Unsurpassed Dweebery - LOL

[beet1e]

Originally posted by SlapShot
It is IMPOSSIBLE to interpret the intentions of the person in this situation. It maybe a "guesstimate", and if so, it would NOT always work.

Slap - truth is, today was the first time I'd seen this firsthand. I have heard other people complaining of ramming, but hadn't seen what happened. So it is a rare occurrence, it would seem. In WB, they had a "collision bubble" - a big beef with many, and crappily modelled. If your wingtip went within about ten feet of an enemy plane, you died instantly. The other real headache in WB was having to get VERY close to fire, but then warping the last 200 yards and colliding - happened a lot. Nopoop's explanation makes it clear.

Mr. Toad!  How nice to see you. I have missed you.  But no, if ramming is a legitimate AH tactic, I shall do some ramming of my own!

I saw that ramming in Memphis Belle. Horrible scene as the rookies go down.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Don
>>Buff guns don't fire when the bomber is on the gound.<<

What game are you playing Muckmaw? Buffs guns certainly do fire when on the ground at an airfield that has no FH up but, all BH are up.

Only bombers with nose mounted guns like the Boston and the A-20 can fire while on the ground.  All other bombers have to have wheels off the ground in order to fire their gun turrets.


Ack-Ack

[muckmaw]

That's what I thought.

THe forward guns fired from the cockpit will fire on the ground in any plane, including the A-20, B-26, etc.

No turret guns of any kind will fire until the wheels leave terra firma.

And it's a fair concessions, as  much as I would have liked those guns on the few occasions where I was getting vulched on a take off...(Unexpected raid just as a mission rolls).

But you know, we'd have idiots DRIVING B-17's over to the town to shoot down a goon, when the FH's and VH are dead.

Once again, a game concession. Fair.

[Tumor]

Originally posted by TW9
if i have no ammo and i see a goon i'd ram em

Another tardling in training.

[Hooligan]

Collisions are determined on the FE.  This makes it really hard to ram and damage another aircraft.  In other words, the FE of the guy trying to ram will certainly see the collision and that plane will die.  On the FE of the other player the planes might be 100 or 200 yards apart due to network lag.  This is why most of the time only one aircraft is damaged in a "collision".  In this particular case (i.e. goony vs. goony) the fact that both aircraft are really slow would make it much more likely that a ram would succed in hurting the target as well as the rammer.  Still that doesn't seem likely and ramming is a tactic of desperation and extremely inneffective at best.

Hooligan

[P38Devil]

Wow! I'm famous!

Well, here's what happened:

I was told base XX needed troops, so being the nice guy that I am, I head out in my goon, with a Chopin piano concerto in the cd player to help pass the time going 200 KIAS 15 feet above the water. I get to my target, and the town is not completely down! No one is in the area to finish it, and no one seems to be interested in that field anymore. So, I decide to practice dropping troops, seeing as no other field in the area is anywhere close to ready and I'm beginning to run out of gas. I drop the troops, a short while later, I see an enemy goon a bit offshore! Well, a enemy goon is not a welcome visitor anywhere! I have no ammo so I decide to try ramming. This is the first time I've visited the AH forums, and I've been rammed a few times myself in my short career, so I didn't realize it was looked down upon. I declared my intent on the country channel just to make sure, and no one tried to dissuade me. So off I go, and being lighter than the enemy goon, began to catch up with him. He must have given up after a while because he slowed down. So I aimed my right wing at his left and did a slight dive and bank right.

I am very pleased to find out that I took him down, I wasn't sure:)  A few minutes ago someone said something to the effect of "Beetle was so pissed off about the goon ramming that he posted it on the BBS! WTG!"

I must say that I am really flattered by all this attention! I didn't know ramming wasn't "cool", especially considering it was a legitimate tactic in WW2. (This is supposed to be a WW2 sim, right?). Anyway, I'll refrain from ramming in the future:)

Oh btw, I'm very grateful you made a film of it, my friends and family are delighted

[Eagler]

LOL

don't worry, they'll fix it in AH2 - the planes will bounce off each other - no collisions at all

it's a GAME - PLAY it as your $15 tells ya too

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Hooligan
Collisions are determined on the FE.  This makes it really hard to ram and damage another aircraft.  In other words, the FE of the guy trying to ram will certainly see the collision and that plane will die.  On the FE of the other player the planes might be 100 or 200 yards apart due to network lag.  This is why most of the time only one aircraft is damaged in a "collision".  In this particular case (i.e. goony vs. goony) the fact that both aircraft are really slow would make it much more likely that a ram would succed in hurting the target as well as the rammer.  Still that doesn't seem likely and ramming is a tactic of desperation and extremely inneffective at best.

