Author Topic: Ref "the Lazs MA strat idea" - oh to one of the "talented" few .... (Read 11658 times)

SlapShot · « **Reply #120 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:03:38 AM »

The over-simplification of "defending" a base is incredible.

"it only takes one person to defend that resource ..."

You can't be serious Overlag. Since when does the enemy line up in single file and await their turn to attack a base.

I can see them all out there ...

"Well ... I only see 3 uppers, so we will only send 3 of our suicide dweebs in ... whos wants to go first."

The object of their game is to go emasse(horde) and dive thru any and all defenders ... at all costs ... to hit their mark and die immediately after. Some don't make it thru the defense, but the majority do ... that is the reason for attacking enmasse.

If all of us that are discussing this topic were noobs, you might be able to slip that argument thru ... but guess what ?

Overlag · « **Reply #121 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:05:48 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by SlapShot

The object of their game is to go emasse(horde) and dive thru any and all defenders ... at all costs ... to hit their mark and die immediately after. Some don't make it thru the defense, but the majority do ... that is the reason for attacking enmasse.

im not talking about this type of play. Ive said that many times already. Im talking about the tactical missions or base capture missions. Anyway, most sucide Jabos are single piliots without squads anyway.

and when i say one person can defend a base i mean 1v1... 1 defender will make the Jabo drop his bombs so he can fight. That means the main battle has been won, the Jabo is no longer a Jabo.

And due to bugs in Buffs, most 1on3s against bombers often ends up with the buff dead.

I say again:

Its not hard, just because you dont want to defend, dont whine about strat guys and stop saying its unfair

lazs2 · « **Reply #122 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:24:40 AM »

overlag... you are missing the point... the way you play is boring... it is boring because you aren't doing anything... you tell us that the way to enjoy the game is to play as you do... and even if we did.. It wouldn't stop suicide fuel porkers.

as for defending.... I am not very good but you could not defend from me suicideing into the fuel. you would be wasting your time waiting for me because I would still do it. That is the imbalance. How can you say that it is right to have fuel porking be so easy?

The only real strat in AH is... the country with the largest numbers "wins the war"... put any pretty face on it you want but us furballers have learned that years ago. to resist when you are down just prolongs the inevitable.. and... makes for crappy gameplay.

I won't play if I have to end up with stats like yours.

lazs

Overlag · « **Reply #123 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:26:11 AM »

well stop moaning then

Quote

Its not hard, just because you dont want to defend, dont whine about strat guys and stop saying its unfair

anyway, WHY ARE YOU STILL TALKING about bloody suicide porkers IM not.

Toad · « **Reply #124 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:28:12 AM »

Horsepuckey.

If a jabo comes in with alt on you, dives in and drops, you can't stop him consistently. Unless you get really lucky,you can't stop him very often.

I see you're UK based. Do you play much in US primetime when there's 500 players on? "Defending" takes on a bit of a different meaning then too.

You still haven't addressed the original question, either. Both you and Beet seem to always dodge the real issue.

Overlag · « **Reply #125 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:31:46 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad
Horsepuckey.

If a jabo comes in with alt on you, dives in and drops, you can't stop him consistently. Unless you get really lucky,you can't stop him very often.

I see you're UK based. Do you play much in US primetime when there's 500 players on? "Defending" takes on a bit of a different meaning then too.

You still haven't addressed the original question, either. Both you and Beet seem to always dodge the real issue.

i play 24/7 (well not in one day)

the only hours ive NOT be on is between 7am and 9am

And whats the real issue? The one where it takes "7" (where you got that number from i dont know) times the effort to rebuild something? So What, it took me, and other "real" strat players an hour to get to our target, and you fix it in 10 minutes, i dont realy SEE a problem

Other than its too easy to resupply things

Jackal1 · « **Reply #126 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:39:59 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
I must be mean if beetle, voss and jakal think I am.

mini di... is just being pissy tho because he got beat up ijn the Oclub by...... GIRLS!

lazs

Well Geee whilakers Humpy, I never said ya was mean. I think maybe you wish you could be, but I put you in the Pee Wee Herman class of mean.

lazs2 · « **Reply #127 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:45:30 AM »

jakal... I guess saying that you "think" was a gross exageration on my part.

lazs

Toad · « **Reply #128 on:** December 12, 2003, 11:48:28 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Overlag
i play 24/7 (well not in one day)

the only hours ive NOT be on is between 7am and 9am

And whats the real issue? The one where it takes "7" (where you got that number from i dont know) times the effort to rebuild something? So What, it took me, and other "real" strat players an hour to get to our target, and you fix it in 10 minutes, i dont realy SEE a problem Other than its too easy to resupply things

A few points here:

You didn't comment on stopping the higher jabo diving through your alt with much more E. You agree, I take it?

