Author Topic: 80% of College Professors are Democratic (Read 1237 times)

H. Godwineson · « **Reply #15 on:** October 03, 2002, 02:35:03 PM »

Dead Man Flying,

If the problem does not lie within the hiring process, as you contend, then how does such a discrepancy in numbers take place?

Determining the political views of an applicant based on research papers published in a scientific or math journal would be difficult. Papers published on topics in the fields of government, history, or law, would be a dfferent matter entirely. How could an applicant keep his views completely hidden from a review board?

I maintain that there is something wrong somewhere, for in a completely objective system, there should be little or no disparity in numbers. One might believe a 60 to 40 percent difference, but 80 to 20 is hard to swallow. Such a discrepancy in hiring involving ethnic groups has spawned numerous lawsuits in the past. Lawsuits, I might add, that have been successfully prosecuted.

Regards, Shuckins

SaburoS · « **Reply #16 on:** October 03, 2002, 03:15:39 PM »

Quote

If the problem does not lie within the hiring process, as you contend, then how does such a discrepancy in numbers take place?

Isn't it possible that the political affiliation of the pool of candidates is about 80-20?
If that being the case it would make sence, no?
It is kind of funny to think that any school/university would pass on more qualified individuals based on political affiliation.
Isn't there a teacher shortage going on?

If the program you saw showed the opposite numbers (80%Republican, 20% Democrat), would you have posted it?

Montezuma · « **Reply #17 on:** October 03, 2002, 03:23:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by H. Godwineson

If the problem does not lie within the hiring process, as you contend, then how does such a discrepancy in numbers take place?

What numbers?

Something that someone heard someone say on a talk show does not qualify.

Curval · « **Reply #18 on:** October 03, 2002, 03:33:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by midnight Target
Well it's obvious to me!

College professors, representing the most highly educated Americans, choose to be Democrats because they know better. duh!

No...I'd say they can't face the real world so they hide in school.

Typical democrats.

Funny, but college is supposed to promote free thinking. I found out that it actually represents free thinking as long as it is based on liberal bleeding heart sentiments.

In my final exam in a political science class I was racing through the questions and feeling good. I knew I had nailed all of the questions and was heading for an A.

Then the last question got me angry. The school was a university in Canada and the question was along the lines of "How did this class help you to better understand the Francophone-Anglophone relationship in Canada.

My answer was quite clear...it didn't. I said that I was sick to death of the French whining and that frankly English Canada should pull all Federal money out of Quebec and build a Berlin (style)-Wall with razor wire along the top of it to surround the whole province. Then give them there own currency and be done with it.

I was accused of being a zenophobe by the professor who marked the exam and he gave me a failing grade on that question...brought my A down to a B.

Yup...free thinking alright...just as long as you think along the same lines as the professor.

john9001 · « **Reply #19 on:** October 03, 2002, 03:43:00 PM »

affirmative action is needed for conservitive teachers

Dinger · « **Reply #20 on:** October 03, 2002, 03:54:38 PM »

Um. I've got bad news for you guys.
If you look at the political breakdown of graduate schools, you'll find *horror*, that 80% of people working for their PhD are democratic.

Now, some of those numbers may be skewed. after all, people tend to vote with their self-interest in mind. Now, who among you believes that the Republican Party believes in giving US Universities as much funding as the Democratic Party does?

Oh my God, now someone's going to complain that oil company CEOs are overwhelmingly Republican! Give me a break!

And, hmmm, the other problem with recruiting reasonably intelligent right-wing profs is that the conservative think tanks offer more money and less work; and look at them! the idiots they hire are really "scraping the bottom of the barrel".
The money is there, the jobs are there; but the brains aren't.

Quote

My answer was quite clear...it didn't. I said that I was sick to death of the French whining and that frankly English Canada should pull all Federal money out of Quebec and build a Berlin (style)-Wall with razor wire along the top of it to surround the whole province. Then give them there own currency and be done with it.

