Author Topic: M3 Effectiveness.....  (Read 13275 times)

Offline Traveler

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3054
      • 113th Lucky Strikes
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #45 on: August 27, 2017, 03:31:03 PM »


Perhaps the answer to your question is why we don't see NOE swarm missions anymore.  When the attacks change, the response is going to change and it will be by any means available to anyone playing who chooses that method.  That's how everything else in the game works, from ammo loadout to bomb loadout to which plane/GV to fly or drive and from where.
there are fewer swarm NOE missions because we don't have the numbers to put together a swarm. 
Traveler
Executive Officer
113th LUcky Strikes
http://www.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/113th_Lucky_Strikes

Offline Lazerr

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3971
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #46 on: August 27, 2017, 03:39:26 PM »
The resupply should be done by ai convoys or trains... the players should be doing the defending via planes tanks and guns if they wish.  Occupied manned guns should count as a kill.  These are two glaring problems of the gameplay.

If you have been here 18 years, you obviously remember the days and type of fights before resupply was implemented.  This type of gameplay is just another obstical to get a good brawl going for a base.  Thats what will get the majority of new guys hooked.  Not shooting some turd in an almost invisable gv.

Offline ACE

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5537
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #47 on: August 27, 2017, 05:02:09 PM »
We play aces high. Not aces low. What's the fun in shooting m3s
Sixth Tri-Annual Dueling Bracket Champion

The Few

-Spek

Offline Zener

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 183
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #48 on: August 27, 2017, 05:17:22 PM »
AI convoys aren't active in the game.  Until that changes what other resupp options are there?

I don't believe doing away with M3 resupp will make the game go back to inter-base furballs, much as some might hope it does.  The numbers are too low, squad sizes are smaller, and it's just really tough to get a good sized chunk of people working on a common goal.  Add in that some people are on long bombing runs and aren't bailing to try and save a base and you get the fights you have.

PLUS, there are those who will try to take a base and if it doesn't go nearly unopposed, they're gone to some other part of the map to try it elsewhere.  They want a base with little or NO fight.  You see it all the time, the T34s running to base to hide in the hangar and vulch planes taking off while their own side fighter pilots are whining there's no air fights anymore; M4s w/rockets and a M3 trying to take a base.  They aren't looking for fights, they want a base with as little conflict as possible.  I'm not defending or condemning that, just saying it's what I see happen all the time.  I've NEVER seen anyone try to dissuade camping anything to prevent "good fights."  I wonder why we never see that?





Offline scott66

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1960
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #49 on: August 27, 2017, 05:54:13 PM »
Sigh... Once again -1
"scott66"        
 XO ThunderHorse Squadron.    
                           
"This place is a psychologist's wet dream".... FishBait

Offline Crash Orange

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 911
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #50 on: August 27, 2017, 10:59:12 PM »
I have the strangest sense I've heard all this before...

Offline rvflyer

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 715
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #51 on: August 28, 2017, 12:39:43 AM »
I wonder where that is coming from GHI? Having flown with you a lot and in many of your missions one of the first things you stress is resupply the town. I do think it was silly to put a flag on the base so all you had to do was look at the flag on the base to see the town was white flagged. I also do not like the fact that all you have to do is hover the cursor over the base icon and see what is down at that base, you can be all the way across the map and see that the town is prepped, where is the spirit of having it ALL handed to you on a silver spoon. You should have to go to the base to see what the status of that base is or at least use the dot commands as we did for years. I also agree that the game has become so dumbbed down so the instant gratification crowd is happy. If you see a base flashing go there to see what the status is. I have no problem with resupply as that was a fact of war.