Do you play consistently in US primetime? I think pretty much everyone agrees it's quite a different game between Europe PT and US PT due to the far greater numbers in US PT.

The 7 number comes from actual experimentation on Trinity a while back.

As to your complaint, you merely highlight what anyone that steps back and looks at the problem already knows. AH strat is pretty much meaningless and totally imbalanced with no relation whatsoever to reality.

I take it you reference killing dar. It takes you an hour to do it and they repair it in ten minutes. Maybe, I don't know because dar is meaningless to me, so I never bother to bomb HQ.

I assume you're using apples to apples for this. It takes one player one hour to kill the dar. OK, now how many player minutes does it take to restore it? One player flying 6 ten minute sorties? Or six players flying 1 ten minute sortie each?

Assuming you have made a fair comparison, if it takes one player 1 hour to kill dar but only one player to fix it in ten minutes then we have another example of the imbalance in AH strat, don't we?

Except THIS time, the imbalance is the OTHER way. It's far easier to fix the dar than kill the dar whereas it's far easier to kill the fuel than fix the fuel.

Again this highlights just how porked the entire strat system is in AH.

So, I'd guess you'd agree the whole thing needs a serious review and overhaul, right?

beet1e · « **Reply #129 on:** December 12, 2003, 12:34:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad
Given the lemming hordes, there's no defending fuel. It's far to easy to destroy and essentially impossible to defend from suicide jabo's. It's pointless.

Hehe, now you're beginning to see why I don't like bases too close together. That lemming crap and the conveyor belting is so much more feasible when they are. Of course, on QWW, the next base is within pissing distance, so it makes bugger all difference. But on maps like BI and pizza, the distance between fields is a challenge to the A.D.D. lemmings, who forget why they've taken off after 5 minutes in flight. All week on Pizza, I've only seen one base fuel porked to 25%.

But you wanted fields closer together - you have it. You've made your bed, and now you must lie in it. Didn't someone once say "Be careful what you wish for - you might just get it"?

Nice to see you back, Mr. T. You seem much more relaxed than a few weeks ago. Clearly those hunting runs with your limey Kates are having a good effect on you.

muckmaw · « **Reply #130 on:** December 12, 2003, 01:40:26 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2

I won't play if I have to end up with stats like yours.

lazs

Since when did stats come into play?

You've always screamed you could care less about the stats.

The mantra you've always shouted was "The fight's the thing".

Well, that and "Move the bases closer".

Overlag-

You can't stop the fuel porkers with defence. Its that simple. The only way it's feasible is with overwhelming odds..say 4 defenders for every 1 attacker.

What about the idea of perking bombs on Jabos, and making it so the heavies have to be level when the release their bombs?

If you survive as a jabo, you get your perks back.

Seems simple and fair.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #131 on:** December 12, 2003, 02:46:45 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
jakal... I guess saying that you "think" was a gross exageration on my part.

lazs

Well I`m just suprised you could spell think Humpy, because the actual doing of it seems to be out of your reach.

Toad · « **Reply #132 on:** December 12, 2003, 04:17:50 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by beet1e
But you wanted fields closer together - you have it. You've made your bed, and now you must lie in it.

On FesterMA, absolutely! I have it and I love it! I'll lie in that bed in the MA until the end of AH.

Too bad ALL the maps aren't as well designed for ALL PLAYERS TO ENJOY as FesterMA has proven to be.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #133 on:** December 12, 2003, 09:38:28 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad

Too bad ALL the maps aren't as well designed for ALL PLAYERS TO ENJOY as FesterMA has proven to be.

That`s a "too bad" I can live with.
If all the maps were filled with Lalas and N1kdaddies with the HO switch locked to "ON" position I`m afraid the game wouldn`t last long.
All I have yet to see on that map is a horde at one base with little or no defense while one base over another horde is doing the same thing to that base.
I think it was a great effort, but just not working.

Toad · « **Reply #134 on:** December 13, 2003, 03:11:08 AM »

Oh, you don't see hordes hitting defenseless bases on AKD or BI or Trin?

What FesterMA DOES is allow everyone, strat and furballer alike, to "do their thing".

That's a rare quality in a big map... in fact, FMA is the ONLY big map that really allows that.

I now believe Laz is right; what the strats don't like about FMA is that they can capture the world, win the war and get the Hawaiian vacation...... and the furballers won't notice.

Wham, Bam, reset and the fight goes right on non-stop without a hitch.

THAT'S what I think bugs most of the "win one fer the gipper" guys.