Author Topic: N1K -problem (Read 689 times)

Pollock · « **Reply #15 on:** February 28, 2002, 06:48:04 PM »

I am all for a complete perk system on all planes.

streakeagle · « **Reply #16 on:** February 28, 2002, 07:17:49 PM »

I don't play for points. Never fly enough to get perks. No plane I like to fly is perked. I have plenty of fun flying CT and HTH and could care less what goes on in the MA. Perk whatever you want as long as I can enjoy historical matchups in CT and fly whatever I want in HTH.

I would still dangerous in the MA if I flew there even with "must land to get perks" type of rules. I have wasted many planes in the past trying to defend a capped field and am will do so in the future when I have the time. Losing 5 or 10 A6Ms to vultures isn't so bad to me when the next one gets off the ground successfully and sweeps the sky clean of vulching P-38s. It is bad for points and stats, but I think it is fun and challenging to fly against the odds.

N1Ks used to be one of the planes that dominated HTH. These days I hardly see it. With planes like the Tempest around, people have found better rides. Of course the Spitfire remains the most popular HTH plane.

Mathman · « **Reply #17 on:** February 28, 2002, 08:45:50 PM »

I think my signature says all I need to about this thread and what it contains.

AKEagle+ · « **Reply #18 on:** February 28, 2002, 08:54:19 PM »

Quote

I think my signature says all I need to about this thread and what it contains.

LOL Mathman!

And I have a name for the present perk the Corsairs to the sky system... Bovine Scatology. Yep BS in it's purest form

AKEagle+

Saurdaukar · « **Reply #19 on:** February 28, 2002, 09:24:16 PM »

Normally I dont get involved with perk arguments but the N1K issue is a problem... The plane can outturn almost anything, outdive almost anything, and outshoot almost anything. It doesnt reward a skilled stick, but a newbie can jump right in and rack up the kills. IMHO the purpose of perk points should be to limit both uber AND RARE planes. In this case I offer this bit of information on behalf of all pilots sick of being shot down by 2 week trial newbies in N1Ks...

From: Hunters in the Sky: A Visual Guide to WWII Aircraft
Fighter Production in WWII (Page 44)
(I have included rarest and most produced AC found in AH to give you an idea of how rediculous it is to see so many of these planes being flown)

Hawker Tempest (800)
Macchi MC202 (1,100)
Kawanishi N1K (1,430)
Messerschmitt Me262 (1,435)
Supermarine Seafire (2,089)
Hawker Typhoon (3,330)
...By comparison...
Messerschmitt Bf109 (35,000)
Supermarine Spitfire (20,351)
Focke Wulf FW190 (20,001)
North American P51 (15,686)
Republic P47 (15,683)
Hawker Hurricane (14,233)

Notice that there were actually more 262s made than N1Ks! I dont think it should be a question of uber planes, but of how rare they are. Wouldnt it be nice if you saw just as many N1Ks as you saw 262's every night?

Mazz
<-TFC->

God created war to teach Americans geography.

fdiron · « **Reply #20 on:** February 28, 2002, 09:40:33 PM »

Why not perk planes soley on their production numbers? Have a cut off limit somewhere ~8,000 plane. If you had 8,000 as the base, anything under it would cost perk points, anything over it would be free.

Saurdaukar · « **Reply #21 on:** February 28, 2002, 09:45:19 PM »

Thats exactly what I had in mind. =)

Glasses · « **Reply #22 on:** February 28, 2002, 10:24:38 PM »

As much as I hate the N1K2 I think for the time being it should NOT be perked due mainly to the fact the Japanese planeset is not extensive enough to have any other aircraft competitive in the MA maybe later when the Japanese planeset is brought to a state where it has much more aircraft to chose from as an alternate to the N1K then maybe it could be considered for perking.

People like Ripsnort had it right when they said the CHOG would be first and the N1K2 would come after it. Of course we know it is not targeted for perking because it dominates the arena but because of its performance it does .

It's really absurd to compare the Laserkampfwageneins(i.e. CHog) with the F4U-1D it isn't in the same league as the 1D and it wasngetting how much? 80% of kills in the MA if I recall correctly, that's why it was perked.

Kweassa · « **Reply #23 on:** February 28, 2002, 11:48:16 PM »

4 Cannons that hits handily up to 600 yards and more.. Yuck

At least 190s have shorter effective cannon ranges.
Typhies, Tempies, C-Hogs and N1K2-Js, all the same to me.
It's not the performance that bothers me, rather the fact that
people can go ratatatatat somebody at 600 yards and almost
always knock something off.

There is no such thing called "separation" when fighting 4
cannon Hizooka/Type99 birds. Either you have the advantage
over them or don't bother to fight at all.

...

but then again, where'd the dweebs go if N1K2 was perked??