You are 100% right , i've been complaining about this lazy ninja m3s resupplying option long before , it's nonsense .....but they made it even more effective after last patches.
After last updates, the GVs  are almost invisible, i can fly 3-4 times at 300 ft above iconless M3 parked in town in F3 mode/ A20, and i realize was an m3 there when red troops start running.   
But unfortunately this is the what the game rewarding; why take off and fight when you can get points for driving m3 or park the invisible dweeb with .45 shot the troops, another stupid slap in face of base takers .
As i said before,  After 18 years  AH is still rewarding the lowest qualities in human behavior and personality; The best fighter never takes off from clubbed fields, best GVer usually sits at spawn crying for sups and best bombers never takes risk bombing CVs, but some worthless targets from 30k, @ 4 AM.
 Watch AH front page; this are AH heroes on front page and the newby crowd follows.
Imo, should reward teams, not individuals .
 The team vs team fight was  eliminated slowly with every patch( and with it 100s of team-vs team fight oriented players), making bases more and more difficult to capture, huge tows, 100s of flacks, more Vh,FHs,,( LOOK at the evolution size of V bases, Airfield base, Ports from AH1 to AH2->AH3 and you'll understand why was better game and better populated even with lower quality graphics )  Vbases un-capturable,  Massive towns around large fields, you need all the average main arena population to white flag}  and what;s left is this nonsense vulch for kills and points.
 I'm not surprised the MA is almost empty, with 15-20 player/team most of the day.
Tour 70 2005 to present

Offline JunkyII

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8428
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #52 on: September 06, 2017, 10:18:52 PM »
All you have to do is include the supporting bases in your attack plan.  They can't resupply A1 if in your planning you strike at the supporting base and kill troops. Then flatten A1 and your done, another base captureThis first part shows you are full of crap and haven't read any arguments yet....but for the 100th time I'll state that it is faster to resupply the supporting base and field then it is to take down the troops and town by far faster.  I've been here 18 years.Good for you, Ive been here 10 and guess what, M3 resupply for towns has only been here about 4 so why are you bringing up the number of years you played when only the last 4 matter?  How is it that you don't see how resupply is a part of all wars.As someone who has actually been in a real war, I'll say this until M3s don't have spawns to other fields you can't bring up real world Sustainment...which is what it is now called...not resupply...especially because that argument immediately goes against ALL COMBAT TACTICS in the world Any strategy to capture a base needs to account for it.  How is it that you don't see that to counter the resupply both sides are forced to engage in combat at the supporting base.If that was really the case then it isn't working because the only effect I see from M3 resupply to towns is a lack of combat all together.
DFC Member
Proud Member of Pigs on the Wing
"Yikes"

Offline bustr

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 12436
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #53 on: September 07, 2017, 12:24:18 PM »
I can't claim to read Hitech's mind. But, I've had 15 years of watching him operate and it's possible he gave us a solution to the dominance of the M3 and towns attracting players who don't want to really fight.

1. - Waffle changes out three vBases for three small airfields with the maproom on the airfield. They are 13 miles from each other creating lots of fruballs and tank combat in the center of them at tank town. This sets a precedence for specific situations to space airfields that close while testing if closer airfields will generate more activity.

2. - Waffle introduces static one off bridges for the Melee arena terrains and Hitech publicly invests precious debug time to make them work. And publicly states he likes the idea of indestructible bridges acting as GV combat choke points.

3. - Waffle introduces buzzsaw and is willing to tweek it from player feed back. Good way to gather information in real time on how players utilize the arena today. Asking questions in the forums results in answers of what the player sees in his fantasies about the game. Reading complaints tells you exactly how players utilize the arena.


If you connect the dots in some manner, you can slow down GV's with choke points courtesy of Hitech while turning an airfield into the center of the fight. If you want to ignore a flashing base, you loose it because an M3 just de-acks and drops troops. Never tested to see if the 50. on an M3 has enough ammo to do that though. Or, just have a friend be a suicide porker. If you check out what is making it flash, you have a very good chance to whiz on a GV's day and camp some bridges to snipe M3's and tanks. And because precedence now shows closer airfields of equal elevations generate air combat, you place most of your airfields 19 miles apart versus the standard 25 and farther. The three airfields on NDisles, static bridge objects, and buzzsaw being quickly modified by Waffle looks like someone trying to adjust the game without disrupting the game with the wrong overnight changes.

