Author Topic: New Liberal Think-Tank established (Read 3776 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #75 on:** October 30, 2003, 02:16:56 PM »

nexus... still having trouble with that pesky "self sustaining" thing?

I don't care what point we decide that a human is a human but we better agree.... When it is a human is not the decision of the person carrying the child. It can't be human and murder at 6 mos. after fertilization if someone hurts the mother and causes an abortion but not murder if a doctor does it.

Like I said.... got nothing against killing people.... just have he guts to admit that is what you are doing and...... have a damn good reason... Not getting around to it because you were too busy for 5 months doesn't fall under "damn good reason".
lazs

DmdNexus · « **Reply #76 on:** October 30, 2003, 02:30:18 PM »

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Originally posted by lazs2

Like I said.... got nothing against killing people.... just have he guts to admit that is what you are doing and...... have a damn good reason... Not getting around to it because you were too busy for 5 months doesn't fall under "damn good reason".
lazs

Here's where we do agree...
Once a woman realizes she's late... there's not reason to deliberate... a decision has to be made.

I'm more inclined to say 4 months pregnant... take it to term.

Up to 3 months... it's abortable.

midnight Target · « **Reply #77 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:23:52 PM »

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Originally posted by Mini D
Actually... couldn't find anything correct with what you said. Though... I do agree they need to be re-written to actually make a point.

MiniD

Ahh, you assumed I was speaking for all liberals. I can see how my post might have seemed that I was. It was however my personal ideals. I should have made that clear. They are liberal ideals that I hold. Not all of my ideals may be defined as liberal.

I am for example not against gun ownership.

So you see there is no correct or incorrect. You may disagree with my ideals, but they are correctly mine.

lazs2 · « **Reply #78 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:27:05 PM »

well..... see? we are not that far off in our thinking.... simply establish a point where a person is a person wheather it is in or out of a womb and at that point.... give him the same rights as everyone else... now... if you want to make a law that says people with birth deffects or people who are unable to pay their own way can be executed.... fine... abort away at any point in the pregnancy.

In the case of abort or kill the mother... well... not many of those cases anymore but... I would say that the mother is the inoccent party in that case.
lazs

lazs2 · « **Reply #79 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:29:44 PM »

mt... join the NRA and i will forgive ya for that really effeminate post.
lazs

DmdNexus · « **Reply #80 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:37:01 PM »

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Originally posted by lazs2
i will forgive ya for that really effeminate post.
lazs

Why do you hate women so much?
Wasn't your mother a woman?

midnight Target · « **Reply #81 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:38:29 PM »

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Originally posted by lazs2
mt... join the NRA and i will forgive ya for that really effeminate post.
lazs

You pay the dues, I'll sign.

Ripsnort · « **Reply #82 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:40:17 PM »

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Originally posted by lazs2
to some extent I agree with animal.... I hate anyone who get's in my way. Liberals get in my way a whole lot more often than conservatives tho so it is "the lesser of two evils".
lazs

SHACK! (Christ, whats the world coming to, Lazs and I agreeing alot in the last year or so, except on the "women" thing....)

lazs2 · « **Reply #83 on:** October 30, 2003, 03:58:30 PM »

nexus... I love women... I hold doors open for em... I can be around em for hours at a time sometimes and they enrich my life.

That doesn't mean I want em making any decisions that might affect me tho. And neither should you.

rip.... what "women thing"?

mt... if you want toi keep your gun rights then the NRA is your best ally. I would think you would want to support them... I will settle for your support at the voting booth tho
lazs

Ripsnort · « **Reply #84 on:** October 30, 2003, 04:41:20 PM »

Lazs, women are equal to men in my book, in pay, in power, in voting, in all issues, and in MOST cases, have level heads compared to men....(except for 5 days out of each month)

lazs2 · « **Reply #85 on:** October 30, 2003, 04:48:07 PM »

and maybe 5 days before that and maybe 5 days after that and maybe sometimes for no reason at all.

lazs

Rude · « **Reply #86 on:** October 30, 2003, 04:51:29 PM »

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Originally posted by DmdNexus
A woman can take 3 birthcontrol pills the morning after having sex... and have a 99% chance of aborting a fertilized egg.

Is the next step to ban birth control pills?

And what if a young woman does get pregnant... and doesn't have a job... and can't support that child... and has to put that child up for adoption.... or worse doesn't and the child has to grow up impoverished, and learn how to survive by stealing and becoming a criminal, a gang member, or drug user/dealer.

What kind of life is that for that child?

And the mother - who may have had a future.. but through a poor choice in judgement must suffer the rest of her life...

And what about the man? No penalty for men. except possibly child support.... what if he were a rapist?

I would like to see every one who is anti-abortion... adopt a teenage child.... a handicapped child.... or else STFU.

There are plenty of children alive today that need a home...
If you are a pro-lifer.. then to what you say you want others to do and go support a child who's already alive.

