Snailman's scary graph

[Arlo]

Pity.  It would be interesting.  I was thinking of FSO logs when I vaguely remembered something about 'objects destroyed'.

Wiley.

Like this?:

Event Logs
Fire in the Phillipines Leyte 1944

02-08-08 20:06:26

USN stats:
Pilots: 250    Kills: 115    Assists: 88
Objects Destroyed: 118    Deaths: 140    Landed: 58
Bailed: 21    Captured: 40    Crashed: 15
Ditched: 11    Disco'd: 13

Japanese stats:
Pilots: 271    Kills: 197    Assists: 138
Objects Destroyed: 189    Deaths: 73    Landed: 149
Bailed: 13    Captured: 16    Crashed: 41
Ditched: 12    Disco'd: 16

[pembquist]

Any attempt to create a beginners arena is effectively pointless.  Any way you cut it, coming into the MA you're going to have a bad time at first.  It's just the nature of the game.
Wiley.

I think this is a bit of baby with the bathwater. Sure a handicapping system might be complex so maybe that wouldn't work but I think the game would benefit from an arena more capable than the TA especially for beginners. A start would be an arena with a small terrain with one airfield with ten airspawns that lead to different alts with AI drones waiting at each spawn. No missions to try to find out how to use and start, a high ratio of maneuvering and shooting to mouse clicking, waiting, climbing out, dying etc.

[Wiley]

I think this is a bit of baby with the bathwater. Sure a handicapping system might be complex so maybe that wouldn't work but I think the game would benefit from an arena more capable than the TA especially for beginners. A start would be an arena with a small terrain with one airfield with ten airspawns that lead to different alts with AI drones waiting at each spawn. No missions to try to find out how to use and start, a high ratio of maneuvering and shooting to mouse clicking, waiting, climbing out, dying etc.

Yeah, that was what I had in mind when I mentioned the offline missions, just having something like a 'training' menu in the main window that would have a set of buttons that would automatically launch something like you suggested there as 'general training', maybe a few others like 'bomber killing', 'bomber defence', 'jabo', and anything else that seems relevant.  Have them like you say, airstarts, quick to get to.  Click menu, it loads the mission.  Nothing for people to figure out.

Wiley.

[Myg]

No way guys, only way for newbies to really get a taste of things and prep for the MA is a free, open TA; so that everyone, even old out of subscription vets can pop in and have some fun flying around with them.

Any sort of combat with flying will build bad habits into them at first.

[Wiley]

No way guys, only way for newbies to really get a taste of things and prep for the MA is a free, open TA; so that everyone, even old out of subscription vets can pop in and have some fun flying around with them.

Any sort of combat with flying will build bad habits into them at first.

What would they do in this free, open TA?

Wiley.

[Myg]

Well for newbies, something new is something new; fly around with other people flying around, trainers and vets popping in to help or to see if there are any new prospects. Some newbies maybe playing around mock fighting while others practice manoeuvres they see others doing with the trainers. With air-starts and the right environment; something like that could go a very long way to breathing more life into the new player culture. Guns would be loaded, but the bullets don't kill or destroy objects, same with bombs and ord that explode but do no damage. I suppose all planes would be unlocked as well.

[Wiley]

Not quite sure what the improvement is over the 2 week trial.  The only advantage I could see there is you could spend more time there than 2 weeks.  If you aren't interested in paying for it after 2 weeks, what would that offer that would make it desirable after a larger amount of time spent there?

Wiley.

[Myg]

Its not what it offers, its what It doesn't.

The point is, that with such a place; the 2 week free trail can actually be removed or lessened to a major degree. While it is important that new players get a bite of the game itself, its also important that they develop their skills properly. That can be done offline, but in an environment with others; it can be much more beneficial.

I don't know if the 2 week part of the trial is meant to be a extension of the running joke, or some sort of mentally gauged standard.

If people just casually hung out there and flew, even if they didn't want to pay; there is a danger that it could create its own "game" out of what it has, but more likely then not, even if you had casual people hanging out there. It would go a long way to providing a base culture for the rest of the parts of the game to grow, without the tension and turmoil found in the MA.

[SirNuke]

I think this is a bit of baby with the bathwater. Sure a handicapping system might be complex so maybe that wouldn't work but I think the game would benefit from an arena more capable than the TA especially for beginners. A start would be an arena with a small terrain with one airfield with ten airspawns that lead to different alts with AI drones waiting at each spawn. No missions to try to find out how to use and start, a high ratio of maneuvering and shooting to mouse clicking, waiting, climbing out, dying etc.

remove the AI, turn teamkill in, and I would fly such arena 

[pembquist]

Myg, I guess I respectfully disagree about bad habits etc.  It is easy to read bfm, acm, its easy to understand the concepts.  The hard part is that without other players there is no way to practice that isn't obscure.  You could make the TA free as a marketing thing but I don't think it would improve the new player experience. If you just want to work on your aim at 2AM for 20 minutes your kinda out of luck except for the luffberry circle offline.

[bustr]

You mean the Trainers who CM the training arena can't lethal up the guns and damage a bit. Then tell their "real' newbies to go furball at some pre arranged location on the map while a trainer watches and ejects vets who interfere? Post a schedule in the MOTD of several days a week a trainer will be at this playground to kick out unwanted griefers. Heck even create a smaller version of the DA Furball Lake as the playground.

People are not complicated in this case. If they can rely on a schedule, they will show up. Even if it's only one newbie occasionally. Then better for the trainer and the student who will now practice ACM with more lethality for an hour or two.

Other wise the DA furball lake seems to be working fine as the training wheels arena. You can tell their play style off the merge in the MA.

[Brooke]

I think that it would be hard to have a newbie-only arena.  If you try to limit it by stats, some griefers will have shade accounts that they keep at low K/D (or whatever) just so that they can go in there.  Also, any limit on who can go in there will mean very few people will be in there.  There aren't that many people in the whole MA at some times of day.

I think that the best way is an offline mode that gives practice with different things -- a training academy that you can go through offline.  Sure, an online academy is good, too, but few players are willing to go through that.

One of the ways that seems to work in games these days is offline training then online free period of try then paid playing.

[pembquist]

I don't think we need a newbie only arena. What we need is an arena with features that are designed for newbies.

[BuckShot]

I think that it would be hard to have a newbie-only arena.  If you try to limit it by stats, some griefers will have shade accounts that they keep at low K/D (or whatever) just so that they can go in there.  Also, any limit on who can go in there will mean very few people will be in there.  There aren't that many people in the whole MA at some times of day.

I think that the best way is an offline mode that gives practice with different things -- a training academy that you can go through offline.  Sure, an online academy is good, too, but few players are willing to go through that.

One of the ways that seems to work in games these days is offline training then online free period of try then paid playing.

there could be a message shown before clicking two week free trial. It should recommend some offline time before starting the trial, along with a link to some training vids or something. I would have heeded the recommendation.

I remember thinking "I wish I learned more offline before this trial."

[bj229r]

there could be a message shown before clicking two week free trial. It should recommend some offline time before starting the trial, along with a link to some training vids or something. I would have heeded the recommendation.

I remember thinking "I wish I learned more offline before this trial."

yeah....prolly more than not DL the game and pop right in, start asking endless inane questions. They would be FAR better served by practicing offline in some canned furballs (it's my understanding that nearly every time the game gets updated, the offline missions get wrecked? A shame if so, air-spawning into a furball of drones would give them better preparedness for the real 2 weeks, I would think)