Author Topic: What ignoring a court order will get ya (Read 4734 times)

Sixpence · « **Reply #45 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:35:57 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Martlet
Which was my point initially. If he is guilty of a crime, then he should go to court, like you or I, and be sentenced as you or I would. Then, the people should decide if they'd like to remove him.

Well, he can appeal to the supreme court, but as stated above, the supreme court appoints the chief of the judiciary commitee. I don't think the people should vote to put a judge above the law though. That's why I do not believe the people should have voted if Clinton was to be removed or not. He did just as bad as the judge did, if not worse. He should have been toast.

Martlet · « **Reply #46 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:39:02 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sixpence
Well, he can appeal to the supreme court, but as stated above, the supreme court appoints the chief of the judiciary commitee. I don't think the people should vote to put a judge above the law though. That's why I do not believe the people should have voted if Clinton was to be removed or not. He did just as bad as the judge did, if not worse. He should have been toast.

I agree. He should not be above the law. I just wouldn't want the neighbors disciplining my kids in my yard while I'm standing right there, either.

http://www.dfw.com/mld/startelegram/news/state/7254764.htm

Sixpence · « **Reply #47 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:47:08 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Martlet
I agree. He should not be above the law. I just wouldn't want the neighbors disciplining my kids in my yard while I'm standing right there, either.

http://www.dfw.com/mld/startelegram/news/state/7254764.htm

Well, if the ruling were ignored there would be consequences. If a judge ignored the ruling and removed it, he would have to answer to it. We can argue the ten commandments and it's place(honestly, it does not affect me one way or another, I do not need a stone to tell me it is wrong to kill, lie , or steal), but we cannot argue a court order, we obide by it or face the concequences.

Martlet · « **Reply #48 on:** November 13, 2003, 10:54:05 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sixpence
Well, if the ruling were ignored there would be consequences. If a judge ignored the ruling and removed it, he would have to answer to it. We can argue the ten commandments and it's place(honestly, it does not affect me one way or another, I do not need a stone to tell me it is wrong to kill, lie , or steal), but we cannot argue a court order, we obide by it or face the concequences.

I think we agree on that. I could care less about the ten commandments. I just threw that link there because it was applicable to the topic.

It doesn't matter whether the judge was right or wrong. What matters is he was outside the law. He should be punished. The Judiciary should be able to punish him. We agree up to that point, I think. I don't think they should have the power to remove him, though. Now that I'm thinking about it. I'll have to check on the MA laws, too.

Sixpence · « **Reply #49 on:** November 13, 2003, 11:03:46 PM »

Well, while you are at it, can you tell me why the speaker of the house cannot be removed? I'm told his appointed positon is untouchable.

Reschke · « **Reply #50 on:** November 13, 2003, 11:04:07 PM »

Martlet,

As a citizen of Alabama I agree that they shouldn't have the authority to remove someone who was an elected official. The former Chief Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court (aka Judge Roy Moore) was elected by a wide margin by the people of the state of Alabama. Our representatives in the Legislature should have been the people who put him on "trial" and either voted to remove or reinstate.

However this allow Judge Moore to begin his bid for the Governor's seat in a little less than 2 years. I think the man will be elected because of one thing. At least he is honest to his constituants. Ask hblair about him; they are from the same area/town in Alabama and I believe that hblair might have some better insight on the matter than I would.

Martlet · « **Reply #51 on:** November 13, 2003, 11:09:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sixpence
Well, while you are at it, can you tell me why the speaker of the house cannot be removed? I'm told his appointed positon is untouchable.

First I'd heard of it. If I don't find anything, I'll ask my mother this weekend.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #52 on:** November 14, 2003, 01:11:51 AM »

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Originally posted by Sixpence
One religion is established in the ten commandments.

Just to be a nitpicker.... Moses was Jewish, and both the Jewish and Christian religions share the ten commandments.

So (at least) two religions are 'established' with the ten commandments.

