Author Topic: Abatic is a chute shooter  (Read 4722 times)

Offline Widewing

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8800
Re: Re: Re: Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2002, 11:40:33 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by eskimo2
I think it was last night...
A Hellcat was running away from a pack of co-alt Jap planes, and towards his CV.  MY Japanese comrads seemed genuinly mad that he wouldn't turn back and fight.  I'm still amazed to hear players complain about such tactics.  Turning around would be nothing but stupid.  He could have hoped for one good HO, and then he would have been eaten up.  They were mad at him for not being stupid.

eskimo


I absolutely agree with Eskimo. I’m continually amazed at the endless whining that follows after a pilot demonstrates the good sense to fly his aircraft in a manner that best suits its capabilities.

For example, there is nothing in the current IJN/JAAF plane set that can cope with a “properly” flown P-38L. Utilizing its speed, tremendous zoom climb and rock-steady shooting platform, the Lightning is almost untouchable, save for a pilot blunder. Often, we hear the talk about how easily it compresses. What we don’t hear is how insignificant this really is once you learn how to make it work to your advantage. It’s those little known secrets that give pilots an edge to be exploited. Other areas can be exploited as well. Again, for example, the P-38 can easily outclimb the N1K2. Nonsense, you say! Well, it can! How? Simply make it a shallow, high-speed climb, around 1 to 1.5k/minute. To the dismay of the Niki driver, he finds himself rapidly falling behind. Once again, this is flying to the strengths of your plane, and avoiding those of the enemy aircraft.

So, why would anyone get involved in a turning fight with Zekes or N1K2 type fighters? Why fight the way your enemy fights best? In the MA, I fly the Zero, Ki-61 and N1K2 fairly often. There’s nothing I like more than a P-38 trying to turn fight with me.

Last night, I came across a pair of P-38s turn fighting with a Zero down on the deck. I watched as the P-38s struggled to avoid the Zero, while trying to gain position for a shot. I orbited above the fight for a few minutes waiting to see if it would ever end. Having waited long enough to give the P-38 guys their opportunity, I finally split-essed and smacked down the Zero. In this instance, we have demonstrated both the wrong way and right way to fight Zekes. Fly smart and you'll look like a genius. Fly dumb and, well, you know.

Unfortunately, the Japanese fighters are all slow in comparison to the American iron. Simply stated, there’s no running away from P-38s, Thunderbolts and Hellcats. Even the A-20G is faster on the deck than any of the current Japanese fighters except the N1K2, which is, essentially, a dead heat (about 320-325 mph).

Another tremendous fighter is the F6F Hellcat. It does everything well. Dive acceleration is incredible, and it is extremely durable. Last evening, I attacked Daddog’s Ki-67 formation, shooting down two of them, but losing a flap, three guns and an elevator in the process. Returning to the carrier, I encounter a Niki fighting with another Hellcat. I saw an opportunity to sneak in a snapshot, by zooming up to the fight. There was some risk, as I would find myself dead slow at the top of the climb, but figured I could get away with it if I was careful. So, up I went, firing a 70 degree deflection shot into the Niki, knocking off some pieces. On the verge of a stall, I rolled inverted and headed down, the beat up Niki in hot pursuit blazing away, and knocking off my other flap too!  But, what the enemy pilot didn’t realize is that the F6F turns remarkably well, even missing one elevator. I pulled into a left-hand Lufberry, and slowly began to work around on the Niki! Meanwhile, that other Hellcat finished him off when he pulled out of the circle. Apparently, one of those pieces I knocked off the Niki was one of his elevators. A minute later the Niki driver stated that I was lucky that he had a damaged plane. Of course, if I had all 6 guns working, he probably wouldn't have survived my snapshot in the first place.

Stupid Cat Tricks department: Attacked a formation of Ki-67s with Hellcat. Instead of using guns, I salvo’d six 5” rockets. Damned if I didn’t hit all three bombers! :eek:   Pangea! He was very good-natured about it. Me, I would have been really pissed! I tried the same stunt again 30 minutes later and missed everything. :rolleyes:  So much for skill!

Finally, I managed to crash out a pair of Hellcats, colliding with bombers, simply flying way too aggressively. Well, stupid is as stupid does.....

I’m starting to feel at home in the CT….

