Now that the scenario is over

[Stampf]

The Axis flat out whooped us.

The only thing that matters is numbers at the point of contact and Allied forces were all over the map.



Fighter support got out of sync with bombers. Bombers flew unescorted ahead of fighters.

The P38 cannot anchor and turn with 109's in equal numbers or worse yet that is what happened in every engagement.

We flew girl scout trail formations and encountered 109's in line abreast. They win the merge and they win the fight.

The Allied side was sloppy and the Axis was not.

Wherever contact was made the Axis poured in assets until they wiped out the attack.

Its pretty simple, he who has the most wins the fight and the Axis made sure they had the most at the point of contact.

I was in my own group for this one, not flying with the JG11 guys in 109's. but as I am reading this, in my mind I can hear Stampf "OK boys line it up... LINE ABREAST  KILL EM ALL    NO LOSES   Get em from the TOP DOWN  That's IT  That's IT!"


I was GL of the FW-190s and had orders to hang over target fields. We watched on DAR and text as the battle unfolded every hour. My pilots did not like it and we were in the back flying in circles while the fight was going on. We took some flack from 109 drivers over this too.

Then when our bases started flashing more times then not we were there or very close and the killing of A-20's would begin.  We were the defense. As I understand it, the allies did not bother with that. Looking at all the stuff destroyed on the logs, it would seem true.

It has been said that planning does not matter. Well, I would have to disagree with that. We had a plan, we stuck with it.
After that last scenario I was shocked to see BOMBERS unescorted every time.

I had a great time and enjoyed flying with the same crew for the most part again.


For only having 6 planes at a time, we managed 92 kills with 87 assists on 72 sorties.  It was a great day.

My wife asked me today "What time do you start up this Saturday?"  I was honest and told her the next one is in February.

Already looking forward to it...   

It's very interesting to see this in text.  The very same things we discussed in our 77th thread leading up to the event. Our flight leader asked me to chime in on tactics.  I did - and we employed those very same tactics.  Own the merge - bracket the enemy - overwhelm them from the flanks - Own the fight top down - one at a time and work together.  I was simply amazed the allied boys allowed us to accomplish this so easily with the exception of the one sortie that they massed everything they had against our unit.

It's very hard for me to follow another - really hard - and I was my usual exuberant self when engaging the enemy.  So much so a couple guys told me to shut up before I jinxed the unit...   I guess I can take comfort in the fact that those comments came from the guys who either were killed every sortie or left to fly alone or with another group. My CO - Devil, either, A)quietly appreciated my input - B) ignored it - or C) employed it.  Either way I apologize for being such a cheerleader in flight - but as discussed earlier in our squad thread this is what I do - this is my strength.

3 of the 4 phases the Allies flew right into this strength and made it awefully easy for us to employ these simple tactics.  Individually the allied boys flew and fought well, and hard but individuals working alone against a group working together is a hard road to find victory on.

So again to the guys who I may have put off with my...ways...I apologise again - but as for our performance and results go...good chance I would do it all over again the exact same way.

<S> Allies and Axis.

[GScholz]

I don't see anybody posting in this thread that I do not consider a close friend. Please don't let this thread deteriorate. I don't want to insult or hurt anybody's feelings. I will do my best to explain what you did see or didn't see, from a planner's view (you experienced guys know what I'm talking about).

The Allies were greatly hamstrung by the inability to secure a strong and experienced scenario planning resource, early enough, to bring its tactical strengths to the fore. I am putting my hand up as being almost completely absent from the process.  I should have been able to be relied upon for guidance and ideas and unfortunately I was unable to deliver this time.

It was not the CO Allies that bears any culpability.  Red did an amazing job considering the restraints upon him.  He followed the script and set up planning with his groups in the general forum.  He made maps, consulted and adjusted.  What he didn't have was a core planning group from the get-go.  He still didn't have one at launch time.  Right now he probably feels exhausted, confused and a little down.  He deserves a round of applause - really.

Core planning is an essential for scenarios.  Nothing delivers for the players on game day so much as days and weeks of off-line flying, flight timetables and routes, target maps and approaches and above it all - confidence in what you are doing.
None of that can be done in an open forum with a sense of touch and feel good, while the crowd (who probably don't care deeply) are asked to vote up, vote down, or otherwise criticise what somebody just spent a week on.  Let's just not ever go that way again if we can avoid it.

Scenarios are chalk and cheese to FSO and any other special event that I can think of.  It requires a different mind-set and a completely different set of tactics to bring out the best from your human and material resources.

Spit 9s or 262s would not have impacted on this scenario so much if you are judging it by aircraft resources alone. 

I must admit, I should've flown a B26 from the start.  Would take more fuel though.

Hear, hear.

[DmonSlyr]

I only flew in the first phase and 1 sortie of the second. And my experince was that there simply weren't enough P38 pilots, the spit5s were not powerful enough.The A20s were easy meat, the bombers had no escorts because most of the 38s were killed by the almighty 77. Bruv and I alone got 29 kills and him, a few others, and I, were able to clean the rest of the fighters because they didn't have enough support. There was only one hour where the P38s were able to dominate. I think the first phase would have gone a lot differently if A. The P38s didn't run into is every time, and lose the majority of their airforce. B. if their groups of fighters stuck together better. I did really enjoy the furballs from my perspective.