So you end up with me creating a new terrain and taking this experiment a bit farther. Of the 29 feilds in each country on my new terrain, 7 of them have the new bridges to slow down GVs. Six of them are a small airfield with the maproom next to the tower. One is a GV's nightmare assault.


Here's what it looks like, three indestructible bridges between the airfield and the spawns and no town to make the M3 the most dangerous tool in the game.   


     





A GV nightmare assault up a 500ft climb, the two bridges will be camped waiting for end runs. The center ramp is to make it possible to win with some effort.





Waffle's precedence of three small airfields with maproom on the field 13 miles apart.


bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline Zardoz

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 190
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #54 on: September 07, 2017, 12:36:54 PM »
Bustr...

 :salute
Your incessant whining just adds entertainment value to my gaming experience :cool:

Offline Ramesis

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1057
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #55 on: September 07, 2017, 01:53:06 PM »
Vehicles and planes are separate groups for the Sortie %
Name        Sortie %   
M-3                    35.91%
Wirbelwind             18.41%
T-34/85                 6.70%
Panzer IV H            13.33%

Since I guess I was hijacking another thread figured I'll start my own....

M3s make up almost identically as much and the next 2 vehicle sorties combined.

While in an M3, players aren't actively engaged in ANY form of combat(no sense arguing that it is, just ignorant if you think an M3 resembles any sort of combat in Aces High)

What they do, is make it so defenders dont have to engage in combat against an enemy to hold a field.

The war for the map generates combat by the progression of taking and losing fields.

My personal thoughts, remove town resupply completely, make it a standard 45 minute down time on town and make cargo trucks/trains/barges more valuable to defend.

-10000000000....
"Would you tell me, please,
 which way I ought to go from here?
 That depends a good deal on where
 you want to get to. Said the cat."
    Charles Lutwidge Dodgson a.k.a. Lewis Carroll

Offline ACE

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5537
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #56 on: September 07, 2017, 02:26:50 PM »
-10000000000....
Saying no doesn't benefit the conversation in any way. Please elaborate.
Sixth Tri-Annual Dueling Bracket Champion

The Few

-Spek

Offline DubiousKB

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1614
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #57 on: September 07, 2017, 05:48:00 PM »
-1 for removing re-supply completely

+10 For making supply convoys matter again! (trains & vehicle convoys)
56th Fighter Group -  Jug Life

Offline JunkyII

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8428
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #58 on: September 07, 2017, 10:19:44 PM »
I have the strangest sense I've heard all this before...
With the same lack of an decent argument for those who want to keep it the way it is...

Again can someone please tell me how nerfing M3 town resupply will effect the game in a negative way other then people have to up a combat aircraft or vehicle to hold a base?

The way it is now just kills fights...simple and that's it. For the land grabbers that might be ok but for anyone looking for a REAL fight....it's terrible.
DFC Member
Proud Member of Pigs on the Wing
"Yikes"

Offline bustr

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 12436
Re: M3 Effectiveness.....
« Reply #59 on: September 08, 2017, 12:16:06 AM »
Hitech gave us the ability to remove the town from the equation and create GV choke points, thus the M3 is nerfed. All he had to do was see if anyone caught on to how to use the available tools to do it. I'm not going to crap on the game by putting a river between the spawns and all the towns or remove towns from all the airfields. I will do it to some percentage of the feilds and take the next step in this experiment to then see how players respond to the change.

You gents are free to build a terrain with a maproom on the airfields and no towns. It will be just like 19 years ago and the M3 really won't have any real job other than deliver troops. You can get really outrageous and put a river with bridges at every field at the same time so one or two guys can stop all incoming GV's from the spawn at will.

Who knows, if my experiment shows GVers like using it and M3's are slowed down, someone with time to kill can add it to many of the current terrains if Hitech decides he likes it to. Just dig a ditch 2 miles out from the town and drop in bridges over it exactly like Waffle did with the super large airfields. Then the M3 still has a role but takes skill to pull it off.
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.