The separation of church and state doctrine that Jefferson wrote of (it is not per se in the constitution, but an interpretation of the intent) was not IMHO broken by a piece of rock in the lobby of the courthouse. This whole issue was blown way out of proportion.

"God save this honorable court" is the same as that rock, and the ex Alabama Chief Justice stands on very solid ground when he points out hypocrisy of the courts.

Chairboy · « **Reply #53 on:** November 14, 2003, 01:24:47 AM »

As an atheist, I feel that having the Ten Commandments from the Old Testament Bible in a government building is a form of intimidation. The message: "Justice for Christians & Jews. Any others need not apply."

I am saddened but not surprised that religious types would support this guy because they like the religion being pushed. If your local courthouse put up witchcraft scrolls on a big monument, or the Quran, would you be so quick to support it?

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #54 on:** November 14, 2003, 01:50:05 AM »

As an Apatheist, I could not care less what is carved on a piece of rock in the lobby. That stone will not break my bones but the words in the adjudication of my case can hurt me.

ravells · « **Reply #55 on:** November 14, 2003, 07:59:24 AM »

I have been following this thread with interest. We don't have any elected judges in the UK so many of the points being discussed could never arise here.

I have a couple of questions which the net has not answered for me and wondered if anyone here could help.

1. Can Judge Moore run again for the same office? How often are the elections held?

2. Does the ethics committee publish the reasons behind its decision? If so does someone have a link to the 'judgment' of the ethics committee?

thanks in advance,

Ravs

Sixpence · « **Reply #56 on:** November 14, 2003, 09:08:24 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
As an Apatheist, I could not care less what is carved on a piece of rock in the lobby. That stone will not break my bones but the words in the adjudication of my case can hurt me.

You are right, but like Clinton, it is not his moral decision that is the problem, it's that he broke the law.

You or I can say or think what we want about child support, but if we get a court order to pay it, we have to pay it or go to jail.

Here is an opposite decision posted by Martlet

http://www.dfw.com/mld/startelegram/news/state/7254764.htm

But if a judge ignores that court decision and removes the ten commandments, he will suffer the same fate.

Sixpence · « **Reply #57 on:** November 14, 2003, 09:30:58 AM »

Here is some from the Alabama constitution

http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeOfAlabama/Constitution/1901/CA-245534.htm

Now, technically, they are not using the law to promote religion, but you can see where having the ten commandments there goes against what section 3 is all about. And you could see why a court would rule the ten commandments where law presides would be a contradiction.

Now here is a section that Miko would be interested in

http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeOfAlabama/Constitution/1901/CA-245566.htm

So while section 35 says it can't make that decision, section 31 says it can.

Here is something interesting, could misconduct as a judge be "an infamous" crime?
http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeOfAlabama/Constitution/1901/CA-245595.htm

Reschke · « **Reply #58 on:** November 14, 2003, 10:24:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by ravells
I have been following this thread with interest. We don't have any elected judges in the UK so many of the points being discussed could never arise here.

I have a couple of questions which the net has not answered for me and wondered if anyone here could help.

1. Can Judge Moore run again for the same office? How often are the elections held?

Yes he can run for the same office and he is eligible to run for other office as well.

Quote

Originally posted by ravells

2. Does the ethics committee publish the reasons behind its decision? If so does someone have a link to the 'judgment' of the ethics committee?

thanks in advance,

Ravs

If they do publish their reasons they may not have done it yet. I can easily find out since I have a few buddies who are attorneys here locally and one of them knows a member of the Judiciary Ethics panel.

Sixpence · « **Reply #59 on:** November 14, 2003, 10:30:47 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Reschke
Yes he can run for the same office and he is eligible to run for other office as well.

he has a 6 year term limit
http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeOfAlabama/Constitution/1901/CA-245693.htm
I'll have to revise that, not sure if that is a term limit, or just the length of the term, so scratch that.

And he may have to fight if they rule is not eligible to run for another office.

http://www.legislature.state.al.us/CodeOfAlabama/Constitution/1901/CA-245595.htm