9mm 1911's

[Gman]

Keep it simple.  Dont listen to the lectures on which caliber is "better", or which gun is better, or which platform is better, blah blah blah

Good advice, advice which pertains directly to the P6 you recommend.  Many countries, Australia being among them, have barrel length restrictions for handguns.  Canada for example has a 106mm minimum length for importation of restricted handguns.  You have to be careful when recommending things to folks outside of the USA as a whole different set of rules applies.  

FYI - I worked for Sig for 11 years off and on, so I don't disagree that the P225 surplus aren't a great way to go, however they are considered a prohibited weapon in Canada and are banned from import for most civilians.  Australia is a similar deal, and has complicated bbl length restrictions based on the size of the overall frame/pistol, but generally 120mm and 100mm/if pistol is 250mm overall measured parallel to the bbl, so the P225 at 98mm is out as well there.  Confused yet?

Anyhow, the OP wanted a 1911, and I don't see them as being THAT much more complicated or difficult to get parts for, or learn to shoot safely and properly with proper instruction.  It could be argued that due to the single action nature of the 1911, following the 4 major safety rules is even more important, and a good way to learn things the correct way first, with a pistol that isn't designed to prevent lawsuits.  I was taught with a 4" Smith 38 and a 1911 .45 before learning to drive, and things turned out just fine for me.  

[-tronski-]

Some great opinions thanks fellas

Mav -all great advice and I too prefer a stainless 1911

Smokin Loon - SIG make a fine pistol, but they are very expensive here with a P226 starting at $1600 with the X5 $2000+. Anytime the words Firearm & Australia are combined it instantly climbs in cost. A Glock 17 & M&P9l both start mid $800, with a Gen 4 nearly $900. And Gman is correct, the min barrel length here is 120mm so if I'm correct that if the P6 is a subcompact it is a restricted barrel length. But I also agree with Gman about your offer of Keep it simple thats a great way to start

No offense Tronski, and I have met some fine people from Australia, but those restrictions suck!

None taken - and they do, so you can imagine the frustration we have with it all

 Tronsky

[GScholz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULysvxSYfoU

Some gun pron to remind you what you can't have... 

[Rich46yo]

I wouldnt hesitate to buy a CZ 9mm.

I also kinda figured your reason for buying <wink> <wink> also included home defense.

I always had an interest in the .38 super. Most of all back when I was competing. I never got around to getting one but if your reloading then why not consider it? It, and the 10mm, were always rounds I wished I had a reason to buy. Add the .357 SIG to that list.

[mbailey]

The fact that im seeing people talk about the 38Super makes me grin like the Cheshire cat.....I shoot a custom IPSC 1911 (EGW/Baer) in 38super. Love that round.

Ive shot a few of the 1911s in 9mm, a pure joy to shoot..... one was a Kimber, the other a Springfield..Very enjoyable.

Smokin...I knew you had class       I have a Sig P225 which is one of my primary CCW guns, but also love target shooting with it, thing is a tackdriver.....great mention there sir!!

Biggest difference in the P6 from the P225 that ive read are the main spring is heavier (28lbs vs 24lbs)  And some blurbs ive read that due to the feed ramp, they (p6s) arent the most reliable with JHP rounds...theres a notch in the hammer of the P6 and the sights are usually just plain black........

None of these would mean much if your shooting ball target loads thru it, and they are readily available....

Good luck tronski....let us know how you make out sir  


Edit....sry tronski...just noticed the posts regarding your BBL length restrictions......scratch the P6


Rich if your ever in PA and want to shoot my 38super....offer is out there...shoot me a note if your commin out this way

[Gman]

I actually prefer the P225 over many of the P229 models as the slide serrations and slide itself are larger and far easier to manipulate with gloves on, or under stress when fine motor skills begin to degrade somewhat.  Outside of the USA the Sig P220 in 9mm is pretty popular as well, it's a single stack 9 round capacity variant of the P220/.45, and is more narrow and lighter than the 45 common variant, yet still has the (IMO) better grip angle than the P226 that the 220 has.  It also qualifies as importable both in Aus and Canada due to having a barrel length that is over 106 for Canada, and fits the 100mm/250mm overall for Australia.  Another good pistol as well.  There are many, many good options to begin with, but like the OP said, and I mentioned before, the 1911 in 9mm is a great way to start, and is one of my favorite pistol to plink on the range with as well.