Dude, that's an F-Worthy answer.
If you want to say that the class didn't help you improve your understanding, (which is a stupid way to phrase the question, I admit), you need toa rgue:
The class didn't help improve my understnading because I came in with fixed ideas and was unwilling to change my mind based on fact. For example, in the course, the argument of ..., failed to impress my position....

To get any sort of grade, first you need to answer the question, not pontificate on your opinion. Second, you need to refer to evidence, not assert what feels good. Finally, in making an argument, nobody cares how you feel. Surprise surprise, a professor who is a democrat doesn't give a damn about how you feel presonally on a poly sci paper. They're not there to say "awww, poor curval's sick to death of the naughty french canadians"; get your bellybutton out of the response and make a coherent argument based on evidence, not on your personal xenophobic reaction.
Then you can say "we should take all federal money out and fence in quebec". It's not about the conclusion; it's about how you reach the conclusions.
And if certain parties have serious logical problems, then the professors who teach such things aren't liable to be members of those parties, are they?

funkedup · « **Reply #21 on:** October 03, 2002, 04:00:55 PM »

Those who can, do.
Those who can't, teach.
So professor jobs are kind of "self-selecting" for people who can't figure out how the real world works and want everybody to be as miserable as they are, i.e. Democrats.

hardcase · « **Reply #22 on:** October 03, 2002, 04:12:49 PM »

Could it be that republicans dont want to teach. You know, something social, as opposed to opening dat bidness?

hardcase

Curval · « **Reply #23 on:** October 03, 2002, 05:00:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Dinger
Dude, that's an F-Worthy answer.
If you want to say that the class didn't help you improve your understanding, (which is a stupid way to phrase the question, I admit), you need toa rgue:
The class didn't help improve my understnading because I came in with fixed ideas and was unwilling to change my mind based on fact. For example, in the course, the argument of ..., failed to impress my position....

To get any sort of grade, first you need to answer the question, not pontificate on your opinion. Second, you need to refer to evidence, not assert what feels good. Finally, in making an argument, nobody cares how you feel. Surprise surprise, a professor who is a democrat doesn't give a damn about how you feel presonally on a poly sci paper. They're not there to say "awww, poor curval's sick to death of the naughty french canadians"; get your bellybutton out of the response and make a coherent argument based on evidence, not on your personal xenophobic reaction.
Then you can say "we should take all federal money out and fence in quebec". It's not about the conclusion; it's about how you reach the conclusions.
And if certain parties have serious logical problems, then the professors who teach such things aren't liable to be members of those parties, are they?

I wasn't allowed to keep the paper, but I wish I had been able to because I would post it.

Your point is well taken...if what you take what I posted as being the major argument and ultimate conclusion of my answer in the exam.

I answered the specific question asked alright...even giving dates where the professor had disregarded my direct questions on points of fact during the classes...it wasn't hard to work out as we only had 4 lectures on the subject for the term (which only lasted about two and a half months).

But, he based my grade on much the same basis you did..which in your case is expected given that it was all I gave you to read. He had the whole thing...but focused only on the points I mentioned above.

My point was that he had HIS way of thinking about the issue and was expecting to hear it "parroted" back to him. He portrayed the French Canadians as the most exploited culture in the world. I disagreed with him and he hated that.

And, by the by...that happened many years ago. I don't need to hear how to get a grade in school anymore. I actually did quite well thanks. The school invited me to join their Masters program in Political Science but I decided to earn some money instead. While doing so I worked towards an accounting designation at night. This after 4 years of listening to puffed up liberal professors tell me what was wrong with the world.

Udie · « **Reply #24 on:** October 03, 2002, 05:27:18 PM »

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Originally posted by Curval

The school invited me to join their Masters program in Political Science but I decided to earn some money instead.

wellllll how CONSERVATIVE of you. Why you should be executed you evil evil man. How dare you take care of yourself!!! Now what's the government supposed to do?!?!! It's a good thing you don't live in America! YOUR type aren't welcome here!!!!

Traitor!!!

