GV Lag?

[MrRiplEy[H]]

You'll be able to take advantage of 180ms.  The way HT takes care of the difference in ping times is through smoothing.  There's nothing to smooth on an initial spawn.

Obviously I don't have the code but go online and try it for yourself with a couple of your buddies.  It's always been that way.  And I'm pretty sure YOU wouldn't be able to fix it lol.

Don't say so. Perhaps HT should hire dedalos!

[dedalos]

You'll be able to take advantage of 180ms.  The way HT takes care of the difference in ping times is through smoothing.  There's nothing to smooth on an initial spawn.

The server is sending data at set intervals and so does the client.  I checked years ago and it was every 250ms.  Therefore, 30ms ping or 200ms ping does not make a difference.  If your ping gets close to 250ms then it may make a difference.  But as I said, most people talking about net lag and how the game woks really don't have a clue.  However, if you think you can take advantage of 180ms in a GV you are a very fast man.  You can do something in the amount of time it takes me to blink my eyes 2 or 3 times  

Obviously I don't have the code but go online and try it for yourself with a couple of your buddies.  It's always been that way.  And I'm pretty sure YOU wouldn't be able to fix it lol.

Obviously you don't but you an state facts about it  
What makes you so sure about that?  Does the fact that I disagree with your non facts make you upset? lol

[dedalos]

Don't say so. Perhaps HT should hire dedalos!

All I meant was that he does not have the code and he should not be making these statements.  I am sure if the code did that HT could fix it easily but eagle really does not have a clue what the code does or does not do.

[BaldEagl]

The server is sending data at set intervals and so does the client.  I checked years ago and it was every 250ms.  Therefore, 30ms ping or 200ms ping does not make a difference.  If your ping gets close to 250ms then it may make a difference.  But as I said, most people talking about net lag and how the game woks really don't have a clue.  However, if you think you can take advantage of 180ms in a GV you are a very fast man.  You can do something in the amount of time it takes me to blink my eyes 2 or 3 times  

Obviously you don't but you an state facts about it  
What makes you so sure about that?  Does the fact that I disagree with your non facts make you upset? lol

So if it takes me 30 ms to ping the server and I do so just after it's sent updates does that mean it will be 280ms before someone else see I spawned?  And if the other guys ping is 120ms does tha mean he sees me spawn in 400ms?  You seem to know so enlighten us.

I'm not the least bit upset.  Someone asked how these things happen and I tried to explain.  Just because you like to troll me on the forums doesn't make me wrong and you right.

All I meant was that he does not have the code and he should not be making these statements.  I am sure if the code did that HT could fix it easily but eagle really does not have a clue what the code does or does not do.

Third is the way the game code is written.  Your computer is continually updated with other player positions.  The further those players are from you the slower the update rates.  This can be seen when watching a distant dot in the air.  It will sit still then transport several hundred feet then sit still again but as you draw nearer it's movement will be fluid.  

So this is wrong?  Please, again, tell us how it works then.

You seem to know all about this stuff yet you offer no explinations or solutions.

[dedalos]

So if it takes me 30 ms to ping the server and I do so just after it's sent updates does that mean it will be 280ms before someone else see I spawned?  And if the other guys ping is 120ms does tha mean he sees me spawn in 400ms?  You seem to know so enlighten us.

I'm not the least bit upset.  Someone asked how these things happen and I tried to explain.  Just because you like to troll me on the forums doesn't make me wrong and you right.

So this is wrong?  Please, again, tell us how it works then.

You seem to know all about this stuff yet you offer no explinations or solutions.

Not trolling you at all.  You just posted something that was wrong and claim knowledge you cannot possibly have (the code).  You are wrong because of the facts, not because of what you call a "troll".  After all, if you had a clue about how it works you would not be asking these questions.  BTW, I thought I offered an explanation. 

To answer your questions above above, no.  It means that server "waits" for 250ms.  Receives data, does what ever processing it needs to do and then sends an update.  That makes it a level playing field for slow and fast connections to update the server.  After that, you will receive an update at half your ping time.

So, assuming we exclude the code HT has in place to help the guy spawning:

So if it takes me 30 ms to ping the server and I do so just after it's sent updates does that mean it will be 280ms before someone else see I spawned?

No, it will be 250ms + (their ping / 2)

And if the other guys ping is 120ms does tha mean he sees me spawn in 400ms?  You seem to know so enlighten us.

Again, it should be 250ms + (120ms / 2)

Also include your computer processing time after the packet is received.

I think the above is right but I don't have knowledge of the code so I could be missing something (or a lot).  The only 'fact' that I have is the 250ms send and receive.  I am not sure why you think any number of milliseconds would make any difference in a GV.  The original poster was talking about several seconds.  Do you think you could react in 100ms?