 I feel like the only reason was because the P38s didn't have enough members. They ran into the us (the 109s) most of the time, instead of being able to cover the bombers better, and since we were able to kill most of the P38s and spit5s. The P39s were easy and the bombers were easy because they didnt have the support they needed.

You can talk about the planes all you want. I flew a G2 the entire time, but I really think the Axis had a better strategy, killed the most threatening opposition quickly every time but 1 time, the P38s. The P39s, Spit5s didn't have a chance because there were not enough of them. I feel if the 38s had more players, the tide would have been a bit different.

Just my .02

[LCADolby]

I thought it was well balanced throughout the combat. The only thing that troubled my mind was the C202, crazy as it seems, but I don't have a lot of experience fighting other people flying it. It was an unknown I wanted at arms length. Axis had the better plan and that was it. I'd fly into that again in the P38G, it was more fun than I ever imagined.

[Bruv119]

I thought it was well balanced throughout the combat. The only thing that troubled my mind was the C202, crazy as it seems, but I don't have a lot of experience fighting other people flying it. It was an unknown I wanted at arms length. Axis had the better plan and that was it. I'd fly into that again in the P38G, it was more fun than I ever imagined.

you shot down Hitech!!     

[LCADolby]

Twice 

[Devil 505]

It's very hard for me to follow another - really hard - and I was my usual exuberant self when engaging the enemy.  So much so a couple guys told me to shut up before I jinxed the unit...   I guess I can take comfort in the fact that those comments came from the guys who either were killed every sortie or left to fly alone or with another group. My CO - Devil, either, A)quietly appreciated my input - B) ignored it - or C) employed it.  Either way I apologize for being such a cheerleader in flight - but as discussed earlier in our squad thread this is what I do - this is my strength.

A and C, Brother. 

[Bruv119]

stampf we have had our differences in the past  but I must say I enjoyed the cheerleading.   

Some of those fighter merges were reminiscent of SDL and you have to kill quickly and cleanly.  Brevity, wingmen and good shooting ruled the roost.   

[Stampf]

stampf we have had our differences in the past  but I must say I enjoyed the cheerleading.   

Some of those fighter merges were reminiscent of SDL and you have to kill quickly and cleanly.  Brevity, wingmen and good shooting ruled the roost.   

Indeed. 

The future will undoubtedly find us on opposite ends of the issue again - but I want to say I would gladly fly with you anytime, Bruv.

<S>

[Dantoo]

stampf we have had our differences in the past  but I must say I enjoyed the cheerleading.   

Some of those fighter merges were reminiscent of SDL and you have to kill quickly and cleanly.  Brevity, wingmen and good shooting ruled the roost.   

A Quicky.  Has something changed in AH3 with shooting?  I was missing 75% of fairly easy shots or perhaps more properly, only doing light damage instead of taking a wing off.  (It might well have been a whole heap of other probs I was dealing with but it was getting frustrating at one point).

[Stampf]

A Quicky.  Has something changed in AH3 with shooting?  I was missing 75% of fairly easy shots or perhaps more properly, only doing light damage instead of taking a wing off.  (It might well have been a whole heap of other probs I was dealing with but it was getting frustrating at one point).

Dantoo - so far my experience with the 20 and 30 Mil German cannons in AH3 is the opposite of what you are finding. (shrug) I am finding it easier to hit the target(s).

...

[Wiley]

A Quicky.  Has something changed in AH3 with shooting?  I was missing 75% of fairly easy shots or perhaps more properly, only doing light damage instead of taking a wing off.  (It might well have been a whole heap of other probs I was dealing with but it was getting frustrating at one point).

My perception is it's different in some way.  I am not quite sure what to make of it, I've got a couple of theories.

One is just the simple fact that everything looks different and our brains are just so used to the normal sight picture we have used for years, and now due to the new engine it's just subtly different and we need to retrain our brains.

I know I feel like I hit better with cannons in a lot of cases, but I also went through a period of about a week early this month where I felt I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn and wasn't getting good damage.  I was practicing in the A5 and stopped using the MGs for a bit so everything I was hitting with was cannon.  Turned out I was shooting behind them with the cannons and only hitting with the MGs.

I also think the way things look affect timing.  Maybe try lengthening your bursts a bit to see if that helps?

Wiley.

[ROC]

I actually prefer the feel of the new version, my accuracy seems up. But that may simply be that due to the radically different look I am simply focusing more.
One thing hasn't changed though, I continue to hit the ground with 100% accuracy.

[Brooke]

It seemed different to me as a bomber gunner compared to AH2.

Not sure if it seems different for pilot-controlled guns.

The tracers look different to me, so that could be most of it for all I know.

[Bruv119]

A Quicky.  Has something changed in AH3 with shooting?  I was missing 75% of fairly easy shots or perhaps more properly, only doing light damage instead of taking a wing off.  (It might well have been a whole heap of other probs I was dealing with but it was getting frustrating at one point).

did you change your FOV back to what you had in AH2  (106) 

Tracers have been improved with some of the patches.   We were flying with gondies so 3x 20mm vaporised everything I shot at.    If anything I would say most rounds are damaging stuff easier especially 50cal but then again I don't usually have trouble making shots. 

I struggled with buff gunning for a bit but have my eye in now getting some stick time definitely helps.