Kieran · « **Reply #25 on:** October 03, 2002, 05:59:56 PM »

My older brother, recently retired from the military (Special Forces, pretty high-speed) decided to go into education. He is taking his first classes, and is now currently enrolled in a multiculturalism in education class. I asked him how things are going.

"Fine, but I need to find a rock to crawl under."
"Why?"
"My professor said that since I am white I am racist, and since I am male I am an oppressor, and there isn't a darn thing I can do about it."
"Pretty harsh."
"Tell me about it."

Yup, I hate to say it, but college academia has more than its share of brainwashers in it.

ispar · « **Reply #26 on:** October 03, 2002, 06:10:30 PM »

Ah, I understand completely, funked. Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Therefore, teachers have no place in society. All they do is take away from the number of people doing, the lazy gits!

I think it may be possible to paraphrase DMF by saying that a large part of the process of becoming a professor in the first is proving that you indeed can.

I'd rather be taught before I have to do. Less likely to lose a hand, you know?

fdiron · « **Reply #27 on:** October 03, 2002, 06:16:43 PM »

College professors are the people who couldn't make it in their respected fields.

Dead Man Flying · « **Reply #28 on:** October 03, 2002, 06:49:32 PM »

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Originally posted by H. Godwineson
If the problem does not lie within the hiring process, as you contend, then how does such a discrepancy in numbers take place?

[/B]

I'm not convinced there's a discrepancy in the first place. The author claims to have gone to 200 different colleges and universities? Did he draw a random sample of colleges and universities? Did he sample community colleges, public universities, private schools, religious and military institutions, etc? Which departments did he ask? Did he draw a random sample of those as well, or did he just ask certain departments?

The question of non-tenure vs. tenure hiring discrimination is incredibly easy to test statistically -- just do a means test between the average percentage who are Democratic and tenured vs. the average percentage who are Democratic and untenured. Did he do this? Why not? The data should be easy to come by given his "rigorous" collection practices.

If we really want to test this hypothesis, how about comparing the political affiliation of people in PhD programs to those employed as professors. Another difference of means test should tell us if things are out of sorts, or if in fact we have a self-selecting phenomenon going on. The fact that this author has failed to consider these possibilities, or to empirically test them tells me he's a roadkill shoveller preaching to a choir and nothing more.

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Determining the political views of an applicant based on research papers published in a scientific or math journal would be difficult. Papers published on topics in the fields of government, history, or law, would be a dfferent matter entirely. How could an applicant keep his views completely hidden from a review board?

[/B]

My field is Political Science. How more "political" can you get than that? And yet, unless the author is frames things in a Marxist/classist ideology, it's extremely difficult to tell the political affiliation. I'd be happy to post some of my published articles for you so you can tell me what my political affiliation is based on them. Obviously, there are some academics who are very vocal and clear in their ideology, but usually this determines what they study rather than what they write or argue. There are exceptions to everything.

Quote

I maintain that there is something wrong somewhere, for in a completely objective system, there should be little or no disparity in numbers. One might believe a 60 to 40 percent difference, but 80 to 20 is hard to swallow. Such a discrepancy in hiring involving ethnic groups has spawned numerous lawsuits in the past. Lawsuits, I might add, that have been successfully prosecuted.

[/B]

Party affiliation is not ethnicity, and it's probably not accorded "protected" status. In any event, I find the notion of an 80/20 split ludicrous and poorly researched in the first place. Maybe the author would have done well to enter a PhD program to learn some research methodology.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Dead Man Flying · « **Reply #29 on:** October 03, 2002, 06:53:18 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Curval
My point was that he had HIS way of thinking about the issue and was expecting to hear it "parroted" back to him. He portrayed the French Canadians as the most exploited culture in the world. I disagreed with him and he hated that.

And I've never encountered this type of bias in many years at the undergraduate and graduate level. In fact, I used to challenge the professors I knew to be liberal-minded by giving answers that were contrary or problematic to their general framework. I was never once penalized for this, and in fact one of the professors I did this with wrote a recommendation letter for me for grad school.

Bad professors suck no matter what their political affiliation.

-- Todd/Leviathn