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Slash27

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 12792
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #31 on: December 12, 2002, 12:04:01 PM »
Well put Widewing:)

Abatic,  if thats what happend I dont see a problem shooting a spy. But there seems to be some controversey on the event so im staying neutral on this:D

Offline pangea

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 164
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #32 on: December 12, 2002, 12:17:39 PM »
LOL Oldman.  I don't mind being called an "Immersionist", just don't classify me as a point-mongering score potato.  As I said earlier, play the way you want to play cause its really not that big of deal as long as you are not rude or offensive to others.  You have always been friendly, respectful and quick to all in the CT and I respect you for that.  So go ahead, shoot chutes if you like.  Its just not my way.

Sometimes I get a little irritated when I get HO'd, vulched, ganged, cherry picked or someone runs away (ahem,..er extends), but hey, I've done it too so what the hell.  At those times of irritation I repeat over and over to myself....ITS JUST A GAME, ITS JUST A GAME.

pangea

Offline Jester

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2753
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #33 on: December 12, 2002, 01:08:06 PM »
Quote
Your squad chose to attack a field where I was the only defender. The odds were 9 to 1. After shooting you down, you bailed between the field and town where you remained on the ground, choosing not to end your flight. I made two low passes over you but you still did not exit. On the third pass I executed a spy.


WELL... Being the "Shootie" in this case that started all this, let me set a few things straight.

1.  We were attacking your field when YOU spawned in the middle of it. So I figure you upping in the middle of an attack, you take your chances no matter the odds.

2.  Yes, you shot me down because I was stupid enought to HO with you. Good for you bad for me.

3. After nurseing my plane as far from the field as I could I bailed. My intention being to GET THE HELL OUT OF DODGE, not hang around and "Spy" on you. There were 8 other a/c right capping the field - why the HELL would I need to "Spy" on you? :confused:  You did pass over me several times but if you noticed I was running like hell for friendly territory! Finally figured it would take all night to get there and had about given up when you shot me.

4. As for "Chute Shooting" during WW2 - I am sure it happened on everyside. While detestable - that is the nature of war. This is a GAME. Totally different varment.

5. As for "Chute Shooting" in AH - IMO it is as Slash put it, "It's just plain CHICKENSHIT." If you already shot someone down no need to rub it in. You have won. Save ammo, give them a and move on to the next enemy a/c.
 For the record, it is one of the squad rules in the 325th FG (and several other squads that I have been in) that behavior of that type WILL NOT be tolerated in the squad and a pilot caught doing it will be grounded and if it persists he will be kicked out of the squad.
 
The way our squad flies, we try to fly as "realisticly" in every way and to try and land or at least make it back to friendly territory on EVERY sortie as during R/L. So when we bug out after bombing a base, we are useing every advantage that we can get from tactics and our a/c. If you don't fly that way you are just plain flying stupid. Try the MA if you just want to "Furball."
Lt. JESTER
VF-10 "GRIM REAPERS"

WEBSITE:  www.VF10.org

Offline Shane

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 7402
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #34 on: December 12, 2002, 01:17:40 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Oldman731
The council has spoken.  My torch is out.  Henceforth I will bite my fingers and stamp my feet, but I won’t shoot at you as you float beneath your frilled parachutes.
Honest.
- Oldman (lies down in corner, sucks thumb):)


heh. good thing i can't hear the council. i'll take up the torch and start nailing any chutes i see, even friendly ones -  that way when i get killshootered and someone else gets shot down because i was taken out of action, maybe the bailer will feel a little guilt.

:D

if all this other "good tatcics" stuff is for the "war" let us be reminded.... all's fair in love and war.

bailers beware! for one of the 4 horse's bellybutton of the apopletic is coming for you!!!

:D
Surrounded by suck and underwhelmed with mediocrity.
I'm always right, it just takes some poepl longer to come to that realization than others.
I'm not perfect, but I am closer to it than you are.
"...vox populi, vox dei..."  ~Alcuin ca. 798

Offline Shane

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 7402
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2002, 01:22:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Andijg
4. As for "Chute Shooting" during WW2 - I am sure it happened on everyside. While detestable - that is the nature of war. This is a GAME. Totally different varment.

5. As for "Chute Shooting" in AH - IMO it is as Slash put it, "It's just plain CHICKENSHIT." If you already shot someone down no need to rub it in. You have won.
 
The way our squad flies, we try to fly as "realisticly" in every way and to try and land or at least make it back to friendly territory on EVERY sortie as during R/L.


make up your damn mind!!  is it a game or is it memorex?