O/T below.

I too shot 38 super back in the 90's and very early 2000's, I had a couple Caspian race guns that I used for competing up here.  Lots of flash and noise to get those compensators working, it's always strange for new shooters when they shoot them, seeing such huge flashes and unreal concussive noise, yet very, very little muzzle flip and recoil due to the comps functioning as they should.

I picked up a couple 10mm pistols back in the day as well, just things I picked up out of interest in the caliber and that were good deals that came by the shop/range I worked at as a kid and while in school.  1006 Smith and a Delta Elite Colt in 10mm.  I've never shot them all that much, but 10mm was a great semi auto round. 

Regarding 357 Sig - If you like 1911's, Sig Sauer offers various 1911's chambered in 357 Sig now.  It's a great platform for it, the bottle nose rounds have no trouble with feedramp stoppages with the 1911 design, and all the advantages of the round are seen with the 5" or 127mm barrel giving a little bit more velocity over most semi auto pistols in the low or sub 100mm range.  The round is already very quick obviously, and the bonus from the extra 10% length over many comparable pistols is notable.  9 round mags are standard, with 10's being around and reliable, giving a slim framed 1911 an 11 round capacity with 357 Sig.  The Commander length 357 1911's are great IMO for CCW, flat and narrow in all the right places with a good holster, and still with the 11 rnd cap.

[CAP1]

After 16 long months I'm just over 28 days (fingers crossed) from being to purchase my first handgun - the way things are here its very difficult to try different firearms unless you know someone at your club who has one and is willing to let you try it - which lets face it most shooter do. I've narrowed it down to either a Walther PPQ Navy SD or 1911. I usually use our clubs CZ SP-01, M&P 9l and a SAM 1911 .38 super but even though Ive never used the Walther if I went a polymer pistol I've been pretty impressed with what I've read and seen about it.
However even though I apparently have hands of a woman - I do love a 1911 so am leaning towards either a 9mm Springfield Loaded, Range Officer or a Remington R1 Enhanced.

Does anyone have experience in these or could offer an opinion about their serviceability, ease of maintenance etc?

In Aus you must have a legal reason to be licensed for firearms and mine is target shooting as home defence etc is not considered a reasonable legal reason - anything bigger than a .38 needs a special permit hence the 9mm and these are ok priced as pistols in Australia go.

 Tronsky

 i've got the Remington r1 enhanced in .45acp. it is my favorite of all of my pistols. it's a $%$% gorgeous gun, fits my hand perfectly, and almost seems to aim itself.
 the trigger's smooth as silk, very light, very nice short reset. she's reliably cycled virtually any ammo i've put through her.

 with the weight of the Remington, in 9mm, your recoil will be almost nothing. oh yea.....i'm biased towards my 1911's. i can shoot my other pistols all day long, but when i put my 1911 in my hand, it just feels soooooo dam good. 

 teaser....

[CAP1]

 The 45 will win hands down

 because shooting twice is just silly.
 because i want what i shot to stay shot.

 

[Maverick]

Lots of folks like top tout the 45 as the be all and end all of handgun calibers, usually pointing and degrading other calibers. The simple fact is that the real world stats, not ballistics tests, tell a different story. The 9 and 38 are very close in performance in one shot stops when the results of real world shootings are tabulated and morgue info is totalled up. The .357 mag is even better than the 45 even though it is the same diameter as the 9 / 38. The new slugs that have been developed has made a world of difference in performance compared the old ball or even solid lead slug we used to use in the 60's. There is no "manliness" to it, just the way things are. Handguns are lousy manstoppers and it takes a rifle or a shotgun at close range to really do the job.

