..... I'm a service contractor and I will get the bid 95% of the time if I'm the third or more quote. It boils down to value not just price.

I know if I am second third or tenth quote that it is based on nothing but trust. Or they would have already made the purchase. The more quotes the higher the price I can get.

Never make a decision based on the price.

Know what you need and want first then find a contractor you can trust to give you the most value.

yep, what Sonic posted 

I covered that in our PM's ,  sonicblu,  I even suggested he might want to check up on the different contractors at his local BBB to see if there is any negative postings, etc....

<S>

TC

[Masherbrum]

After dealing with the electric bills of the past summer and the house barely being able to hold 85 degrees I think it's time for a new system

Current

OLD 3.5 ton
lousy duct work
'insulation' is a joke

House is 35 years old and I'm betting this was the original unit.  1700 sq ft.

Got a bid on a 4 ton with new insulation, ducts, vents, adding a return in the garage conversion, for 13k.  Is this reasonable?  I'm getting additional bids but I'm out of my depth here.

We just purchased a Dual-Stage 90% Amana and a 95% Central Unit, with Humidifier, roughly $4k.