How many people did Fidel Castro murder?

[davidpt40]

Now this is also as ignorant as anything the others have said.

I would NEVER trade what I have now to live in Cuba. And if you visited, neither would you.

Who wouldn't want to live in a tropical fishing village or tropical farming community?  Theres more to life than spending hours a day on the Aces High BBS.

The best things in life have nothing to do with technology : Relationships, running, fishing, eating.

[Maniac]

f we opened trade with Cuba would the price of Cuban cigars go down?

Well i guess you buy them from smugglers? then i guess its more expensive, i got a whole carton of em from my brother and he did not pay too much for em when he was there

I smoke one Cohiba every new years eve

Are they really rolled on the thighs of cuban virgins?

You dont want to see the hands that rolls these

[Maniac]

Who wouldn't want to live in a tropical fishing village or tropical farming community? Theres more to life than spending hours a day on the Aces High BBS.

This is very true, im currently looking into changing my life dramatically, i will know how my life will turn out in february, we are 3 friends that "might" give up life standards for more life quality...

But we will see how it turns out... better not to say too much...

[Martlet]

Originally posted by Maniac
This is very true, im currently looking into changing my life dramatically, i will know how my life will turn out in february, we are 3 friends that "might" give up life standards for more life quality...

But we will see how it turns out... better not to say too much...

Sounds like one of those Richard Simmons Communes you hear about on the infomercials.

[GtoRA2]

Maniac
 I have bought one bootleg at like 100 bucks a pop. That was years ago and I prolly got ripped.

I still have 3 or 4 cohibas in my humidor. (in storage  )

I have a budy who likes to go to Cuba on vacation, he did so twice and both times brought home a bunch of cuban cigars.

I did not like them at first, to strong, but after a year in the humidor they where awsome. hehe

[Maniac]

Sounds like one of those Richard Simmons Communes you hear about on the infomercials.

Huh?

Richard Simmons? no idea who he is and i dont want to know either...

Imagine a paradise island with about 10 - 15 Bungalows on it and then you will get closer...

[GRUNHERZ]

Originally posted by Animal
*sigh*
When have I said I prefered material wealth over freedom? I like material wealth, its nice, but I value freedom above everything.

Quote me, when have I said I would like to live in Cuba? When have I defended Comunist ideals, or even Fidel himself? I dont like Comunism. I have said it over and over again on this board. I know you cant grasp, because anyone who disagrees with you on things, is automatically a liberal/comunist lover/terrorist lover/whatever ludicrous persona your mind projects.



Do you honestly believe that Cuba is worse than ANY democratic country?
Have you been anywhere that is not Croatia, or the USA?

Cause that is what is seems like.

So you value freedom over anything else but you defend Castro's one party communist dictatorship because it provides some material goods to people.

Stop lying Animal... Which is it?

[Animal]

All I have been pointing out is that Cuba is not as ****ed up as you would think it is. That is all I and Maniac have been trying to say. It has nothing to do with my ideals. I dont know how I am defending a man and his government by saying that he is senile and outdated.

The truth is that you have a very bipolar way of seeing things. You say what you think is the truth, if someone tells you that its not accurate, you bring their ideals into question. An educated man with such a way of reasoning is embarassing.

Funny that you call me a liar and a defender of comunism. Last monday in college I was having an arguement with an anti-american young comunist about the US, the war, the Fidel documentary, etc.
It got pretty heated, in the end he dismissed me as a pro-american fascist, just because I did not agree with his anti american blabble, and because I told him Fidel was lying about not torturing dissidents.

You are just like him, except on the other side of the political scale.

[GRUNHERZ]

Well animal I hope you can understand my sensitivity towrads communism. On the surface, as a tourist,  it can seem ok but the reality in communist system is different. There is a reason why people dont tll you the bad things...

As for view being seeming to be polar, I think thats largely a product of the BBS. Real life communication is more flexible and dynamic which allows me to be more clear as much of what I say is in a high-context style and is metaphorical - I suppose thats how people communicated around me where i grew up.

Look the standard of living in old yugoslavia was pretty high, yet they still had secret police and political prisoners and censorship and human rights issues. It seems to me that you are saying Cuba's health programs and whatnot somehow make up for the fact that its an opressive dictatorship. You yourself implied that you dont think its any worse there than any democracy. If this is what you are saying then we simply disagree.

