Author Topic: How to get a high rank  (Read 28517 times)

Offline Murdr

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Final summery
« Reply #120 on: January 05, 2004, 08:08:53 PM »
It is suggested that the rank system is flawed and invalid for the following reasons:
1.  Better pilots can be named who are not at the top.
Answer: They chose not to compete
      a)  If pilots have to choose to compete, then its the metrics that are flawed.
Answer:  This type of thinking is not in line with real world metrics or competition.  Teachers teach what their students need to know for their future pursuits, but the curriculum is geared to teaching what is going to be tested.  Military personel train to be proficient at their job, but the training is geared toward being good at the qualification test.  Playing toward metrics is part in parcel with competition, and its grading.
2.  The system can be gamed.
Answer: Of course it can, but the real deal will trump the poser.  If the better pilot is actually trying to compete, they will win.
     a)  The rank system therefore is set up to promoting activites which are conducive to high rank, not good performance.
Answer:  I would argue that for the most part, they are one in the same.  You may counter that each individual stat can be manipulated in a way that is not truely productive.  I would point out that generally there is a statistic of equal weight that will provide a counter-balance.  However as I said before, playing toward what is being tested is part in parcel with competition, and is the nature of the beast no matter how perfect the system of measurment is.

Enjoyed the good discussion, even though I was appearently in the minority :aok

{edit} Just saw your post.  Wanted to conceed the point that mabey the average player does not understand the short commings of the ranks.  As far as its accuracy, I believe just like any other competition scale, it is only accuratate to measure those who chose to compete.  I dont know that it is the best way, it is in my opinion the best way I have see to date.  It would be hard for statistics to pluck the best out of a group, if they dont want to participate.  It seems to me that it is conducive for the best of a group to emerge if they want to.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2004, 08:20:01 PM by Murdr »

Offline killnu

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How to get a high rank
« Reply #121 on: January 05, 2004, 08:39:27 PM »
cc levi, no biggie either way :)
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Offline Redd

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« Reply #122 on: January 05, 2004, 09:22:42 PM »
Most of these guys must be pretty good , if  I spent 130 hours (ave) a month (like some of them) doing something  I'd expect to get pretty damn good at it.

The top 10 must be the domain of the single man  -  enjoy it while you can   ;)

Wait till you got a wife pinging you on your six everytime you spend "all that waste of time" on the computer.


Redd
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Offline nopoop

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« Reply #123 on: January 05, 2004, 09:38:37 PM »
Redd if total hours flown online in flightsims was a measure, I'd be a GOD.

Just don't fly as much as I used to.

Think golf. With every weekend your waiting for that slice..

Your never disappointed.

But I solved that, I quit golf.
nopoop

It's ALL about the fight..

Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #124 on: January 05, 2004, 09:46:19 PM »
If we could somehow measure the “true” fighter skill of all players and compare that to the AH fighter ranking system, I think that we would find that it is both flawed and yet generally accurate.  Suppose that we could compare the “true” skill of the top 50 ranked players to those ranked 251 through 300, and then compare those groups to a group ranked 1001 through 1050, and then again to a group ranked 5001 through 5050.  Imagine putting these 200 players into a dueling ladder.  I’d bet that 17 of the top 20 in this ladder are going to come from the top 50 group.  At the same time, I’d also bet that a more than a few from the 251 – 300 group would pummel some in the top 50.  It wouldn’t be surprising to see 1 or 2 from the 1001 – 1050 group do well.  I think that it would be surprising however, to see anyone from the 5001 – 5050 group beat anyone from the higher groups.

While certainly not a rule, better players gravitate toward higher ranks.  This doesn’t mean that some very skilled players may hold only average rankings.

It’s a mistake to place a lot of value on the AH ranking system, but it is also a mistake to write it off as being meaningless.  For a flight sim ranking system, it’s pretty good.

One thing that a lot of folks don’t seem to get, is that AH is many games in one.  It is a furball game, a strat game, a team game, a solo game, a buff game, a GV game, a survival game, a killing game, a suicide game, an ego game, a silly game, a social game, and even a rank game (and many, many more types of games).  We each can choose to play or ignore any of these games.  

One thing is for sure, lots of folks are pretty darn sure that their way of playing the game is the only pure way, and the only way to have fun.

eskimo

Offline Redd

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« Reply #125 on: January 05, 2004, 11:01:25 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by nopoop

Think golf. With every weekend your waiting for that slice..

Your never disappointed.

But I solved that, I quit golf. [/B]



I'm pretty keen golfer Nopoop - currently off the course with a nagging injury.

guess that's why I'm flying again  - some  free time.

bugger of game - golf that is  -  few minutes of excitment , surrounded by hours of frustration.