Is the solution for unwanted children.... to ban pre-marital sex?
Or ban sex between couples who don't earn a certain income?
Only the rich may have children? (Gee that will make the Republicans happy... fewer minorities in the world!)

The right wing wants to ban abortion... yet why don't they want to educate children about sex, safe sex, and responsible sex?

Why do they insist on making laws to ban freedom of speach between doctors and patients about family planning?

The question is when does a part of a human body become independently human.. a sentient being.. is it conception? Is it the intent of the man and the woman...

according to the bible it is when the baby draws it's first breath... (even if it's born premature)... it's when it breaches the womb and draws it's first breath.

Genesis 2:7, when God "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

Anti-abortionist, especially, the religious ones, forget their own hipocracy because even God told the Jews to kill children of their enemies.

Numbers 31:17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones.
Deuteronomy 2:34 utterly destroyed the men and the women and the little ones.
Deuteronomy 28:53 And thou shalt eat the fruit of thine own body, the flesh of thy sons and of thy daughters.
I Samuel 15:3 slay both man and woman, infant and suckling.
2 Kings 8:12 dash their children, and rip up their women with child.
2 Kings 15:16 all the women therein that were with child he ripped up.
Isaiah 13:16 Their children also shall be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses shall be spoiled and their wives ravished.
Isaiah 13:18 They shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eyes shall not spare children.
Lamentations 2:20 Shall the women eat their fruit, and children.
Ezekiel 9:6 Slay utterly old and young, both maids and little children.
Hosea 9:14 give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts.
Hosea 13:16 their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up.

You have no idea how badly you show you ignorance when you quote scripture:)

Shuckins · « **Reply #87 on:** October 30, 2003, 04:56:16 PM »

Rip,

Knew a guy once who wouldn't allow his wife to have her five days each month. Talk about a male-chauvinist pig!

Shuckins

Gunslinger · « **Reply #88 on:** October 30, 2003, 05:00:51 PM »

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5. A democracy is measured by its protection of the minority, not its service to the majority. Hence part of our government's mandate should include those protections.

SO minoritys should have more rights than majoritys...I thaught it was equality?

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2. Women should have a right to choose to be an incubator or not.

Woman have a choice....and that choice is to use birth control or keep her legs closed

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6. The environment is for everyone to enjoy and for us to protect. Future generations should not have to pay for our short term gain.

this is NOT a libral ideal....if an off roader or hunter wanted to enjoy the environment they A. destroy it rather than savor it and B. use evil guns to kill the happless animals.

librals dont seem to want to protect the environment rather keep it from anyone by putting up a huge fence around it that says "keep out"

anyhow....MT those arnt all bad ideas but u forgot

1. Health care for all no matter how much it costs
2. Removing the guns from ALL citizens (except criminals..send them to rehab for there bad thaughts)
3. Make everything equal so that no matter how much or how little u work u have the same as the next guy.

Those are just my impressions on what librals stand for

Mini D · « **Reply #89 on:** October 30, 2003, 05:09:41 PM »

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Originally posted by midnight Target
Ahh, you assumed I was speaking for all liberals. I can see how my post might have seemed that I was. It was however my personal ideals. I should have made that clear. They are liberal ideals that I hold. Not all of my ideals may be defined as liberal.

Ya.. I did. That is because someone asked for a list of things liberals could champion. With most of what you wrote, the organization being cited most likely feels they are saying exactly what you wrote... basically its close to party lines. Of course, its implimentation is a whole different story.

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I am for example not against gun ownership.

Who said anything about gun ownership. Now why would you chose that word instead of the one I used?

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So you see there is no correct or incorrect. You may disagree with my ideals, but they are correctly mine.

More power to you. Its the difference between having opinions and generating policy.

BTW... so you know... here's my oppinions on what you mentioned:

1. Opportunities can never be equalized for everyone unless neputism is outlawed, organizations are banned and all wealth is evenly distributed to every single person. Other than that... I'd like to see a utopia where everyone got equal consideration too.

2. Abortion should not be used as the first step in birth control. As a result, defining "abortable" by law will always be flawed. Right now it, combined with child support laws, is skewed too far towards the whims of the woman. She can chose to abort regardless of what the father wants, or she can chose to have the baby regardless of what the father wants. "Sholdn't be forced to be an incubator" aplies... but "shouldn't be forced to be a father" does not?

3. I totally agree... when the word precedence is used.

4. I totally agree except for the use of the word regardless. Why not just say "freedom of rights should aply to all equally" and not bother with defining who will be the particulars that are protected? It is a classic blunder these days. Unless you fit into one of the predefined "we'll watch out for you" sections, you don't really get the benifit of the first part of the sentance.

5. A government is measured by its equal concern for all of its citizens.

... more after the movie.

MiniD