[Animal]

Originally posted by GRUNHERZ

Look the standard of living in old yugoslavia was pretty high, yet they still had secret police and political prisoners and censorship and human rights issues. It seems to me that you are saying Cuba's health programs and whatnot somehow make up for the fact that its an opressive dictatorship. You yourself implied that you dont think its any worse there than any democracy. If this is what you are saying then we simply disagree.

You must be confusing me with kappa. I never said any of that. I know what Cuba is and how things work there, I have seen it first hand. Like I said before, I would never live there.

All I have been saying is that dont believe that Comunism is automatically the worst thing. Yeah, its stupid and ill conceived. But there are places that are much worse off and no one cares because the way their government works are not as controversial as comunism.

When I say Cuba is better than the Dominican Republic or Mexico, I'm not saying it out of ideal - I honestly believe in democracy, and I am lucky to have been born where I am. I know that moving from Croatia to the USA was a radical change for you, and you would never go back. But you said something in this thread that I believe is wrong. You said that you cant compare Yugoslavia with a democratic country. I hope you dont mean ANY democratic country.

Cause in many democracies, if you dont have money, you are better off somewhere else, including Cuba.

[Glasses]

My personal opinion is that Cuba's hour will come sooner than later and Fidel Castro will be ousted. Once he does fall American companies and Cuban Enterpeneurs will descend on the island bringing ecnomic growth at an astounding rate. Once it does this I think it will become one of the richest countries if not the richest in the Carribbean.

I think there's something brewing but I don't know when I just know it'll happen if Bush remains in office.

[NUKE]

Up until the mid-late 1950's before Castro, Cuba was a very popular destination for Americans and it will be again when Castro is gone.

 A lot of money and oppertunity will again flow into Cuba..... and the Cuban people will benifit from it most I hope.

[NUKE]

Originally posted by kappa
Grun,

Do you really see Cuba as a opressed country? I cant...

The country is 100% literate....

The people are happy...

The people have health coverage......

Most the people have jobs........

Have you known of a mass murder taking place in Cuba??

Castro wanted a relationship with america... America in turn pushed him away... He came to us first... We said no....

My step father has been there... Passport not stamped of course.. They will not stamp american's passports..  What he saw of the country was not unlike Mexico...  Poor people yes, but people with food, shelter, and medical coverage...  He spoke of happy families...  He spoke of smiling children.... He spoke of dailey commerce and exchange of goods and services... He spoke of a kind caring people.... Nowhere, that he related to me was evidence of a brutal dictatorship...

Not all revolutions are bad........

Hate for Castro has festered long....

And... o ya... Castro is luved by his people.. He gave them what they did not have before... food, shelter, education.. etc...

k
AoM

You might be interested to know that Cuba had one of the lowest infant mortality rates, highest literacy  rate, among highest doctors per 100,000 , 1 hospital bed per 190 people, most poeple had jobs, people were happy.... ALL BEFORE CASTRO.

One difference: 62% of Cuban industry was owned by private Cuban citizens. Most people were also free.

So in other words, Castro did not bring anything new to the people other than oppression.

[Animal]

Originally posted by NUKE
You might be interested to know that Cuba had one of the lowest infant mortality rates, highest literacy  rate, among highest doctors per 100,000 , 1 hospital bed per 190 people, most poeple had jobs, people were happy.... ALL BEFORE CASTRO.

whhhaaaaaaat?!
are you talking about the same cuba we are talking?  are you talking Batista's regime?
dude... read!!! cuba was a HELLHOLE for the common people under Batista. Sure, it was great if you were rich.. and it was great for tourists, but that place was a prime example of a country with only two, very distinct classes. The revolution came and succeeded for a reason.

And the only reason Fidel has not been overthrown is that, although his dictatorship sucks, things are better than they were before, under Batista.

Fidel is a dictator, Batista was a tyrant.

Dude, who led you to believe that things were nice under Batista?

[Regular]

LOL GRUNHERZ= fat boy  on leather chair talking about politics on his fast pc. Latino Girls laugh at you in Cali in the lunch room?