N1K2 should not be perked until there are some more Japanese
planes.

Vulcan · « **Reply #24 on:** March 01, 2002, 12:10:54 AM »

Niki cannons have a relatively slow rate of fire, and you don't have to fly straight and level.

I engaged 2 Niki's in ToD recently @ 25k with a Hawg-D. I was quite suprised, the nikis really struggled at that alt. Much as they reportedly did in R/L.

NHLawman got me, and it was a good fight.

The Niki no longer has the uber-zoom. If you choose to turn fight one below 20k then so be it. Just be aware that the niki is king in that area.

From tour 25:
Vulcan has 18 kills and has been killed 4 times in the Typhoon IB against the N1K2.

From Tour 24:
Vulcan has 24 kills and has been killed 4 times in the Typhoon IB against the N1K2.

Glasses · « **Reply #25 on:** March 01, 2002, 12:36:20 AM »

Kweassa is laso right that those planes mentioned seldom the 190s can hit 600,sometimes beyond that with relative ease that's one of the biggest threts these aircraft have and of course how lethal it is to combine the agility and the firepower/range of the weapons.

SOB · « **Reply #26 on:** March 01, 2002, 12:50:16 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by RangerBob
The only change I would really like to see is, no points for perks or score unless you land or ditch in friendly territory. That will change things for the good. No more INTENTIONAL ramming, no more INTENTIONAL suicide dive bombing unless you really want to be a Kamikaze with no points. If you can't live to get home or ditch in friendly territory, you shouldn't be earning any points for that mission. Things might just get a bit more realistic around Aces High Land.

Ranger Bob

Not to mention completely lame and boring with people choosing to run away if they don't have the advantage rather than staying and taking their chances to produce the possibility of a truly great fight. There's already a bonus in place for landing your aircraft, and that's good enough, imo.

SOB

AKEagle+ · « **Reply #27 on:** March 01, 2002, 01:17:58 AM »

Did I actually read someone trying to justify perking the 202?

Yeh perk the NIK and any plane a newbie can fly and see how quickly this sim dies.

If anything will kill AH it will be producing an arena where newcommers are driven off by elitist hot shot pilots with 10:1 K/Ds in the unperked Doras.

My prediction, The more planes you perk the quicker the sim will lose appeal to newbies. The fewer newbies and with the normal attrition of any sim, the sim will become unprofitable, and poof.

Give the newbies NIKs and F4U4s and Doras and Spit9s and Spit 14s. If you are a good stick you will figure out how to kill them. If not, well tough.

Think about the average pilot. He has maybe a .7 :1 K/D ratio. Probably takes him 15 or more sorties to pay for a C Hog, even at 8 points. That is the average so many take a lot more sorties than that!

I mean sit back, take a deep breath, and think.

Think about what it takes to make the game enjoyable for the newcomers, and you will have a veritable buffet of easy kills to add to you K/D. Face it a newbie in a C Hog is a seal pup on the ice.

And if a newbie gives you a snoot full of 20 mike mikes from his NIK2 on the HO, what the hell were you doing flying into a situation where he was able to get a HO guns solution? Flying stupid thats what. So why whine because you get your butt handed to you for allowing a bandit to get a guns solution on you??? I don't care what quadrant the shots come from. In real life if you did that, you are dead. Learn SA, learn how to really fight with proper ACM, and you won't care what plane he if flying, he isn't going to get you unless you let him. The solution is to learn how to fight in the arena, not perk a plane that you don't like fighting. You fly into a furball, well, fly stupid, die stupid [like me LOL!].

Whine about the NIKs, LA7s, Spits and soon you will them perked, and soon all that you will find is a small number of tough BnZers at 25K+ and spend half the evening to find a fight. And then? Well, no arena at all. HTC is setting themself up to lose if they keep on this path.

Then we all lose.

Kee Rap Lads, Think Think Think, so we can play play play

AKEagle+

mrsid2 · « **Reply #28 on:** March 01, 2002, 01:55:32 AM »

Uh, Akeagle, which arena were you playing on?

The most common move with fast turning planes like hurricane or n1k or spit is to pull the nose up to shoot HO to the bouncing enemy. This is 90% resulting in the whines..

Of course then too its also the attackers fault if he goes for the shot. But that's where it's coming from. A perfectly good offensive manouver (bounce) is often turned into a HO while the attacker is in dive.

air_guard · « **Reply #29 on:** March 01, 2002, 04:12:51 AM »

there will always be a better plane, so this discussion is endless.
the fu4c went away with some smart perking we got rid of the endless newbie headon suicide with perking that.
but some people fly the nik as their main craft and they do that very good dont forget that( no stupid dweeb flying but real good ).
What i do when i start irritating over to much spits,niks i take one myselve and get 10 kills then back to another plane

no big deal
I say no more perking let it be as it is.

airguard