I am also willing to bet based on your question that you had no idea about the (ping / 2), yet you are here explaining things away lol

[MrRiplEy[H]]

All I meant was that he does not have the code and he should not be making these statements.  I am sure if the code did that HT could fix it easily but eagle really does not have a clue what the code does or does not do.

And I was serious. I have seen what magic a skilled coder can pull from his hat. Black or white

[icepac]

What's the longest amount of lag you can induce before the server will kick you?

I'm sure it's quite a few seconds...........surely long enough for a P51 in front of your guns to invert, fly underground for a pretty long time, and suddenly have the hand of god put him on your six.

It can be gamed to advantage in many situations whether defensive or offensive.

Your best defense is to film film film and, if you see this stuff from the same player over and over, check his stats for outright discos.    If he has very few, then it's possible he's gaming lag and you should send in a few short clips of it to HTC.

HTC has to walk a fine line with the threshold at which the server will kick you or they could end up having players quit if the server kicks them every time they have a hiccup in connection ping times so that threshold is pretty high.

As players, it's up to us to provide evidence of any gaming of lag that gives the lagger an advantage over players.

That doesn't mean you should flood HTC with films of every player you see lag but we do have a screenshots and films forum in which you can subtly point the finger without naming the player in your text in an accusatory tone since the icons in the film will identify him.

This could help players "self-police" this bad behavior by shaming the intentional laggers.

If enough players keep posting suspicious lag films of the same player, HTC might be inclined to check the arena logs for the player to see if said lagging player has a rock solid connection that only goes "fruity" when someone is on his six.......or when he spawns in a GV......or when he suddenly warps from the opposite side of a mound to right next to you.

Film it, check player's score for discos to see if he simply has a bad connection, then post it if you see something suspicious.

[dedalos]

Ice,

If someone was able to induce lag at will, wouldnt they be effecting them selves also?  They would have to only delay or drop sendin packets but not receiving.  Lag does happen and what you described sounds more like dropped packets or bad satellite connection.

I m not saying it is impossible but we are talking about a community that  needed to be told what alt-f4 does. I d be very surprised if anyone could do it on demand with out HT busting them with in a day or two.

[icepac]

Dude.....I'm trying to hip you to something without giving the entire forum a tutorial on how to induce lag and best game it.

[hitech]

There is nothing incorrect in eagles posting.

At one time I thought about changing it so that a spawn would occur instantly. And then decided I like the variable spawn time when it came to vehicle camping. Gave the spawner a change to kill the attacker.

The reason for the delay is mostly due to the way the server keeps track of who you need to see. It has a list of near people, and then everyone else. The server updates you 4 times a sec.

During each update, it looks at only some of the people in the everyone else list. So some times a spawn can been seen almost immediately,some times a few seconds after launch. It simply depends where the server is in the everyone else list when the player spawns.

Also the spawner does not always have an advantage. If the remote spawn point is far enough away, he will have the same lag as the camper.

As far as purposely inducing lag. This myth has been around since I started playing AW in 1991. The strange thing is that I have always heard accusations, but it always is the other guy doing it. Never once has anyone shown an advantage to be had.

The question is not if a delay could be induced purposely, it really is that there is nothing to be gained from inducing this lag. Your plane can still be killed, and flying on a very predictable path while the temporary disconnect is happening.

HiTech

[BaldEagl]

There is nothing incorrect in eagles posting.

At one time I thought about changing it so that a spawn would occur instantly. And then decided I like the variable spawn time when it came to vehicle camping. Gave the spawner a change to kill the attacker.

The reason for the delay is mostly due to the way the server keeps track of who you need to see. It has a list of near people, and then everyone else. The server updates you 4 times a sec.

During each update, it looks at only some of the people in the everyone else list. So some times a spawn can been seen almost immediately,some times a few seconds after launch. It simply depends where the server is in the everyone else list when the player spawns.

Also the spawner does not always have an advantage. If the remote spawn point is far enough away, he will have the same lag as the camper.

As far as purposely inducing lag. This myth has been around since I started playing AW in 1991. The strange thing is that I have always heard accusations, but it always is the other guy doing it. Never once has anyone shown an advantage to be had.

The question is not if a delay could be induced purposely, it really is that there is nothing to be gained from inducing this lag. Your plane can still be killed, and flying on a very predictable path while the temporary disconnect is happening.

HiTech

Thank you.

[dedalos]

Eagle, what ever you posted does not explain the OPs question. It does not even come close.
No one can take advantage of a few milliseconds.
No one is inducing lag.
4 shots do not take a few milliseconds.
Lag does not explain the OP question.
That is why I say you are wrong.

Notice how HT stated pretty much exactly what I said?

[Butcher]

this thread reminds me of joeblack, lol

[EskimoJoe]

Notice how HT stated pretty much exactly what I said?

You just posted something that was wrong

There is nothing incorrect in eagles posting.

HiTech

[dedalos]

good, now read past the first line.