The argument will live on irregardless of the facts since handguns / caibers are a point of subjective opinion for many who only have range experiance to base it on.

The key factor in any fight is shot placement. A center punch to the forhead with a 22 LR is far far better than a periferal hit with a 500 S&W. Shoot what you can hit with, not what some wag on a forum touts as the solution to all problems.

The OP has a restriction he has to deal with so caliber debate is moot.

[-ammo-]

Lots of folks like top tout the 45 as the be all and end all of handgun calibers, usually pointing and degrading other calibers. The simple fact is that the real world stats, not ballistics tests, tell a different story. The 9 and 38 are very close in performance in one shot stops when the results of real world shootings are tabulated and morgue info is totalled up. The .357 mag is even better than the 45 even though it is the same diameter as the 9 / 38. The new slugs that have been developed has made a world of difference in performance compared the old ball or even solid lead slug we used to use in the 60's. There is no "manliness" to it, just the way things are. Handguns are lousy manstoppers and it takes a rifle or a shotgun at close range to really do the job.

The argument will live on irregardless of the facts since handguns / caibers are a point of subjective opinion for many who only have range experiance to base it on.

The key factor in any fight is shot placement. A center punch to the forhead with a 22 LR is far far better than a periferal hit with a 500 S&W. Shoot what you can hit with, not what some wag on a forum touts as the solution to all problems.

The OP has a restriction he has to deal with so caliber debate is moot.

Mav,  you are correct of course in the context of the OP's original post.  Right on.

Arguing caliber, brand, revolver vs pistol, shotgun for home defense, etc... has, is, and always be a fun discussion with lot's of opinions backed up by statistics, ballistic comparisons and the like.  Threads like this always get derailed but nevertheless are entertaining.

here's my Kimber Stainless II, which unfortunately cannot be bought by the OP in his homeland.  What a great pistol this is.  The quality is amazing and the firearm is much more accurate than it's current owner.

[Rich46yo]

The only current 1911 I own is a Springfield milspec. I have no problem recommending one. Their customer service is excellent. The kimbers are excellent too.

Its really up to the Op. Does he want a serious race gun or just a plinker. I did very well in competition but they were mainly Police ones and mostly Local. I wasnt on no big time shooting circuit so I never bought an expensive race gun. Had I I would have very seriously considered a .38 super. Theres a reason this round still clings to life and thats cause its an inherently accurate round with a wide range of bullet types and weights hard core shooters love. The rifle comparison would be a .30 caliber something. With the amounts of bullet weights and types available dedicated handloaders can match and hone to a particular firearm.

When it was developed the .38 Super was THE hot defense round of its day. I couldnt begin to guess what the modern handloader can squeeze out of it in 130 grn or less bullet weights but I'd bet the performance is impressive. Or a hot ammo maker like CorBon.

[-tronski-]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULysvxSYfoU

Some gun pron to remind you what you can't have...  

Lol thanks - I actually really like Jerry Miculek's channel - I also quite like hickok45

I wouldnt hesitate to buy a CZ 9mm.

I also kinda figured your reason for buying <wink> <wink> also included home defense.

I always had an interest in the .38 super. Most of all back when I was competing. I never got around to getting one but if your reloading then why not consider it? It, and the 10mm, were always rounds I wished I had a reason to buy. Add the .357 SIG to that list.

I'm not looking to reloading just yet - .38 super (and .357 sig) is a good round imo - but its also expensive here compared to 9mm.
home defense is not a legal reason to obtain a firearm in this country - it would not be appropriate to use my firearm to defend my family in a crisis.  