Redd
I come from a land downunder

Offline streetstang

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« Reply #126 on: January 05, 2004, 11:17:49 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Murdr
I know of morpheus, so I would remove that one too.  


lol... You know me do ya? Funny thing though... I know nothing of you nor your tallent.. So why comment on mine? Rank is a bunch of chit... There is lets say... A ballace bettween skill and Rank... MA and DA are two entirely different worlds... If your great in the MA, dont be surprised it you suck in the DA and vise versa...

If you want to know a great over all pilot of the game... I know of only one name that comes to mind and does deserve alot of credit... GBaLL... All the others, well, are great sticks, and they deserve credit also, but G is best over all imo.. from flying with him and against him in the DA...

As far as we go Murdr... Im in the MA all the time.. DA also... Feel free to call me out to the DA anytime you have a few minutes... Rank means squat... I dont care what any of you think or say or feel.... Study all the stats you want till your blue in the face... When it comes to 1v1, stats mean chit...

Morph...

Offline DrDea

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« Reply #127 on: January 06, 2004, 12:50:26 AM »
I dont care what any of you think or say or feel.... Study all the stats you want till your blue in the face... When it comes to 1v1, stats mean chit...

 No truer words were ever spoken.
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Offline Steve

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« Reply #128 on: January 06, 2004, 01:10:24 AM »
Quote
When it comes to 1v1, stats mean chit...


Well this is true... but not really relevent to what Murdr was talking about.  Murdr is discussing the MA... 1v1's of any length are very rare there.

As For G, well, he is one of my favorite wingies.   :)
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Offline Ack-Ack

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« Reply #129 on: January 06, 2004, 02:21:55 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Steve

As For G, well, he is one of my favorite wingies.   :)


What a coincidence, he's one of my favorite targets




ack-ack
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Offline Murdr

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How to get a high rank
« Reply #130 on: January 06, 2004, 02:30:52 AM »
hmm...well...  Name recognition among 5-6 thousand people over the last 8 years to me always seemed to me somewhat of a complement, and opinions too for that matter regardless of their context.  Ive questioned comments by people Ive never heard of on ch1 after they've gotten a proxie or ram kill on me to find out I had killed them repeatedly in the past, and they were genuinely happy to get one on me.   to each his own I guess.

As for GBall in fighter rank he has finished 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th, 9th, 11th...and more recently 347th, and a 2nd overall rank.  This would appear to support my claim that its validity is limited only to those who choose to compete for rank.  By the way, I have fought aginst, and with GBall over the years more than I can count.  Always a good time.

Offline gofaster

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« Reply #131 on: January 06, 2004, 07:55:41 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by SlapShot
Last night some noob on channel 1 was telling USGrim to STFU cause he didn't know what he was talking about ... "with a rank like yours ... blah blah blah". USGrim would hand this guys his prettythang on a platter, but because USGrim had a rank in the 3000s, he was assumed to be easy.


That's pretty funny.

Still, I'll sometimes check rank on someone that popped me to just to see if they were any good or if they were just lucky and I was sucking at the moment.

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #132 on: January 06, 2004, 08:07:12 AM »
murdr.. I never heard of you.   did you play under another handle?  I don't like dueling myself.. I like the MA but... I like medium performance planes that force me to get in and mix it up.   I could fly a Deee 9 or pee 51 but I would get bored and then fight it and get killed.

Rank is particularly unimpressive in an arena where you can fly any plane you like and furballs are all full of the slower planes whose SA is overwhelmed.   A fast plane can vultch the edges with impunity.   Most people do not think this is a particularly admirable skill.   I think people feel that this "skill" is what makes rank so bogus.

lazs

Offline gofaster

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« Reply #133 on: January 06, 2004, 08:10:39 AM »
Everybody should fly Corsairs all the time.  Its the only way we'd know who was good and who wasn't.

Offline streetstang

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« Reply #134 on: January 06, 2004, 08:16:21 AM »
Well... This thread is just getting a bit too long, but even so I thought I'd add my 2 to it...

Rank is easy to get... You dont nessesrily have to be very good overall at the game itself more so than you do have to be good at gaming the game... Fly fighters smart, and score as fighter when odds are in your favor and you can get a good amount of kills in a short period of time... For the rest of the time fly attack and score that way... Milk run blah blah blah... Same goes for bomber... Milk run with a single 17 or a Ju87 with the BAB (BigprettythangBomb)... GVs.... Well... I HATE GV's... But they too count so when the opportunity arises..Spawn camp... Yup There I said it ok... Spawn camp... Ask TopGunz how he gets 80--90% of those kills... If he says its by any other means other than camping then his CO and my friend is lieing... THere are a few more things one can do do really get GV rank down but those have been coverd I bleive...

So I ask all of you who submited to this thread... To any of the above mentiond activities require any considerable level of skill? I mean it really is something that someone about a month or two into the game can accomplish if they sit down and really work at it...

I still stand behind what I said before... Rank and 1v1 means nothing and are in no way connected... If some want to beleive that.... Well here ya go:aok :aok :aok


Morph