:confused:
Surrounded by suck and underwhelmed with mediocrity.
I'm always right, it just takes some poepl longer to come to that realization than others.
I'm not perfect, but I am closer to it than you are.
"...vox populi, vox dei..."  ~Alcuin ca. 798

Offline Samm

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 980
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #36 on: December 12, 2002, 01:26:43 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Andijg



5. As for "Chute Shooting" in AH - IMO it is as Slash put it, "It's just plain CHICKENSHIT." If you already shot someone down no need to rub it in. You have won. Save ammo, give them a and move on to the next enemy a/c.
 For the record, it is one of the squad rules in the 325th FG (and several other squads that I have been in) that behavior of that type WILL NOT be tolerated in the squad and a pilot caught doing it will be grounded and if it persists he will be kicked out of the squad.
 


Uber dorks, You should hook up with this squad,

 http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=60353

 Note rule #5 .

Offline Jester

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2753
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2002, 01:56:24 PM »
The "Peanut Gallery" has spoken.

:p
Lt. JESTER
VF-10 "GRIM REAPERS"

WEBSITE:  www.VF10.org

Offline CurtissP-6EHawk

  • Parolee
  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1452
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2002, 04:17:29 PM »
Quote
After shooting you down, you bailed between the field and town where you remained on the ground, choosing not to end your flight


You did not shoot me down. It was not I that you stooped so low by chute shooting, it was a squad mate. I made it to a friendly base safe, alive and fired up for the next sortie.

Please do not shoot chutes in the CT.

And the reason I plastered you name all over this board is because I was explaining myself to you on "private" when you ".schelched" me. You squelched me but forgot to use the "." later on when we were on the same side during a time when I was not even around or near you minding my own buisness. SO were you mad at me for driving an M16 or for kicking your butt in it?

Oldman...Thanks

Widwing well put!!

Shane...welcome back!

Last night I decided to stay and dogfight for a while. The 27th Sentai (my former squad) kicked my white arse. I turned, I died. I climb to quick, I died. I flew too low and slow, I died. Thats why I dont do it.


However, I did get into a fight with "weapon?" He blew off my wing tip, I was low and slow so I could not bail. I limped as far as I could before he caught me and vulched me. I know its hard to see that kind of damage but I still called him a name or two then blew it off to "Thats Life". I did the same thing to Abatic on one of those sorties. I dove in a shot off a burst then noticed that his left outboard wing was gone, knowing he was no threat any longer, I stoped shooting and buzzed by letting him do whatever he decided to do. My job was not to kill but to eliminate the weapon! His weapon was no longer a threat :D
« Last Edit: December 12, 2002, 04:40:37 PM by CurtissP-6EHawk »

Offline kidcol

  • Zinc Member
  • *
  • Posts: 56
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2002, 04:28:27 PM »
#1 I fully admit to not reading this thread, the whole way...  sue me

#2 If I 'm dumb enuff to bail, I prefer to be shot, makes it easier for me to re-up faster :)

#3 If Oldman is having delusionary dreams, I'd really like it if HT would require him to be on some sort of meds before flying again.

#4 Where'd I leave my beer?

declan

oh yeah..  QWAH!!

Offline daddog

  • Aces High CM Staff (Retired)
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 15082
      • http://www.332nd.org
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #40 on: December 13, 2002, 05:23:41 PM »
Quote
Last evening, I attacked Daddog’s Ki-67 formation, shooting down two of them, but losing a flap, three guns and an elevator in the process.
Hold still next time! I will save you having to return to land. ;) Well done!

I don't shoot chutes because I need ALL the ammo I can get for the things that shoot back at me. And like eskimo I know it up sets some so I just dont bother.

Of course others enjoy the "bothering" end of it. ;)

If someone shoots my chute I don't care at all.
Noses in the wind since 1997
332nd Flying Mongrels
daddog
Knowing for Sure

Offline Samm

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 980
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #41 on: December 13, 2002, 08:36:59 PM »
Why does being shot while in a parachute bother people ?

Offline mrfish

  • Parolee
  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2343
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #42 on: December 13, 2002, 09:16:44 PM »
abatic got me today and he didn't get my chute- did i do something worng? what'd i do- is there another chute? i knew it! you're shooting other chutes now aren't you boo hoo hoo

Offline CurtissP-6EHawk

  • Parolee
  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1452
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #43 on: December 14, 2002, 04:03:11 AM »
Quote
Why does being shot while in a parachute bother people

Can you not read plain english?

Quote
abatic got me today and he didn't get my chute- did i do something worng


Can you not read as well?
« Last Edit: December 14, 2002, 04:05:13 AM by CurtissP-6EHawk »

Offline Samm

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 980
Abatic is a chute shooter
« Reply #44 on: December 14, 2002, 09:54:32 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by CurtissP-6EHawk
Can you not read plain english?


Yes I can, so tell me in plain english why it bothers you to be shot while in a chute .