I actually prefer the P225 over many of the P229 models as the slide serrations and slide itself are larger and far easier to manipulate with gloves on, or under stress when fine motor skills begin to degrade somewhat.  Outside of the USA the Sig P220 in 9mm is pretty popular as well, it's a single stack 9 round capacity variant of the P220/.45, and is more narrow and lighter than the 45 common variant, yet still has the (IMO) better grip angle than the P226 that the 220 has.  It also qualifies as importable both in Aus and Canada due to having a barrel length that is over 106 for Canada, and fits the 100mm/250mm overall for Australia.  Another good pistol as well.  There are many, many good options to begin with, but like the OP said, and I mentioned before, the 1911 in 9mm is a great way to start, and is one of my favorite pistol to plink on the range with as well.

I've never really considered a centerfire SIG because of the cost, but I might ask around about the P2022 as a quick search says its in the same price range as the Remington - I considered a .22LR mosquito during my probationary period (which is the maximum caliber allowed) - but the law in my state is that you cannot own a rimfire AND a centerfire pistol at the same time  

i've got the Remington r1 enhanced in .45acp. it is my favorite of all of my pistols. it's a $%$% gorgeous gun, fits my hand perfectly, and almost seems to aim itself.

Thats a sensational looking thing alright - I'm right in saying they don't come in a stainless 9mm? - otherwise that would be the icing on the cake

here's my Kimber Stainless II, which unfortunately cannot be bought by the OP in his homeland.  What a great pistol this is.  The quality is amazing and the firearm is much more accurate than it's current owner.

Another beauty - you can get these here with 127mm/5 inch barrel - just a bit out of my price range thats all

The only current 1911 I own is a Springfield milspec. I have no problem recommending one. Their customer service is excellent. The kimbers are excellent too.

Its really up to the Op. Does he want a serious race gun or just a plinker.

Plinker - maybe a bit of classic, or if I do end up with a poly - then shoot some standard div. For every firearm you own with target shooting as your legal reason - you have to shoot 3 comp  & 1 club shoot to satisfy your license conditions. For every subsequent centerfire pistol you add 4. For alot of people it can be hard to satisfy the legal comp shoots - but I think thats the point and why they made it that way

 Tronsky

[10thmd]

Check out the Cz-75 and all its clones. Very reliable handgun that gets better with Age. My favorite is the SAR B6 Steel Frame. Turkish made gun of very nice quality.

[Hajo]

i've got the Remington r1 enhanced in .45acp. it is my favorite of all of my pistols. it's a $%$% gorgeous gun, fits my hand perfectly, and almost seems to aim itself.
 the trigger's smooth as silk, very light, very nice short reset. she's reliably cycled virtually any ammo i've put through her.

 with the weight of the Remington, in 9mm, your recoil will be almost nothing. oh yea.....i'm biased towards my 1911's. i can shoot my other pistols all day long, but when i put my 1911 in my hand, it just feels soooooo dam good. 

 teaser....

Cap I have the same , mine is R1 carry model.  I also have another 1911 Colt.  I would have no other for home defense then these two weapons for same reason you stated.

They knock down. 

[CAP1]

Lots of folks like top tout the 45 as the be all and end all of handgun calibers, usually pointing and degrading other calibers. The simple fact is that the real world stats, not ballistics tests, tell a different story. The 9 and 38 are very close in performance in one shot stops when the results of real world shootings are tabulated and morgue info is totalled up. The .357 mag is even better than the 45 even though it is the same diameter as the 9 / 38. The new slugs that have been developed has made a world of difference in performance compared the old ball or even solid lead slug we used to use in the 60's. There is no "manliness" to it, just the way things are. Handguns are lousy manstoppers and it takes a rifle or a shotgun at close range to really do the job.

The argument will live on irregardless of the facts since handguns / caibers are a point of subjective opinion for many who only have range experiance to base it on.

The key factor in any fight is shot placement. A center punch to the forhead with a 22 LR is far far better than a periferal hit with a 500 S&W. Shoot what you can hit with, not what some wag on a forum touts as the solution to all problems.

The OP has a restriction he has to deal with so caliber debate is moot.

 i was being more sarcastic than anything with my comments about caliber. i've got both 9, and 45. i greatly enjoy shooting them both. my carry gun is a ruger sr9c. it's nice and compact, and i can conceal it rather easily.