Hooligan

Slower connection speeds usually dictates who wins and who doesn't in a collision.  Usually the one with the faster connection will get damaged or die from the collision while the one with the slower connection usually flies off unscathed, even if he's the one that initiated the collision in the first place.


Ack-Ack

[Toad]

Not so fast, Beet1e.

We're talking "selective realism" here.. you remember, you've been accusing everyone who disagrees with you of "selective realism".

Now, on the ramming topic, it's an " AH tactic"?

Kamikaze ring any bells for you?

Your own instance of the Spitfire pilot?

The known Luftwaffe consideration of ramming the bombers?

No, old son, it's not an "AH tactic" it is a documented "WW2" tactic.

If you want it removed from AH, that would, of course, be "selective realism".

But we all knew you were always one of those guys anyway.

[rshubert]

Thanks for the technical discussion of collisions.  I have always wondered why I (no I don't ram on purpose, but I sometimes collide during a head-on pass) am "shot down" 9 times out of 10.

I have a really low ping!  It usually runs between 45-80.

Do you think that some players with dial up connections ram on purpose, knowing they have a good chance of coming away with a win--no shots fired?

Well, I'll fix that.  Dial up, here I come!!  Can you say "33.6 K"?  Sure.  I knew you could.  This could start a race to 300 baud!

Seriously, could that explain why I see a lot of warping?? THe difference in connection speed, not a problem with my connection??

[Hooligan]

Ack-Ack:

I really doubt that slower connection speeds have that effect.

On a player's FE if his aircraft touches an enemy aircraft a collision occurs.  The FE does not consult the server about this.  It shouldn't matter at all for collision detection how good or bad your connection is because all your FE is checking is the positions of 2 objects in your FE.

However, a bad connection will mean that the server and other aircraft will see the collision effects on you later than on the other guy.  Suppose A and B both detect a collision and both blow up.  If A has a much slower connection than B, then B's death information will be transmitted to the server before A's and A will get a kill on B (even though it was "simultaneous").  This happens just because the server knows that B is dead before it knows that A is dead.

rshubert:

Everybody loses 9 out of 10 collisions.  Because most of the time  the "winner" evades and doesn't actually collide on his FE.  On the other guys FE, his aircraft is typically 100 yards or 200 yards away from where you see it on yours.  On his FE he turns enough to evade the enemy aircraft when he is 100 yards out.  On your FE you run into each other.

Hooligan

[nopoop]

It starts to get confusing with a guns headon pass.

Pilot A has an 80 ping and Pilot be has a 300 ping.

If I'm understanding this right, in a headon pass, the low ping pilot has the advantage because the con is "closer" to him on his FE than what the high ping pilot sees on his FE.

Low ping opens fire and sees hits ( now being sent to the opponent ) when the opponent is not in firing range on his FE.

Make sense ??

Or does the position updates sent from the low ping pilot TO the high ping pilot equalize the relative "positional distance" or somewhat equalize what there both seeing ??

I'm high ping ( 325 ) and on a guns headon, I'm recieving hits "before" we meet. That would tell me the other FE has a low Ping.

In WB any hits my plane took ALWAYS were AFTER the merge due to lag. There may be a different way of doing things here.

I can't recall ever receiving hits after the merge on my FE here.

[muckmaw]

What the hell is a ping!??!!?

Seriously, mine runs about 47 in the MA.

Does this mean I'm at a disadvantage???

I am so confused now!

[devious]

ROFL. Ping 150 - 300 here. Go figure.

[edit]Yes, german fighter pilots were trained to ram the enemy.[/edit]

[beet1e]

Originally posted by Toad
Not so fast, Beet1e.

We're talking "selective realism" here.. you remember, you've been accusing everyone who disagrees with you of "selective realism".

Now, on the ramming topic, it's an " AH tactic"?

Kamikaze ring any bells for you?

Your own instance of the Spitfire pilot?

The known Luftwaffe consideration of ramming the bombers?

No, old son, it's not an "AH tactic" it is a documented "WW2" tactic.

If you want it removed from AH, that would, of course, be "selective realism".

But we all knew you were always one of those guys anyway.

I think you missed the "LOL" in my post title! This whole deal was an isolated piece of AH nonsense. I had never been rammed before, and didn't realise that I would die too. It's so rare that it's not worth worrying about. I thought I'd step up as a change-the-game whiner - LOL - was impersonating a few other people in here. Admittedly, I was slightly surprised at the goon's choice of tactic, and had I just kept going, Hawker's LA7 would have caught up and saved me. But then I would be suffering the ignominy of having been saved by an LA7 - lol! I died with honour. Hehe, remember that time we first met in the arena, and you were in an LA7 and saved my arse? That was DOUBLE ignominy - ROFL

Oh, and we did get V38 a short time later, though its only strategic value as a Bish base was to stop "them" from having it.