Author Topic: Paul Van Riper's War (Read 999 times)

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #30 on:** September 08, 2002, 07:33:01 PM »

Last game I lost all I said was "aw s**t"...

Seemed good enough for my opponent, cost me a sixer.

Toad · « **Reply #31 on:** September 08, 2002, 08:24:46 PM »

The idea was to find any flaw in the plan that they could. Looks like a creative Marine ex-General showed them quite a few.

Good job all around. Best to find the problems during the wargaming, not the war.

They'll probably re-tool the plan and wargame it a few more times before they commit troops.

Dinger · « **Reply #32 on:** September 08, 2002, 10:36:50 PM »

Disagree Toad.

If you have any doubts, look at what happened in our own little community when some bright USAFA cadets ran a "diversionary" NOE raid on the Ruhr. If I recall correctly, the head of the CM corps lamented the decision of those commanders to "game the game".

My point's not to flog this dead horse; but that's the counterargument -- "gaming the game". Yet our buddies in the military don't have the luxury of hiding under the veneer of historicity. Sure, that particular scenario may be "impossible" given the actual circumstances, but without doubt an analogous, perhaps unsimulatable "crease" exists. I'm sorry, you've got to think of those things.

But if these principles are not universally accepted by the AH community, odds are the military won't take them either. (sure, professionals and amateurs; but I suspect with what fellatio's going for in Washington, Baghdad and Moscow, nobody in the world is a professional strategist)

funkedup · « **Reply #33 on:** September 08, 2002, 10:56:59 PM »

To me it sounds like a good exercise. If they did the exercise and didn't find any problems THEN I'd be worried.

If you train properly, your training looks like a real battle, and vice-versa. - Some Roman Dude

senna · « **Reply #34 on:** September 08, 2002, 11:18:32 PM »

Anybody who knows anything about modern military weapons and capability knows that you can shoot holes all over that story.

Dinger · « **Reply #35 on:** September 09, 2002, 12:02:03 AM »

Nice toy, senna. Now, if an Iraqi mirage is diving to a profile consistent with an exocet launch, what's gonna stop you from turning it on?

senna · « **Reply #36 on:** September 09, 2002, 12:42:48 AM »

Hum, once the ship is underway its all depends on the active systems on board and their preliminary status. Its really up to those systems. You have a point.

lord dolf vader · « **Reply #37 on:** September 09, 2002, 02:14:51 AM »

when I was in, one of thos lite up and took out a officer and half the wheelhouse on another ship at a big seperation ( a couple clicks if memory serves)freak accident according to the navy .

Even then they were questioning the use of makeing one big missile into 1000 little pieces going mach 2 since our ships weren't armored at all.

sound cool when fired though.

ferrrrrappppppppppppppppp!!

you dont even what to know what they said it cost .

Dowding (Work) · « **Reply #38 on:** September 09, 2002, 03:51:01 AM »

Quote

Even then they were questioning the use of makeing one big missile into 1000 little pieces going mach 2 since our ships weren't armored at all.

Take a look at the pictures of HMS Sheffield shortly before she sank due to an exocet hit during the Falklands War. She didn't have any sophisticated anti-missile systems.

Revvin · « **Reply #39 on:** September 09, 2002, 08:18:05 AM »

So the American Army start's losing so resorts to gaming the game...I'm starting to think there's quite a few US Forces top brass playing AH

Dinger · « **Reply #40 on:** September 09, 2002, 10:51:24 AM »

Quote

In contrast, the Stark suffered from being caught in a cognitive frame in which an attack was unexpected. They regarded the closing of the Mirage as a puzzle rather than a threat, and did not take action to unmask its defensive systems in time for them to engage.

sound familiar?

Kieran · « **Reply #41 on:** September 09, 2002, 11:04:04 AM »

You referring to the U.S.S. Cole?

wulfie · « **Reply #42 on:** September 09, 2002, 03:32:02 PM »

No he's referring to the Stark, which lost alot of Sailors and made it home due to superb damage control.

But it wasn't really 'news' to U.S. 'media' because it happened before 11SEP01.

Mike/wulfie

midnight Target · « **Reply #43 on:** September 09, 2002, 05:37:03 PM »

Could this be a propaganda tool by our govt.?

Remember all the dire predictions prior to the ground war starting in the Gulf? "Iraq has the 5th largest army in the world", "They are battle hardened and ready after years of war with Iran"

I'll take the USA and give the points on this one.

Kieran · « **Reply #44 on:** September 09, 2002, 05:39:37 PM »

I see, Wulfie. I read the question wrong.