Author Topic: GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...  (Read 2579 times)

Offline Sabre

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2003, 09:36:36 AM »
Here's another article on it...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,101680,00.html

Of course, it's a Fox News story, so some will automatically discount it:p ; however, it jives pretty well with the Reuters report.  Interesting that every one of the presidential-wannabees in that debate just a couple nights ago again described the woeful state of the economy.  Next to "that quagmire" in Iraq, it was the number one Bush-clubber.
Sabre
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Offline miko2d

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2003, 09:46:58 AM »
Rude: So if the economy tanks, it will not be Bush's fault?

 That would be a meanigfull statement in this argument - if still incorrect - if the DmdNexus stated that "growth in economy is not Bush's merit".

 But I do not see him saying anything about the "economy" growing. I see him stating that GDP went up due to monetary expansion and the government expenditures.
 So you are not replying to anything he said.

 GDP is calculated in such way that many items that would be counted as expense in private business are counted as income. GDP is supposed to comprise the value of final goods. Most government expenses cannot be rationally counted as final goods.

 Government - Congress and Bush - did not reduce the amount of resources consumed by the government - and withdrawn from economy, they increased it. So that leaves fewer resources available for investment and consumption, even though it printed and gave away the money to buy resources in the form of tax cuts and credit expansion. Oh, yes - he actually caused americans to pay more for steel, lumber, agricultural products and other stuff necessary for business.
 So if the economy does tank, it may well be Bush's fault - depending on his actions. It would certainly be Greenspan's fault causing unsustainable misallocation of capital by artificially lowering the interest rate.

 At the same time consumer spending increased, indicating that people - americans - are nots aving and investing resources into the increase of production.

 So if the production is increasing, it would mean there is a serious capital decumulation going on or someone abroad is investing the necessary capital.
 It's not a great trick increasing production in a factory by neglecting the machinery - but a temporary one.

 GDP is certainly growing - just look at the money supply. It is actually growing faster than GDP because a lot of money gets siphoned off by foreigners in exchange for real goods.

 Economy growing? Maybe - but you would have to demonstrate it to us. Muckmaw clearly does not believe so, since he expect the increase in money supply to run into insufficient production and cause the raise in prices.

 miko

Offline muckmaw

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2003, 09:59:13 AM »
Miko-

Please understand, I do not bother to read whatever it is your saying. This is the reason for my lack of replies. I simply do not have time today to go through your posts. Sorry.

Offline AKIron

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2003, 09:59:48 AM »
"WASHINGTON -- The U.S. economy roared ahead in the third quarter, growing at its fastest pace in nearly 20 years, fueled by greater consumer and business spending.

Third-quarter gross domestic product, a measure of all the goods and services produced in the U.S., rose at a sizzling 7.2% annual rate, more than double the 3.3% rate in the second quarter, the Commerce Department (news - web sites) said Thursday. The economy grew at a 1.4% pace in the first quarter."


Looks like consumer and business spending rather than government spending to me.
Here we put salt on Margaritas, not sidewalks.

Offline muckmaw

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #19 on: October 30, 2003, 10:08:47 AM »
Miko-

I may have an overly simplistic view of this number, but I'm just interested in the mechanics of it. I don't have time or the inclination to ponder the deeper meaning.

In my universe, a stronger than expected GDP is a single indicator of an accelerating economy, which, if left unchecked will become inflationary and eventually require a move by the federal reserve to tighten the money supply.

Offline Rude

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2003, 10:13:03 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by DmdNexus
No it will be Bush's fault... blame can't be traced back to Greenspan...

that's the doctrine of "Plausible Deniability"

I wouldn't be talking about Greenspan having to do anything with Iraq...
I don't want to disappear in the middle of the night!


Must be nice to have your cake and eat it too...typical liberal.

Offline DmdNexus

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2003, 10:23:31 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by AKIron
"Looks like consumer and business spending rather than government spending to me.


There's a reason why I didn't study economics... it's like psychology... there's as many theories as their are quacks...

Straight from the mouths of the conservative  "FAIR and BALANCED" fox news room.... we get these quotes..

"While consumers have been the main force keeping the economy going, there are more signs that businesses are starting to do their part. "

And the most telling quote of all is...

"...in the second quarter, military spending on the Iraq war — which grew at a whopping 45.8 percent rate — helped to catapult economic growth."

here's the full text...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,101680,00.html

Offline DmdNexus

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #22 on: October 30, 2003, 10:25:38 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Rude
Must be nice to have your cake and eat it too...typical liberal.


The relavence of your bitterness is lost...
Did your dog piss in your wheaties again today?

Offline AKIron

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2003, 10:27:22 AM »
My quote was taken from a Yahoo! Dow Jones report. Are you denying it's validity? Let's be plain spoken Nexus.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/dowjones/20031030/bs_dowjones/200310300841001006
Here we put salt on Margaritas, not sidewalks.

Offline Ripsnort

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2003, 10:27:57 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by DmdNexus
Straight from the mouths of the conservative  "FAIR and BALANCED" fox news room.... we get these quotes..

"While consumers have been the main force keeping the economy going, there are more signs that businesses are starting to do their part. "

And the most telling quote of all is...

"...in the second quarter, military spending on the Iraq war — which grew at a whopping 45.8 percent rate — helped to catapult economic growth."

here's the full text...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,101680,00.html



You *do* realize that consumer spending accounts for 2/3's of the economy, don't you?

Offline DmdNexus

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #25 on: October 30, 2003, 10:30:23 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort
You *do* realize that consumer spending accounts for 2/3's of the economy, don't you?


Hey don't argue with me....

These are not my opinions...

I'm just passing along what the conservative "Fair and balanced" people at fox news are saying iare the "reasons" for this upsurge in the GDP...

go argue with the idiots in your silly conservative movement

Offline muckmaw

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #26 on: October 30, 2003, 10:32:13 AM »
Why do you guys bother with someone who refuses to think for him/herself and only spouts out party rhetoric?

You cannot win a debate with closed-minded people.

Offline DmdNexus

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #27 on: October 30, 2003, 10:32:31 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by AKIron
My quote was taken from a Yahoo! Dow Jones report. Are you denying it's validity? Let's be plain spoken Nexus.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/dowjones/20031030/bs_dowjones/200310300841001006


And my quotes were taken from the conservative right wing "fair and balanced" Fox news...

Are you calling them liars? :lol

Offline DmdNexus

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #28 on: October 30, 2003, 10:36:24 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by muckmaw
Why do you guys bother with someone who refuses to think for him/herself and only spouts out party rhetoric?

You cannot win a debate with closed-minded people.


that's rather closed minded of you...don't you think.

So if someone expresses an opinion and references other sources in support of those opinions... that's a person who doesn't think for them selves?

What party is the Fox news and the Dow Jones report associated with?

Offline DmdNexus

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GDP in at 7.2%...Economy looking up...
« Reply #29 on: October 30, 2003, 10:39:46 AM »
I swear you people smoke pot!