Author Topic: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY  (Read 26028 times)

Offline SysError

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #285 on: April 22, 2020, 05:59:32 PM »
See rule 14 & 4.
You were just fine until your last paragraph.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2020, 06:18:08 PM by hitech »
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Offline SysError

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #286 on: April 22, 2020, 06:30:54 PM »
I am done

Thanks for all the fish
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Offline Vulcan

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #287 on: April 22, 2020, 10:22:35 PM »
I would like to ask... It seems in Canada that opposing politicians who are usually at one another's throats, are now quite united in their actions to fight and contain this disease. Is it similar in New Zealand?

Nah, we're arguing whether we could've done better but closing the borders sooner.

Offline Tilt

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #288 on: April 23, 2020, 05:18:19 AM »
A different way of looking at it from the same sight.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/17/antibody-study-suggests-coronavirus-is-far-more-widespread-than-previously-thought
One of the key parts.
So now consider that if far more people.

1. The possibility to contain it becomes impossible.
2. The odds of creating a vaccination soon enough to have a significant impact on most of the population is small.
3. All we are doing is possibly  slowing the spread, but in the end we will still have to reach heard immunity.
4. The 2 = 3% number is in a non crisis area. If you do New York State with the same numbers working backwards from the death rate.
     NY State had 14,828 deaths. With a 0.12% - 0.20 death rate that works out to about to between 11.7   to million 7 people. So NY State has approximately 20 million. so between 35% and 58% of the people would have all ready been infected. Those numbers are approaching herd immunity, And could possibly be a major reason the new infection rate is dropping.

So now is it better to try isolate every one , or try to just isolate the high risk population?


HITech


I agree that all measures seem targeted at slowing stuff down to enable the various health services to cope.
In the UK this has three facets.

1)Social distancing... we still go out for "essential" stuff.
2)Lock down..... we are "locked down" but as per above go out for essential stuff when we exercise social distancing.
3)Isolation...my son is diabetic..... my mother is 94 both are under so called isolation...….ie full lock down for 12 weeks. My mother still went to the local clinic for her beta injections.

Whilst also reducing the load on our health service, only isolation protects the individual in a direct manner. Lockdown and social distancing IMO are about containing spread.

Clearly "efficient" voluntary social distancing may be sufficient but  the evidence is that, in the west, its not possible to obtain unless enforced by a form of lockdown.

Boffins in the UK tell us herd immunity would only be reached when (depending upon source) 70-90% of the population are immune. Herd immunity is defined thru an "acceptable" level of deaths...the actual value of "acceptable" in this case is not often discussed. At the present rate of contagion even given the masses of unregistered infections natural herd immunity is considered to be unachievable unless re enforced by vaccine...…. particularly from those defining it by the higher percentile. But the common thought is that this (with help from vaccine) is upto 12months away.

Herd immunity is a political mine field and now considered an unacceptable dialogue , yet clearly (even if given another name) it has to be the end goal. If/when life returns to some level of normality it will be because COVID 19 is considered to be at an "acceptable"  (tolerable?) level.

So what is an acceptable death rate for COVID19?

It's widely considered that the UK lockdown/social distancing has now flattening the curve which is going through its peak. We are at ~20,000 deaths (adding unregistered care home deaths to the hospital stats) and we can pretty much see that the tail of the curve will have twice the volume of the head. That would equate to 60,000 deaths (20k+40K) assuming that all these measures stayed in place.... with the prospect that we would still not reach herd immunity.

Our yearly flu death rate varies between 12,000 -20,000 …….we have herd immunity for types A&B flu. The view is that that COVID19 will not go away and every year, whilst it will cull some of the flu numbers (and vice versa) its looking like it could be adding  ~ 10,000 to those numbers every year. that with a population of some 66M

Face masks...….. if someone is infectious, then wearing a face mask will protect those not infected...…….. to some degree. Wearing one to avoid infection seems  to be less effective.

Social distancing...…. clearly avoiding human contact reduces risk.....more avoidance = less risk


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Offline 100Coogn

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #289 on: April 23, 2020, 06:49:14 AM »
Does this dress make me look fat?

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Offline Eagler

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #290 on: April 23, 2020, 06:52:06 AM »
By the end of today more than 1 in 5 Americans will be unemployed.

Those are only the numbers that have been able to register for unemployment

Many more cannot as the system was never designed for such numbers

As talk starts about how we are going to try to unlock the lock down, seems very clear to me this will not be the "V" recovery some are hoping for

As soon as they stop the printing presses, more will be hurting

Then comes the pain caused by all the $$ printing

Oh yeah then there is the virus that caused this mess, it isn' t going anywhere soon...

It does not look good at all at this point

Eagler

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Offline NatCigg

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #291 on: April 23, 2020, 07:27:25 AM »
https://qcostarica.com/hydroxychloroquine-the-drug-costa-rica-uses-successfully-to-fight-covid-19/

some good news. Costa Rica has a death rate of 0.5%. (compare to Michigan (8.3%)

Maybe because of their rational use of drugs.  using antiviral hydroxychloroquine early in disease, NOT for severe patients only.

 Be careful out there! the information is twisted and politicized.

Offline hitech

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #292 on: April 23, 2020, 09:21:13 AM »
Quote
UN warns of 'biblical' famines of a quarter of a billion people as coronavirus threatens to leave three dozen nations starving

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8239619/UN-warns-biblical-famines-coronavirus-threatens-leave-three-dozen-nations-starving.html

There could also be huge down side if lock downs continue to long.

HiTech

Offline mora

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #293 on: April 24, 2020, 02:40:03 AM »

Offline redcatcherb412

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #294 on: April 24, 2020, 09:20:22 AM »
Does this dress make me look fat?

Coogan

I've heard it's just the fat that makes folks look fat, do tell.  :rofl
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Offline 1stpar3

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #295 on: April 26, 2020, 12:09:07 AM »
I've heard it's just the fat that makes folks look fat, do tell.  :rofl
REd...Grnd, the proper answer to that question,is..."Do I LOOK STUPID?" NEVER answer that question! :bhead  Just looking out for ya :police: Wait...dont answer either question..I wasnt asking if I looked :furious nevermind... love ya, Brother/Fav target :salute
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Offline redcatcherb412

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #296 on: April 26, 2020, 11:03:15 AM »
REd...Grnd, the proper answer to that question,is..."Do I LOOK STUPID?" NEVER answer that question! :bhead  Just looking out for ya :police: Wait...dont answer either question..I wasnt asking if I looked :furious nevermind... love ya, Brother/Fav target :salute
Ahhh yes, my fav egg dispenser, over easy on target  :airplane:
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Offline MiloMorai

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #297 on: April 27, 2020, 05:57:34 AM »
See rule #14
« Last Edit: April 28, 2020, 02:09:29 PM by hitech »

Offline Maverick

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #298 on: April 27, 2020, 10:15:50 AM »
See rule #14
« Last Edit: April 28, 2020, 02:08:39 PM by hitech »
DEFINITION OF A VETERAN
A Veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard or reserve - is someone who, at one point in their life, wrote a check made payable to "The United States of America", for an amount of "up to and including my life."
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Offline Arlo

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Re: Covid 19 Prevention discussion ONLY
« Reply #299 on: April 27, 2020, 10:21:46 AM »
Perhaps
One
Listens
Intently
To
Ideology
Canceling
All
Logic?